Why did God create pediatric cancer?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cold is the absence of heat. Darkness is the absence of light. Evil is the absence of good.

God gave His creatures freedom. When He created angels and humans, they had the capacity to freely choose to love God and all that is good. Instead, Lucifer and other angels abused their freedom and tried to take God’s place in order to lead the whole world astray.

Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, they cooperated with Satan’s evil plan.

Instead of destroying all evil people, God set up a plan. God himself decided to enter history as a human being in Jesus Christ. He never did anything that was evil. But he lived a truly good life. Yet, as God, he decided to absorb all the world’s evil into Himself. He let evil crush him on the cross.

In Genesis 3, a serpent tempts the woman:
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
— Genesis 3:4–5, KJV

The serpent told Eve that eating the fruit from the tree would make her and Adam as gods. Adam and Eve didn’t want knowledge: they wanted to be gods.


Their physical condition changed as a result of their eating the forbidden fruit. As God had promised, they became mortal. Now Adam and Eve could get sick and die. They had to leave the garden of Eden. That’s where the physical illness and death that humans now experience originated. God’s plan was not for us to experience illness and death.

If you don’t believe in God, you don’t believe any of that happened. You must have an alternative theory to why people get sick and die, and why humans are not immortal and get diseases and can die from accidents and injuries. Something else makes humans mortal and age and die.

Humans age and die just like animals and plants because that’s the way nature is. If there’s a beginning (conception) then there’s bound to be an ending. Certainly you couldn’t have children if no one ever died cause it would get awfully crowded if not. This earth is beautiful but also imperfect. Sometimes those random imperfections, of which there are many, lead to new things, some of which are positive and some of which are negative. There is not some being out there who is directing it all.

That’s your personal opinion, which is all well and good. Everyone in the US has a right to have their opinions about everything. However that doesn’t mean your opinion is valid for everyone else. Some people think like you, others do not. That’s why we have a great country; we have absolute freedom of thought and expression.

I think that God exists and I don’t think He chooses anyone to give a painful disease to. I don’t think He looks down and sees a person crossing the road and wiggles His fingers and makes another person driving a car speed up against their will and smash into the pedestrian. I don’t think God has a list of people He gives cancer or AIDS, and I don’t think He decides who wins the lottery or gets a prize at the county fair.

Both our opinions are valid and reasonable and acceptable. Neither are wrong or right; they simply are what we choose to believe. I don’t care what other people believe nor do I want to make them believe as I do. I wish atheists would enjoy their freedom and stop trying to convince people that the way they think is “right.” Nobody should worry about what others think and we all should appreciate our freedom to think as we wish. It says a lot about a person when they decide they have to advertise their own opinions and pretend their opinions are special and correct.

PP was giving their opinion in response to someone (you?) who said if you don’t believe in god you must have an alternative theory. So if you want atheists to stop giving their opinion don’t ask for it.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Honestly, this is one thing that I struggle with myself.

The last church I went to, the pastor was talking about how the way we pray makes a difference, that there're correct and incorrect ways of praying. I broke down right then and there, thinking that I must not have prayed correctly b/c why else did my mom suffer so much from her cancer and die with such agony and indignity. Then I got really angry at the idea that if you pray incorrectly, God will refuse to listen.

I don't know the answer. And I suspect nobody really does.

Let me try.

God doesn't really exist in the way people think and cancer is a chain of events that happens inside the body. God does not give people cancer anymore than God heals people with cancer.

Does God dictate the laws of physics or does God follow then? If God dictates the laws of physics than surely we would see miracles that are exceptions. We don't

But God created cancer. If God wanted to create bodies in which cells didn't mutate, God could have done so - unless you don't believe that God actually has control over everything in the universe? There is no "good" God unless there is also an evil god, who also creates and dishes to humans all the traumas and pains in life.

Ultimately, the evidence is clear - there is no god. Not in any "creator" type sense. No afterlife, no being that actually starts and ends.

So where does pediatric cancer come from?

It comes from a genetic mutation gone awry, which all human bodies are susceptible to. Because that's how God chose to create human bodies (or god doesn't exist, which is more likely).

What a weird answer. The God the who definitely doesn’t exist created pediatric cancer.

OK now you are just being a petulant jerk. You’re embarrassing yourself. Every person can see that is not what PP wrote.

A bunch of people who don’t believe God exists are insisting the non-existent God created pediatric cancer. It doesn’t make any sense. Entities who do not exist do not create or destroy anything.

Many people have already answered this, you are just being purposefully obtuse.

1) Atheists don't believe in god, therefore don't believe god created cancer that kills children.
2) If you do believe in god, and god created everything, then he must have also created cancer that kills children.

Person 1 does not believe what person 2 believes. No atheist thinks a non-existent god created cancer that kills children. You just keep copy and pasting this all over every religious thread and it makes it seem like you can't read properly.

No; evil doesn’t come from God. Evil is an absence of God. Humans have free will.

God had already made the world so no cancer existed. Adam and Eve were not satisfied with that; they decided to disobey God and wanted to be gods. They rejected the pediatric cancer free world which God had graciously already provided for us.

Because we have free will and are not Westworld humanoid robots God created in His lab, preloaded with software that makes it so we like Him. And we aren’t programmed to do what He wants. We have the ability to choose what we do.

K well I want to use my free will to not get cancer, or have my children or family get cancer. Unfortunately that's not how free will works.

We would all love perfect lives. There isn’t a single human being on earth that would choose to be poor or sick.

Free will is how we live our lives no matter how poor or sick or healthy or rich we are. Very wealthy people who are given so much can be terrible people. Poor people who have nothing can be the most wonderful and beautiful souls on earth.

