Exposing kids to dysfunctional relatives

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think when you are as blunt as you were with your mom then you invariably set up a fight, which it sounds like you now have. So my advice is to tone down the words in the future. Why throw oil on the flames?

You should not ever put your children in a situation where there is a sexual predator because you may not be able to protect them. However, for garden variety dysfunction, it can be helpful to expose your children in small doses so that they can have their own range of experiences and judgements. If you have been doing a good job as a parent, and it sounds like you have, then they will be able to read the signals and develop their own assessment of their relatives, and it most likely will coincide with yours. If you never expose them then you leave them open to being surprised one day by a relative or someone with similar patterns, and your kids may not have developed the skills to cope or repel the person.

I do question the wisdom of leaving your children with someone whom you feel did not protect you as a child. Has your mother changed that much? Or do you think that the situation is more controlled? It seems odd.

I agree with this. You did nothing wrong but it seems a little illogical to describe your parents who failed to protect you and are presumably connected to this dysfunctional family as somehow separate from it. Unless they also chose to distance themselves (which it sounds like is not the case since they want to go to this wedding), I have a hard time believing they totally have it together. But OP would be in a better position to judge that.

I can see where you are coming from in questioning my mothers judgement. I do too. The cousin getting married is not one that I would lump in with the other crazy relatives. He just finished law school and has a nice fiancé. My mom was only looking at that. I however don’t want to take the chance that other relatives will appear and causes issues or do something inappropriate.

Okay, that sounds logical. I normally I would be inclined to take the kids if your estranged family members were just more typically dysfunctional, especially since you like this cousin, but you know your family best and it sounds like you're right to be concerned.

As an aside, you might want to even start talking about your family a little bit. You don't have to make anyone sound scary (except the sexual predator and that one you be very clear that your kids should never be alone with him/her and tell you about any interaction) but you can say stuff like 'Aunt Larla is a nice person but she is an alcoholic. That's a person who drinks too much alcohol and it makes her do/say crazy things. We love her but not her behavior' or 'Cousin Laslo gets upset really easily and gets into a lot of fights so we just try to stay away from him and not get into any arguments' or whatever feels comfortable to you. Again, forewarned is forearmed. In this case, it is called pre-talk and it is something you can do with regular stuff (today we're going to have breakfast then go to the park then come back for naps before lunch...) as well as with stuff like family relationships before you see the family members.

[Anonymous]

I agree with 21:36. I tend to think that for garden-variety dysfunction, you just give kids a heads-up so that the behavior doesn't totally confuse them. I would draw a hard line and being around someone who was credibly accused of sexual abuse.

[Anonymous]

I get the being around someone accused of sexual assault but it feels like you would know if someone like that was attending?

I have to say its a little weird to say your kids can't attend a wedding, at which most people will be on better behavior than normal.

I don't know this is weird. I can't imagine asking to take the kids of someone who had disowned their family to a family wedding. Like how does your mom not know this? Does your mom get along with her family? Is there some deep sadness in her that you are estranged? Is there really only like one redeemable person?

This feels a little overly dramatic no matter how you slice it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I get the being around someone accused of sexual assault but it feels like you would know if someone like that was attending?

I have to say its a little weird to say your kids can't attend a wedding, at which most people will be on better behavior than normal.

I don't know this is weird. I can't imagine asking to take the kids of someone who had disowned their family to a family wedding. Like how does your mom not know this? Does your mom get along with her family? Is there some deep sadness in her that you are estranged? Is there really only like one redeemable person?

This feels a little overly dramatic no matter how you slice it.

I disagree that you will know if the pedophile is attending. Families with incest don't think it's a "big deal".

Our family will lie and then when we show up after driving 3 hours and have to turn around and go home the "family" act like we are over reacting.

Our trauma therapist says this is very common in families with sex offenders.

[Anonymous]

I think you're fine OP. I don't think you should be surprised at your mother's reaction, and maybe in hindsight you could have tempered how you delivered the message. But I also think it's fine for you to decide you're not going to shirk away from being clear about the boundaries you set for your kids.

I have a lot of extended family dysfunction also so I fully understand having to make the kinds of decisions you made here. I have found becoming a mother to be one of the most helpful and clarifying things for me in establishing healthy boundaries. I am crystal clear on not wanting to subject my children to the dynamics I experienced growing up. I have zero guilt about that clarity and it is very helpful to me when I'm torn by family allegiances, guilt trips, emotional reactions, etc...

