US Supreme Court Rules Against Affirmative Action in College Admissions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

They recently spent 500 million dollars on the Adolescent Brain Cognitive Development (ABCD) study, which tested over 10,000 American ten-year-olds into adulthood: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41386-020-0736-6

The average IQ of Asians in the study was 108, Whites 100 and Blacks 83. Immigrant blacks averaged 91.

I’m sure some of the gap is due to a culture that emphasizes academics, but there’s an almost 2 standard deviation gap between Asians and Blacks. Given these IQ scores, the test score gaps we see make perfect sense. This also helps explain why a large fraction of Blacks in top schools are the children of immigrants.

Are Asian students okay with attending an school with an all-Asian student body in a very diverse country ?

I understand that the response is likely to be that one wants to attend university with the best qualified students regardless of race/ethnicity so that if the best qualified are all Asian students, then so be it. But, this raises the issue of what constitutes the "best qualified" ? Is the American educational experience just about book learning and tests ?

Aren't Blacks okay with attending an school with almost all Blacks today? Also Whites?

You asking this type of question seems racist oriented. Open your mind.

Because I prefer a diverse educational environment & experience, you think that I have a closed mind ?

No, I would not like attending an all white or all black school as I value and crave diversity.

Others may prefer the comfort of attending an all black, all white, all Asian, all Jewish, all Catholic, all Baptist, etc. school, but I would not as I value the experience and learning derived from involvement in a diverse environment.

Yes everyone is difference and have different preference
So we have 3000+ 4 year colleges to choose from.
This is great thing about the US. Lots of options.
Pick what you like, but I'm not sure why you are so interested in other people's choices.
You think your choice is the only right answer?

No, I do not think that my preference is the only "right answer", but I do think that it is the best answer because we live and work in a diverse environment.

I appreciate that there are well over 3,000 four year colleges & universities in the US, but this court case involves one of the most selective & prestigious schools in the world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

You should study and prepare for those major tests like that.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
What is matter with these people??

These tests weren’t originally meant to be taken after the extreme amounts of “prep” that sometimes occurs now. The scores are no longer useful in giving insight into a student’s potential, so colleges are moving away from using them. Scores acquired by extreme prepping practices simply are not that useful in distinguishing one student’s abilities forum another.

The best university in the world MIT disagrees with you after years of research.
Colleges are not moving away. I want to keep it in the name of test optional.

So, MIT has published a study comparing outcomes between students who engaged in extreme prepping practices for the SAT and ACT and those who did not? Do you have a link to that exact study?

You should study and prepare for those major tests such as SAT, MCAT, Bar Exam, Professional Engineer exam, etc.
It's expected.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
You just want to walk in without much effort? WTF

So, got it, there is no such MIT study. It is not “careless” to fill your life with worthwhile experiences such as music, sports, theatre, volunteering rather than spending that time in extreme prepping.

Colleges want students with a wide breadth of experiences and backgrounds because they have found that that kind of college community enhances each student’s growth and development as people during their college years. Elite colleges want to graduate students who will be future societal leaders, not only academics. Good leaders need to have many different experiences with many different types of people.

Yes I agree.
Asians excel in all those areas - leadership, music, art, etc. etc. at the same time they prepare for tests as well.

Pay attention to the category by Harvard 'quality of activities and leadership positions'

You either do not understand the post you are replying to or are being deliberately obtuse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

You should study and prepare for those major tests like that.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
What is matter with these people??

These tests weren’t originally meant to be taken after the extreme amounts of “prep” that sometimes occurs now. The scores are no longer useful in giving insight into a student’s potential, so colleges are moving away from using them. Scores acquired by extreme prepping practices simply are not that useful in distinguishing one student’s abilities forum another.

The best university in the world MIT disagrees with you after years of research.
Colleges are not moving away. I want to keep it in the name of test optional.

So, MIT has published a study comparing outcomes between students who engaged in extreme prepping practices for the SAT and ACT and those who did not? Do you have a link to that exact study?