Free will is the capacity or ability to choose between different possible courses of action. It is not choosing to live forever, choosing to not be sick, choosing to win the lottery, etc.

Yes, that is the point PP is making. You just affirmed the point (I assume) you were trying to refute. That stuff is all true, so stop trying to use free will as the excuse for the god you believe in’s behavior.

So you’re one of the “I don’t believe in God, but He gives babies cancer” posters. That doesn’t make any sense. It explains why you are obsessed and miserable though.

Stop being intentionally dense. This has been explained to you multiple times in this thread alone.

YOU BELIEVE IN A GOD THAT INTENTIONALLY GIVES BABIES CANCER. YOU WORSHIP THAT GOD. THAT IS RIDICULOUS.

ATHEISTS DO NOT BELEIVE IN A GOD SO THEY DO NOT THINK HE EXISTS OR CAN GIVE BABIES CANCER. THEY THINK CANCER IS PROBABLY A RESULT OF NATURAL PROCESSES BUT DON’T CLAIM TO KNOW THAT FOR SURE.

NO YOU DO NOT NEED AN ALTERNATIVE EXPLANATION TO REJECT THE EVIDENCELESS CLAIM A GOD CREATED EVERYTHING.

NO I AM NOT OBSESSED OR MISERABLE AND YOUR INSULTS DO NOTHING TO BOLSTER YOUR ARGUMENT. THEY JUST SHOW YOU CAN’T DEFEND YOUR POSITION WITHOUT RESORTING TO THEM. THAT’S WEAK.

There it is again, shouted on purpose so maybe you will hear it this time.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:First off, this question, the question of suffering (and evil) is one of the toughest questions for Christianity, so you are not alone in raising this. It has been written about over and over from different angles by different theologians. If are looking for an answer, start with some books, not here.

Here are some personal thoughts on this issue. First, Christianity looks at suffering through a very different lens than secular society. In Christianity, suffering is redemptive. Part of the reason Jesus has to die (as someone asked) is precisely to show us the power of obedience and suffering. So I think for the faithful, they view tragic events differently, or aspire to. They try to focus on the love in the situation, and the grief, while real, is an extension of that love.

Second is the idea that whatever suffering there is in this world will pale in comparison to the glory of heaven. We feel suffering and evil acutely because this world is all we know and anything that shatters our lives in this world feels catastrophic. However, this is not how God sees things. It is like if your 2 year old needs to have some procedure, it might feel like the end of the world for him, but you as the parent know that the small pain is worth it because it will make him healthier in the long run. We don't have the long view but God does.

Third is the idea that God does not create any of the evil or suffering. He allows it, which might be a small distinction but it is an important one. And he only allows suffering and evil when it would ultimately bring about a greater good. I find the parent analogy really apt here. A good parent would never cause harm or suffering to their child but might allow a certain amount of suffering in order to bring about a greater good (natural consequences, for example, or to learn value of hard work etc).

Thanks for this thoughtful answer.

To me though, it still doesn't quite track. If we believe that God is omnipotent, God gets to decide what is redemptive and God gets to decide the relative positive experience of worldly suffering v. heavenly glory. He sets up the system. So why would suffering even need to enter into the equation?

Your question goes deep into philosophical/theological territory. I have my own views, which I'll share, but I think ultimately we will never know (in this world) why the world had to be set up the exact way that it is. To me, that is not a cop out because if God is defined, as it classically is, as that which nothing greater can be thought, then God's thinking is way above ours. It is like a 2 dimensional creature trying to understand the 3D world, only perhaps the gulf is even greater. We will never understand to our satisfaction here, but I believe God gives us enough, through our mental faculties, that we can understand enough to have faith.

Ok now my random thoughts. God is omnipotent but that doesn't mean that he can do anything. He cannot contradict himself, for example, or perform logical absurdities. He cannot make a creature greater than himself, he cannot commit evil, etc. The fact that God cannot defy logic is not a limitation on God but rather logic as we know it, comes from God and is part of his essence. Anyways, part of God's logic is that true love can only be freely given, and that growth comes through overcoming hardship. These are not foreign concepts. We see these themes echoed in story after story (secular and biblical), art, personal experience, observations in the natural world (did anyone read Anxious Generation? look at concept of anti-fragility). Because God does not want slaves or servants, but to be friends with us, he wants us to gain a deeper understanding of him and to freely love him. It is in this context we have evil and suffering. God does not want to force us to love him, to do the right thing. God does not want us to stay as children, pampered, spoiled, and helpless. Once again I go to the parent-child analogy. The child might put up a big fuss about learning his letters or getting sick or being denied certain things, but the parent knows that it is worth it in the long view.

PP here. Thanks again for another thoughtful answer.

I don't say this to be dismissive, but I think this exchange gets to the crux of why non-believers, like myself, can never reconcile the concept of an omnipotent and loving god.
In the end, belief is not logical or reasonable, at least not completely.

Some people are capable and willing to make that "leap of faith." Others are either not capable, or not willing, or both.

So then, at least on this board, either group just devolves into pointlessly hurling insults at the other....

It is sad.

I somewhat agree. Everyone is different and the idea of faith is easier for some than others, which might feel like a great injustice, but I truly believe everyone has their own path to God. Some get there through art, some through logic and science.

For me personally faith doesn't necessarily come easily. What helps me on the mundane daily basis is actually a form of Pascal's wager. There is no real cost to faith but the benefits can be enormous, not just in terms of afterlife but to help me through hardships and suffering and just the daily grind in this life. What faith provided is a world infused with meaning. I might not always "believe it" fully every day but I can't go back to the gray world of atheism. I just simply don't want to. Again I don't see this as a cop out. In Christianity we would say that I have fallen in love with God and gotten a taste of life with him and nothing else will do. I strive for that even when faith does not come easily.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Honestly, this is one thing that I struggle with myself.

