Why do teachers allow horribly behaved kids to stay in the classroom and disrupt other kids?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m the mom of a child with special needs who exhibits a lot of problem behavior.

We have moved heaven and earth trying to get him more support or a different placement. The school just won’t.

I feel terrible for the teacher. Teachers have no power. It’s truly a wonder they keep working. They are micromanaged, have impossible demands, and very limited discretion.

The system is complex and under resourced. There are no villains or heroes. All of it just sucks.

Good for you (sincerely), but far more common in public schools are parents who gum up the world by demanding that their kids with a lot of problem behavior be mainstreamed and in Gen Ed at all costs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m the mom of a child with special needs who exhibits a lot of problem behavior.

We have moved heaven and earth trying to get him more support or a different placement. The school just won’t.

I feel terrible for the teacher. Teachers have no power. It’s truly a wonder they keep working. They are micromanaged, have impossible demands, and very limited discretion.

The system is complex and under resourced. There are no villains or heroes. All of it just sucks.

Good for you (sincerely), but far more common in public schools are parents who gum up the world by demanding that their kids with a lot of problem behavior be mainstreamed and in Gen Ed at all costs.

Gum up the “works.” Thanks, Autocorrect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The principals and school systems claim it’s the law to allow everyone in the least restrictive environment. So until parents sue to change the law nothing will change.

Good luck changing the law.

“The law” doesn’t say that everyone gets Gen Ed bEcAuSe LrE. The problem is spineless leadership who cave in to the demands of parents of disruptive kids.

[Anonymous]

What’s a disgrace is that ALL students don’t have a legal right to FAPE. That law needs to change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So picture being in a Target and someone is upset and decides to throw things off the shelves and at other customers. It would be like the store needs to be evacuated until the person decides to calm down and leave and the police are never called. Society can't function like that. So I don't understand why people would expect schools to function like that.

Bad example. That's basically how stores operate now. It's not great, but society does function.

No, good example. If this happened in Target, the police would be called and the person throwing things at other people would be removed and trespassed from the store and likely arrested. DP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So picture being in a Target and someone is upset and decides to throw things off the shelves and at other customers. It would be like the store needs to be evacuated until the person decides to calm down and leave and the police are never called. Society can't function like that. So I don't understand why people would expect schools to function like that.

Bad example. That's basically how stores operate now. It's not great, but society does function.

No, good example. If this happened in Target, the police would be called and the person throwing things at other people would be removed and trespassed from the store and likely arrested. DP

I don't understand how the PP could say that stores operate a person entering the store knocking shelves over, smashing things, and also assaulting other customers and employees MULTIPLE times a week sometimes for extended periods of time which results in all the customers of the store leaving and the employees just blocking punches, kicks, and objects thrown at them and no police ever shows up. Where is this happening? Stores don't operate like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The principals and school systems claim it’s the law to allow everyone in the least restrictive environment. So until parents sue to change the law nothing will change.

Good luck changing the law.

“The law” doesn’t say that everyone gets Gen Ed bEcAuSe LrE. The problem is spineless leadership who cave in to the demands of parents of disruptive kids.

They can't justify more restrictive placement if they can't explain why bringing in support to the classroom has or would fail. And they don't know to pay for that.

They also don't want to pay for expensive restrictive programs, so there isn't anywhere else to send them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you think it’s the teachers’ decision to keep these kids in their rooms? I had a student in my classroom who destroyed it. I’d say at least a few hundreds of dollars worth of my belongings were destroyed including nearly half of my classroom library, bulletin boards, art supplies, etc. It took months of documentation and a very on board admin to get this student a one on one aid (didn’t help much). The kid ended up in a different program this year.

I had no idea. I’m not a teacher so how am I suppose to know. Whatever the problem is, it has to stop.

We are letting the majority of the class suffer because of one or two struggling students.

You did not know this is the result of the “I” for Inclusion, in DEI ?

The sooner we end DEI entirely, the better.

It’s federal law and not easy to overturn

Disagree. It is being legally interpreted a certain way the past decade or so. This law passed many decades ago. It was in place when most of us went to school yet the huge over inclusion was not a thing back then. It needs better case law to course correct the extreme spot it’s devolved to at this point.

You just said the magic word (in bold). Inclusion.

I am opposed to inclusion.

More people need to get comfortable with opposing inclusion, equity, and diversity. Until they do become more comfortable saying it out loud, nothing will change in our violent and dysfunctional schools.