You should study and prepare for those major tests such as SAT, MCAT, Bar Exam, Professional Engineer exam, etc.
It's expected.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
You just want to walk in without much effort? WTF

So, got it, there is no such MIT study. It is not “careless” to fill your life with worthwhile experiences such as music, sports, theatre, volunteering rather than spending that time in extreme prepping.

Colleges want students with a wide breadth of experiences and backgrounds because they have found that that kind of college community enhances each student’s growth and development as people during their college years. Elite colleges want to graduate students who will be future societal leaders, not only academics. Good leaders need to have many different experiences with many different types of people.

Yes I agree.
Asians excel in all those areas - leadership, music, art, etc. etc. at the same time they prepare for tests as well.

Pay attention to the category by Harvard 'quality of activities and leadership positions'

After all this time, some people still believe in this myth that Asian are only good on GPA + SAT, so they bring in SAT to pick on, but the truth was reveal that Asians are actually better on all those activities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

They recently spent 500 million dollars on the Adolescent Brain Cognitive Development (ABCD) study, which tested over 10,000 American ten-year-olds into adulthood: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41386-020-0736-6

The average IQ of Asians in the study was 108, Whites 100 and Blacks 83. Immigrant blacks averaged 91.

I’m sure some of the gap is due to a culture that emphasizes academics, but there’s an almost 2 standard deviation gap between Asians and Blacks. Given these IQ scores, the test score gaps we see make perfect sense. This also helps explain why a large fraction of Blacks in top schools are the children of immigrants.

Are Asian students okay with attending an school with an all-Asian student body in a very diverse country ?

I understand that the response is likely to be that one wants to attend university with the best qualified students regardless of race/ethnicity so that if the best qualified are all Asian students, then so be it. But, this raises the issue of what constitutes the "best qualified" ? Is the American educational experience just about book learning and tests ?

Do you have problem with the mostly black NBA or the NFL? What's wrong with you? Expand your moral horizon a bit.

I will ignore your childish insult & silly judgmental comment for the benefit of readers & posters who are not afraid to face & discuss real issues.

Professional sports teams have a clear goal--winning. Education is a much more difficult endeavor to encapsulate. What makes a leader ? Is it book learning or is it cultural awareness and understanding or, most likely, is a combination of several experiences ?

+1

There is one or two trolls who say this on any thread related to this topic.

At least half of the responses here are "Asian exceptionalist" trolls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

They recently spent 500 million dollars on the Adolescent Brain Cognitive Development (ABCD) study, which tested over 10,000 American ten-year-olds into adulthood: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41386-020-0736-6

The average IQ of Asians in the study was 108, Whites 100 and Blacks 83. Immigrant blacks averaged 91.

I’m sure some of the gap is due to a culture that emphasizes academics, but there’s an almost 2 standard deviation gap between Asians and Blacks. Given these IQ scores, the test score gaps we see make perfect sense. This also helps explain why a large fraction of Blacks in top schools are the children of immigrants.

Are Asian students okay with attending an school with an all-Asian student body in a very diverse country ?

I understand that the response is likely to be that one wants to attend university with the best qualified students regardless of race/ethnicity so that if the best qualified are all Asian students, then so be it. But, this raises the issue of what constitutes the "best qualified" ? Is the American educational experience just about book learning and tests ?

Aren't Blacks okay with attending an school with almost all Blacks today? Also Whites?

You asking this type of question seems racist oriented. Open your mind.

Because I prefer a diverse educational environment & experience, you think that I have a closed mind ?

No, I would not like attending an all white or all black school as I value and crave diversity.

Others may prefer the comfort of attending an all black, all white, all Asian, all Jewish, all Catholic, all Baptist, etc. school, but I would not as I value the experience and learning derived from involvement in a diverse environment.

Yes everyone is difference and have different preference
So we have 3000+ 4 year colleges to choose from.
This is great thing about the US. Lots of options.
Pick what you like, but I'm not sure why you are so interested in other people's choices.
You think your choice is the only right answer?