The last church I went to, the pastor was talking about how the way we pray makes a difference, that there're correct and incorrect ways of praying. I broke down right then and there, thinking that I must not have prayed correctly b/c why else did my mom suffer so much from her cancer and die with such agony and indignity. Then I got really angry at the idea that if you pray incorrectly, God will refuse to listen.

I don't know the answer. And I suspect nobody really does.

Let me try.

God doesn't really exist in the way people think and cancer is a chain of events that happens inside the body. God does not give people cancer anymore than God heals people with cancer.

Does God dictate the laws of physics or does God follow then? If God dictates the laws of physics than surely we would see miracles that are exceptions. We don't

But God created cancer. If God wanted to create bodies in which cells didn't mutate, God could have done so - unless you don't believe that God actually has control over everything in the universe? There is no "good" God unless there is also an evil god, who also creates and dishes to humans all the traumas and pains in life.

Ultimately, the evidence is clear - there is no god. Not in any "creator" type sense. No afterlife, no being that actually starts and ends.

So where does pediatric cancer come from?

It comes from a genetic mutation gone awry, which all human bodies are susceptible to. Because that's how God chose to create human bodies (or god doesn't exist, which is more likely).

What a weird answer. The God the who definitely doesn’t exist created pediatric cancer.

OK now you are just being a petulant jerk. You’re embarrassing yourself. Every person can see that is not what PP wrote.

A bunch of people who don’t believe God exists are insisting the non-existent God created pediatric cancer. It doesn’t make any sense. Entities who do not exist do not create or destroy anything.

Many people have already answered this, you are just being purposefully obtuse.

1) Atheists don't believe in god, therefore don't believe god created cancer that kills children.
2) If you do believe in god, and god created everything, then he must have also created cancer that kills children.

Person 1 does not believe what person 2 believes. No atheist thinks a non-existent god created cancer that kills children. You just keep copy and pasting this all over every religious thread and it makes it seem like you can't read properly.

No; evil doesn’t come from God. Evil is an absence of God. Humans have free will.

God had already made the world so no cancer existed. Adam and Eve were not satisfied with that; they decided to disobey God and wanted to be gods. They rejected the pediatric cancer free world which God had graciously already provided for us.

Because we have free will and are not Westworld humanoid robots God created in His lab, preloaded with software that makes it so we like Him. And we aren’t programmed to do what He wants. We have the ability to choose what we do.

K well I want to use my free will to not get cancer, or have my children or family get cancer. Unfortunately that's not how free will works.

We would all love perfect lives. There isn’t a single human being on earth that would choose to be poor or sick.

Free will is how we live our lives no matter how poor or sick or healthy or rich we are. Very wealthy people who are given so much can be terrible people. Poor people who have nothing can be the most wonderful and beautiful souls on earth.

Free will is the capacity or ability to choose between different possible courses of action. It is not choosing to live forever, choosing to not be sick, choosing to win the lottery, etc.

Yes, that is the point PP is making. You just affirmed the point (I assume) you were trying to refute. That stuff is all true, so stop trying to use free will as the excuse for the god you believe in’s behavior.

So you’re one of the “I don’t believe in God, but He gives babies cancer” posters. That doesn’t make any sense. It explains why you are obsessed and miserable though.

Stop being intentionally dense. This has been explained to you multiple times in this thread alone.

YOU BELIEVE IN A GOD THAT INTENTIONALLY GIVES BABIES CANCER. YOU WORSHIP THAT GOD. THAT IS RIDICULOUS.

ATHEISTS DO NOT BELEIVE IN A GOD SO THEY DO NOT THINK HE EXISTS OR CAN GIVE BABIES CANCER. THEY THINK CANCER IS PROBABLY A RESULT OF NATURAL PROCESSES BUT DON’T CLAIM TO KNOW THAT FOR SURE.

NO YOU DO NOT NEED AN ALTERNATIVE EXPLANATION TO REJECT THE EVIDENCELESS CLAIM A GOD CREATED EVERYTHING.

NO I AM NOT OBSESSED OR MISERABLE AND YOUR INSULTS DO NOTHING TO BOLSTER YOUR ARGUMENT. THEY JUST SHOW YOU CAN’T DEFEND YOUR POSITION WITHOUT RESORTING TO THEM. THAT’S WEAK.

There it is again, shouted on purpose so maybe you will hear it this time.

Once again: people who believe in God do not believe God gives babies cancer.

The only people who are insisting that God gives babies cancer are the people who don’t believe in Him. It’s quite illogical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cold is the absence of heat. Darkness is the absence of light. Evil is the absence of good.

God gave His creatures freedom. When He created angels and humans, they had the capacity to freely choose to love God and all that is good. Instead, Lucifer and other angels abused their freedom and tried to take God’s place in order to lead the whole world astray.

Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, they cooperated with Satan’s evil plan.

Instead of destroying all evil people, God set up a plan. God himself decided to enter history as a human being in Jesus Christ. He never did anything that was evil. But he lived a truly good life. Yet, as God, he decided to absorb all the world’s evil into Himself. He let evil crush him on the cross.

In Genesis 3, a serpent tempts the woman:
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
— Genesis 3:4–5, KJV

The serpent told Eve that eating the fruit from the tree would make her and Adam as gods. Adam and Eve didn’t want knowledge: they wanted to be gods.


