The White Lotus season 2

[Anonymous]

It would be highly ironic if Cameron and Harper wind up making a child together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When Daphne said she has no female friends bc they gossip behind her back - I assumed it was about Cameron's cheating, but maybe it's also that they figured out that her kids are the trainer's.

Just a random thought I had since I keep thinking about the show. Haha

She also has to know that her husband might hit on and try to have an affair with a friend so that's another reason to keep her distance.

I just rewatched the first episode and when Cameron and Harper go up to the Spiller's room to get swim trunks for Cameron, Daphne has this expression on her face that is very un-enthused. It's just a quick shot of her face, and subtle enough that it didn't read as "oh she thinks her husband is going to try and sleep with Harper" upon first viewing. But after seeing what happens in the last few episodes, it really jumped out at me. You get the sense watching it that she has watched her husband find an excuse to go off alone with many, many other women (including, probably, friends of hers) and that he was probably cheating on her, or trying to her, many of those times. Plus, since he strips in front of Harper up in the room in way that feels intentional, it's very likely that this was exactly what Cameron had in mind in this instance as well.

Actually a lot of Cameron's and Daphne's behavior toward or about Harper looks really different on rewatch. Like Cameron is much more annoyed by Harper early on ("She's terrible") and Daphne defends her, and in retrospect this comes off as either Cameron protesting too much (like he pretends he hates Harper, and likely other women, to deflect from the fact that he's definitely trying to bang them) or sexual frustration (he genuinely dislikes Harper but not because of her personality or anything she says, but just because he's frustrated she's not reciprocating his advances). And meanwhile Daphne will defend Harper but also land a little dig (like about Harper "cutting off" Ethan's balls) just some subtle mean girl negging that is very likely intended to try and lower Harper in Cameron's esteem so he is less interested.

Though in general I think Cameron's deal is that he always wants what he can't have, and therefore it basically doesn't matter what Daphne does or even what Harper does -- as long as Harper "belongs" to Ethan and as long as she's not hopping into bed with Cameron, Cameron will want her just because.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When Daphne said she has no female friends bc they gossip behind her back - I assumed it was about Cameron's cheating, but maybe it's also that they figured out that her kids are the trainer's.

Just a random thought I had since I keep thinking about the show. Haha

She also has to know that her husband might hit on and try to have an affair with a friend so that's another reason to keep her distance.

I just rewatched the first episode and when Cameron and Harper go up to the Spiller's room to get swim trunks for Cameron, Daphne has this expression on her face that is very un-enthused. It's just a quick shot of her face, and subtle enough that it didn't read as "oh she thinks her husband is going to try and sleep with Harper" upon first viewing. But after seeing what happens in the last few episodes, it really jumped out at me. You get the sense watching it that she has watched her husband find an excuse to go off alone with many, many other women (including, probably, friends of hers) and that he was probably cheating on her, or trying to her, many of those times. Plus, since he strips in front of Harper up in the room in way that feels intentional, it's very likely that this was exactly what Cameron had in mind in this instance as well.

Actually a lot of Cameron's and Daphne's behavior toward or about Harper looks really different on rewatch. Like Cameron is much more annoyed by Harper early on ("She's terrible") and Daphne defends her, and in retrospect this comes off as either Cameron protesting too much (like he pretends he hates Harper, and likely other women, to deflect from the fact that he's definitely trying to bang them) or sexual frustration (he genuinely dislikes Harper but not because of her personality or anything she says, but just because he's frustrated she's not reciprocating his advances). And meanwhile Daphne will defend Harper but also land a little dig (like about Harper "cutting off" Ethan's balls) just some subtle mean girl negging that is very likely intended to try and lower Harper in Cameron's esteem so he is less interested.

Though in general I think Cameron's deal is that he always wants what he can't have, and therefore it basically doesn't matter what Daphne does or even what Harper does -- as long as Harper "belongs" to Ethan and as long as she's not hopping into bed with Cameron, Cameron will want her just because.

In the previews for the next show isn't there a clip of Ethan saying exactly that - Cameron always wants what isn't his?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m wondering if Portia will lose her marbles when she finds out this guy is using her… She’s already alluded to being depressed.

She might be on board with the Explore your gender, Explore your orientation generation, so no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

For me, the distaste is because I get the vibe that he isn't all that he seems/wants to be. He is parroting progressive/feminist ideas he heard in college but he has an underlying entitlement that you can tell is going to come out at some point.

I think he is the classic "nice guy" where he will feel like he is entitled to affection from a woman because he has done and said all the right, feminist-approved things. And he will turn nasty when he doesn't get what he thinks he deserves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think what was brutal about season 1 was everyone just shrugged at the end and the rich just leave this wake of fked up ness. He was just the help so who really cared?

It was self defense. In the court of law. He heard someone in his closet and bathroom one day after a break-in and robbery attempt, with physical violence.

Fight or flight.

No income or wealth figures needed.

