The realities of being lower middle class

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Chiming in with a naive question, as this thread is terrifying! Wait, so schools make admission decisions based on whether the families also applied for financial aid?

I'm moving to the area in summer 2019 with my son; he'll be a student there for two years. We applied to several private schools, and also applied for financial aid. I was looking at it as, hey, if we qualify for financial aid, great; if not, I'm willing to blow through my non-TSP savings to pay for a couple of years of private school. (I was assured by a wealthier friend that most families who work for my employer qualify for some amount of financial assistance.)

So, wait, it's possible that we're going to be turned down by schools not because of my kid's qualifications or lack thereof, but rather because we applied for aid? I guess I thought that those two applications were more separate -- that a school might say "You're in! but you didn't qualify for financial aid," and then a family would have to decide whether or not they could afford to accept the admissions offer.

My experience is with Baltimore private schools. They admitted my DS but said they didn't have any aid for us. I couldn't pay for the tuition without aid so I turned them down. He ended up at another school that gave us aid.

What school did you end up in?

If you made the other comment about Baltimore schools . . . There are some good publics, especially the ones with strong gifted programs, and the magnet high schools are decent. You definitely have folks going all the way through to Princeton.

[Anonymous]

Just move to a good public school district and send your kids to public school. That's what we did and all went to ivy league colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Just move to a good public school district and send your kids to public school. That's what we did and all went to ivy league colleges.

If your kids all went to Ivy League colleges why are you still trolling this board?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Chiming in with a naive question, as this thread is terrifying! Wait, so schools make admission decisions based on whether the families also applied for financial aid?

I'm moving to the area in summer 2019 with my son; he'll be a student there for two years. We applied to several private schools, and also applied for financial aid. I was looking at it as, hey, if we qualify for financial aid, great; if not, I'm willing to blow through my non-TSP savings to pay for a couple of years of private school. (I was assured by a wealthier friend that most families who work for my employer qualify for some amount of financial assistance.)

So, wait, it's possible that we're going to be turned down by schools not because of my kid's qualifications or lack thereof, but rather because we applied for aid? I guess I thought that those two applications were more separate -- that a school might say "You're in! but you didn't qualify for financial aid," and then a family would have to decide whether or not they could afford to accept the admissions offer.

Unfortunately you’ve assumed wrongly. While it is true most schools assess an applicant in their own right based on merit FIRST and separately assess financial aid based on income - and while a small number of schools will extend admissions separately and regardless of the school’s ability to offer financial aid - the vast majority of schools, and ALL of the elites, will waitlist otherwise qualified applicants if they’ve applied for financial aid but the school is unable to make an award. Some schools are transparent about this while for others it’s less obvious. It is a rare school that can afford to be truly needs blind.

It's me, the naive parent, coming back to report. My son was accepted to our first choice, and we were also notified that we don't qualify for financial aid. I'm just happy that giving financial aid a shot didn't count against us! I'm fortunate that I can afford the tuition by making sacrifices -- it'll be worth it, I hope.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FA isn’t just about SES. I’ve literally been told by a school - in writing no less - that their FA was intended to diversify the school, which we don’t do. Admitted, yes. Being white meant no FA.

My family is white and we are at a top 5 on 66% FA.

I can tell you know that while my daughter has had incredible teachers and a wonderful experience, the reality is, it is expensive and as they get older in high school and there are opportunities, trips, and all the expenses of junior/senior year, you will wonder why you ever did it. These kids are handed everything and it g ets tough when you can’t afford the 5 figure tutors, the most expensive private college counselor, or take the 5K test prep course. Not to mention that a white kid who needs aid for college is not well received. The URM’s have their choices. The rich whites can get into anything that isn’t need blind. The FA whites struggle, even with fantastic GPA’s. They aren’t inflated enough for in-state schools and privates don’t see you as a valuable asset when someone with a slightly lower GPA will not only pay but donate money.

Be grateful you will save the money. Save it for tutors, vacations, colleges, etc...

