Has a male boss ever told you to be "nicer"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would say, " 'Nicer' implies there are emotions involved. There are none. I was trying to move business forward, and that's what I'm here to do support the business." People don't often like to hear that, but as I say, we're not running a day care, we're running a business.

Men often try to appeal to emotions when dealing with women, it becomes our responsibility to take that type of communication off the table.

I agree completely.

The nicer meant have been in the context of Op saying she rebuffed the efforts of this staffer to help and she 'worked around' the staffer. The staffer might have felt this was not a nice way to be treated by OP. I can see saying if a female employee came to me and said a new male employee was not listening to her input, rebuffing her efforts to help, working around her and generally not working with her, an being aggressive - that as a boss I might tell him he needs to be nicer to fit in and be a better team member.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:He was being nice and didn't say stop being a bitch

Agreed. That is what he was saying. The point is (even though it cannot be proven here) that the interaction in question simply was not aggressive or "not-nice" in any way. It was a very normal interaction - albeit an interaction of a more senior person needing decisive action from a more junior person. That's the problem -- that this boss is so ready to accept that staff member's account of a normal interaction. In addition, it is odd that a senior executive (the boss) would feel so comfortable sharing that I should be "nicer." I am a senior exec woman. WTH was he thinking in making such and incendiary remark?

Meh. Just from your posts, it's clear that you are very focused on hierarchy and making sure everyone knows from the get-go that you are an "executive."

Your boss is trying to give you some useful feedback on how to interact with others in the organization. Keep up the drama you've already managed to create in a short time and your bosses will tell you that it's just not working out.

[Anonymous]

I am afraid you just have to suck it up and watch your back. Either this place has a very fragile office culture, or that jr employee has a lot of sway for some reason. I would try to cultivate some female allies so you can learn more about the culture. It may not be a good fit for you. On the other hand you should be honest with yourself too - have you run into trouble in the past wrt interpersonal communication styles?

[Anonymous]

I can relate, OP. You're in a delicate situation since you're new to the company. I'd probably start documenting any questionable interactions in case you get this sort of feedback again. You'd be able to say, "You know, Bob, I took your initial feedback very seriously and have been really attentive to my interactions. I've started making notes in the moment so that I can review them and look for patterns...." Presumably, your notes will show that you behaved appropriately, make clear that you are attentive to your professional demeanor, and make him think twice before offering one-sided critique in the future.

Best case, it makes you look serious and professional and thoughtful about feedback. Worst case, this is the first in a series of incidents that reveal a pattern of sexism, and you've created a paper trail.

Good luck!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In a job at a senior executive level (i.e., the type of job where you have to be there bearer of bad news, tell people things they might not want to hear, etc.). Recently, the head of another department (but a "boss" nonetheless) told me that a more junior person felt I was "aggressive" and that I should be "nicer." Yes, I am a woman.

I'm not one to reflexively suggest sexism…but in this case I simply cannot imagine a man being "accused" of being aggressive and actually told to be "nicer."

A little backstory: I knew of the incident he was referring to - after a system crash, a staffer came in to "help" solve the system problem (after multiple attempts to get this staffer to be bothered to help) but instead of fixing it, staffer made comments about the history of the systems etc. In that moment, I said - in an authoritative way (not aggressive at all in my opinion) - that the history didn't matter, but I just needed to get the document out quickly. (I've worked in truly aggressive environments and, for the sake of this conversation, let's just agree that there was nothing "aggressive" about it. It was a more senior person setting a clear and direct expectation.)

I'm a relatively new employee. This same staffer has been unwilling from day one to provide basic company information necessary to ramp me up (at a fairly high level). I've hit my personal limit with this employee, but have simply tried to "work around" this person rather than engage/discuss/argue. However, I found out today, that this staffer went to a senior executive and characterized our meeting as "aggressive" and clearly planted the seed that there was an issue with me (without, of course, accurately describing the events in question).

How would you handle this?

why didn't you fix the system yourself? why did you need help?

[Anonymous]

Do you reflexively scream sexism at every opportunity? I have told many a male and female underling to be nicer, work better together, get a attitude adjustment, etc. This isn't a gender thing necessarily.

[Anonymous]

Sorry to hear that you are working in a sexist place - since that is a sexist remark. I went through this at one job (7 years there) and it was to the point that it was ludicrous to even say this when men yelled when I and other women may have forgotten to ask to "PLEASE" - fill in the blank-- You may want to start looking so you are not surprised when "you" just don't fit in so they decide to change things.

[Anonymous]

I quit.

My boss turned on me after I started pushing back. I found another job and then quit.

I am assertive and proud of it.