Tragic, yes. But don’t go in someone else’s room or property to sneak around. You might get honked in the head. QED.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we talk about Ethan actually did cheat. I’m sorry but hiring hookers getting them to your room, undressing, kissing and then crying. GTFO that’s not “doing nothing”. So annoyed by this. Like is actual penetration the line. Is this Bill Clinton train of thinking?

No, he didn't. He behaved badly, but most of it was by being adjacent to Cameron. Ethan is so passive--do you honestly think he was the impetus behind finding the girls, flirting with them, inviting them back to their room, and undressing them? He was just high and drunk and along for the ride. He rejected Mia's overtures.

I get the sense that Ethan is not normally this passive, and that his passive behavior towards Cameron on this trip is a big part of what is unsettling Harper. I think normally, Ethan is probably pretty direct and opinionated (he built and sold a tech business that has made them incredibly rich, he's probably not a pushover). I also bet that normally he and Harper are both kind of caustic and critical of people they think are less intelligent than them. You get glimpses of this. They seem like a couple who was attracted to each other for being curious, intelligent, and aware. They sit in bed and read books and work on their computers. They probably talk about work a lot and love that they both are so good at and interested in their jobs. I get the sense that if the met some random couple on a vacation and that couple was like "we don't vote or read! I love Dateline and we're friends with Jeff Bezos!" Ethan would be right there with Harper in skewering them later that night as vapid and stupid.

But he's not doing that with Cameron and keep suggesting they are "fun". And you can tell Harper is just like "who are you and what did you do with my husband?" Like I just get the sense based on her interactions with him that he is acting VERY unusually. What reads as her being super negative and unpleasant to him is actually her being confused and frustrated because normally they'd cackle about the dump rich couple from dinner and instead he's suddenly defending them. Is it because he's newly rich and wants to be the dumb rich couple? Or is it because he's distracted by this longstanding beef with Cameron that is consuming him and making him withdraw into himself? It's very unclear. But I think normally Ethan would be rolling his eyes right along with Harper and they'd probably bond over their shared sense of superiority. Harper is frustrated that's not happening and it's making her feel very distant from her husband during a huge shift in their financial circumstances due to his job, not hers. And it's making her insecure.

Cameran did him once. The porn is his attempt at self therapy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

For me, the distaste is because I get the vibe that he isn't all that he seems/wants to be. He is parroting progressive/feminist ideas he heard in college but he has an underlying entitlement that you can tell is going to come out at some point.

I think he is the classic "nice guy" where he will feel like he is entitled to affection from a woman because he has done and said all the right, feminist-approved things. And he will turn nasty when he doesn't get what he thinks he deserves.

I think he's had a few opportunities for that side to have made an appearance and it hasn't. When Portia blows him off he calls her out but then he lets it lie. And honestly she was pretty crappy to him and I think he would have been reasonable to be more upset then he got. He also clearly harbors no ill will towards his mother or sister and I don't think that would be the case if he was a secret incel. And his reaction to Lucia on multiple levels is to me young naivete not barely constrained anger towards women. I think Lucia's betrayal will shake him to his core though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

For me, the distaste is because I get the vibe that he isn't all that he seems/wants to be. He is parroting progressive/feminist ideas he heard in college but he has an underlying entitlement that you can tell is going to come out at some point.

I think he is the classic "nice guy" where he will feel like he is entitled to affection from a woman because he has done and said all the right, feminist-approved things. And he will turn nasty when he doesn't get what he thinks he deserves.

I do not think Albie is some complex incel character that is going to snap.

He’s exactly what he and his mom said: a nice kid. A person who takes in wounded bird girls. Well, the latter is not good.

He just needs a nice type A girl that doesn’t charge him €2000 a night and uses protection.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

The previous season showed that the awful, repugnant people never pay for their sins. The decent or lesser people get hurt. Anyone under the thumbs of the wealthy entitled people will pay. Albie, Portia, hotel employees and even the hookers are probably going to pay for being decent or not part of the privilieged set.

I think the point of Albie is that he is what smart women think they want, but the douchey, overconfident alpha-male type is more sexually attractive. Portia's head tells her to go for Albie, but her heart (ok not her heart exactly!) wants to hook up with Essex boy, even though objectively he has way less to offer her than Albie does

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

The previous season showed that the awful, repugnant people never pay for their sins. The decent or lesser people get hurt. Anyone under the thumbs of the wealthy entitled people will pay. Albie, Portia, hotel employees and even the hookers are probably going to pay for being decent or not part of the privilieged set.