I do try to avoid overt conflict when necessary, but my role and job as a mom trumps everything else. So you have my unqualified support for your the right thing for your kids. Good for you.

Obviously, you won't always be able to shelter your kids from their extended family, but you can manage that exposure and wait until they're old enough for appropriate conversation around it.

[Anonymous]

OP your family sounds so similar to mine. It’s a sad and stressful situation. Stand firm on not allowing your kids to go. It’s your decision, and it’s a good and healthy decision.

Now you need to reflect on your mom’s actions. I’m sure she’s doing better by your kids than she did by you as far as exposing anyone to dysfunction goes. However, she’s showing you that she wants to have her grandkids meet the rest of her family. Maybe she wants to show them off, or maybe someone’s been asking about them and she wants to please that person. Either way, are you sure she won’t just go without asking next time? Maybe not a wedding but lunch with Auntie Molester’s Wife or Cousin Alcoholic. “But I was there the whole tim so nothing could’ve happened.”

That’s what my mom did. I’ve been estranged from my divorced grandparents (and most of my extended family) for years. They were abusive to my mom and looked the other way when a family member sexually abused her as a child. One is an alcoholic chain smoker. They’re both raging racists. I made it clear when my kids were little that my grandparents were not to meet my children. We just went round and round with my mom who was upset that my sister wouldn’t invite them to her wedding, and my mom was shocked that I supported her decision. I reminded her then that they’re not even allowed to be around my kids, so why would I want them at the wedding either. The next time my kids visited her, she took them to run an errand and drop something off at her mom’s house and let her meet my kids. Then she felt like it would be unfair for her not to give equal time to my grandfather so she took them to visit him. My parents are not allowed unsupervised access to my children anymore.

[Anonymous]

11:15 here again. I wonder if the people saying you should’ve delivered the message less bluntly have dealt with this level of dysfunction before. You have to be very clear about boundaries. Crystal clear.

OP’s mom knew OP’s feelings about not being around those people, and keeping her kids away, and still expected an exception to be made for a family wedding. That kind of twisted thinking permeates dysfunctional families, and if you don’t spell out the rules exactly, cross every t and dot every i, some people will look for loopholes then try to feign ignorance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:11:15 here again. I wonder if the people saying you should’ve delivered the message less bluntly have dealt with this level of dysfunction before. You have to be very clear about boundaries. Crystal clear.

OP’s mom knew OP’s feelings about not being around those people, and keeping her kids away, and still expected an exception to be made for a family wedding. That kind of twisted thinking permeates dysfunctional families, and if you don’t spell out the rules exactly, cross every t and dot every i, some people will look for loopholes then try to feign ignorance.

11:32 here. I totally agree with this.

[Anonymous]

Jeez - I meant 11:15, not 11:32.

[Anonymous]

OP here. I just learned my mother took them to this wedding anyways against my wishes. I am beside myself. She claims it was only to drop off a card and then leave, but that feels beside the point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I just learned my mother took them to this wedding anyways against my wishes. I am beside myself. She claims it was only to drop off a card and then leave, but that feels beside the point.

NP: I'm sorry, and that sucks, but why was your mom watching your kids if you don't trust her? I don't trust my mom not to do certain things, so I don't let her watch the kids unless in very, very limited circumstances.

It blows not to be able to trust your parents to care for your children. Totally. But it is what it is. You can't accept free childcare and then expect to get your way with everything, especially not in a dysfunctional family. It just doesn't work that way. It's a grieving process to realize that (or has been for me), but I feel so much better with this clarity.

[Anonymous]

The PPs saying that it’s all fine if the kids are given a little verbal warning first must have absolutely no idea about the emotional/psychological damage that a truly dysfunctional family can do. It affects adults even with many years of life experience, therapy, and knowing exactly what to expect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I just learned my mother took them to this wedding anyways against my wishes. I am beside myself. She claims it was only to drop off a card and then leave, but that feels beside the point.

NP: I'm sorry, and that sucks, but why was your mom watching your kids if you don't trust her? I don't trust my mom not to do certain things, so I don't let her watch the kids unless in very, very limited circumstances.

It blows not to be able to trust your parents to care for your children. Totally. But it is what it is. You can't accept free childcare and then expect to get your way with everything, especially not in a dysfunctional family. It just doesn't work that way. It's a grieving process to realize that (or has been for me), but I feel so much better with this clarity.