Their physical condition changed as a result of their eating the forbidden fruit. As God had promised, they became mortal. Now Adam and Eve could get sick and die. They had to leave the garden of Eden. That’s where the physical illness and death that humans now experience originated. God’s plan was not for us to experience illness and death.

If you don’t believe in God, you don’t believe any of that happened. You must have an alternative theory to why people get sick and die, and why humans are not immortal and get diseases and can die from accidents and injuries. Something else makes humans mortal and age and die.

Humans age and die just like animals and plants because that’s the way nature is. If there’s a beginning (conception) then there’s bound to be an ending. Certainly you couldn’t have children if no one ever died cause it would get awfully crowded if not. This earth is beautiful but also imperfect. Sometimes those random imperfections, of which there are many, lead to new things, some of which are positive and some of which are negative. There is not some being out there who is directing it all.

That’s your personal opinion, which is all well and good. Everyone in the US has a right to have their opinions about everything. However that doesn’t mean your opinion is valid for everyone else. Some people think like you, others do not. That’s why we have a great country; we have absolute freedom of thought and expression.

I think that God exists and I don’t think He chooses anyone to give a painful disease to. I don’t think He looks down and sees a person crossing the road and wiggles His fingers and makes another person driving a car speed up against their will and smash into the pedestrian. I don’t think God has a list of people He gives cancer or AIDS, and I don’t think He decides who wins the lottery or gets a prize at the county fair.

Both our opinions are valid and reasonable and acceptable. Neither are wrong or right; they simply are what we choose to believe. I don’t care what other people believe nor do I want to make them believe as I do. I wish atheists would enjoy their freedom and stop trying to convince people that the way they think is “right.” Nobody should worry about what others think and we all should appreciate our freedom to think as we wish. It says a lot about a person when they decide they have to advertise their own opinions and pretend their opinions are special and correct.

PP was giving their opinion in response to someone (you?) who said if you don’t believe in god you must have an alternative theory. So if you want atheists to stop giving their opinion don’t ask for it.

Op asked for people who believe in God to answer. Per usual, atheists began posting (even though op didn’t ask for their opinion) and started taking the thread off topic. Thet started changing the subject to how they believe God doesn’t exist. Then they added that the God they do not believe exists gives babies cancer. Then they started telling people who do believe in God what they must believe about God.

It turns out people who don’t believe in God sure do post about Him a lot. And they have the weirdest belief that they know how religious people think. Totally obsessed, very wrong. And people who don’t believe in God don’t believe in Him so hard THEY WILL START SHOUTING IN ALL CAPS ABOUT HOW THEY DON’T BELIEVE IN HIM, because they are so mad other people don’t think like THEY DO.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had heard that it was because God needed their help in heaven because they were such little angels

I was told similar. Also, or alternatively, that God needed to bring the parents closer to him.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Honestly, this is one thing that I struggle with myself.

The last church I went to, the pastor was talking about how the way we pray makes a difference, that there're correct and incorrect ways of praying. I broke down right then and there, thinking that I must not have prayed correctly b/c why else did my mom suffer so much from her cancer and die with such agony and indignity. Then I got really angry at the idea that if you pray incorrectly, God will refuse to listen.

I don't know the answer. And I suspect nobody really does.

Let me try.

God doesn't really exist in the way people think and cancer is a chain of events that happens inside the body. God does not give people cancer anymore than God heals people with cancer.

Does God dictate the laws of physics or does God follow then? If God dictates the laws of physics than surely we would see miracles that are exceptions. We don't

But God created cancer. If God wanted to create bodies in which cells didn't mutate, God could have done so - unless you don't believe that God actually has control over everything in the universe? There is no "good" God unless there is also an evil god, who also creates and dishes to humans all the traumas and pains in life.

Ultimately, the evidence is clear - there is no god. Not in any "creator" type sense. No afterlife, no being that actually starts and ends.

So where does pediatric cancer come from?

It comes from a genetic mutation gone awry, which all human bodies are susceptible to. Because that's how God chose to create human bodies (or god doesn't exist, which is more likely).

What a weird answer. The God the who definitely doesn’t exist created pediatric cancer.

OK now you are just being a petulant jerk. You’re embarrassing yourself. Every person can see that is not what PP wrote.

A bunch of people who don’t believe God exists are insisting the non-existent God created pediatric cancer. It doesn’t make any sense. Entities who do not exist do not create or destroy anything.

Many people have already answered this, you are just being purposefully obtuse.

1) Atheists don't believe in god, therefore don't believe god created cancer that kills children.
2) If you do believe in god, and god created everything, then he must have also created cancer that kills children.

Person 1 does not believe what person 2 believes. No atheist thinks a non-existent god created cancer that kills children. You just keep copy and pasting this all over every religious thread and it makes it seem like you can't read properly.

No; evil doesn’t come from God. Evil is an absence of God. Humans have free will.

God had already made the world so no cancer existed. Adam and Eve were not satisfied with that; they decided to disobey God and wanted to be gods. They rejected the pediatric cancer free world which God had graciously already provided for us.

Because we have free will and are not Westworld humanoid robots God created in His lab, preloaded with software that makes it so we like Him. And we aren’t programmed to do what He wants. We have the ability to choose what we do.

K well I want to use my free will to not get cancer, or have my children or family get cancer. Unfortunately that's not how free will works.

We would all love perfect lives. There isn’t a single human being on earth that would choose to be poor or sick.

Free will is how we live our lives no matter how poor or sick or healthy or rich we are. Very wealthy people who are given so much can be terrible people. Poor people who have nothing can be the most wonderful and beautiful souls on earth.

Free will is the capacity or ability to choose between different possible courses of action. It is not choosing to live forever, choosing to not be sick, choosing to win the lottery, etc.

