Are you offended when someone says they “didnt want someone else to raise my kids”?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone even ask why someone chose to work or stay home? I mean if you ask the question, then you should be prepared to hear the answer even if it feels judgy and unpleasant. The issue is that I don’t think people are asking the question before someone volunteers the explanation.

Not my experience as a sahm but maybe because it's a rare choice in my community. People do ask, especially when they look down on someone's choice and cannot comprehend why one would choose what they consider a lesser choice. They are quite insistent but I think if I gave them my reasons, they'd get more upset, there's no winning when someone had made up their mind so I try to stay vague or end the conversation. Most people (like vast majority) do not question it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I get it, because it’s true, even if people don’t want to admit that’s what’s happening when children are in full-time daycare. But in polite society we avoid saying things that might hurt someone’s feelings, regardless of whether it’s truthful or not.

But it’s not truthful. My kids went to daycare, and, sure, their daycare teachers, who were all wonderful, provided care during the workday. But my spouse and I made the decisions on how to parent, which included finding great caregivers.

If your children go to daycare for 10-11 (7-6 or 7:30-5:30) hours a day for the first 4-5 years of life and sleep 10-12 hours a night then you are not spending 4-5 hours with them each day 70% of the week. How is this controversial? You are outsourcing a lot of parenting duties to other caregivers. Someone saying that they don’t want to do that is not wrong. And I’m saying this as a full time working parent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I get it, because it’s true, even if people don’t want to admit that’s what’s happening when children are in full-time daycare. But in polite society we avoid saying things that might hurt someone’s feelings, regardless of whether it’s truthful or not.

But it’s not truthful. My kids went to daycare, and, sure, their daycare teachers, who were all wonderful, provided care during the workday. But my spouse and I made the decisions on how to parent, which included finding great caregivers.

If your children go to daycare for 10-11 (7-6 or 7:30-5:30) hours a day for the first 4-5 years of life and sleep 10-12 hours a night then you are not spending 4-5 hours with them each day 70% of the week. How is this controversial? You are outsourcing a lot of parenting duties to other caregivers. Someone saying that they don’t want to do that is not wrong. And I’m saying this as a
full time working parent.

Does your math include weekends, holidays, and vacations? Why do naps at daycare count as daycare time but night sleeps don’t count for parents?

At least be consistent.

[Anonymous]

When my kids were little I was at a gathering of family friends. We all had little kids the same age, but DH and I were the only dual income couple. I overheard the other dads congratulating themselves that they "didn't have to have a stranger raise their kids." At another point my dear friend was feeling restless as her kids got a little older and wished she could work again. I pointed out that she could if she wanted to, that day care is an option (my kid was in day care). She vehemently replied "It isn't for me."

Was I hurt by those things? Yes. My kids are in highschool, and clearly it is still stings.

And yet these friendships endure, and our kids are all doing well. You can't tell which had a parent at home and which didn't. Its just that when kids are little our emotions are so tender, and each decision feels like it can make or break our kids. Compassion for each other helps.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When my kids were little I was at a gathering of family friends. We all had little kids the same age, but DH and I were the only dual income couple. I overheard the other dads congratulating themselves that they "didn't have to have a stranger raise their kids." At another point my dear friend was feeling restless as her kids got a little older and wished she could work again. I pointed out that she could if she wanted to, that day care is an option (my kid was in day care). She vehemently replied "It isn't for me."

Was I hurt by those things? Yes. My kids are in highschool, and clearly it is still stings.

And yet these friendships endure, and our kids are all doing well. You can't tell which had a parent at home and which didn't. Its just that when kids are little our emotions are so tender, and each decision feels like it can make or break our kids. Compassion for each other helps.

If two people are feeling insecure and unsure, it’s so hard to talk about these things. If you were the only one in the group with kids in daycare, it must have felt odd. And she’s couldn’t talk to you about her restlessness without hurting you even though she added the caveat that daycare was not an option “for her.”

But I’m glad you weathered through even if you remember it.

[Anonymous]

It’s rude and it’s typically sexist. The women who say it would certainly never say that their husbands aren’t raising their children, and would not say to a professional man with a SAH spouse that they stay at home so they can raise their children.

(though they might say something like “because I love being with my children” which is a statement about themselves and not about the moral value of the decision)

Internalized misogyny is real, and it’s sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I get it, because it’s true, even if people don’t want to admit that’s what’s happening when children are in full-time daycare. But in polite society we avoid saying things that might hurt someone’s feelings, regardless of whether it’s truthful or not.

But it’s not truthful. My kids went to daycare, and, sure, their daycare teachers, who were all wonderful, provided care during the workday. But my spouse and I made the decisions on how to parent, which included finding great caregivers.

If your children go to daycare for 10-11 (7-6 or 7:30-5:30) hours a day for the first 4-5 years of life and sleep 10-12 hours a night then you are not spending 4-5 hours with them each day 70% of the week. How is this controversial? You are outsourcing a lot of parenting duties to other caregivers. Someone saying that they don’t want to do that is not wrong. And I’m saying this as a full time working parent.

I actually did the math with my neighbor who was a SAHM and I did spend more 1-1 time with my kids than she did.

1st. My H's time counted and I know many of SAHP's who are the 1st to tell you that their H does nothing, works late, travels a lot.
2nd: She did not take into account napping, time in front of TV, time they were in the basement playing and she was futzing around.