🙄
You’re not being helpful at all. The massive over inclusion of certain very troubled SPED kids predates the DEI push. These are not the same thing.

Correct. It’s not DEI it’s IDEA

+1 Inclusion in schools is because of IDEA law

Signed, a school psychologist

I wonder what those members of congress would say now, to know that they actually voted to destroy our public school system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you think it’s the teachers’ decision to keep these kids in their rooms? I had a student in my classroom who destroyed it. I’d say at least a few hundreds of dollars worth of my belongings were destroyed including nearly half of my classroom library, bulletin boards, art supplies, etc. It took months of documentation and a very on board admin to get this student a one on one aid (didn’t help much). The kid ended up in a different program this year.

I had no idea. I’m not a teacher so how am I suppose to know. Whatever the problem is, it has to stop.

We are letting the majority of the class suffer because of one or two struggling students.

You did not know this is the result of the “I” for Inclusion, in DEI ?

The sooner we end DEI entirely, the better.

It’s federal law and not easy to overturn

Disagree. It is being legally interpreted a certain way the past decade or so. This law passed many decades ago. It was in place when most of us went to school yet the huge over inclusion was not a thing back then. It needs better case law to course correct the extreme spot it’s devolved to at this point.

You just said the magic word (in bold). Inclusion.

I am opposed to inclusion.

More people need to get comfortable with opposing inclusion, equity, and diversity. Until they do become more comfortable saying it out loud, nothing will change in our violent and dysfunctional schools.

🙄
You’re not being helpful at all. The massive over inclusion of certain very troubled SPED kids predates the DEI push. These are not the same thing.

Correct. It’s not DEI it’s IDEA

+1 Inclusion in schools is because of IDEA law

Signed, a school psychologist

I wonder what those members of congress would say now, to know that they actually voted to destroy our public school system.

DP. They don't care. Their kids go to private schools that do not have to admit students with poor behaviors and can kick out anyone who is causing problems, regardless of disability. This is one reason they have no appetite to discuss change. It doesn't affect them or their families.

[Anonymous]

I’m the mom of a child with special needs who exhibits a lot of problem behavior.

We have moved heaven and earth trying to get him more support or a different placement. The school just won’t.

I feel terrible for the teacher. Teachers have no power. It’s truly a wonder they keep working. They are micromanaged, have impossible demands, and very limited discretion.

The system is complex and under resourced. There are no villains or heroes. All of it just sucks

You’re right, it’s a broken system, and I empathize so much with what your family is going through. My school has several students who we know would thrive in a different placement, but the district is shutting down these already not-big-enough programs in favor of returning students to the mainstream classroom. Our special education teachers are not able to meet the needs of all their students as a result. It’s so sad. Nobody is getting what they need.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you think it’s the teachers’ decision to keep these kids in their rooms? I had a student in my classroom who destroyed it. I’d say at least a few hundreds of dollars worth of my belongings were destroyed including nearly half of my classroom library, bulletin boards, art supplies, etc. It took months of documentation and a very on board admin to get this student a one on one aid (didn’t help much). The kid ended up in a different program this year.

I had no idea. I’m not a teacher so how am I suppose to know. Whatever the problem is, it has to stop.

We are letting the majority of the class suffer because of one or two struggling students.

You did not know this is the result of the “I” for Inclusion, in DEI ?

The sooner we end DEI entirely, the better.

It’s federal law and not easy to overturn

Disagree. It is being legally interpreted a certain way the past decade or so. This law passed many decades ago. It was in place when most of us went to school yet the huge over inclusion was not a thing back then. It needs better case law to course correct the extreme spot it’s devolved to at this point.

You just said the magic word (in bold). Inclusion.

I am opposed to inclusion.

More people need to get comfortable with opposing inclusion, equity, and diversity. Until they do become more comfortable saying it out loud, nothing will change in our violent and dysfunctional schools.

🙄
You’re not being helpful at all. The massive over inclusion of certain very troubled SPED kids predates the DEI push. These are not the same thing.

Correct. It’s not DEI it’s IDEA

+1 Inclusion in schools is because of IDEA law

Signed, a school psychologist

I wonder what those members of congress would say now, to know that they actually voted to destroy our public school system.

Do you remember what special education programs were like before IDEA and LRE? They're not getting rid of it, so lobby for more special education funding if you don't think students are being properly supported.

[Anonymous]

The teachers don’t decide which students they get.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a child who will, in later years, likely have interactions with the carceral system, whereas your child will be privileged. As equity is our most important value, the privileged need to face more struggle, and the future oppressed need to be able to have more enjoyment in their lives.