No, I do not think that my preference is the only "right answer", but I do think that it is the best answer because we live and work in a diverse environment.

I appreciate that there are well over 3,000 four year colleges & universities in the US, but this court case involves one of the most selective & prestigious schools in the world.

Have you ever asked Black people "Are you okay with attending an school with 80% Black student body in a very diverse country?"
or White people "Are you okay with attending an school with 80% White student body in a very diverse country?

If not, why only ask that kind of quesiton to Asians?
And those schools actually exist today unlike the imaginative Asian schools.

The the bigger problem seems to me is that people like you are a racist even without realizing you are a racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is quite eye-opening to read some of these posts- so many people showing how racist they are, even while they claim that they are not. Their convoluted way of thinking seems so normal to them, that they truly have no idea how easily everyone else can see how superior they feel their own race is to all others.

I'm shocked by racism agasint Asians.

But you’re just fine with racism against other groups. We see how you think.

This exactly.

Keep the Black people out of elite colleges and the boardroom at any costs. But they can keep fighting the wars for the USA.

Are you saying that black people aren't smart enough for elite colleges or qualified enough for boardrooms?
Now, that is a racist mindset.

No, they are saying that laws will be made to keep black people out of college and boardrooms but laws to keep rich white kids in the pipeline will be maintained.

What part of the law will keep black people out of colleges and boardrooms??
Will they be discriminated??

You want me to educate you on education in poverty, red lining, lack of funding, racism in teacher, over policing of black makes in school?

You want me to educate you… no thanks, educate yourself then come back and have an educated conversation.

It’s like Test prep but it’s not memorizing and drilling it’s learning. Try it sometime.

I wonder why is that happening to Blacks but not Asians.

You wonder why redlining happened to blacks and not Asians?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is quite eye-opening to read some of these posts- so many people showing how racist they are, even while they claim that they are not. Their convoluted way of thinking seems so normal to them, that they truly have no idea how easily everyone else can see how superior they feel their own race is to all others.

I'm shocked by racism agasint Asians.

But you’re just fine with racism against other groups. We see how you think.

This exactly.

Keep the Black people out of elite colleges and the boardroom at any costs. But they can keep fighting the wars for the USA.

Are you saying that black people aren't smart enough for elite colleges or qualified enough for boardrooms?
Now, that is a racist mindset.

No, they are saying that laws will be made to keep black people out of college and boardrooms but laws to keep rich white kids in the pipeline will be maintained.

What part of the law will keep black people out of colleges and boardrooms??
Will they be discriminated??

[b]You want me to educate you [b]on education in poverty, red lining, lack of funding, racism in teacher, over policing of black makes in school?

You want me to educate you… no thanks, educate yourself then come back and have an educated conversation.

It’s like Test prep but it’s not memorizing and drilling it’s learning. Try it sometime.

I refused to be educated by someone whose iq is 3 sd below mine. Have a seat and be quiet.

Good I refuse to educate someone so ignorant. Educate yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is quite eye-opening to read some of these posts- so many people showing how racist they are, even while they claim that they are not. Their convoluted way of thinking seems so normal to them, that they truly have no idea how easily everyone else can see how superior they feel their own race is to all others.

I'm shocked by racism agasint Asians.

But you’re just fine with racism against other groups. We see how you think.

This exactly.

Keep the Black people out of elite colleges and the boardroom at any costs. But they can keep fighting the wars for the USA.

Are you saying that black people aren't smart enough for elite colleges or qualified enough for boardrooms?
Now, that is a racist mindset.

No, they are saying that laws will be made to keep black people out of college and boardrooms but laws to keep rich white kids in the pipeline will be maintained.

What part of the law will keep black people out of colleges and boardrooms??
Will they be discriminated??

You want me to educate you on education in poverty, red lining, lack of funding, racism in teacher, over policing of black makes in school?

You want me to educate you… no thanks, educate yourself then come back and have an educated conversation.

It’s like Test prep but it’s not memorizing and drilling it’s learning. Try it sometime.

I wonder why is that happening to Blacks but not Asians.