[Anonymous]

OP, please be honest with yourself. Are you a bit tone deaf? If someone is trying to help you, you indulge them a bit in the history (s/he is interested/excited by what s/he does--good--any SES should encourage) and then you say something like "That helps me understand better. I am so grateful you are helping me--I'm desperate to get this document out!"

Every work exchange is not all business--it is a personal, emotional exchange as well. I agree that some of what you say is off putting and shows you don't quite get this. Emphasizing you are senior executive service and saying things like work is not a day care are signs of this.

Are your emails all business? If someone emails you to say they've done something requested, do you immediately email back a "Thanks!" Or do you think that's their job, so no need to thank?

I find that women who don't realize this get called bitch and men who don't are called jerks. This may not be such a negative in the private sector where ability to generate profit counts very heavily and so personality deficits are more easily overlooked. But in government it can be deadly--many of the people there have given up higher private sector salaries to do public service and in return they expect a civil work place.

FWIW, I am female SES.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do you reflexively scream sexism at every opportunity? I have told many a male and female underling to be nicer, work better together, get a attitude adjustment, etc. This isn't a gender thing necessarily.

Um, nope. Without going into all the details here, my example involved sending a matter-of-factly email staff person who had shared private info outside of the company -- a big deal b/c we are publicly traded and are involved in a transaction. (Yes, I am the compliance officer, so it is my job to watch out for these issues.)

My email was straight-forward and said, basically, this type of thing can not happen again and here's why. The boss told me I should consider being nicer because this wasn't received well. I then asked the boss if he had read the email b/c I didn't think there was anything out of the ordinary about it. He told me he hadn't read it, but that the employee was upset. I told him the employee was probably upset because he realized that he exposed the company to a serious issue (not because I was "mean" to him). I sent my boss the email, and, upon reading it, he acknowledged that it wasn't bad…but that I should still consider trying to be nicer in because that employee was upset!

Flash to the next day. In a meeting with that same boss and some other male execs. One of the execs starts screaming at the top of his lungs, shouting to a staff person that "you really f-cked that up" and threw a plastic cup of water at the wall. There was no admonition to that exec about being nicer.

I know its easy to assume the woman in these cases is really the mean bitch, but honestly, that wasn't the case here. So, I was wondering how others have dealt with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you reflexively scream sexism at every opportunity? I have told many a male and female underling to be nicer, work better together, get a attitude adjustment, etc. This isn't a gender thing necessarily.

Um, nope. Without going into all the details here, my example involved sending a matter-of-factly email staff person who had shared private info outside of the company -- a big deal b/c we are publicly traded and are involved in a transaction. (Yes, I am the compliance officer, so it is my job to watch out for these issues.)

My email was straight-forward and said, basically, this type of thing can not happen again and here's why. The boss told me I should consider being nicer because this wasn't received well. I then asked the boss if he had read the email b/c I didn't think there was anything out of the ordinary about it. He told me he hadn't read it, but that the employee was upset. I told him the employee was probably upset because he realized that he exposed the company to a serious issue (not because I was "mean" to him). I sent my boss the email, and, upon reading it, he acknowledged that it wasn't bad…but that I should still consider trying to be nicer in because that employee was upset!

Flash to the next day. In a meeting with that same boss and some other male execs. One of the execs starts screaming at the top of his lungs, shouting to a staff person that "you really f-cked that up" and threw a plastic cup of water at the wall. There was no admonition to that exec about being nicer.

I know its easy to assume the woman in these cases is really the mean bitch, but honestly, that wasn't the case here. So, I was wondering how others have dealt with it.

Wow! Would never have used email for this--would have spoken to employee in person.

Also, depending on your relationship with your boss, I would have asked him if he every had asked cup throwing exec to tone it down. I also would have considered the judicious walk out, which, when reserved for very bad behavior, can be every effective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you reflexively scream sexism at every opportunity? I have told many a male and female underling to be nicer, work better together, get a attitude adjustment, etc. This isn't a gender thing necessarily.

Um, nope. Without going into all the details here, my example involved sending a matter-of-factly email staff person who had shared private info outside of the company -- a big deal b/c we are publicly traded and are involved in a transaction. (Yes, I am the compliance officer, so it is my job to watch out for these issues.)

My email was straight-forward and said, basically, this type of thing can not happen again and here's why. The boss told me I should consider being nicer because this wasn't received well. I then asked the boss if he had read the email b/c I didn't think there was anything out of the ordinary about it. He told me he hadn't read it, but that the employee was upset. I told him the employee was probably upset because he realized that he exposed the company to a serious issue (not because I was "mean" to him). I sent my boss the email, and, upon reading it, he acknowledged that it wasn't bad…but that I should still consider trying to be nicer in because that employee was upset!

