Protecting undocumented students (families) in DC schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How can illegal families even afford to live in DC given how expensive it is here? Through subsidies that should probably be restricted to legal citizens and residents who have lived here for a while?

Nope. The magic works this way:

1) work hard, often in several jobs

2) most important: be frugal. For example, share housing with another family (or with your extended one). Don't waste money on frivolities.

Sort of. The method above is usually used by men and women who are single while in the US (they may have a spouse and children back in their home country)

What then often happens, is they have a child (this is where the term anchor baby originates) who is a legal US citizen and is entitled to welfare services such as food stamps, WIC, etc and the parent collects those benefits on the child's behalf. They might still continue to live in a shared housing situation and be frugal as well. If the govt moves to deport the illegal parents, often this is avoided by claiming something like "family preservation".

We are mixing things here, but it's a good conversation.

OK, imagine they give birth to an American kid. Yes, that means they can collect food stamps. But NOPE, it does not mean they stop working as hard as before. They continue with the multiple jobs, and with the frugality, precisely motivated to do their best for said kid.

Net net, any study shows that immigrants add more to our revenues than they get back (because they rarely use entitlement programs, especially if they are undocumented)

Agree wholeheartedly. But these are facts. Most people on this thread are just responding to their racism.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, why shouldn't schools be required to report undocumented students? I'm troubled by the implication that being undocumented is perfectly A-OK. It isn't.

That attitude is why a lot of people went for Trump. I didn't, but I understand why people did.

Because presumably their parents are the ones who broke the law, not the students.

Really funny considering how many people have no problem reporting people they think come from MD or VA. The kids aren't the ones breaking the law in that situation either.

You are a fool. How dare you equate the two?

If a kid gets caught in a DC school residency cheating, he goes back to Maryland schools. His parents might have to pay for the cost of his DC education. They had the option of attending school in Maryland, but convenience or other reasons put them in a DC school.

If a kid whose parents are undocumented workers, or if the child is undocumented, they get sent back to another country they might not know, might not speak the language, and they lose everything they worked hard for here. Families can be torn apart with the U.S. Citizen child being left here while the parents are deported into a potentially dangerous situation. Americans love hiring cheap immigrant labor, but have no understanding of the consequences of deportation.

You should be ashamed of yourself.

Oh shut up. If they want to be together, they can all go home together. To their own damned country. Not ours.

If the children are born here, this is their country too. Stop posting your racist agenda here on the DC boards.

anti-illegal-immigrant != racist

Yes your rant was racist. You are a racist. Own it. You are disgusting and I'm ashamed that you call yourself American.

Also people are not illegal, they are undocumented. You are not a legal person, you're a person. You have legal documentation.

You'd scream bloody murder if the government tried to separate your family. But if dark skinned, Spanish speaking people have their families torn apart, you are gleeful. That's racist and that makes you disgusting. You make me sick.

PP, you are confusing me with someone else. I posted only what is in bold above.

You should also know that I am brown and come from a Spanish-speaking family. My ancestors all became US citizens in 1917. They had been Spanish subjects until 1898.

Nevertheless, I am still opposed to illegal, i.e., against the law, immigration, and I am quite certain that my stance on illegal immigration is not motivated by bias against brown Spanish-speaking people.

New poster here. Lots of people in my family, including my children's grandparents and additional family members we are very close to would love to live in the United States. But, they don't. It's the law, and so they stay in their home country and we visit each other. Undocumented people in the US having children and then expecting the right to stay here in this country because they did so illegally shouldn't be shocked by the application of well-known law. Their kids may have the benefit of being US citizens, and that's the gift the parents received by breaking the law themselves by entering the country illegally and then having children here. But that doesn't mean it is the gift that keeps on giving, with the parents who made the illegal choice to come here also getting the moon double of staying with their kids to preserve family togetherness.

You are right that there are no people who are illegal, and that is a terrible term. But there are a lot of undocumented people, and they have no right to remain in the United States, regardless of whether or not they chose to have children born here. I have a family togetherness is such a priority, these parents, who knew what they were doing before having children here, could take their children back with them. Or they could choose to have their children stay in the states with family members or others, or the kids could move temporarily until they are old enough to be on their own in the US. It's the parents who came here undocumented, and decided to have kids here, put their kids in this situation. It's not our government, which is clear about its rules, and has been cleared that their pools may change in either direction over time.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of the charge that if you support measures to curb illegal immigrants that automatically makes you racist.

America is a land of immigrants and that has been one of its greatest strengths. However, unless you are ready to issue an open invitation to the world, there must be some restrictions on the flow of immigration. This means the greater our tolerance for illegal immigrants, the less opportunities we can offer legal immigrants.

