Vacation wife here. 4 month update

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh my goodness OP.

Thank you for the update.

I think the work you have both been doing is pretty astonishing and impressive. I don't know many people who would put in this level of effort, work, self-reflection, energy, etc... It's very impressive.

It seems to me that feeling a sense of peace right now with wherever things lead you is the best possible place you could be in. I wish you (all of you) all the very best in finding your way. I have to think that you are through the worst of it, but certainly respect the toll it has taken and the permanent changes that happen at all kinds of levels w/ such a seismic event.

I have used DCUM as a bit of a journal/sounding board/therapy session at times over the years and going back and rereading my threads (when I'm ready/able) has been enlightening for me. So I hope you'll have the same experience when it's appropriate.

If you do stay in the marriage I bet that you and your husband will have built something extraordinary, and if you don't stay in the marriage it seems like you will end it in a loving and caring way. Very few people put that kind of work in, so congratulations. I really respect what you're doing.

+1 so much respect for you op!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've seen my original post bumped a few times, but I haven't had the guts to open it for some reason. I was so incredibly raw with anguish in those early days and I'm not ready to revisit it yet.

Today is 4 months since "dday" so I thought I'd post an update and use it to sift thought my own thoughts.

The good:
-I understand the affair now. It was a complete and utter mindf*** to even just grasp the fact that it happened. Seriously, I felt like my brain was broken for at least two months. It was like I had a mental barrier that wasn't allowing me to process (which I now know is a common trauma response). Our marriage therapist had us each write up a detailed timeline of the last 3 years of our lives and we painstakingly spent weeks comparing them which was incredibly eye opening for both of us. Some important things we each really missed the mark on supporting each other, some sad, some so painful, some moments of true happiness that we had forgotten about in the midst of this train wreck.
-He has made insane strides in communication. I mean I didn't even realize how much his communication skills were lacking. At the start of all this, he would completely shut down when we started talking about the affair which would royally piss me off because I'd be spewing all my intense emotions just to be met with silence. He still falls into this pattern sometimes except now I will always find a letter later that day where he writes out everything he heard me say, asks if he is understanding my feelings correctly, and if there's anything he missed. It really has been mind-blowing for me to read these. He hits the nail on the head every time so even when I think he's shutting down or tuning me out, he's listening and processing and sometimes being more insightful into my emotions than I even am. Not to be mean- but I didn't even realize he had this level of attention and understanding in him.
-His individual therapist is EXCEPTIONAL.
-There has been zero trickle truthing, no additional information or facts or evidence has surfaced that he didn't originally disclose that first night I found out.
-We have not heard from the AP at all.
-He sees the affair for what it really was- two broken people bringing out the worst in each other. At one point he even spiraled when he fully realized that it was all a facade. Two blubbering idiots spouting compliments and nudes (peppered with threats on her end) at each other and creating these fake personas in some sort of escapist fantasy land. He had this lightbulb moment where he said "She knows nothing about me- she has absolutely no idea about who I am and I don't really know anything about her".
-He is 3 weeks into antidepressants and I'm starting to see glimmers of my best friend again. It's been a long, long time and it feels like home, but also angering at why it's been so long.
-Hysterical bonding is absolutely mind blowing and I am thoroughly enjoying it to levels I didn't even know could exist.

The bad:
-I had absolutely NO idea how conflict avoidant my DH was. None. I mean I have learned things like when we were dating he had two job offers: one really amazing offer that would have fast tracked his career goals in a place he knew I'd never want to live and then the one in our hometown that he accepted. He never even brought the other offer up to me. I had no idea, no chance to support that dream of his. He declined it thinking he was making a sacrifice for the future of our relationship and then internalized the regret and resentment. Repeat this over and over. He wasn't totally happy with our wedding venue, but I seemed to love it so he feigned the same level of excitement. He thought we should have continued house hunting longer, but saw my excitement when we walked into our house and wanted to give me the world so he said it was perfect. He did all these things with the intention of making "sacrifices" for me or fulfilling my wants- which I always thought were our wants- and it snowballed into this immense resentment that our life was not built with his input. It really pains me that my husband either subconsciously didn't feel he could/should express his true opinions and maddens me that I wasn't even given a chance to show him I also care about his wants and needs to the same extent he cares about mine.
-He's unearthed a lot of unhealthy dynamics from his family of origin and it's really made me change how I see my in laws. They did their kids some MAJOR disservices if not completely emotionally neglected them under the guise of a big happy laughing family. Interestingly, DH's brother and his wife are in marriage therapy for almost identical communication issues and BIL never expressing his wants to his wife and then building resentment. My MIL and FIL are also breaking down at the moment over an unexpected life change for them that they can't effectively communicate about after 40 years of marriage. It has been quiet the eye opener for DH and I.
-He has so much guilt, remorse, shame, and self hatred still that it can be hard to be around him. Seriously, he has such a heavy, melancholy presence sometimes that I just need to be away from it (and I have taken weekends away several times). His relationship with himself got to a very dark place, but is hopefully getting slightly better with the continued individual therapy and now medication.

