US Supreme Court Rules Against Affirmative Action in College Admissions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Asians get higher scores on activities, leadership, interview

they do work harder as parents push harder but they start with significant advantage, most of them have parents with higher education that came here with scholarships for graduate school or postdoc jobs, no debt as undergrad is free in their home country, then continue to stay here and get good positions in academia or research labs, then help their kids to get internships and jobs through their connections and so on

the ones that came poor with little education have little upward mobility, so do not generalize

LOL No, you seem to have some sort of fantasy about Asians, but it's not like that.
What you just described are actually wealthy White ALDC folks.

Just 50-70 years ago, Asian countries like Japan, Korea, Vietnam, and China were all in ruins, and they were among the poorest countries, even poorer than some African nations. Most Asian immigrants didn't have any luxuries in the end. If they had anything, it was due to hard work and sacrifices, as well as their value for education. For those who come here after college from their home countries, they face significant language, social, and cultural barriers.

However, they manage to achieve middle-class status by the second or third generation through their dedication to education.
It's important to move away from a victim mentality in order to make progress.

no, it's pretty accurate for those that came here after college in the early 2000s and now have college-bound kids, the language barrier is only in spoken not in written, they are pretty fluent in English because only those fluent in English get acceptance into the doctoral programs, unless they lie about it and cheat on exams, and regarding social and cultural, they have the largest communities with programs and services in their language, much more that immigrants of european descent

Those begin as international students, and they are very small segment of Asian immigrants.
It's also not easy to get green card and get to stay after your degree.

[Anonymous]

Not sure why all the nonsense above. We are not re-litigating what Harvard lost.

I am only curious how much this is costing Harvard the loser And does it have to pay the winner's legal expenses?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Which "certain" groups score lower than others? Why "certain"?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is my understanding that GPA and test scores TOGETHER are both equally indicative of student performance. In other words, students with excellent grades can often have good SAT scores.

However, the reverse is not true. Students with lowGPAs can achieve excellent SAT scores through tutoring. This second scenario is not indicative of a good student. Just a good test taker who may have the money to “buy” their score.

In the end, GPA and rigor are king and this is why we are moving test optional… to level the playing field

You don't understand.
Rich people can hire tutors and afford to take shit ton of APs and college level math such as multi-variable calculus, differntial equations advance statistics, etc.
This boost their rigor points and weight GPA.

SAT is at least cover just the fundamental level that low income smart kids can compete.
There are really good free resources if you have smart and will.

grade inflation means GPA scores are meaningless.

Money can buy great extra curriculars.

At least SATs and APs are standard across the board. No grade inflation. You can get free test prep online at Khan (my kid used it) or at the library, and some schools even offer free test prep.

The SAT as mandatory train left the station years ago. Sorry.

Keep up with the trends. "MIT" isn't it.

HYPS, Columbia, etc. Is.

The "trend" is to increase diversity. And since certain groups score lower than others, and it was pretty obvious, they did away with it.

Keep up.

Probably due to the large IQ differences from a previous post. Blacks in the US have an average IQ of 83; Asians in the US have an average IQ of 108. To think that groups with such large differences in average IQ should have even remotely similar representation at top colleges is absurd.

The entire rubric behind gathering this data is absurd. Back in the 1970s we were tested for IQ in elementary school. I was called in to retake the exam - twice. Why? Because I scored over 130 and the administrators were certain something was wrong ( I am a black American) so I took it again. Same result.

Ever since then I have been aware of the fact that even when blacks perform well the results are challenged. My first score was literally tossed into a waste bin.

You can measure your peter against those results if you like. Doesn't trouble me at all.

Yes, it’s all a conspiracy. The entirety of social scientists are in on it. You’ve figured it all out.

I bet my co-worker someone would respond with a dismissive "conspiracy" comment. I should have put money on it.

That said, I expect I have more experience with the Black cohort than you ever will. And I am intimately familiar with people so dumb you might fear for their own safety more than your own. But that doesn't change the fact that whenever one of us excels in class, on an exam, at work, etc. there is invariably someone standing on the sidelines insisting that something was wrong with the process.

Take yourself as an example. Your response was to crack a joke and be dismissive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Which "certain" groups score lower than others? Why "certain"?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is my understanding that GPA and test scores TOGETHER are both equally indicative of student performance. In other words, students with excellent grades can often have good SAT scores.

However, the reverse is not true. Students with lowGPAs can achieve excellent SAT scores through tutoring. This second scenario is not indicative of a good student. Just a good test taker who may have the money to “buy” their score.

In the end, GPA and rigor are king and this is why we are moving test optional… to level the playing field

You don't understand.
Rich people can hire tutors and afford to take shit ton of APs and college level math such as multi-variable calculus, differntial equations advance statistics, etc.
This boost their rigor points and weight GPA.

