This is what happens....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All the people screaming that our parents have the right to live as they choose, wake the F UP.

My parents refused to move. My sister lives with them and, I see now, enabled it so she could keep the roof over her head. Had they moved a few years ago, listened to reason,they would be sitting on easy street with over a mil in the bank, being able to hire caregivers, stay in the lovely home they downsized to.

What they have now: desperation, no money, incontinence, immobilization due to declining health, and destined for a state-run nursing home for one or both that will take their home through estate recovery. Even if one still lives there, if the other dies in nursing home on Medicaid, the state/feds can take about 150K of the value in repayment. And they are still screaming that they won't move and won't go to a nursing home. My father still insists MediCARE will pay for all they need. Totally clueless. My mother will soon be in a wheelchair and/or bedridden all day. My father is too out of it to even care about that, not because he's selfish, but because of a past stroke. He has no capacity to make a good decision.

We cannot afford the 10K plus per month that will be required for them to live the life they desire. So the solution to them is for me to uproot my life and go out there full time and service their needs. I'm not the only one to try to talk sense into them. My aunt (father's sister) tried and all my father would do is scream at her that he knew what he was doing and would not be controlled. My aunt is 96, bought her own addition to my cousin's house and lives well with them, in the life she deserves and loves. She invested in long term care insurance early on. She's fine financially because she made good decisions. She's still so spry and so smart and I'm lucky to have her in my life.

All of this - ALL OF THIS - did NOT have to happen. Years of calling me a control freak and doing NOTHING has put them in this position. It makes me sad and angry and frustrated. I'm hoping when my mother finally gets scared enough, she will allow me and my older sister to come whisk her away from the fresh hell she's living in.

I don’t get the problem. They sell their house, spend down their assets, and find a nursing home that will take Medicaid. They can't take their home with them when they die anyway.

Agree with this. And in some places there are additional resources. Montgomery County has a program for seniors under a certain income level to subsidize rent in retirement places. The parents need to sell the house and move to a life care community.

OP here. Agreed. Problem: they don’t and are considered of sound mind. So now what?

NP here, dealing with two elderly/disabled/stubborn parents. I've had to learn, especially in the last year, that just because they are 'competent' to make decisions-doesn't mean they will make good ones!

In my case, it's mostly my mom, because my Dad's Parkinsons has caused cognitive issues. But she'll go along with whatever he wants, despite it not being grounded in reality. Mom suffered a broken hip last year when Dad fell over on her. She didn't fully recover. They don't want ANY outside help in the home, they won't move to one of the several nice assisted living places near us-Mom thinks 'they're not ready yet'. They are PAST ready!!! I work full time and commute 2 hours a day and am still raising a dc. I do see them daily and do tasks at their house, but it's so stressful everyday to be away at work and worrying ALL.The.Time. My brother and I try till we are blue in the face to get them to get home help (dad is significantly physically disabled). We did finally get them to do POA thankfully before last year, because I sure needed it then. I guess they are just going to stay in that house until one or both of them fall or something awful happens. Then they will both have to go to a nursing home. I can't make them make better choices.

PP, ooof, that sounds like a lot. How are they financially? When people are well-heeled, then having only one plan - remain in the home - seems okay. Where I struggle is when finances are limited for the parents as well as the children, especially when that refusal to consider options could wipe out the children (and grandchildren). My goal is to remove these kinds of burdens from our kids so they are able to be present with us and their kids when the time comes. Yes, it will still be a struggle, but ideally money worries will not be a part of it.

7K left in the bank - enough to pay 1/2 next year's real estate taxes and HOA fees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All the people screaming that our parents have the right to live as they choose, wake the F UP.

My parents refused to move. My sister lives with them and, I see now, enabled it so she could keep the roof over her head. Had they moved a few years ago, listened to reason,they would be sitting on easy street with over a mil in the bank, being able to hire caregivers, stay in the lovely home they downsized to.

What they have now: desperation, no money, incontinence, immobilization due to declining health, and destined for a state-run nursing home for one or both that will take their home through estate recovery. Even if one still lives there, if the other dies in nursing home on Medicaid, the state/feds can take about 150K of the value in repayment. And they are still screaming that they won't move and won't go to a nursing home. My father still insists MediCARE will pay for all they need. Totally clueless. My mother will soon be in a wheelchair and/or bedridden all day. My father is too out of it to even care about that, not because he's selfish, but because of a past stroke. He has no capacity to make a good decision.

We cannot afford the 10K plus per month that will be required for them to live the life they desire. So the solution to them is for me to uproot my life and go out there full time and service their needs. I'm not the only one to try to talk sense into them. My aunt (father's sister) tried and all my father would do is scream at her that he knew what he was doing and would not be controlled. My aunt is 96, bought her own addition to my cousin's house and lives well with them, in the life she deserves and loves. She invested in long term care insurance early on. She's fine financially because she made good decisions. She's still so spry and so smart and I'm lucky to have her in my life.

