Help me understand DD's lying and aggression

[Anonymous]

My 11yo DD lies in ways I find troubling and upsetting, often coupled with physically aggressive behavior. I just don't understand why she does it or how to deal with it. I know I get angry about it and that doesn't help.

I'll give you an example: We were playing ping pong. The ball rolled on the floor in between us but closer to my side. I went to pick it up, she came running over, grabbed my hand as I was reaching down, and bit it hard (I guess she was trying to get the ball from me, but I really don't know what her motive was). I reprimanded her. She claimed that I had shoved her and she bit me to try to get my hand off her -- a lie that didn't even make sense. Honestly, I lost my cool over that one and yelled at her.

Or this: She was playing foosball with her brother. At some point, she threw the ball at his groin, hard. Those balls are hard as a rock, she has a very strong arm, and they were standing 2 feet apart. He writhed on the floor for a while. I reprimanded her. She claimed that she had merely tossed him the ball gently. I watched it happen; that was a lie.

Or this: After she ate breakfast, I asked her to put her dish and utensils in the dishwasher. She whined and put them in the sink. I heard them clink in the sink, so I turned around and told her they need to go in the dishwasher, not the sink. She told me that she had in fact put them in the dishwasher. I said that was not true: I'd left the sink empty and now there were a dish and one set of utensils in it, and I'd heard her place them in the sink just a second ago. She was adamant. I opened the dishwasher and asked her again to put it in, but she claimed that the dish that was already in the dishwasher was hers. I explained that it wasn't; I'd put that dish there earlier when I'd cleaned the kitchen and left the sink empty, and now the dish in the sink was hers. She continued to deny it. That's when I started to get angry. I asked why she was lying about this and why she wouldn't just do the simple thing of putting her stuff in the dishwasher. Her answer: because I was yelling at her. Now, I had definitely become angry but I wasn't yelling. But putting that aside, she'd completely reversed the timeline and the cause and effect: she refused my request, she lied, and then I got angry, not the other way around. She went over to her computer and started doing stuff, ignoring me. So, I took the (wireless) keyboard away, to get her attention back. We went in circles a few more times, with me getting increasingly angry about this. That's when DW walked in and asked what's going on, and DD said: "Dad took my keyboard and threw it on the ground." That was another lie: I hadn't thrown it and in fact was holding it in my hand.

I'm at a loss. Like I said, I know I do get angry and I know that it doesn't help, but this is awfully distressing behavior to me and I feel powerless when she starts lying and even accusing me of doing things like shoving her or throwing her keyboard on the floor when I most certainly did not.

[Anonymous]

Step one, take away all the screens and monitor her while she does her homework if any computers are required. Put her in activities and take her outside every day. Start connecting with her by reading books together and going on hikes.

Try this for 2 months and if nothing changes, she has something else going on and needs a neuropsych evaluation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Step one, take away all the screens and monitor her while she does her homework if any computers are required. Put her in activities and take her outside every day. Start connecting with her by reading books together and going on hikes.

Try this for 2 months and if nothing changes, she has something else going on and needs a neuropsych evaluation.

I think this is good advice. My kid can be prone to this kind of gaslighting and it's when she feels cornered and not connected to us that it comes out. She's a double down, triple down, quadruple down type of personality. It's also worse when she is just bored and restless.

[Anonymous]

Getting angry is FINE in this scenario. She bit you and hurt her brother! I’m wondering where you got the idea that you shouldn’t get angry?

Anyway I think you need to work with a therapist specializing in child behavior. Not a play therapist, not a talk therapist, but a therapist that will teach you behavioral management techniques, like positive reinforcement and appropriate punishments. Because this is bad behavior and it needs to have a consistent consequence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Getting angry is FINE in this scenario. She bit you and hurt her brother! I’m wondering where you got the idea that you shouldn’t get angry?

Anyway I think you need to work with a therapist specializing in child behavior. Not a play therapist, not a talk therapist, but a therapist that will teach you behavioral management techniques, like positive reinforcement and appropriate punishments. Because this is bad behavior and it needs to have a consistent consequence.

Consequences are going to exacerbate a kid like this. Dad needs to connect with his daughter and remove the computers and phones. Daughter needs things to do outside of the home and make friends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Step one, take away all the screens and monitor her while she does her homework if any computers are required. Put her in activities and take her outside every day. Start connecting with her by reading books together and going on hikes.

Try this for 2 months and if nothing changes, she has something else going on and needs a neuropsych evaluation.

?? What’s actually going on is that OP appears to have literally zero idea how to appropriately discipline his child. He needs instruction on how to do that. The other ideas are good, but he is going to need to learn how to be a parent regardless.