We are living this very scenario right now. Unless you are an athlete or some rare musician, going to private school is not worth unless you are willing to spend more money in it. Test preps classes are minimum $3000 and that is with groups. Private tutors are $100/hr. Private college preparers are about $20,000. Each SAT or ACT is another $50+. SAT subject tests, AP test fees. $100 application fees for colleges. Then you have to PAY to submit your test scores to college (what an f'ing scam) and also have to pay to do the FAFSA and CSS for the schools. Then there are prom attire, graduation outfits, trips for Beach Week that cost $1500, kids in brand new cars driving to school that are nicer than the staff parking lot. My kid doesn't even have a car. There is SO much we have to say no to and so much we just drop our jaws in the expenses others think are just like handing a $5 bill. Don't even get me started on the fundraising, and the parent parties, and the auctions. I am grateful they allow so many kids on FA to go to the school, but it has been so tough to watch my daughter in middle class think she is a "has not." I know she knows we aren't poor and I know she appreciates what she has, but it doesn't really present itself in lower grades the way it does in high school.

So unless you child needs a smaller atmosphere or has a need only a private school can fill, then you REALLY have to sit back and think of the finances for the long haul. How you could help your child out with that money saved. If you are a minority, I absolutely do think it is worth it though. Those kids get into amazing schools and rightfully so. I also think kids that need some help can get it in lower and middle school and then go into public high school and do just fine. I truly regret not moving to public high school. She really wanted to stay, but the last 2 years have been extremely stressful for her and she now regrets not going back to public.

We are middle class, with a HHI of under $200. DC just got accepted at a top private and we are really questioning if this is the route we want to take. It's a load of money (even with FA) and will be a huge burden for us, especially if we do this for the long haul. I'm just wondering if it will be worth it. We can go to a fairly good public. My concern is that the financial toll will just increase, and my DC will in later years really feel the income disparity between our family and her peers. It's a tough choice, and I just don't know the answer, despite having less than 2 weeks to make a decision. My DC is an URM, and so I also fear that she may feel out of place because of that, in addition to the income disparity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are middle class, with a HHI of under $200.

You are not middle class. An HHI around $200,000 is higher than 80 to 90 percent of families in the DC area.

[Anonymous]

Both depend greatly on the school. The costs will increase, at a decent clip each year. We feel it more than triple your HHI (obv no FA). There are things that my kids friends have and get to do that are non-starters for them. But, the educational experience is worth it and it is also a good way for kids to learn the value of money and to develop good values generally. I think the income disparity issue will likely be more noticeable than the URM issue is likely to be. Many of the independents do a good job of attracting URMs and making everyone feel welcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are middle class, with a HHI of under $200.

You are not middle class. An HHI around $200,000 is higher than 80 to 90 percent of families in the DC area.

Well, I didn't say we had a HHI around $200,000, I said under. It's quite a bit under and to be technical, I'd say we were upper middle class.

[Anonymous]

If it's $150,000, that still puts you at top 20 percent in Maryland or DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If it's $150,000, that still puts you at top 20 percent in Maryland or DC.

What's your point? You want me to say upper class? Fine. Whatever label it is, the point was there will be a socioeconomic disparity that I'm concerned about.

[Anonymous]

Are you new to the private school world? My point is that the socioeconomic disparity between top 1 percenters and top 20 percenters rarely translates to any practical differences in treatment and social circles. I can't speak for all private schools in the area, but at least that seems to be the case at the "top privates" (using your term). There are lots of past threads about this issue on DCUM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Chiming in with a naive question, as this thread is terrifying! Wait, so schools make admission decisions based on whether the families also applied for financial aid?

I'm moving to the area in summer 2019 with my son; he'll be a student there for two years. We applied to several private schools, and also applied for financial aid. I was looking at it as, hey, if we qualify for financial aid, great; if not, I'm willing to blow through my non-TSP savings to pay for a couple of years of private school. (I was assured by a wealthier friend that most families who work for my employer qualify for some amount of financial assistance.)