Yes, that is the point PP is making. You just affirmed the point (I assume) you were trying to refute. That stuff is all true, so stop trying to use free will as the excuse for the god you believe in’s behavior.

So you’re one of the “I don’t believe in God, but He gives babies cancer” posters. That doesn’t make any sense. It explains why you are obsessed and miserable though.

Stop being intentionally dense. This has been explained to you multiple times in this thread alone.

YOU BELIEVE IN A GOD THAT INTENTIONALLY GIVES BABIES CANCER. YOU WORSHIP THAT GOD. THAT IS RIDICULOUS.

ATHEISTS DO NOT BELEIVE IN A GOD SO THEY DO NOT THINK HE EXISTS OR CAN GIVE BABIES CANCER. THEY THINK CANCER IS PROBABLY A RESULT OF NATURAL PROCESSES BUT DON’T CLAIM TO KNOW THAT FOR SURE.

NO YOU DO NOT NEED AN ALTERNATIVE EXPLANATION TO REJECT THE EVIDENCELESS CLAIM A GOD CREATED EVERYTHING.

NO I AM NOT OBSESSED OR MISERABLE AND YOUR INSULTS DO NOTHING TO BOLSTER YOUR ARGUMENT. THEY JUST SHOW YOU CAN’T DEFEND YOUR POSITION WITHOUT RESORTING TO THEM. THAT’S WEAK.

There it is again, shouted on purpose so maybe you will hear it this time.

Once again: people who believe in God do not believe God gives babies cancer.

The only people who are insisting that God gives babies cancer are the people who don’t believe in Him. It’s quite illogical.

Not the poster you were responding to. But I also do not understand the above. If you are not too frustrated to try again, could you help me see what you are saying?

It seems to me that many who believe in God think He is all knowing and all powerful. And so when someone who sees something bad (pediatric cancer), they pray to God to intervene. If there is a positive outcome, the devotee often gives thanks to God for being good and saving the life of their child. If the patient dies, the religious community responds with “it is not God’s fault because of original sin” or something similar. How do you hold God responsible for all that is good but none of what is bad? This is the piece I have never understood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had heard that it was because God needed their help in heaven because they were such little angels

I was told similar. Also, or alternatively, that God needed to bring the parents closer to him.

People don’t turn into angels when they die.

Eerdman’s Dictionary of the Bible gives a good summary:

“Angels are a part of the creation of God, created either in the beginning or sometime before the foundation of the earth (Ps. 148:2–5; Neh. 9:6; Col. 1:15–17). They are of a higher order than humans (Heb. 2:7) and are greater in power and might (2 Pet. 2:11; cf. 2 Kgs. 19:35). However, they are not to be worshipped by humans (Col. 2:18; Rev. 22:8–9). Angels are not omniscient as is God, for they do not know the time of the coming of Christ (Matt. 24:36; cf. 1 Pet. 1:12). Neither are they omnipresent, for they are said to go from place to place (Dan. 9:21–23). Angels are spirit beings (Heb. 1:14). They do not die, nor do they marry (Luke 20:36; Mark 12:25). While the number of the angels is never definitely given, they are said to be innumerable (Dan. 7:10; Heb. 12:22; Rev. 5:11).”

According to Sam Emadi, “Their primary functions as revealed in Scripture are to engage in the worship of God in heaven and carry out his purposes on earth. God commissions angels to protect his people, deliver them from danger, transmit divine messages, and encourage believers.”

People often say that when their loved one passes away, they become an angel. They say their loved one becomes their guardian angel. That’s something people probably like to think about; their loved one is protecting them. But that’s not biblically accurate. It’s not something we should ever correct a grieving family member or loved one about; we don’t need to start quoting scripture and proving to someone that their loved one is not an angel. But it’s just not how it works. I just express my condolences to a grieving person and let them work out their own thoughts. It’s not a bible trivia contest when someone is grieving. But nobody here is grieving, so we can correct the record. Just because someone says something they think or believe, doesn’t mean they speak for the bible or all other people who believe in God. But it’s always good to educate yourself and not just take people’s word that they know what they are talking about, especially when they are grieving.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, this is one thing that I struggle with myself.

The last church I went to, the pastor was talking about how the way we pray makes a difference, that there're correct and incorrect ways of praying. I broke down right then and there, thinking that I must not have prayed correctly b/c why else did my mom suffer so much from her cancer and die with such agony and indignity. Then I got really angry at the idea that if you pray incorrectly, God will refuse to listen.

I don't know the answer. And I suspect nobody really does.

Let me try.

God doesn't really exist in the way people think and cancer is a chain of events that happens inside the body. God does not give people cancer anymore than God heals people with cancer.

Does God dictate the laws of physics or does God follow then? If God dictates the laws of physics than surely we would see miracles that are exceptions. We don't

But God created cancer. If God wanted to create bodies in which cells didn't mutate, God could have done so - unless you don't believe that God actually has control over everything in the universe? There is no "good" God unless there is also an evil god, who also creates and dishes to humans all the traumas and pains in life.

Ultimately, the evidence is clear - there is no god. Not in any "creator" type sense. No afterlife, no being that actually starts and ends.

So where does pediatric cancer come from?

It comes from a genetic mutation gone awry, which all human bodies are susceptible to. Because that's how God chose to create human bodies (or god doesn't exist, which is more likely).

What a weird answer. The God the who definitely doesn’t exist created pediatric cancer.

OK now you are just being a petulant jerk. You’re embarrassing yourself. Every person can see that is not what PP wrote.

A bunch of people who don’t believe God exists are insisting the non-existent God created pediatric cancer. It doesn’t make any sense. Entities who do not exist do not create or destroy anything.