All of this - ALL OF THIS - did NOT have to happen. Years of calling me a control freak and doing NOTHING has put them in this position. It makes me sad and angry and frustrated. I'm hoping when my mother finally gets scared enough, she will allow me and my older sister to come whisk her away from the fresh hell she's living in.

I don’t get the problem. They sell their house, spend down their assets, and find a nursing home that will take Medicaid. They can't take their home with them when they die anyway.

Agree with this. And in some places there are additional resources. Montgomery County has a program for seniors under a certain income level to subsidize rent in retirement places. The parents need to sell the house and move to a life care community.

OP here. Agreed. Problem: they don’t and are considered of sound mind. So now what?

NP here, dealing with two elderly/disabled/stubborn parents. I've had to learn, especially in the last year, that just because they are 'competent' to make decisions-doesn't mean they will make good ones!

In my case, it's mostly my mom, because my Dad's Parkinsons has caused cognitive issues. But she'll go along with whatever he wants, despite it not being grounded in reality. Mom suffered a broken hip last year when Dad fell over on her. She didn't fully recover. They don't want ANY outside help in the home, they won't move to one of the several nice assisted living places near us-Mom thinks 'they're not ready yet'. They are PAST ready!!! I work full time and commute 2 hours a day and am still raising a dc. I do see them daily and do tasks at their house, but it's so stressful everyday to be away at work and worrying ALL.The.Time. My brother and I try till we are blue in the face to get them to get home help (dad is significantly physically disabled). We did finally get them to do POA thankfully before last year, because I sure needed it then. I guess they are just going to stay in that house until one or both of them fall or something awful happens. Then they will both have to go to a nursing home. I can't make them make better choices.

PP, ooof, that sounds like a lot. How are they financially? When people are well-heeled, then having only one plan - remain in the home - seems okay. Where I struggle is when finances are limited for the parents as well as the children, especially when that refusal to consider options could wipe out the children (and grandchildren). My goal is to remove these kinds of burdens from our kids so they are able to be present with us and their kids when the time comes. Yes, it will still be a struggle, but ideally money worries will not be a part of it.

7K left in the bank - enough to pay 1/2 next year's real estate taxes and HOA fees.

Ooops responded to the wrong question

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where is the sister who lives with them in all of this?

OP, I stopped worrying about my parents after they gave my brain-dead sister POA, etc. They were of reasonably sound mind when paperwork was executed. When I first saw the documentation I expressed my strong view of their choices. Then I dropped it. Afterwords I refused to get sucked into all the resulting drama.

OP hear with an update. Thank you for responding and you are very smart.

My sister actually brought up filial law in a backhanded way, i.e. “good thing we aren’t living in a state that has one”. Told her that that filial laws usually require criminal neglect and that me helping with bills, treating to carry out, buying a lift chair, etc, will not be considered past willful neglect. In addition, I reminded her that joint funds can’t be confiscated to pay their nursing home under these laws, etc.

I can’t with them anymore. Disengaging.

You are making stuff up.

Wish I was. Wanna help?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You need to protect their estate from the estate recovery! This is all you can do I think.

Given how late it sounds like OP's parents are in the game here, it is probably too late for that.

Yes, and I tried much earlier. My aunt told my mother that I was trying to steal their money My mother was too afraid to make a change. My father had them invested in high risk. So stupid

They now have 7 grand left. 4 or which will go to taxes and HOA fees this month. They also need a new hot water heater. The good thing is they can quality for help when they have less than 2 grand in savings. None of this needed to happen. None.

What are they applying for? Sounds like they are both still in their home, yes?

Applying to see if they qualify for my sister to be a paid caregiver to them

So she would be the caregiver, but remain in the home? Aren't they nearly depleted of funds? Having your sister compensated would be great, but how does covering their other expenses work?

OP, sorry that you are going through this - not ever easy.

At this point, we could help them some with taxes/insurance/HOA because I know there is a caregiver. When one goes to nursing home care (or both), since the house is not in an irrevocable trust, Medicaid can force the sale of the house when the other spouse (if living in the house) passes. The first 150K we keep and the government takes the rest. I’d been trying to tell them all that for years, but no one listened

Please elaborate on being allowed to keep the first $150k. Is that common? Does this vary by state?

[Anonymous]

My dad passed away. My mom stayed in the family home for 5 more years. She was very lonely. She just sold it and bought a condo in an over-55 community with a ton of amenities and there is an assisted living on site if she progresses to needing that. There is so much to do in this facility and they are all very active.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My dad passed away. My mom stayed in the family home for 5 more years. She was very lonely. She just sold it and bought a condo in an over-55 community with a ton of amenities and there is an assisted living on site if she progresses to needing that. There is so much to do in this facility and they are all very active.

^shes about to turn 80.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You need to protect their estate from the estate recovery! This is all you can do I think.

Given how late it sounds like OP's parents are in the game here, it is probably too late for that.