Yes, I'll grant you most of them are hard-working, tax-paying people who just want a better life for their families. Do we think their fellow countrymen who wait years to immigrate, following the lawful process would do less? What about the Chinese who live in a politically restrictive country? What about the North Koreans who not only live under communist restrictions, but one where the head of the government is generally acknowledged around the world as unstable, whose policies have caused food shortages? What about the Syrians whose country has been so wracked with war that the flood of immigrants is de-stabilizing the EU? What about the countries in Africa where young boys are forced to be soldiers, or the countries in the Middle East where girls are forbidden to go to school? I bet their parents would be happy to pay taxes to keep their children safe? What about the Sudanese who have been undergoing a genocide for years? Something tells me they would embrace the opportunity to work and pay taxes just for the chance to survive.

No, I don't want anybody to suffer, least of all children. Unfortunately there is suffering, great suffering, in this world. I don't blame the illegal immigrants for trying to make better lives for their children - in their shoes I might do the same. I don't know what the answer is to curtailing illegal immigration, but I don't think it racist to say that other Latinos (and Africans, Asians, Arabs, etc.) are just as deserving (more so if they follow the rules that we give them for immigration) and would be just as productive contributing to our society.

+1

I would add regarding the difficult question of how to handle the illegally-present parents of children born here, that this was never the intended consequence of birthright citizenship. The purpose of birthright citizenship, as I understand it, was to ensure that all former slaves had citizenship. If the drafters of that amendment could have foreseen our current problems then I am sure they would have added a caveat. There are very few OECD countries that allow citizenship by birth regardless of the status of the parents. I believe Canada does, and the UK does or it used to. No continental European country grants citizenship to the children of people who are in the country illegally. It is kind of insane if you think about it.

I'm sorry, just SHOCKED that this is posted by a DC resident.

For what it's worth, I am a US Citizen. I guess since I'm not poor and uneducated like the racist and xenophobic pps, it might explain my attitude.

This country needs immigrants.
By limiting birthright citizenship to only those who can prove the parents are here legally, you create an underclass of second tier citizens. Even though YOUR family might have come here illegally, you are somehow given rights that more recent immigrants won't be able to enjoy.

Finally, idiot, the framers of the constitution did not do birthright citizenship to give slaves citizenship. They were slave owners themselves and considered blacks to be chattel. Might want to crack a book for once. They allowed for birthright citizenship because THEY needed it. They showed up and took the land from others.

Come to think of it as an American Indian (don't care if this outs me) only I am here legally. The rest of you xenophobes are not. So if you want to kick out the Mexicans, see yourself out the door as well.

NP. Um, you really should not call someone an idiot when you spew wrong information. The 14th Amendment was adopted in 1868 as a part of the Reconstruction Act in regards to giving former slaves full-citizenship rights in this country. The framers of the constitution were long dead at this time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am so tired of the charge that if you support measures to curb illegal immigrants that automatically makes you racist.

America is a land of immigrants and that has been one of its greatest strengths. However, unless you are ready to issue an open invitation to the world, there must be some restrictions on the flow of immigration. This means the greater our tolerance for illegal immigrants, the less opportunities we can offer legal immigrants.

Yes, I'll grant you most of them are hard-working, tax-paying people who just want a better life for their families. Do we think their fellow countrymen who wait years to immigrate, following the lawful process would do less? What about the Chinese who live in a politically restrictive country? What about the North Koreans who not only live under communist restrictions, but one where the head of the government is generally acknowledged around the world as unstable, whose policies have caused food shortages? What about the Syrians whose country has been so wracked with war that the flood of immigrants is de-stabilizing the EU? What about the countries in Africa where young boys are forced to be soldiers, or the countries in the Middle East where girls are forbidden to go to school? I bet their parents would be happy to pay taxes to keep their children safe? What about the Sudanese who have been undergoing a genocide for years? Something tells me they would embrace the opportunity to work and pay taxes just for the chance to survive.

No, I don't want anybody to suffer, least of all children. Unfortunately there is suffering, great suffering, in this world. I don't blame the illegal immigrants for trying to make better lives for their children - in their shoes I might do the same. I don't know what the answer is to curtailing illegal immigration, but I don't think it racist to say that other Latinos (and Africans, Asians, Arabs, etc.) are just as deserving (more so if they follow the rules that we give them for immigration) and would be just as productive contributing to our society.