So, wait, it's possible that we're going to be turned down by schools not because of my kid's qualifications or lack thereof, but rather because we applied for aid? I guess I thought that those two applications were more separate -- that a school might say "You're in! but you didn't qualify for financial aid," and then a family would have to decide whether or not they could afford to accept the admissions offer.

Unfortunately you’ve assumed wrongly. While it is true most schools assess an applicant in their own right based on merit FIRST and separately assess financial aid based on income - and while a small number of schools will extend admissions separately and regardless of the school’s ability to offer financial aid - the vast majority of schools, and ALL of the elites, will waitlist otherwise qualified applicants if they’ve applied for financial aid but the school is unable to make an award. Some schools are transparent about this while for others it’s less obvious. It is a rare school that can afford to be truly needs blind.

It's me, the naive parent, coming back to report. My son was accepted to our first choice, and we were also notified that we don't qualify for financial aid. I'm just happy that giving financial aid a shot didn't count against us! I'm fortunate that I can afford the tuition by making sacrifices -- it'll be worth it, I hope.

Hey, congratulations! I hope he has a great experience.

[Anonymous]

10:29 poster, I would not do it if I were you. We are also URM, UMC, and grandparents foot the bill. We would not do private if it weren’t for their generosity. The tuition is not the only expense, all of the activities, trips, homes, clothes, and cars do make a difference even for those who say they don’t care about that stuff. What I have seen is a natural drifting that happens over the years between the kids and it’s not because they are mean, it’s just the way the world works. When they were younger they barely noticed that someone had less than them as long as they all were into the same games on the playground. Families of similar socio-economic status start hanging together and the kids just spend more time together with those kids because that’s who goes with them on the ski trips, to the Caribbean, Disney, etc. I always feel like an imposter because my in law’s foot the bill so we are able to spend on the numerous activities, gear, and some of the group vacations otherwise we would not fit in. No one is mean or obnoxious about it but they will not invite your child to certain things because they will know you cannot afford it. It takes a certain type of child to deal with that day in and day out. Some are ok with it and respect the sacrifice their parents make for the education, others do start to resent it over time. Being an URM just makes it worse. Our kids know they are lucky but they also know that while our house is nice, it’s the smallest of their friends, we don’t have a Range Rover, and we have not nor will ever fly private. I just tell them those things are awesome and we should be so happy for those who have those great things, if you want that too, work hard and do well in school. These conversations will only get tougher over time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:10:29 poster, I would not do it if I were you. We are also URM, UMC, and grandparents foot the bill. We would not do private if it weren’t for their generosity. The tuition is not the only expense, all of the activities, trips, homes, clothes, and cars do make a difference even for those who say they don’t care about that stuff. What I have seen is a natural drifting that happens over the years between the kids and it’s not because they are mean, it’s just the way the world works. When they were younger they barely noticed that someone had less than them as long as they all were into the same games on the playground. Families of similar socio-economic status start hanging together and the kids just spend more time together with those kids because that’s who goes with them on the ski trips, to the Caribbean, Disney, etc. I always feel like an imposter because my in law’s foot the bill so we are able to spend on the numerous activities, gear, and some of the group vacations otherwise we would not fit in. No one is mean or obnoxious about it but they will not invite your child to certain things because they will know you cannot afford it. It takes a certain type of child to deal with that day in and day out. Some are ok with it and respect the sacrifice their parents make for the education, others do start to resent it over time. Being an URM just makes it worse. Our kids know they are lucky but they also know that while our house is nice, it’s the smallest of their friends, we don’t have a Range Rover, and we have not nor will ever fly private. I just tell them those things are awesome and we should be so happy for those who have those great things, if you want that too, work hard and do well in school. These conversations will only get tougher over time.

We also have these concerns. Would you have preferred doing private up to middle school and switching to a gifted magnet program (public) or going public in elementary so your kid could develop another social network before starting private?