Yes, and I tried much earlier. My aunt told my mother that I was trying to steal their money My mother was too afraid to make a change. My father had them invested in high risk. So stupid

They now have 7 grand left. 4 or which will go to taxes and HOA fees this month. They also need a new hot water heater. The good thing is they can quality for help when they have less than 2 grand in savings. None of this needed to happen. None.

What are they applying for? Sounds like they are both still in their home, yes?

Applying to see if they qualify for my sister to be a paid caregiver to them

So she would be the caregiver, but remain in the home? Aren't they nearly depleted of funds? Having your sister compensated would be great, but how does covering their other expenses work?

OP, sorry that you are going through this - not ever easy.

At this point, we could help them some with taxes/insurance/HOA because I know there is a caregiver. When one goes to nursing home care (or both), since the house is not in an irrevocable trust, Medicaid can force the sale of the house when the other spouse (if living in the house) passes. The first 150K we keep and the government takes the rest. I’d been trying to tell them all that for years, but no one listened

Please elaborate on being allowed to keep the first $150k. Is that common? Does this vary by state?

Yes, grateful for some elaboration. I believe the "community" spouse, the one remaining in the family home, can retain up to ~$145,000, but not offspring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You need to protect their estate from the estate recovery! This is all you can do I think.

Given how late it sounds like OP's parents are in the game here, it is probably too late for that.

Yes, and I tried much earlier. My aunt told my mother that I was trying to steal their money My mother was too afraid to make a change. My father had them invested in high risk. So stupid

They now have 7 grand left. 4 or which will go to taxes and HOA fees this month. They also need a new hot water heater. The good thing is they can quality for help when they have less than 2 grand in savings. None of this needed to happen. None.

What are they applying for? Sounds like they are both still in their home, yes?

Applying to see if they qualify for my sister to be a paid caregiver to them

So she would be the caregiver, but remain in the home? Aren't they nearly depleted of funds? Having your sister compensated would be great, but how does covering their other expenses work?

OP, sorry that you are going through this - not ever easy.

At this point, we could help them some with taxes/insurance/HOA because I know there is a caregiver. When one goes to nursing home care (or both), since the house is not in an irrevocable trust, Medicaid can force the sale of the house when the other spouse (if living in the house) passes. The first 150K we keep and the government takes the rest. I’d been trying to tell them all that for years, but no one listened

Please elaborate on being allowed to keep the first $150k. Is that common? Does this vary by state?

Yes, grateful for some elaboration. I believe the "community" spouse, the one remaining in the family home, can retain up to ~$145,000, but not offspring.

Correct.

[Anonymous]

So you may not see it this way, tbf it would be best for them to die in their own home uGet a part time aide.

Plus they could die sooner which means you wouldn’t have to sell the house in order to qualify them for long term nursing home Medicaid

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All the people screaming that our parents have the right to live as they choose, wake the F UP.

My parents refused to move. My sister lives with them and, I see now, enabled it so she could keep the roof over her head. Had they moved a few years ago, listened to reason,they would be sitting on easy street with over a mil in the bank, being able to hire caregivers, stay in the lovely home they downsized to.

What they have now: desperation, no money, incontinence, immobilization due to declining health, and destined for a state-run nursing home for one or both that will take their home through estate recovery. Even if one still lives there, if the other dies in nursing home on Medicaid, the state/feds can take about 150K of the value in repayment. And they are still screaming that they won't move and won't go to a nursing home. My father still insists MediCARE will pay for all they need. Totally clueless. My mother will soon be in a wheelchair and/or bedridden all day. My father is too out of it to even care about that, not because he's selfish, but because of a past stroke. He has no capacity to make a good decision.

We cannot afford the 10K plus per month that will be required for them to live the life they desire. So the solution to them is for me to uproot my life and go out there full time and service their needs. I'm not the only one to try to talk sense into them. My aunt (father's sister) tried and all my father would do is scream at her that he knew what he was doing and would not be controlled. My aunt is 96, bought her own addition to my cousin's house and lives well with them, in the life she deserves and loves. She invested in long term care insurance early on. She's fine financially because she made good decisions. She's still so spry and so smart and I'm lucky to have her in my life.

All of this - ALL OF THIS - did NOT have to happen. Years of calling me a control freak and doing NOTHING has put them in this position. It makes me sad and angry and frustrated. I'm hoping when my mother finally gets scared enough, she will allow me and my older sister to come whisk her away from the fresh hell she's living in.

I don’t get the problem. They sell their house, spend down their assets, and find a nursing home that will take Medicaid. They can't take their home with them when they die anyway.

No they can die in the comfort of their home. This way she wouldn’t have to sell the house and give all the proceeds (millions) to the government.

It’s cruel to put anyone in a nursing home if you have options.
She can hire a part time aide. Why isnt the live-in sister not doing anything, evict that loser



From personal work experience in a nursing home, I would prefer to die in my own home

[Anonymous]

The government or aps can’t do nothing if you decide to die in your home