I think this is an oversimplified read of the first season. The under privileged people were flawed as well. Armand was very flawed! The guy who violently robbed the family was flawed. And those people also treated the people below them poorly (like how they treated the pregnant woman in the first episode). And notably, everyone is unhappy. The rich people are not happy. The happiest people in this season are the hookers! The ones on the bottom of the totem pole but who seem the freest. Connie Britton and Steve Zahn and the daughter and her friend are all MISERABLE. The only person in that group who left happier than they arrived was the son who shed the power anyone had on him. He found a way to choose sleeping on the beach, found a way to break free of the expectations he was held to, found a way to connect to a more grounded reality (hey fellow survivor friend, the boy's journey of spending a week on a beach and emerging transformed was DEFINITELY a nod to survivor). But it isn't like, the rich people win and the poor people lose. It is more like, the rich people inflict damage on everyone around them and while they seem to face no consequences for this, they also do not live a happy gilded life, they are weighed down by the corruption they have embraced.

I think it is about how power is corrupting and whenever you have and use power over another person, good is lost. And this dynamic is not just with rich people, it is Valentina and the front desk girl, it is Giuseppe and Mia. The people who seem happy are generally the people not using exerting power over someone else to meet their will. Albie, Mia here and there, Lucia (I wonder if this will change next episode), and to a lesser extent Tanya, who certainly is powerful but seems kind of oblivious to it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

The previous season showed that the awful, repugnant people never pay for their sins. The decent or lesser people get hurt. Anyone under the thumbs of the wealthy entitled people will pay. Albie, Portia, hotel employees and even the hookers are probably going to pay for being decent or not part of the privilieged set.

I think the point of Albie is that he is what smart women think they want, but the douchey, overconfident alpha-male type is more sexually attractive. Portia's head tells her to go for Albie, but her heart (ok not her heart exactly!) wants to hook up with Essex boy, even though objectively he has way less to offer her than Albie does

Yes I feel like this is why they cast Theo James too. Like I find him way more attractive than Albie! He is distractingly attractive and alluring despite being by every other measure absolutely awful. I think a lot of the men are set up to foil one another in different ways.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

The previous season showed that the awful, repugnant people never pay for their sins. The decent or lesser people get hurt. Anyone under the thumbs of the wealthy entitled people will pay. Albie, Portia, hotel employees and even the hookers are probably going to pay for being decent or not part of the privilieged set.

I think the point of Albie is that he is what smart women think they want, but the douchey, overconfident alpha-male type is more sexually attractive. Portia's head tells her to go for Albie, but her heart (ok not her heart exactly!) wants to hook up with Essex boy, even though objectively he has way less to offer her than Albie does

Yes I feel like this is why they cast Theo James too. Like I find him way more attractive than Albie! He is distractingly attractive and alluring despite being by every other measure absolutely awful. I think a lot of the men are set up to foil one another in different ways.

Huh. I don’t find Cameron or Albie or Jack attractive. Ethan or bust.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

The previous season showed that the awful, repugnant people never pay for their sins. The decent or lesser people get hurt. Anyone under the thumbs of the wealthy entitled people will pay. Albie, Portia, hotel employees and even the hookers are probably going to pay for being decent or not part of the privilieged set.

I think the point of Albie is that he is what smart women think they want, but the douchey, overconfident alpha-male type is more sexually attractive. Portia's head tells her to go for Albie, but her heart (ok not her heart exactly!) wants to hook up with Essex boy, even though objectively he has way less to offer her than Albie does

Yes I feel like this is why they cast Theo James too. Like I find him way more attractive than Albie! He is distractingly attractive and alluring despite being by every other measure absolutely awful. I think a lot of the men are set up to foil one another in different ways.

Huh. I don’t find Cameron or Albie or Jack attractive. Ethan or bust.

Ethan is going to win an academy award for his facial expressions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Albie is so gross

I am kind of confused by the distaste for Albie in this thread. I don't find him distasteful, I actually do find him to be pretty much what you'd want out of a guy? He takes no for an answer, isn't shaming any of the women for their choices. Isn't excusing the bad behavior of the men in his life. I do think he is going to get screwed over by a woman and we will see his true colors but I don't think he's done anything bad and wonder if this is a choice in itself. Showing a non dominant but confident guy who isn't incredibly anything (not incredibly handsome or powerful or anything at all, just very average, but essentially one of the only people making good choices that don't hurt others) but who is unlikeable for some amorphous reason. A foil to Cam who from all objective measures is absolutely horrible but is SO handsome and affectionate that you have to keep reminding yourself how bad he is when he's not being blatantly terrible.

The previous season showed that the awful, repugnant people never pay for their sins. The decent or lesser people get hurt. Anyone under the thumbs of the wealthy entitled people will pay. Albie, Portia, hotel employees and even the hookers are probably going to pay for being decent or not part of the privilieged set.

I think the point of Albie is that he is what smart women think they want, but the douchey, overconfident alpha-male type is more sexually attractive. Portia's head tells her to go for Albie, but her heart (ok not her heart exactly!) wants to hook up with Essex boy, even though objectively he has way less to offer her than Albie does

Yeah, but if every season, it’s that the rich people get away with no consequences, it’s going to be a boring show. That won’t be the angle this time.