+1

I would add regarding the difficult question of how to handle the illegally-present parents of children born here, that this was never the intended consequence of birthright citizenship. The purpose of birthright citizenship, as I understand it, was to ensure that all former slaves had citizenship. If the drafters of that amendment could have foreseen our current problems then I am sure they would have added a caveat. There are very few OECD countries that allow citizenship by birth regardless of the status of the parents. I believe Canada does, and the UK does or it used to. No continental European country grants citizenship to the children of people who are in the country illegally. It is kind of insane if you think about it.

I'm sorry, just SHOCKED that this is posted by a DC resident.

For what it's worth, I am a US Citizen. I guess since I'm not poor and uneducated like the racist and xenophobic pps, it might explain my attitude.

This country needs immigrants.
By limiting birthright citizenship to only those who can prove the parents are here legally, you create an underclass of second tier citizens. Even though YOUR family might have come here illegally, you are somehow given rights that more recent immigrants won't be able to enjoy.

Finally, idiot, the framers of the constitution did not do birthright citizenship to give slaves citizenship. They were slave owners themselves and considered blacks to be chattel. Might want to crack a book for once. They allowed for birthright citizenship because THEY needed it. They showed up and took the land from others.

Come to think of it as an American Indian (don't care if this outs me) only I am here legally. The rest of you xenophobes are not. So if you want to kick out the Mexicans, see yourself out the door as well.

NP. Um, you really should not call someone an idiot when you spew wrong information. The 14th Amendment was adopted in 1868 as a part of the Reconstruction Act in regards to giving former slaves full-citizenship rights in this country. The framers of the constitution were long dead at this time.

You have a problem with mistaking the fourteenth amendment but not the xenophobia, lies, and racism above? Feel free to correct that too.

Shaking my head. Your kids deserve better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How can illegal families even afford to live in DC given how expensive it is here? Through subsidies that should probably be restricted to legal citizens and residents who have lived here for a while?

Nope. The magic works this way:

1) work hard, often in several jobs

2) most important: be frugal. For example, share housing with another family (or with your extended one). Don't waste money on frivolities.

Yet there are lots of folks born and raised in DC who can't manage to pull this off...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How can illegal families even afford to live in DC given how expensive it is here? Through subsidies that should probably be restricted to legal citizens and residents who have lived here for a while?

Nope. The magic works this way:

1) work hard, often in several jobs

2) most important: be frugal. For example, share housing with another family (or with your extended one). Don't waste money on frivolities.

Yet there are lots of folks born and raised in DC who can't manage to pull this off...

So true.

Having said that, your point is proven and the argument is won. Time to rest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm sorry, just SHOCKED that this is posted by a DC resident.

For what it's worth, I am a US Citizen. I guess since I'm not poor and uneducated like the racist and xenophobic pps, it might explain my attitude.

This country needs immigrants.
By limiting birthright citizenship to only those who can prove the parents are here legally, you create an underclass of second tier citizens. Even though YOUR family might have come here illegally, you are somehow given rights that more recent immigrants won't be able to enjoy.

Finally, idiot, the framers of the constitution did not do birthright citizenship to give slaves citizenship. They were slave owners themselves and considered blacks to be chattel. Might want to crack a book for once. They allowed for birthright citizenship because THEY needed it. They showed up and took the land from others.

Come to think of it as an American Indian (don't care if this outs me) only I am here legally. The rest of you xenophobes are not. So if you want to kick out the Mexicans, see yourself out the door as well.

In addition to educating yourself on the subject matter, in this case the 14th amendment, you should consider whether ad hominem attacks and stigma (highlighted above in bold) add much to your argument. For more on the ineffectiveness of stigma as employed by the left, I recommend this recent article:

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/the-scourge-of-the-left-too-much-stigma-not-enough-persuasion/508961/

Regarding the protection of undocumented families in DC schools, a lot probably turns on whether or not DC can withstand the withdrawal of federal funds, as New York and Chicago have decided they will do, or whether the federal government can attempt, and wants to attempt, making DC's entire budget contingent on obeying federal law. For more on this issue of how the Republicans may try to pressure sanctuary cities, but with no specific consideration of DC, here is a good article:

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/442578/sanctuary-cities-federal-law-congress-power-purse-incentivizes-cooperation

This could affect more than sanctuary, also marijuana and other initiatives. We don't know yet what the focus of Congress will be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How can illegal families even afford to live in DC given how expensive it is here? Through subsidies that should probably be restricted to legal citizens and residents who have lived here for a while?

Nope. The magic works this way:

1) work hard, often in several jobs

2) most important: be frugal. For example, share housing with another family (or with your extended one). Don't waste money on frivolities.

Yet there are lots of folks born and raised in DC who can't manage to pull this off...

So true.

Having said that, your point is proven and the argument is won. Time to rest.

Very glad to finally see DCUM consensus about something...