You wonder why redlining happened to blacks and not Asians?

well all those things. they were here first. they are the biggest minority.
they have much less language and cultural barier, etc.

Please don't tell me slavery, it's already 21st century.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

You should study and prepare for those major tests like that.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
What is matter with these people??

These tests weren’t originally meant to be taken after the extreme amounts of “prep” that sometimes occurs now. The scores are no longer useful in giving insight into a student’s potential, so colleges are moving away from using them. Scores acquired by extreme prepping practices simply are not that useful in distinguishing one student’s abilities forum another.

The best university in the world MIT disagrees with you after years of research.
Colleges are not moving away. I want to keep it in the name of test optional.

So, MIT has published a study comparing outcomes between students who engaged in extreme prepping practices for the SAT and ACT and those who did not? Do you have a link to that exact study?

You should study and prepare for those major tests such as SAT, MCAT, Bar Exam, Professional Engineer exam, etc.
It's expected.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
You just want to walk in without much effort? WTF

SAT is supposed to measure ability to learn, not what you have already learned.

the BAR exam and engineering tests test what you have already learned.

MIT research says SAT and GPA together are the best indication of how you'll be successful in college.

I can also say that BAR exam and Engineering tests idicate how succssful you will be in those professions.

MIT says they would like the option to see SAT. They also say they know a perfect SAT does not mean you will be a successful student at MIT. They also will accept applications without an SAT if you have a compelling reason.

Looks like MIT is smart enough to know it’s 1 data point with some information but not enough to choose a successful student.

You cite MIT because it's like the ONLY top college that went back to standardized testing, which fits your preference.

It's just one school that focuses on tech. A clear outlier since no other T25 college followed suit. Columbia went permanently test optional. The top colleges are test optional. They are not going back to requiring the SAT/ACT.

But keep pulling MIT out to make your point.

#sowhat

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is quite eye-opening to read some of these posts- so many people showing how racist they are, even while they claim that they are not. Their convoluted way of thinking seems so normal to them, that they truly have no idea how easily everyone else can see how superior they feel their own race is to all others.

I'm shocked by racism agasint Asians.

But you’re just fine with racism against other groups. We see how you think.

This exactly.

Keep the Black people out of elite colleges and the boardroom at any costs. But they can keep fighting the wars for the USA.

Are you saying that black people aren't smart enough for elite colleges or qualified enough for boardrooms?
Now, that is a racist mindset.

No, they are saying that laws will be made to keep black people out of college and boardrooms but laws to keep rich white kids in the pipeline will be maintained.

What part of the law will keep black people out of colleges and boardrooms??
Will they be discriminated??

You want me to educate you on education in poverty, red lining, lack of funding, racism in teacher, over policing of black makes in school?

You want me to educate you… no thanks, educate yourself then come back and have an educated conversation.

It’s like Test prep but it’s not memorizing and drilling it’s learning. Try it sometime.

I wonder why is that happening to Blacks but not Asians.

You wonder why redlining happened to blacks and not Asians?

well all those things. they were here first. they are the biggest minority.
they have much less language and cultural barier, etc.

Please don't tell me slavery, it's already 21st century.

Tell me you don’t understand American history without telling me.. current and recent.. slavery SMFH

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

You should study and prepare for those major tests like that.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
What is matter with these people??

These tests weren’t originally meant to be taken after the extreme amounts of “prep” that sometimes occurs now. The scores are no longer useful in giving insight into a student’s potential, so colleges are moving away from using them. Scores acquired by extreme prepping practices simply are not that useful in distinguishing one student’s abilities forum another.

The best university in the world MIT disagrees with you after years of research.
Colleges are not moving away. I want to keep it in the name of test optional.

So, MIT has published a study comparing outcomes between students who engaged in extreme prepping practices for the SAT and ACT and those who did not? Do you have a link to that exact study?

You should study and prepare for those major tests such as SAT, MCAT, Bar Exam, Professional Engineer exam, etc.
It's expected.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
You just want to walk in without much effort? WTF

SAT is supposed to measure ability to learn, not what you have already learned.

the BAR exam and engineering tests test what you have already learned.