I don't think a SAHP should be connected at the hip and I think that independent time is valuable but the reality is she was not spending more 1-1 time with her child than I was.

[Anonymous]

I know plenty of screwed up children who had full time moms at home.

[Anonymous]

We can fight with eachother as parents or we could actually lobby the government and businesses for infant parental leave, reasonable work hours with vacation time. We can also question men who don’t take paternity leave instead of shaming the ones that do, stop being angry at colleagues for having sick kids or volunteering at their kids school, and recognize that supporting parents is a societal issue that affects everyone and is worth investing in.

[Anonymous]

No. It only reflects poorly on the speaker.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread shows such a misunderstanding about child development and attachment. I'm a parent who has done multiple options - full time 8 hrs a day home daycare for 1.5 years, part time 4 days a week half day preschool (while I was part time) for a couple years, and now one in elementary school and one in preschool 9-3 pm each day. My career/background is in child development as well. And this whole thread is missing the point - the way attachment works means that parents still have WAY more influence over a child. Way, way. It actually isn't about hours. Most parents that work full time that are present and connected to their children when they aren't working are 100% the primary caregiver and research shows have the most influence BY FAR on the child.

Is the work that caregivers do at preschools, daycares etc important? Of course - it is important they are loving, that the care is responsive, flexible etc. but they will never have more influence than a connected parent even if there are technically more hours in a day. It just isn't how it works.

So, parents staying home can say that and it is a decision I understand - I've adjusted my career as well because it was what worked best for me. But to the PhD parent at the front of this thread claiming how smart they are, reading about how attachment works would really help. Kids with parents who work full time but have a connected, warm, loving, responsive relationship at home are absolutely just fine.

This is too simplistic. It's very dependent on individual circumstances.

This is why this "debate" always goes nowhere. People talk past each other. The person saying they "didn't want someone else to raise my kids" may not have had access to loving and responsive and flexible paid caregivers. If you are looking at daycares and all you can afford are places that don't seem like particularly great places for your kids to spend 8+ hours a day then it's actually really reasonable to say you decided you didn't want "someone else" to raise your kids when the someone else is a substandard care situation.

But then working moms who have access to the best possible childcare (like a lot of the moms on this site) hear it and take offense and talk about how great their nanny is and how they WFH three days a week and they or their husband is always home by 4:30 and so on. Great! No one is talking about that situation because it's literally ideal. If you are well off and well resourced then who cares what you do -- you're kids will be fine.

But most parents are not in that situation. I wasn't. I had to choose between staying home in order to ensure my child actually got the attentive and loving care that she needed in order to develop well and correctly or continuing to work but sending her to a daycare facility that had policies and qualities that threw up major red flags for me as someone with a background in child development. It didn't actually feel like a choice. I went back to work later and I'm glad I was able to stay home for a while (and the proof is in the pudding -- my kid got what she needed) and I'm also glad I was able to go back because I like my work and I really like earning my own money.

I know how freaking touchy everyone is about this subject so I'd never say something as triggering as "I didn't want someone else to raise my kids." But quite literally I stayed home because I didn't want someone else [who I didn't trust and who I don't think had the correct skill set for it] to raise my kid." Just because that's the situation I was in doesn't mean my choice or the reasons for my choice are a commentary on anyone else but least of all some high income working parent with tons of great childcare options! We are not the same and we didn't have the same choices. Stop being so myopic.

So how do you feel about the parents who DID send their kids to that daycare? Because clearly there are a lot of them.

It's almost like you can't even hear yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is not an acceptable turn of phrase.

But I am not offended because it shows the low character of the speaker. Just as if they had said they work FT because “I wanted to use my brain”

Literally been said to my face numerous times, during the times when it didn't work full time.

And also, BOTH statements have truth in them. I DO use my brain more when I work full time and there IS someone else raising your child when you outsource childcare.

HELPING to raise your child. Do you not get the difference?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone even ask why someone chose to work or stay home? I mean if you ask the question, then you should be prepared to hear the answer even if it feels judgy and unpleasant. The issue is that I don’t think people are asking the question before someone volunteers the explanation.

I don’t ever talk about this in real life. I only comment online if someone says something offensive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If I said, I want to be the primary caregiver as a reason behind my choose to stay home, would that be offensive?

There is a saying in the medical field "the care of the patient is in the care of the patient" and I think that the same is true of children. Pumping breast milk and having a third party give it to your child is not the same as nursing your baby. The same way that you can't care for a patient with the same efficacy via email.

So dads aren't parents? Adoptive parents aren't parents? Women who can't breastfeed for whatever reason aren't parents?

The difference between emailing a patient and seeing them in person is in no way related to the difference between bottle and breastfeeding a child. You're a moron.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We can fight with eachother as parents or we could actually lobby the government and businesses for infant parental leave, reasonable work hours with vacation time. We can also question men who don’t take paternity leave instead of shaming the ones that do, stop being angry at colleagues for having sick kids or volunteering at their kids school, and recognize that supporting parents is a societal issue that affects everyone and is worth investing in.

This.

I was once volunteering at my childs school, I did it a lot since I have a flexible schedule, the other moms were like "working moms this", "working moms that"... blah blah blah and they turned to me... like right? and said, Oh I am a working mom. I just took 2 hours leave for this and will make it up tomorrow.

That is how it should be... but I will point out the volunteering was mostly nonsensical and provided little to no value to the school so that should really be run by someone who knows how to maximize it's value.