I told DW it’s time for her to return to work FT

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can she really make that much? I had two masters and never cracked 50k. It sounds like if she worked full time that is about what she would make. Her salary would go to the commute and take out unless the kids make dinner.

I have one Master's degree, been in the field 5 years and I make more than $50k now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
What if she's fine living on a lower income? You can't make someone work for a lifestyle they don't want, OP. This is my husband. He has a high IQ, multiple terminal degrees, and earns very little in a little business working for NIH scientists. It's maddening that he thinks everything is peachy when all his peers have actual careers and make much more.

Or, he could get a better paying job. That is what my husband did.

You don't understand. My husband is FINE with this situation. He's been refusing to budge for years. This is why it's maddening.
And he doesn't help around the house either.

OP can make more money. Your husband probably has a good income just not good enough for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can she really make that much? I had two masters and never cracked 50k. It sounds like if she worked full time that is about what she would make. Her salary would go to the commute and take out unless the kids make dinner.

Yes. I am. But STEM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Tell her divorce, or she works. I am a female and I can not imagine not pulling my weight financially in a relationship.

Be careful about issuing ultimatums you’re not willing to follow through on.

If you do this and don’t divorce, all that happened is that you damaged your relationship, you’re still agonizing over every financial decision and your wife won’t take you seriously. If you do divorce, I guarantee you will have significantly less money than you do right now. Whatever small savings you currently have will be depleted. Half of your retirement will be gone. Financially you will be worse off than you are today.

So, maybe instead of going down the ultimatum road, why not insist on marriage counseling?

You will probably have to let go of the idea of a 70K windfall from your wife’s hypothetical full time job. Your wife will probably have to find a better paying part time job or work longer hours. You will both have to give a little to avoid losing a lot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
What if she's fine living on a lower income? You can't make someone work for a lifestyle they don't want, OP. This is my husband. He has a high IQ, multiple terminal degrees, and earns very little in a little business working for NIH scientists. It's maddening that he thinks everything is peachy when all his peers have actual careers and make much more.

Or, he could get a better paying job. That is what my husband did.

You don't understand. My husband is FINE with this situation. He's been refusing to budge for years. This is why it's maddening.
And he doesn't help around the house either.

OP can make more money. Your husband probably has a good income just not good enough for you.

25K for the year, in the DC area. He has a PhD. His business is not working, he just doesn't want to admit it and likes the low pressure. What was that you said about a good income?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can she really make that much? I had two masters and never cracked 50k. It sounds like if she worked full time that is about what she would make. Her salary would go to the commute and take out unless the kids make dinner.

If she makes $18 part time she'll make $40, maybe 50K. After taxes, a housekeeper and extra expenses due to work it may not be as much as he thinks.

Not everyone has a housekeeper, Gardner, etc. They will be fine without those things.... She needs to help towards the children college, their own retirement, etc. What is wrong with people not contributing to their own life?

She very much is contribution. They don't need a housekeeper or gardner as she dose all that. He only "helps" with the kids so what driving a few times for activities. Nothing wrong with staying home. When we are all dead, reality is we are replaceable at our jobs and no one will care when you are six feet under. You value what you do far more than others do. What she does is equally if not more valuable and he couldn't do everything he had to do if he had to do 1/2 which he probably has no concept of as she just does it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
What if she's fine living on a lower income? You can't make someone work for a lifestyle they don't want, OP. This is my husband. He has a high IQ, multiple terminal degrees, and earns very little in a little business working for NIH scientists. It's maddening that he thinks everything is peachy when all his peers have actual careers and make much more.

Or, he could get a better paying job. That is what my husband did.

You don't understand. My husband is FINE with this situation. He's been refusing to budge for years. This is why it's maddening.
And he doesn't help around the house either.

OP can make more money. Your husband probably has a good income just not good enough for you.

25K for the year, in the DC area. He has a PhD. His business is not working, he just doesn't want to admit it and likes the low pressure. What was that you said about a good income?

Yes, it is good income if your expenses are low.

[Anonymous]

Hopefully you approached the conversation more diplomatically than your post title suggests. Your feelings are valid, but your tone and wording implies that you are the boss and you're telling your wife what she needs to do.

If I were in her shoes, I would resist going back to work being approached like that.

On the other hand, if you said you had concerns about family finances and asked me when it would be a good time to discuss it, I'd happily be involved with the conversation and coming up with a plan. That plan may be too look for a job. It may be to cut expenses. It may be a combination of the two. But I'd want the conversation to center on the fact that we are the team.

She may be feeling insecure about her career and current marketability. She may also be feeling undervalued for the effort she put into raising kids and making home life run smoother. I'm almost certain that expressing your appreciation for what she's done will go a long way in helping you achieve your objective. Otherwise it's too easy for her to end up feeling defensive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tell her divorce, or she works. I am a female and I cannot imagine not pulling my weight financially in a relationship.