MIT research says SAT and GPA together are the best indication of how you'll be successful in college.

I can also say that BAR exam and Engineering tests idicate how succssful you will be in those professions.

MIT says they would like the option to see SAT. They also say they know a perfect SAT does not mean you will be a successful student at MIT. They also will accept applications without an SAT if you have a compelling reason.

Looks like MIT is smart enough to know it’s 1 data point with some information but not enough to choose a successful student.

You cite MIT because it's like the ONLY top college that went back to standardized testing, which fits your preference.

It's just one school that focuses on tech. A clear outlier since no other T25 college followed suit. Columbia went permanently test optional. The top colleges are test optional. They are not going back to requiring the SAT/ACT.

But keep pulling MIT out to make your point.

#sowhat

If those schools think SAT is no good and not a good measrue, they wouldn've gone test blind already, not test optional.
they want to keep the test. they like high scores.

[Anonymous]

An aspect of the US Supreme court case involving Harvard University and affirmative action is that the litigants want to be admitted to a school for the best and most prestigious educational experience in the world, yet they want to change how that educational institution does its business.

This is not a matter of exclusion--as in not admitting applicants of a certain race, religion, or ethnicity, etc.--this is a case about forcing the arguably best educational institution in the world how to do its business in creating such a superb educational experience. And, yes, I do understand that it was brought & decided based on the US Constitution's equal protection clause of the 14th amendment, but, in this matter, it seems to be an overreach by the court. If, for example, we focus on Asian representation in the student body at Harvard College, Asians comprise about 6.3% of the US population, but are about 38% of the most recent entering class at Harvard--which does not appear to be a case of insidious discrimination when it is in fact a case of over-representation. And Harvard's admission policies do not constitute fraud, as Harvard is upfront that standardized test scores and GPAs are not the only factors considered in the admissions process. And class valedictorians and salutorians of many different races , religions, and ethnic backgrounds are denied admission to Harvard each and every year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

You should study and prepare for those major tests like that.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
What is matter with these people??

These tests weren’t originally meant to be taken after the extreme amounts of “prep” that sometimes occurs now. The scores are no longer useful in giving insight into a student’s potential, so colleges are moving away from using them. Scores acquired by extreme prepping practices simply are not that useful in distinguishing one student’s abilities forum another.

The best university in the world MIT disagrees with you after years of research.
Colleges are not moving away. I want to keep it in the name of test optional.

So, MIT has published a study comparing outcomes between students who engaged in extreme prepping practices for the SAT and ACT and those who did not? Do you have a link to that exact study?

You should study and prepare for those major tests such as SAT, MCAT, Bar Exam, Professional Engineer exam, etc.
It's expected.
If you are careless and don't do that, you don't belong in the elite schools.
You just want to walk in without much effort? WTF

SAT is supposed to measure ability to learn, not what you have already learned.

the BAR exam and engineering tests test what you have already learned.

MIT research says SAT and GPA together are the best indication of how you'll be successful in college.

I can also say that BAR exam and Engineering tests idicate how succssful you will be in those professions.

MIT says they would like the option to see SAT. They also say they know a perfect SAT does not mean you will be a successful student at MIT. They also will accept applications without an SAT if you have a compelling reason.

Looks like MIT is smart enough to know it’s 1 data point with some information but not enough to choose a successful student.

You cite MIT because it's like the ONLY top college that went back to standardized testing, which fits your preference.

It's just one school that focuses on tech. A clear outlier since no other T25 college followed suit. Columbia went permanently test optional. The top colleges are test optional. They are not going back to requiring the SAT/ACT.

But keep pulling MIT out to make your point.

#sowhat

If those schools think SAT is no good and not a good measrue, they wouldn've gone test blind already, not test optional.
they want to keep the test. they like high scores.

They will use it in the way it was originally intended to find a needle in a haystack.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:An aspect of the US Supreme court case involving Harvard University and affirmative action is that the litigants want to be admitted to a school for the best and most prestigious educational experience in the world, yet they want to change how that educational institution does its business.