Many people have already answered this, you are just being purposefully obtuse.

1) Atheists don't believe in god, therefore don't believe god created cancer that kills children.
2) If you do believe in god, and god created everything, then he must have also created cancer that kills children.

Person 1 does not believe what person 2 believes. No atheist thinks a non-existent god created cancer that kills children. You just keep copy and pasting this all over every religious thread and it makes it seem like you can't read properly.

No; evil doesn’t come from God. Evil is an absence of God. Humans have free will.

God had already made the world so no cancer existed. Adam and Eve were not satisfied with that; they decided to disobey God and wanted to be gods. They rejected the pediatric cancer free world which God had graciously already provided for us.

Because we have free will and are not Westworld humanoid robots God created in His lab, preloaded with software that makes it so we like Him. And we aren’t programmed to do what He wants. We have the ability to choose what we do.

K well I want to use my free will to not get cancer, or have my children or family get cancer. Unfortunately that's not how free will works.

We would all love perfect lives. There isn’t a single human being on earth that would choose to be poor or sick.

Free will is how we live our lives no matter how poor or sick or healthy or rich we are. Very wealthy people who are given so much can be terrible people. Poor people who have nothing can be the most wonderful and beautiful souls on earth.

Free will is the capacity or ability to choose between different possible courses of action. It is not choosing to live forever, choosing to not be sick, choosing to win the lottery, etc.

Yes, that is the point PP is making. You just affirmed the point (I assume) you were trying to refute. That stuff is all true, so stop trying to use free will as the excuse for the god you believe in’s behavior.

So you’re one of the “I don’t believe in God, but He gives babies cancer” posters. That doesn’t make any sense. It explains why you are obsessed and miserable though.

Stop being intentionally dense. This has been explained to you multiple times in this thread alone.

YOU BELIEVE IN A GOD THAT INTENTIONALLY GIVES BABIES CANCER. YOU WORSHIP THAT GOD. THAT IS RIDICULOUS.

ATHEISTS DO NOT BELEIVE IN A GOD SO THEY DO NOT THINK HE EXISTS OR CAN GIVE BABIES CANCER. THEY THINK CANCER IS PROBABLY A RESULT OF NATURAL PROCESSES BUT DON’T CLAIM TO KNOW THAT FOR SURE.

NO YOU DO NOT NEED AN ALTERNATIVE EXPLANATION TO REJECT THE EVIDENCELESS CLAIM A GOD CREATED EVERYTHING.

NO I AM NOT OBSESSED OR MISERABLE AND YOUR INSULTS DO NOTHING TO BOLSTER YOUR ARGUMENT. THEY JUST SHOW YOU CAN’T DEFEND YOUR POSITION WITHOUT RESORTING TO THEM. THAT’S WEAK.

There it is again, shouted on purpose so maybe you will hear it this time.

Once again: people who believe in God do not believe God gives babies cancer.

The only people who are insisting that God gives babies cancer are the people who don’t believe in Him. It’s quite illogical.

Not the poster you were responding to. But I also do not understand the above. If you are not too frustrated to try again, could you help me see what you are saying?

It seems to me that many who believe in God think He is all knowing and all powerful. And so when someone who sees something bad (pediatric cancer), they pray to God to intervene. If there is a positive outcome, the devotee often gives thanks to God for being good and saving the life of their child. If the patient dies, the religious community responds with “it is not God’s fault because of original sin” or something similar. How do you hold God responsible for all that is good but none of what is bad? This is the piece I have never understood.

By that thought, why do you only believe God gives children cancer? That’s the only thing God created? Cancer? That’s His totality of creation? Doesn’t make sense. God never promised that humans would live forever or not get sick. We are not immortal or robots.

If someone views the entire creation of God through pediatric cancer, that’s just their outlook. Nobody can reason with someone who denies God exists but then states He created pediatric cancer and that’s the totality of the non-existent God’s creation. It’s really nuts. If you don’t believe in God you can’t credit him with pediatric cancer and you can’t tell people who believe in God what they must believe about God. Really, you are just going in circles day after day. You should speak in person to a religious leader and ask these questions because no matter what, I would never make my mind up about any subject based on the opinions of anon posters online. Nobody knows who is posting and what their agenda or educational background is. Everyone has their own opinion, as they should. We are individuals with unique perspective and experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cold is the absence of heat. Darkness is the absence of light. Evil is the absence of good.

God gave His creatures freedom. When He created angels and humans, they had the capacity to freely choose to love God and all that is good. Instead, Lucifer and other angels abused their freedom and tried to take God’s place in order to lead the whole world astray.

Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, they cooperated with Satan’s evil plan.

Instead of destroying all evil people, God set up a plan. God himself decided to enter history as a human being in Jesus Christ. He never did anything that was evil. But he lived a truly good life. Yet, as God, he decided to absorb all the world’s evil into Himself. He let evil crush him on the cross.

In Genesis 3, a serpent tempts the woman:
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
— Genesis 3:4–5, KJV

The serpent told Eve that eating the fruit from the tree would make her and Adam as gods. Adam and Eve didn’t want knowledge: they wanted to be gods.


Their physical condition changed as a result of their eating the forbidden fruit. As God had promised, they became mortal. Now Adam and Eve could get sick and die. They had to leave the garden of Eden. That’s where the physical illness and death that humans now experience originated. God’s plan was not for us to experience illness and death.

If you don’t believe in God, you don’t believe any of that happened. You must have an alternative theory to why people get sick and die, and why humans are not immortal and get diseases and can die from accidents and injuries. Something else makes humans mortal and age and die.