The ugly:
-A month ago, DH was messaging with his high school gf (which even sounds ridiculous). Turns out, DH heard through one of his long time friends that her husband had an affair about 5 years ago and they put in all the work and are really happy with the marriage they've built since so all of the conversation was surrounding DH seeking feedback if we were on the right track and what he could do to be supportive and help me heal. She offered to be a source of support for me as well and said when she went through it she didn't know anyone else who had and felt incredibly isolated. She also offered to connect my DH with her husband. I basically lost my ever-loving mind. At first he was like "it was so helpful for me to get insight from a couple that has successfully rebuilt", but now he does fully understand that even if that wasn't an affair, it was AFFAIR BEHAVIOR- talking to a woman I'm unaware of, felt like he was again allowing another female inside our marriage and such. Thank god both his therapist and our marriage therapist completely laid it out on the table for him. It was such a breach of trust for me and I truly thought that was it for us. This is still burning at my soul.

I'm still not sure where I want to go from here. I go through hopeful phases and then have moments where I am just done. I'm sick of the emotional rollercoaster, sick of the pain, sick of the time and resource blackhole this has all been, sick of working on therapies and having big conversations. I'm not sure if I'll be able to get past this enough to stay in the relationship and I won't stay unless we truly build something I'm proud to be a part of. I do feel really at peace with whichever way this goes now and that feels relieving in itself. If we can construct a foundation of communication, transparency, and mutual respect, we can build upon that for the rest of our lives. If we can't, our kids have two great parents and I feel that I can look them in the eye someday and honestly tell them I gave it my all.

Hi, OP. You are such a wonderful thoughtful woman. I hope you find peace - with or without him. How would you fare financially in the event of divorce?

I'd be ok. I make $110k and we live in a MCOL area. Only have one more year of daycare payments. We have no debt. If we sold this house, I'd walk away with $80-100k. If I stay in the house, I'll have $50k and DH says he'd pay for the house til the kids are 18 (seems unrealistic- 16 more years) or just give it to me without me buying him out (again- can I trust this). One sticking point is our mortgage loan is at 2.9% so it would be insane to refinance right now or try to buy something else. I'm cautiously optimistic enough that we could continue owning it together if needed at least until the market stabilizes a bit. I'm only 32 so I have time to beef up my own retirement and move up (I've haven't aggressively pursued career advancements up til this point bc DH travels for work and I've remained in my flexible job for the life balance).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for sharing your story and updates, OP.

Out of curiosity, how did you find out about his communications with his h.s. gf? Did he disclose that on his own?

Since dday his phone lives out on the kitchen counter unlocked so the message just popped up on his home screen while I was cooking. Honestly, if he would have said "Hey, so and so from high school has been through this and they're really happy. I feel it would help me to talk to someone who's been through it- do you care if I reach out?" or even just "letting you know I'm going to reach out". Again, it was a potential conflict avoidance. Realistically I know that this is not going to be linear and from day 1 my individual therapist has said that lots of therapist liken infidelity to addiction and there can be "relapses" along the way but at the same time I'm like come on buddy we've spent MONTHS ripping our souls apart around this stuff- you really thought this was an appropriate outlet?