+100

Stupid advice. If there is a divorce. OP and his family will be in a worse situation financially as well as emotionally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
What if she's fine living on a lower income? You can't make someone work for a lifestyle they don't want, OP. This is my husband. He has a high IQ, multiple terminal degrees, and earns very little in a little business working for NIH scientists. It's maddening that he thinks everything is peachy when all his peers have actual careers and make much more.

She can live on her own $18k income after her husband divorces her, then.

They have kids. She'd get child support and possibly alimony.

And have to support herself for the rest. Seems fair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Tell her divorce, or she works. I am a female and I can not imagine not pulling my weight financially in a relationship.

Be careful about issuing ultimatums you’re not willing to follow through on.

If you do this and don’t divorce, all that happened is that you damaged your relationship, you’re still agonizing over every financial decision and your wife won’t take you seriously. If you do divorce, I guarantee you will have significantly less money than you do right now. Whatever small savings you currently have will be depleted. Half of your retirement will be gone. Financially you will be worse off than you are today.

So, maybe instead of going down the ultimatum road, why not insist on marriage counseling?

You will probably have to let go of the idea of a 70K windfall from your wife’s hypothetical full time job. Your wife will probably have to find a better paying part time job or work longer hours. You will both have to give a little to avoid losing a lot.

Post taxes, extra expenses related to work, someone picking up the slack at home, its not going to be close to $70K if she's only making 18K now. Maybe $40-50, possibly $60 but she'll be taxed at his rate, minus social security and all that, so she'll bring home much much less.

I'd be fine with an ultimatum. I'd get a job and while job searching I'd pack my husband's stuff and leave it at the door saying he wanted a divorce, here it is. Hand him his stuff and paperwork and he can have the kids every other weekend and one night a week.

[Anonymous]

You still have kids at home. To you it’s a no-brainer. For her - it will turn her whole world upside down. Will the kids come home to an empty house? Are they old enough to drive themselves to practices? Are you prepared to miss work to cover 50% of the crap that comes up during the day that she’s likely been covering herself for years? What do the kids do all summer while school’s out?

When a mom goes back to work FT after 15 years, everyone suffers a little bit. It will be a big adjustment for the whole family.

There’s more to life than money. Personally I’d rather eat beans than be forced back to work FT against my will so my teens can go home to an empty house from 2-6 every day. It’s not about keeping up with the rainmaker friends. It’s about maintaining connections with the kids while they’re still at home. They’re only under your roof for a couple more years. Can’t you catch up on savings once the kids are gone?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
What if she's fine living on a lower income? You can't make someone work for a lifestyle they don't want, OP. This is my husband. He has a high IQ, multiple terminal degrees, and earns very little in a little business working for NIH scientists. It's maddening that he thinks everything is peachy when all his peers have actual careers and make much more.

Or, he could get a better paying job. That is what my husband did.

You don't understand. My husband is FINE with this situation. He's been refusing to budge for years. This is why it's maddening.
And he doesn't help around the house either.

OP can make more money. Your husband probably has a good income just not good enough for you.

I’m a GS15 in my late 40s, assume OP is in his 50s.

How do we magically increase our incomes? I’ve applied to dozens of equivalent private industry roles, gotten at least a dozen offers and none paid any more than I make now but involved more risk. I imagine if I went into company leadership I would make more, but no traction when I broached that during negotiations. And of course you have seen many threads about being laid off in 50s.

So I would really like to know how OP can whip up another $40k like that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hopefully you approached the conversation more diplomatically than your post title suggests. Your feelings are valid, but your tone and wording implies that you are the boss and you're telling your wife what she needs to do.

If I were in her shoes, I would resist going back to work being approached like that.

On the other hand, if you said you had concerns about family finances and asked me when it would be a good time to discuss it, I'd happily be involved with the conversation and coming up with a plan. That plan may be too look for a job. It may be to cut expenses. It may be a combination of the two. But I'd want the conversation to center on the fact that we are the team.

She may be feeling insecure about her career and current marketability. She may also be feeling undervalued for the effort she put into raising kids and making home life run smoother. I'm almost certain that expressing your appreciation for what she's done will go a long way in helping you achieve your objective. Otherwise it's too easy for her to end up feeling defensive.

PP, you hit the nail on the head!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
What if she's fine living on a lower income? You can't make someone work for a lifestyle they don't want, OP. This is my husband. He has a high IQ, multiple terminal degrees, and earns very little in a little business working for NIH scientists. It's maddening that he thinks everything is peachy when all his peers have actual careers and make much more.

She can live on her own $18k income after her husband divorces her, then.

They have kids. She'd get child support and possibly alimony.

And have to support herself for the rest. Seems fair.

For 4 years maybe, kids are in high school.