SAT is at least cover just the fundamental level that low income smart kids can compete.
There are really good free resources if you have smart and will.

grade inflation means GPA scores are meaningless.

Money can buy great extra curriculars.

At least SATs and APs are standard across the board. No grade inflation. You can get free test prep online at Khan (my kid used it) or at the library, and some schools even offer free test prep.

The SAT as mandatory train left the station years ago. Sorry.

Keep up with the trends. "MIT" isn't it.

HYPS, Columbia, etc. Is.

The "trend" is to increase diversity. And since certain groups score lower than others, and it was pretty obvious, they did away with it.

Keep up.

Probably due to the large IQ differences from a previous post. Blacks in the US have an average IQ of 83; Asians in the US have an average IQ of 108. To think that groups with such large differences in average IQ should have even remotely similar representation at top colleges is absurd.

The entire rubric behind gathering this data is absurd. Back in the 1970s we were tested for IQ in elementary school. I was called in to retake the exam - twice. Why? Because I scored over 130 and the administrators were certain something was wrong ( I am a black American) so I took it again. Same result.

Ever since then I have been aware of the fact that even when blacks perform well the results are challenged. My first score was literally tossed into a waste bin.

You can measure your peter against those results if you like. Doesn't trouble me at all.

Yes, it’s all a conspiracy. The entirety of social scientists are in on it. You’ve figured it all out.

I bet my co-worker someone would respond with a dismissive "conspiracy" comment. I should have put money on it.

That said, I expect I have more experience with the Black cohort than you ever will. And I am intimately familiar with people so dumb you might fear for their own safety more than your own. But that doesn't change the fact that whenever one of us excels in class, on an exam, at work, etc. there is invariably someone standing on the sidelines insisting that something was wrong with the process.

Take yourself as an example. Your response was to crack a joke and be dismissive.

Since PP is so smart, how much is the loser in this court case paying in legal expenses? Does the loser pay the winner, and how much?

[Anonymous]

I'm fascinated by the number of people on here who are crying racism against Asians and then making racist comments towards black people

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Asians get higher scores on activities, leadership, interview

they do work harder as parents push harder but they start with significant advantage, most of them have parents with higher education that came here with scholarships for graduate school or postdoc jobs, no debt as undergrad is free in their home country, then continue to stay here and get good positions in academia or research labs, then help their kids to get internships and jobs through their connections and so on

the ones that came poor with little education have little upward mobility, so do not generalize

LOL No, you seem to have some sort of fantasy about Asians, but it's not like that.
What you just described are actually wealthy White ALDC folks.

Just 50-70 years ago, Asian countries like Japan, Korea, Vietnam, and China were all in ruins, and they were among the poorest countries, even poorer than some African nations. Most Asian immigrants didn't have any luxuries in the end. If they had anything, it was due to hard work and sacrifices, as well as their value for education. For those who come here after college from their home countries, they face significant language, social, and cultural barriers.

However, they manage to achieve middle-class status by the second or third generation through their dedication to education.
It's important to move away from a victim mentality in order to make progress.

no, it's pretty accurate for those that came here after college in the early 2000s and now have college-bound kids, the language barrier is only in spoken not in written, they are pretty fluent in English because only those fluent in English get acceptance into the doctoral programs, unless they lie about it and cheat on exams, and regarding social and cultural, they have the largest communities with programs and services in their language, much more that immigrants of european descent

Those begin as international students, and they are very small segment of Asian immigrants.
It's also not easy to get green card and get to stay after your degree.

not true, not really small segment, pretty significant in academia, all of those I know personally got green card through their employers

[Anonymous]

ok, so states can put quotas on out-of-state because they fund the public schools; can ivies say 'as reparations for slavery and injustices to the indigenous people, cause we are funded by rich whites that had direct benefit from those practices, we want to sponsor scholarships only for those affected by them'? yes, they can, and they already do it and they should continue to do it. so, then they have to select groups from those urm segments and select from them the ones that are the most deserving. have the others compete on merit all they want and accept only full-pay and pay for the educations of the urm ... that is what they do, they should be free to do it, they do not openly say it, just not politically correct and business savvy to admit it, but perfect scores with little ability to pay has slim chance unless they are urm and it makes perfect sense

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Asians get higher scores on activities, leadership, interview

they do work harder as parents push harder but they start with significant advantage, most of them have parents with higher education that came here with scholarships for graduate school or postdoc jobs, no debt as undergrad is free in their home country, then continue to stay here and get good positions in academia or research labs, then help their kids to get internships and jobs through their connections and so on

the ones that came poor with little education have little upward mobility, so do not generalize

LOL No, you seem to have some sort of fantasy about Asians, but it's not like that.
What you just described are actually wealthy White ALDC folks.