Yeah I agree the worst part is doing it behind your back. How in the world can you rebuild trust with someone who’s still lying to you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I share your outrage that your DH contacted his high school GF. Regardless of how pure his intensions were, it's shocking that he would A.) contact another female at this point without your knowledge, and B.) contact another female without your knowledge that at one time he had romantic feelings for. That doesn't sound like someone who has done "the work" necessary to rebuild a marriage. Rather he seems like a self-centered, emotionally obtuse jerk. I think you would be better off without him.

Agree, sorry OP. He sounds like my ex-DH who has ZERO BOUNDARIES with women. Men like this get their self worth from women thinking they are wonderful. He reached out to his friend to brag about how wonderful the work he is doing is. AFTER AN AFFAIR. Think about this, hard.

Also, my DH was on his best behavior for about 9 months after D-Day. Then the mask came off and he was "sick and tired of feeling like the bad guy" and having to "listen to crying" because of his actions. I hope your situation ends differently, but please, please keep your eyes wide open. By one year post D-day, my ex was already engaging in an affair with yet another woman.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the update, OP. Was the thread about the suicidal husband a few weeks ago from you?

[Anonymous]

I love that you found actual help, OP, and are making progress (as well as DH!). Can you share the name of your therapist?

[Anonymous]

The high school girlfriend, eh? When my dad was in his late 40s (and married to my mother for 20+ years), he and his old gf from high school reconnected on facebook. One torrid affair later, they left their spouses for each other. They have been married for 15+ years now. I sometimes wonder if she made him feel like a teenager again and that's why it has worked out for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a very honest post, and you have incredible self-awareness and emotional intelligence. No response other than I am happy you are exploring your options and being honest with yourself. I wish you healing and happiness.

This. OP, you are very mature and thoughtful. Your kids are lucky to have you navigating these major family decisions. I wish you the very best.

[Anonymous]

OP, best of luck to you. My heart broke with you as I read your narrative of your world imploding in real time.

I think you're right about the exgf. On the one hand, it was sweet of him. But on the other hand, it also shows that he hasn't learned enough yet about how to avoid inappropriate behavior, or what inappropriate behavior looks like. As an outsider, I read this as environmental feedback that he still needs a lot of coaching from a therapist in this area.

[Anonymous]

Hi OP — You are doing great. We are 3.5 years out. it takes a long time to heal the issues that lead ti cheating but it can be done. There are going to be ups and downs for at least first year. Once we got past year three I started to heal some but most people say 5 years. Ours was different as we had been together for decades and are much older but same issues from family of origin lead to what you are describing. Good luck and best wishes.

[Anonymous]

PP again — I should say dh is still working but first couple years were the hardest for him even though he was super eager to get better and never feel like he felt in hooking up with a broken, abusive in her own way, woman.

[Anonymous]

-I had absolutely NO idea how conflict avoidant my DH was. None. I mean I have learned things like when we were dating he had two job offers: one really amazing offer that would have fast tracked his career goals in a place he knew I'd never want to live and then the one in our hometown that he accepted. He never even brought the other offer up to me. I had no idea, no chance to support that dream of his. He declined it thinking he was making a sacrifice for the future of our relationship and then internalized the regret and resentment. Repeat this over and over. He wasn't totally happy with our wedding venue, but I seemed to love it so he feigned the same level of excitement. He thought we should have continued house hunting longer, but saw my excitement when we walked into our house and wanted to give me the world so he said it was perfect. He did all these things with the intention of making "sacrifices" for me or fulfilling my wants- which I always thought were our wants- and it snowballed into this immense resentment that our life was not built with his input. It really pains me that my husband either subconsciously didn't feel he could/should express his true opinions and maddens me that I wasn't even given a chance to show him I also care about his wants and needs to the same extent he cares about mine.

This resonates with me. My DH has done this and I’ve tried to address and he doesn’t see it. He’s so entrenched in the mindset that being a good person/husband means deferring.

I encouraged him to get therapy because the dynamic was causing me so much anxiety and he’s just come back bitter and accusing me of being toxic and abusive.

I think I would have preferred him to cheat.

[Anonymous]

Hello, me again.