Humans age and die just like animals and plants because that’s the way nature is. If there’s a beginning (conception) then there’s bound to be an ending. Certainly you couldn’t have children if no one ever died cause it would get awfully crowded if not. This earth is beautiful but also imperfect. Sometimes those random imperfections, of which there are many, lead to new things, some of which are positive and some of which are negative. There is not some being out there who is directing it all.

That’s your personal opinion, which is all well and good. Everyone in the US has a right to have their opinions about everything. However that doesn’t mean your opinion is valid for everyone else. Some people think like you, others do not. That’s why we have a great country; we have absolute freedom of thought and expression.

I think that God exists and I don’t think He chooses anyone to give a painful disease to. I don’t think He looks down and sees a person crossing the road and wiggles His fingers and makes another person driving a car speed up against their will and smash into the pedestrian. I don’t think God has a list of people He gives cancer or AIDS, and I don’t think He decides who wins the lottery or gets a prize at the county fair.

Both our opinions are valid and reasonable and acceptable. Neither are wrong or right; they simply are what we choose to believe. I don’t care what other people believe nor do I want to make them believe as I do. I wish atheists would enjoy their freedom and stop trying to convince people that the way they think is “right.” Nobody should worry about what others think and we all should appreciate our freedom to think as we wish. It says a lot about a person when they decide they have to advertise their own opinions and pretend their opinions are special and correct.

PP was giving their opinion in response to someone (you?) who said if you don’t believe in god you must have an alternative theory. So if you want atheists to stop giving their opinion don’t ask for it.

Op asked for people who believe in God to answer. Per usual, atheists began posting (even though op didn’t ask for their opinion) and started taking the thread off topic. Thet started changing the subject to how they believe God doesn’t exist. Then they added that the God they do not believe exists gives babies cancer. Then they started telling people who do believe in God what they must believe about God.

It turns out people who don’t believe in God sure do post about Him a lot. And they have the weirdest belief that they know how religious people think. Totally obsessed, very wrong. And people who don’t believe in God don’t believe in Him so hard THEY WILL START SHOUTING IN ALL CAPS ABOUT HOW THEY DON’T BELIEVE IN HIM, because they are so mad other people don’t think like THEY DO.

You’re right, the correct answer is god doesn’t exist and doesn’t give children cancer. But if you believe in god then you also believe he could heal the children and chooses not to. Or he chose your child to get cancer and die. Or they chose you to be an example of… ? Faith? For being strong? While your child dies of cancer.

What an ahole!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had heard that it was because God needed their help in heaven because they were such little angels

I was told similar. Also, or alternatively, that God needed to bring the parents closer to him.

People don’t turn into angels when they die.

Eerdman’s Dictionary of the Bible gives a good summary:

“Angels are a part of the creation of God, created either in the beginning or sometime before the foundation of the earth (Ps. 148:2–5; Neh. 9:6; Col. 1:15–17). They are of a higher order than humans (Heb. 2:7) and are greater in power and might (2 Pet. 2:11; cf. 2 Kgs. 19:35). However, they are not to be worshipped by humans (Col. 2:18; Rev. 22:8–9). Angels are not omniscient as is God, for they do not know the time of the coming of Christ (Matt. 24:36; cf. 1 Pet. 1:12). Neither are they omnipresent, for they are said to go from place to place (Dan. 9:21–23). Angels are spirit beings (Heb. 1:14). They do not die, nor do they marry (Luke 20:36; Mark 12:25). While the number of the angels is never definitely given, they are said to be innumerable (Dan. 7:10; Heb. 12:22; Rev. 5:11).”

According to Sam Emadi, “Their primary functions as revealed in Scripture are to engage in the worship of God in heaven and carry out his purposes on earth. God commissions angels to protect his people, deliver them from danger, transmit divine messages, and encourage believers.”

People often say that when their loved one passes away, they become an angel. They say their loved one becomes their guardian angel. That’s something people probably like to think about; their loved one is protecting them. But that’s not biblically accurate. It’s not something we should ever correct a grieving family member or loved one about; we don’t need to start quoting scripture and proving to someone that their loved one is not an angel. But it’s just not how it works. I just express my condolences to a grieving person and let them work out their own thoughts. It’s not a bible trivia contest when someone is grieving. But nobody here is grieving, so we can correct the record. Just because someone says something they think or believe, doesn’t mean they speak for the bible or all other people who believe in God. But it’s always good to educate yourself and not just take people’s word that they know what they are talking about, especially when they are grieving.

Huh?

I was listening to the Preist who said God was bringing the parents of the sick child closer to him. The child hadn't died at that point.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, this is one thing that I struggle with myself.

The last church I went to, the pastor was talking about how the way we pray makes a difference, that there're correct and incorrect ways of praying. I broke down right then and there, thinking that I must not have prayed correctly b/c why else did my mom suffer so much from her cancer and die with such agony and indignity. Then I got really angry at the idea that if you pray incorrectly, God will refuse to listen.

I don't know the answer. And I suspect nobody really does.

Let me try.

God doesn't really exist in the way people think and cancer is a chain of events that happens inside the body. God does not give people cancer anymore than God heals people with cancer.

Does God dictate the laws of physics or does God follow then? If God dictates the laws of physics than surely we would see miracles that are exceptions. We don't

But God created cancer. If God wanted to create bodies in which cells didn't mutate, God could have done so - unless you don't believe that God actually has control over everything in the universe? There is no "good" God unless there is also an evil god, who also creates and dishes to humans all the traumas and pains in life.

Ultimately, the evidence is clear - there is no god. Not in any "creator" type sense. No afterlife, no being that actually starts and ends.

So where does pediatric cancer come from?