Flash to the next day. In a meeting with that same boss and some other male execs. One of the execs starts screaming at the top of his lungs, shouting to a staff person that "you really f-cked that up" and threw a plastic cup of water at the wall. There was no admonition to that exec about being nicer.

I know its easy to assume the woman in these cases is really the mean bitch, but honestly, that wasn't the case here. So, I was wondering how others have dealt with it.

Wow! Would never have used email for this--would have spoken to employee in person.

Also, depending on your relationship with your boss, I would have asked him if he every had asked cup throwing exec to tone it down. I also would have considered the judicious walk out, which, when reserved for very bad behavior, can be every effective.

Well, I think this is really the crux of the issue OP is trying to get to. Women are held to a different standard of "niceness" than men are. I see it at my firm--which is in many ways very progressive--all the time. There are male execs in our firm who berate and belittle people regularly, in really public and humiliating ways; they are known for it, and people joke about it. But women who are professional but direct are told that they are intimidating.

Maybe in an ideal world OP should have delivered her message in person rather than by email. But what she did wasn't inappropriate, unprofessional, or "not nice." Meanwhile, male execs are throwing tantrums in meetings, cursing at fellow employees and throwing things. OP is calling out a real double-standard, and it's sad to see how many women accuse her of "crying sexism" rather than considering the possibility that sexism is still deeply entrenched in most workplaces.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you reflexively scream sexism at every opportunity? I have told many a male and female underling to be nicer, work better together, get a attitude adjustment, etc. This isn't a gender thing necessarily.

Um, nope. Without going into all the details here, my example involved sending a matter-of-factly email staff person who had shared private info outside of the company -- a big deal b/c we are publicly traded and are involved in a transaction. (Yes, I am the compliance officer, so it is my job to watch out for these issues.)

My email was straight-forward and said, basically, this type of thing can not happen again and here's why. The boss told me I should consider being nicer because this wasn't received well. I then asked the boss if he had read the email b/c I didn't think there was anything out of the ordinary about it. He told me he hadn't read it, but that the employee was upset. I told him the employee was probably upset because he realized that he exposed the company to a serious issue (not because I was "mean" to him). I sent my boss the email, and, upon reading it, he acknowledged that it wasn't bad…but that I should still consider trying to be nicer in because that employee was upset!

Flash to the next day. In a meeting with that same boss and some other male execs. One of the execs starts screaming at the top of his lungs, shouting to a staff person that "you really f-cked that up" and threw a plastic cup of water at the wall. There was no admonition to that exec about being nicer.

I know its easy to assume the woman in these cases is really the mean bitch, but honestly, that wasn't the case here. So, I was wondering how others have dealt with it.

Wow! Would never have used email for this--would have spoken to employee in person.

Also, depending on your relationship with your boss, I would have asked him if he every had asked cup throwing exec to tone it down. I also would have considered the judicious walk out, which, when reserved for very bad behavior, can be every effective.

Well, I think this is really the crux of the issue OP is trying to get to. Women are held to a different standard of "niceness" than men are. I see it at my firm--which is in many ways very progressive--all the time. There are male execs in our firm who berate and belittle people regularly, in really public and humiliating ways; they are known for it, and people joke about it. But women who are professional but direct are told that they are intimidating.

Maybe in an ideal world OP should have delivered her message in person rather than by email. But what she did wasn't inappropriate, unprofessional, or "not nice." Meanwhile, male execs are throwing tantrums in meetings, cursing at fellow employees and throwing things. OP is calling out a real double-standard, and it's sad to see how many women accuse her of "crying sexism" rather than considering the possibility that sexism is still deeply entrenched in most workplaces.

12:29 appears to be a different poster than OP. 12:29 is in the private sector, while OP is in SES. 12:29 gives evidence of a double standard--berated for a not nice email (about an offense which in my office likely would have resulted in a security escort out of the building), while male execs throw things against the while after publicly dressing down employees.

12:29 seems to have a legitimate beef with her workplace. OP on the other hand seems to have mishandled communication with a more junior (but not subordinate) employee who did not meet her expectation of doing his or her job. OP should look at the advice of 12:26. 12:29 should be looking for other employment unless she's paid enough to overlook really bad behavior at her work place.

[Anonymous]

I am OP and 12:29. One and the same. Sometimes posters try to obscure facts to maintain anonymity (which can make it difficult for other posters to get a full picture).

[Anonymous]

See Hopkins v Price Waterhouse. This kind of thing has a long history. OP, be "nicer" to this employee in demeanor but bit substance, and document things he's doing that are subpar. Strengthen your relationships with the other employees so that this dude becomes a clear outlier who's the only one with a problem with you.