This is not a matter of exclusion--as in not admitting applicants of a certain race, religion, or ethnicity, etc.--this is a case about forcing the arguably best educational institution in the world how to do its business in creating such a superb educational experience. And, yes, I do understand that it was brought & decided based on the US Constitution's equal protection clause of the 14th amendment, but, in this matter, it seems to be an overreach by the court. If, for example, we focus on Asian representation in the student body at Harvard College, Asians comprise about 6.3% of the US population, but are about 38% of the most recent entering class at Harvard--which does not appear to be a case of insidious discrimination when it is in fact a case of over-representation. And Harvard's admission policies do not constitute fraud, as Harvard is upfront that standardized test scores and GPAs are not the only factors considered in the admissions process. And class valedictorians and salutorians of many different races , religions, and ethnic backgrounds are denied admission to Harvard each and every year.

^ you're beating a dead horse. I'm sure many of us agree with you, but that position lost. Now Harvard just needs to figure out how to keep it's incoming classes diversified without over reliance on race and other prohibited factors. They're smart people there - I'm sure they'll figure out a way to do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the Harvard stats. 150 points lower on the SAT. Party of over. Time for merit.

Cheapened the degree.

It’s entirely possible that those 150 points are only due to prepping and that the non-prepped score is actually an equivalent. In other words, when you add in the advantage of prepping, the scores are pointing to the same amount of merit.

They recently spent 500 million dollars on the Adolescent Brain Cognitive Development (ABCD) study, which tested over 10,000 American ten-year-olds into adulthood: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41386-020-0736-6

The average IQ of Asians in the study was 108, Whites 100 and Blacks 83. Immigrant blacks averaged 91.

I’m sure some of the gap is due to a culture that emphasizes academics, but there’s an almost 2 standard deviation gap between Asians and Blacks. Given these IQ scores, the test score gaps we see make perfect sense. This also helps explain why a large fraction of Blacks in top schools are the children of immigrants.

Are Asian students okay with attending an school with an all-Asian student body in a very diverse country ?

I understand that the response is likely to be that one wants to attend university with the best qualified students regardless of race/ethnicity so that if the best qualified are all Asian students, then so be it. But, this raises the issue of what constitutes the "best qualified" ? Is the American educational experience just about book learning and tests ?

Aren't Blacks okay with attending an school with almost all Blacks today? Also Whites?

You asking this type of question seems racist oriented. Open your mind.

Because I prefer a diverse educational environment & experience, you think that I have a closed mind ?

No, I would not like attending an all white or all black school as I value and crave diversity.

Others may prefer the comfort of attending an all black, all white, all Asian, all Jewish, all Catholic, all Baptist, etc. school, but I would not as I value the experience and learning derived from involvement in a diverse environment.

Yes everyone is difference and have different preference
So we have 3000+ 4 year colleges to choose from.
This is great thing about the US. Lots of options.
Pick what you like, but I'm not sure why you are so interested in other people's choices.
You think your choice is the only right answer?

No, I do not think that my preference is the only "right answer", but I do think that it is the best answer because we live and work in a diverse environment.

I appreciate that there are well over 3,000 four year colleges & universities in the US, but this court case involves one of the most selective & prestigious schools in the world.

Have you ever asked Black people "Are you okay with attending an school with 80% Black student body in a very diverse country?"
or White people "Are you okay with attending an school with 80% White student body in a very diverse country?

If not, why only ask that kind of quesiton to Asians?
And those schools actually exist today unlike the imaginative Asian schools.

The the bigger problem seems to me is that people like you are a racist even without realizing you are a racist.

Asking a question/raising an issue that has been the most discussed in this thread is not racist.

You seem to be too sensitive and probably need to examine your own orientation.

As I noted in my earlier post, the same issue was addressed regarding white, black, Asian, as well as several different religions. You need to read more carefully & try to keep your emotions in check & focus on using your intellect more.