[Anonymous]

Other than reprimands, what kind of consequences does she get for the aggressive behavior? That seems to me to be the number one place to start because an 11 year old biting is alarming.

The lying is bad and needs correcting, but I don't think it is as out of the range of normal as the aggression. Kids are going to deny culpability and try to shift responsibility when they are caught in bad behavior. In the cases you mention, don't ask her why she did or didn't do something- just call her out on what you know she did and go from there.

[Anonymous]

Your 11 year old BIT you?! That’s not normal misbehavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting angry is FINE in this scenario. She bit you and hurt her brother! I’m wondering where you got the idea that you shouldn’t get angry?

Anyway I think you need to work with a therapist specializing in child behavior. Not a play therapist, not a talk therapist, but a therapist that will teach you behavioral management techniques, like positive reinforcement and appropriate punishments. Because this is bad behavior and it needs to have a consistent consequence.

Consequences are going to exacerbate a kid like this. Dad needs to connect with his daughter and remove the computers and phones. Daughter needs things to do outside of the home and make friends.

I could not disagree more strongly. She needs to learn the behavior is unacceptable through a consistent structure of consequences and positive reinforcement. All the connection in the world doesn’t substitute for actual parenting with structure. Connection is important too but she bit him because she hasn’t been taught this is unacceptable, because there are no consequences, not because she uses a computer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your 11 year old BIT you?! That’s not normal misbehavior.

Right? this is where gentle parenting gets you.

[Anonymous]

Have you assessed for ADHD? My ADHD kid lies all the time often for no reason and has very little impulse control. Just a thought to consider. Meds saved us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Other than reprimands, what kind of consequences does she get for the aggressive behavior? That seems to me to be the number one place to start because an 11 year old biting is alarming.

The lying is bad and needs correcting, but I don't think it is as out of the range of normal as the aggression. Kids are going to deny culpability and try to shift responsibility when they are caught in bad behavior. In the cases you mention, don't ask her why she did or didn't do something- just call her out on what you know she did and go from there.

Agree about the lying. It’s stemming from OP’s highly dysfunctional approach, which is to react verbally and spar with her, instead of calmly imposing pre-determined consequences.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like unmanaged ADHD to me, but there could be more going on. You need to up your parenting skills, OP and get your DD checked out. Neuropsych waitlist time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting angry is FINE in this scenario. She bit you and hurt her brother! I’m wondering where you got the idea that you shouldn’t get angry?

Anyway I think you need to work with a therapist specializing in child behavior. Not a play therapist, not a talk therapist, but a therapist that will teach you behavioral management techniques, like positive reinforcement and appropriate punishments. Because this is bad behavior and it needs to have a consistent consequence.

Consequences are going to exacerbate a kid like this. Dad needs to connect with his daughter and remove the computers and phones. Daughter needs things to do outside of the home and make friends.

I could not disagree more strongly. She needs to learn the behavior is unacceptable through a consistent structure of consequences and positive reinforcement. All the connection in the world doesn’t substitute for actual parenting with structure. Connection is important too but she bit him because she hasn’t been taught this is unacceptable, because there are no consequences, not because she uses a computer.

I mean, I think she knows. The reason consequences won’t work are because she can’t act on the knowledge that people aren’t teething toys, but we don’t know why that is. But it’s not because she is confused.

OP, does she bite others? Or just generally engage in physical aggression with them?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting angry is FINE in this scenario. She bit you and hurt her brother! I’m wondering where you got the idea that you shouldn’t get angry?

Anyway I think you need to work with a therapist specializing in child behavior. Not a play therapist, not a talk therapist, but a therapist that will teach you behavioral management techniques, like positive reinforcement and appropriate punishments. Because this is bad behavior and it needs to have a consistent consequence.

Consequences are going to exacerbate a kid like this. Dad needs to connect with his daughter and remove the computers and phones. Daughter needs things to do outside of the home and make friends.

I could not disagree more strongly. She needs to learn the behavior is unacceptable through a consistent structure of consequences and positive reinforcement. All the connection in the world doesn’t substitute for actual parenting with structure. Connection is important too but she bit him because she hasn’t been taught this is unacceptable, because there are no consequences, not because she uses a computer.

I mean, I think she knows. The reason consequences won’t work are because she can’t act on the knowledge that people aren’t teething toys, but we don’t know why that is. But it’s not because she is confused.

OP, does she bite others? Or just generally engage in physical aggression with them?

What she knows is that there is no discipline in her home: she can bite her father and throw a ball at her brother’s groin with zero consequences. So actually she knows she CAN bite and be violent. Kids are not stupid. When she learns that violence is followed by a consequence, every single time, she’ll change her behavior. And when she knows that if she’s good she’ll get a reward every day, she’ll learn to be good. There’s plenty of research on this.