It comes from a genetic mutation gone awry, which all human bodies are susceptible to. Because that's how God chose to create human bodies (or god doesn't exist, which is more likely).

What a weird answer. The God the who definitely doesn’t exist created pediatric cancer.

OK now you are just being a petulant jerk. You’re embarrassing yourself. Every person can see that is not what PP wrote.

A bunch of people who don’t believe God exists are insisting the non-existent God created pediatric cancer. It doesn’t make any sense. Entities who do not exist do not create or destroy anything.

Many people have already answered this, you are just being purposefully obtuse.

1) Atheists don't believe in god, therefore don't believe god created cancer that kills children.
2) If you do believe in god, and god created everything, then he must have also created cancer that kills children.

Person 1 does not believe what person 2 believes. No atheist thinks a non-existent god created cancer that kills children. You just keep copy and pasting this all over every religious thread and it makes it seem like you can't read properly.

No; evil doesn’t come from God. Evil is an absence of God. Humans have free will.

God had already made the world so no cancer existed. Adam and Eve were not satisfied with that; they decided to disobey God and wanted to be gods. They rejected the pediatric cancer free world which God had graciously already provided for us.

Because we have free will and are not Westworld humanoid robots God created in His lab, preloaded with software that makes it so we like Him. And we aren’t programmed to do what He wants. We have the ability to choose what we do.

K well I want to use my free will to not get cancer, or have my children or family get cancer. Unfortunately that's not how free will works.

We would all love perfect lives. There isn’t a single human being on earth that would choose to be poor or sick.

Free will is how we live our lives no matter how poor or sick or healthy or rich we are. Very wealthy people who are given so much can be terrible people. Poor people who have nothing can be the most wonderful and beautiful souls on earth.

Free will is the capacity or ability to choose between different possible courses of action. It is not choosing to live forever, choosing to not be sick, choosing to win the lottery, etc.

Yes, that is the point PP is making. You just affirmed the point (I assume) you were trying to refute. That stuff is all true, so stop trying to use free will as the excuse for the god you believe in’s behavior.

So you’re one of the “I don’t believe in God, but He gives babies cancer” posters. That doesn’t make any sense. It explains why you are obsessed and miserable though.

Stop being intentionally dense. This has been explained to you multiple times in this thread alone.

YOU BELIEVE IN A GOD THAT INTENTIONALLY GIVES BABIES CANCER. YOU WORSHIP THAT GOD. THAT IS RIDICULOUS.

ATHEISTS DO NOT BELEIVE IN A GOD SO THEY DO NOT THINK HE EXISTS OR CAN GIVE BABIES CANCER. THEY THINK CANCER IS PROBABLY A RESULT OF NATURAL PROCESSES BUT DON’T CLAIM TO KNOW THAT FOR SURE.

NO YOU DO NOT NEED AN ALTERNATIVE EXPLANATION TO REJECT THE EVIDENCELESS CLAIM A GOD CREATED EVERYTHING.

NO I AM NOT OBSESSED OR MISERABLE AND YOUR INSULTS DO NOTHING TO BOLSTER YOUR ARGUMENT. THEY JUST SHOW YOU CAN’T DEFEND YOUR POSITION WITHOUT RESORTING TO THEM. THAT’S WEAK.

There it is again, shouted on purpose so maybe you will hear it this time.

Once again: people who believe in God do not believe God gives babies cancer.

The only people who are insisting that God gives babies cancer are the people who don’t believe in Him. It’s quite illogical.

Not the poster you were responding to. But I also do not understand the above. If you are not too frustrated to try again, could you help me see what you are saying?

It seems to me that many who believe in God think He is all knowing and all powerful. And so when someone who sees something bad (pediatric cancer), they pray to God to intervene. If there is a positive outcome, the devotee often gives thanks to God for being good and saving the life of their child. If the patient dies, the religious community responds with “it is not God’s fault because of original sin” or something similar. How do you hold God responsible for all that is good but none of what is bad? This is the piece I have never understood.

By that thought, why do you only believe God gives children cancer? That’s the only thing God created? Cancer? That’s His totality of creation? Doesn’t make sense. God never promised that humans would live forever or not get sick. We are not immortal or robots.

If someone views the entire creation of God through pediatric cancer, that’s just their outlook. Nobody can reason with someone who denies God exists but then states He created pediatric cancer and that’s the totality of the non-existent God’s creation. It’s really nuts. If you don’t believe in God you can’t credit him with pediatric cancer and you can’t tell people who believe in God what they must believe about God. Really, you are just going in circles day after day. You should speak in person to a religious leader and ask these questions because no matter what, I would never make my mind up about any subject based on the opinions of anon posters online. Nobody knows who is posting and what their agenda or educational background is. Everyone has their own opinion, as they should. We are individuals with unique perspective and experience.

Forget cancer then. Take a trivial example. Let’s say you interviewed for a job and really wanted it. If you get the job, you may thank God and say God is good. If you don’t get the job, religious people I know say something along the lines of “it’s not in God’s plan”. So why does God get “credit” for the good stuff but no “blame” for any of the bad stuff?

[Anonymous]

If God can’t save an innocent person from suffering, then he isn’t omnipotent, is he? He can’t be both benevolent and omnipotent. The two are mutually exclusive in this case.

[Anonymous]

God wants his favorites closest to him

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If God can’t save an innocent person from suffering, then he isn’t omnipotent, is he? He can’t be both benevolent and omnipotent. The two are mutually exclusive in this case.

Suffering is noble in most religions including Christianity so.. the ones who suffer most on Earth but keep faith alive despite the difficulty usually inherit Gods kingdom in heaven