NP and a teacher. I recognize this is a troll post, but you're right about one thing. The kids who are acting out like this are likely to end up incarcerated, especially if they're not taught that inappropriate behavior has negative consequences. In most cases it's a parenting issue and the lax discipline policies in schools are doing them no favors. There are also kids with attentive parents who have serious mental health issues and need a lot more support than a public school system can provide.

Thank you for being honest that worthless parenting is a big contributor to this problem. It is.

I agree strongly with the teacher. It’s a parenting problem. The problematic children aren’t special needs.They’re hyper, unfocused and don’t get enough parent attention. Focus is a learned skill, so is not talking out of turn.

Part of the problem also is that schools can’t discipline or remove kids, and of course their parents don’t either.

All of them? How do you know? My kid had multiple head injuries, plus preexisting special needs. You’d have no idea if your child was in class with him. No professional who’s heard our story has anything negative to say about my patenting, but believe me, they walk in the door wondering. Are there many kids whose behavior stems from parenting problems? Possible. But not ALL. That’s so insulting. Look up Phineas Gage if you think my child’s misbehavior was my fault.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a child who will, in later years, likely have interactions with the carceral system, whereas your child will be privileged. As equity is our most important value, the privileged need to face more struggle, and the future oppressed need to be able to have more enjoyment in their lives.

NP and a teacher. I recognize this is a troll post, but you're right about one thing. The kids who are acting out like this are likely to end up incarcerated, especially if they're not taught that inappropriate behavior has negative consequences. In most cases it's a parenting issue and the lax discipline policies in schools are doing them no favors. There are also kids with attentive parents who have serious mental health issues and need a lot more support than a public school system can provide.

Thank you for being honest that worthless parenting is a big contributor to this problem. It is.

I agree strongly with the teacher. It’s a parenting problem. The problematic children aren’t special needs.They’re hyper, unfocused and don’t get enough parent attention. Focus is a learned skill, so is not talking out of turn.

Part of the problem also is that schools can’t discipline or remove kids, and of course their parents don’t either.

All of them? How do you know? My kid had multiple head injuries, plus preexisting special needs. You’d have no idea if your child was in class with him. No professional who’s heard our story has anything negative to say about my patenting, but believe me, they walk in the door wondering. Are there many kids whose behavior stems from parenting problems? Possible. But not ALL. That’s so insulting. Look up Phineas Gage if you think my child’s misbehavior was my fault.

My mother was an elementary school teacher that complained about the behaviors of her students with special needs and would have written the same thing as the previous poster that blamed parents.

Then I had a child with autism and ADHD and she got a very different perspective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a child who will, in later years, likely have interactions with the carceral system, whereas your child will be privileged. As equity is our most important value, the privileged need to face more struggle, and the future oppressed need to be able to have more enjoyment in their lives.

NP and a teacher. I recognize this is a troll post, but you're right about one thing. The kids who are acting out like this are likely to end up incarcerated, especially if they're not taught that inappropriate behavior has negative consequences. In most cases it's a parenting issue and the lax discipline policies in schools are doing them no favors. There are also kids with attentive parents who have serious mental health issues and need a lot more support than a public school system can provide.

Thank you for being honest that worthless parenting is a big contributor to this problem. It is.

I agree strongly with the teacher. It’s a parenting problem. The problematic children aren’t special needs.They’re hyper, unfocused and don’t get enough parent attention. Focus is a learned skill, so is not talking out of turn.

Part of the problem also is that schools can’t discipline or remove kids, and of course their parents don’t either.

All of them? How do you know? My kid had multiple head injuries, plus preexisting special needs. You’d have no idea if your child was in class with him. No professional who’s heard our story has anything negative to say about my patenting, but believe me, they walk in the door wondering. Are there many kids whose behavior stems from parenting problems? Possible. But not ALL. That’s so insulting. Look up Phineas Gage if you think my child’s misbehavior was my fault.

You’re arguing to assume zebras not horses when you hear galloping animals. It’s just absurd. Every kid who is misbehaving is not Phineas Gage. Do you care about the well-behaved, determined students in nightmare rooms because of poorly behaving kids? Are each of them as special as yours, or does the fact that you’ve spent a lot of time interacting with ‘professionals’ plural reenacting the Good Will Hunting ‘it’s not your fault’ scene sum you up?

Come on. Get over yourself.