Thank you for your advice. I’ve had a complicated relationship with my mother since I was a child. She comes from a very large and dysfuntional family. While I was never directly subject to abuse from her relatives, I’ve witness her family member physically fighting and abusing their children along with a lot of vulgar and preverted talk that young kids shouldn’t hear. Although I have never been molested my extended family was aware that an older cousin was molesting younger cousins and basically looked the other way until one decided to file charges unsuccessfully after the statute of limitations. Sometimes my aunts and uncles would tease me about my appreance I cried as a child and my mother did nothing. Other times I’ve witness relatives abuse drugs and one aunt after she was stabbed when I was in elementary school. Logic would tell me that a parent would no longer bring their child around these environments but she continiued and my father did object.. She knows how I feel and it look me moving on a different coast for two decades to let go of some of my resentment. Since my kids were born, both of my parents have been exceptional grandparents. My kids adore them more than anyone. My only request in order to protect my kids is that they not be around my mothers extended family. Today I found out via social media, not my mom that they were by my family. To make matters worse my parents are blaming me for being so angry and accused me of raising them in an classist bubnle( my husband and I are very wealthy and my mom’s family is not). I feel like I’ve been gaslighted about the whole issue.

[Anonymous]

11:15 here again. The more you tell about her, the more she sounds like my mom. She crossed a line. I absolutely would not allow them to be alone with your kids anymore if I were you. If you let this slide, they’ll chip away at all your rules and standards. They clearly don’t respect you. They’re falling back into the roles of them being the parents and you being the child, and thinking they get to make the rules without regards to your feelings. It won’t get any better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I just learned my mother took them to this wedding anyways against my wishes. I am beside myself. She claims it was only to drop off a card and then leave, but that feels beside the point.

NP: I'm sorry, and that sucks, but why was your mom watching your kids if you don't trust her? I don't trust my mom not to do certain things, so I don't let her watch the kids unless in very, very limited circumstances.

It blows not to be able to trust your parents to care for your children. Totally. But it is what it is. You can't accept free childcare and then expect to get your way with everything, especially not in a dysfunctional family. It just doesn't work that way. It's a grieving process to realize that (or has been for me), but I feel so much better with this clarity.

Thank you for your advice. I’ve had a complicated relationship with my mother since I was a child. She comes from a very large and dysfuntional family. While I was never directly subject to abuse from her relatives, I’ve witness her family member physically fighting and abusing their children along with a lot of vulgar and preverted talk that young kids shouldn’t hear. Although I have never been molested my extended family was aware that an older cousin was molesting younger cousins and basically looked the other way until one decided to file charges unsuccessfully after the statute of limitations. Sometimes my aunts and uncles would tease me about my appreance I cried as a child and my mother did nothing. Other times I’ve witness relatives abuse drugs and one aunt after she was stabbed when I was in elementary school. Logic would tell me that a parent would no longer bring their child around these environments but she continiued and my father did object.. She knows how I feel and it look me moving on a different coast for two decades to let go of some of my resentment. Since my kids were born, both of my parents have been exceptional grandparents. My kids adore them more than anyone. My only request in order to protect my kids is that they not be around my mothers extended family. Today I found out via social media, not my mom that they were by my family. To make matters worse my parents are blaming me for being so angry and accused me of raising them in an classist bubnle( my husband and I are very wealthy and my mom’s family is not). I feel like I’ve been gaslighted about the whole issue.

I'm so sorry, OP. Your mom's family sounds a lot like my in-laws. Thankfully they're not local so we don't have to deal with these issues. My family of origin is local and we have other issues with them, such that I no longer trust my parents to watch my kids for any extended period of time. (And we found out that they allowed my sister, who has multiple psychiatric diseases and is recently relapsed to drinking alcohol, to take all three of our young kids to the park solo only because the oldest told us after the fact. That did it for me.)

It sounds like the really awful thing is them disobeying your wishes after the detente of them being loving grandparents. It's awful to realize you can't trust your parents. They may have been gaslighting you, or they may truly not get what the big deal is and lashing out is a way to express general anger/shame at the wreck of your mom's family. There's no logic here, or so I've learned with my family. People act on emotion and trying to protect some part of themselves, and that overshadows reason.

If you haven't been in therapy, I've found it very helpful. Other than that, setting firm boundaries (and enforcing them over and over when family tries to cross them) and finding the people you do want as your family help. But it's also very hard, and lonely, to realize that this is who your family of origin is. It's a grieving process and while time helps, not always linear. For now, take good care of you. I'm sorry this happened.