Reflecting on being 7 months out now. DH's communication has changed immensely...to the point where it's taken me a lot of time to begin adjusting because it feels like a whole new relationship in many ways. He had a business last week and proactively made me an itinerary before he left, kept in contact the whole time, checked in with me a ton. We had a moment last weekend where we were driving with our kids and DH mentioned that his brother was coming in town the next day and wanted to go out and I immediately started to spiral bc BIL likes to hit the city and get wasted basically. It was like panic set in without me even thinking about it. DH was great- he reassured me he brought it up to see what I felt comfortable with and get my take before he responded and that he was on my team. His response was so kind and genuine that I really felt like we turned a corner. I didn't feel crazy and felt like I was safe to share my feelings even thought they felt way overboard even to me. Just a few months ago, he would have immediately shame spiraled from my reaction, but he stayed steady and validated me. He ended up telling his brother that he's been putting in a ton of work on himself and our relationship and he'd prefer to do something that doesn't involve drinking. So they actually fixed their dad's car together which he really enjoyed.

My birthday is coming up and I saw a text come in on his phone from my best friend that said "I'm so sorry that I can't make it, but she is going to love that- I feel so hopeful for you guys and am glad you cleared the air". So I think he is planning something for my birthday, but I did ask my friend about that text and she said that he reached out to her and apologized for hurting me so badly, thanked her for being a steady source of comfort for me, and said he understands how they (her and her husband) likely feel about him now, but hopes with time and work on his end it can be our most authentic friendship because they have seen our highs and lowest lows. This is huge for me because even though he has encouraged me the whole time to tell anyone I want and build up my own support system, he did tell me in a therapy session that he was too overwhelmed with shame, guilt, remorse, and embarrassment to even think about facing my best friend again so I'm relieved he took a step to lessen that burden for me.

I ended up telling my other long term best friend. It wasn't planned. I was driving home from an errand and started sobbing and then all of a sudden found myself getting on the highway and driving an hour to her house. I literally just showed up at her doorstep like a crazy person sobbing. She has a toddler and a husband and I just walked in there on a Saturday morning like a blubbering mess and spilled my guts. We grew up next door to each other so she's my longest friendship, but we are very different. She can be extremely opinionated and brutally honest which is why I hadn't told her up til that point. I was absolutely shocked when she looked at me, gave me a huge hug, and said "If you have any more fight left in you- fight for this". I had to leave shortly after dumping that all on her, but she has been so kind and supportive constantly checking in and honestly giving me MUCH better advice than I ever could have imagined coming from her.

So DH's end is all constructive and he's feeling so much better about himself and I'm just....ugh. I have more hopeful days than not now, but everything is still just there. I'm much better during the days now and really only spiral when there's a concrete trigger, but man the nights are rough. As soon as I lay down, my mind just wanders. It replays all of the messages I read and nudes I saw over and over and over. I end up on the couch 50% of the time because sometimes it gets so overwhelming I just can't breathe in bed. I'm still doing weekly therapy for myself which has been a great oasis. I'm slowly coming to terms with the fact that this did happen, this is going to be part of our story forever, our old marriage is dead and we're either building one that we can both be proud of or bust. I'm seeing the man I fell in love with come back if not even a better version of him in some ways, but it feels like home and simultaneously like damn why tf did you have to put me through that to get here? My entire viewpoint on life, relationships, trust, infidelity, marriage, mental health is just completely altered forever.

Thanks for listening to my ranting. It helps to get everything down and out and I know there's a lot of others here in a similar boat (unfortunately).

[Anonymous]

This must be so rough to go through but I really do appreciate you sharing so much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for your update. I truly wish you the best.

Also, and please understand I am not criticizing you here - you are allowed to feel however you want to feel about all of this - I read the part about him contacting his high school girlfriend as actually kind of sweet because of what he was seeking from her. I guess being 44 the thought of a high school girlfriend/boyfriend means nothing to me now and perhaps it's different for you because you're younger and also because you live in a smaller town and also perhaps because this was the girlfriend right before you? But anyway, while he should have said something to you before discussing your issues with his high school girlfriend, I guess I would urge you to try to let that go for the sake of trying to move on from all of this. I totally understand how a sliver after losing a limb can still hurt, but perhaps screaming about this into the sky and then leaving it behind you so you an focus on the more important things would be best.

Hugs.

I 100% agree with this. I get that he was communicating with a woman that you were not aware of, but given the facts as you describe them, I would NOT put this action under "the ugly" at all.