Just 50-70 years ago, Asian countries like Japan, Korea, Vietnam, and China were all in ruins, and they were among the poorest countries, even poorer than some African nations. Most Asian immigrants didn't have any luxuries in the end. If they had anything, it was due to hard work and sacrifices, as well as their value for education. For those who come here after college from their home countries, they face significant language, social, and cultural barriers.

However, they manage to achieve middle-class status by the second or third generation through their dedication to education.
It's important to move away from a victim mentality in order to make progress.

no, it's pretty accurate for those that came here after college in the early 2000s and now have college-bound kids, the language barrier is only in spoken not in written, they are pretty fluent in English because only those fluent in English get acceptance into the doctoral programs, unless they lie about it and cheat on exams, and regarding social and cultural, they have the largest communities with programs and services in their language, much more that immigrants of european descent

Those begin as international students, and they are very small segment of Asian immigrants.
It's also not easy to get green card and get to stay after your degree.

not true, not really small segment, pretty significant in academia, all of those I know personally got green card through their employers

Of course significant in academia. Duh

Small segment for overall Asian immigrants.

Your limited first hand experience in academia doesn't represent the whole

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
ok, so states can put quotas on out-of-state because they fund the public schools; can ivies say 'as reparations for slavery and injustices to the indigenous people, cause we are funded by rich whites that had direct benefit from those practices, we want to sponsor scholarships only for those affected by them'? yes, they can, and they already do it and they should continue to do it. so, then they have to select groups from those urm segments and select from them the ones that are the most deserving. have the others compete on merit all they want and accept only full-pay and pay for the educations of the urm ... that is what they do, they should be free to do it, they do not openly say it, just not politically correct and business savvy to admit it, but perfect scores with little ability to pay has slim chance unless they are urm and it makes perfect sense

Yes do whatever you want, and no more state and federal funds. Even pay tax.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm fascinated by the number of people on here who are crying racism against Asians and then making racist comments towards black people

Vile racists have been emboldened since Trump.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm fascinated by the number of people on here who are crying racism against Asians and then making racist comments towards black people

Vile racists have been emboldened since Trump.

I believe that would be the divider in chief, Obama, who you are talking about. Nobody used race against our society better than him. Give credit where credit is due.

[Anonymous]

https://medium.com/@dddefenddiversitydd/anti-asian-american-bias-exists-but-here-are-ten-reasons-not-to-fall-for-the-asian-american-71ef01195189

Here are TEN reasons NOT to fall for the “Asian American Penalty” trap in admissions!

"There is no evidence of discrimination based on “personality.” The personal rating is not a personality rating. It is an assessment based on elements of the application file, including the teacher and guidance counselor reports and the alumni interviewer ratings. Asian American applicants, as a group, were assigned very slightly weaker personal ratings — only 0.05 points difference between Asian American and White applicants on average."

these from people that in their words 'All of us study Asian Americans for a living, and know all too well that Asian Americans are subject to microaggressions and exclusion based on race and immigrant status. These charges resonate with all Asian Americans. They confirm our worst fears. At the same time, we must remain skeptical of these charges and how they are being used. For instance, the SFFA filing repeats stereotypes that are not in the Harvard files submitted to the court. Some of these images were deployed over 30 years ago, but SFFA could not find them in the recent evidence produced in the lawsuit. SFFA relies on these kind of misleading inconsistencies.'

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://medium.com/@dddefenddiversitydd/anti-asian-american-bias-exists-but-here-are-ten-reasons-not-to-fall-for-the-asian-american-71ef01195189

Here are TEN reasons NOT to fall for the “Asian American Penalty” trap in admissions!

"There is no evidence of discrimination based on “personality.” The personal rating is not a personality rating. It is an assessment based on elements of the application file, including the teacher and guidance counselor reports and the alumni interviewer ratings. Asian American applicants, as a group, were assigned very slightly weaker personal ratings — only 0.05 points difference between Asian American and White applicants on average."

these from people that in their words 'All of us study Asian Americans for a living, and know all too well that Asian Americans are subject to microaggressions and exclusion based on race and immigrant status. These charges resonate with all Asian Americans. They confirm our worst fears. At the same time, we must remain skeptical of these charges and how they are being used. For instance, the SFFA filing repeats stereotypes that are not in the Harvard files submitted to the court. Some of these images were deployed over 30 years ago, but SFFA could not find them in the recent evidence produced in the lawsuit. SFFA relies on these kind of misleading inconsistencies.'

Sorry, the Supreme Court of the US disagrees with your claims.

[Anonymous]

Case is closed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Case is closed.

No case is ever closed anymore.

Time to overturn all precedent and then back again.