Do you think the left struggles with marketing because the right uses professional firms?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a theory that the left has so many gaffes because the right is wealthier, more coordinated and hires professional political consulting firms at a higher frequency than the left does.

I think what happened is that the same Russians who herded Republicans to the hateful right herded Democrats to the loony left. Democrats often have trouble presenting rational arguments for a lot of positive because a. many of us refuse to take funding or market forces seriously; and b. a lot of our positions came from a meme on Twitter and have no substance, or value.

The Democrats haven’t really drifted, but the GOP has. Their own positions from a few years ago are now derided as “liberal” policies. That’s insane.

And let’s not forget:

The only reason that the GOP has messaging hegemony is because they have the corporate media in their pocket and that’s how people frame issues. I know everyone likes to pretend that they’re independent thinkers, but the fact is that the way the message is filtered changes how we view it.

DP. I absolutely love it when liberals post tweets from far-left people no one has ever heard of, and try to pass off their words as gospel. Never fails to amuse me.

As for the bolded - tell us you're delusional without actually telling us you're delusional. Good grief.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a theory that the left has so many gaffes because the right is wealthier, more coordinated and hires professional political consulting firms at a higher frequency than the left does.

I think what happened is that the same Russians who herded Republicans to the hateful right herded Democrats to the loony left. Democrats often have trouble presenting rational arguments for a lot of positive because a. many of us refuse to take funding or market forces seriously; and b. a lot of our positions came from a meme on Twitter and have no substance, or value.

The Democrats haven’t really drifted, but the GOP has. Their own positions from a few years ago are now derided as “liberal” policies. That’s insane.

And let’s not forget:

The only reason that the GOP has messaging hegemony is because they have the corporate media in their pocket and that’s how people frame issues. I know everyone likes to pretend that they’re independent thinkers, but the fact is that the way the message is filtered changes how we view it.

DP. I absolutely love it when liberals post tweets from far-left people no one has ever heard of, and try to pass off their words as gospel. Never fails to amuse me.

As for the bolded - tell us you're delusional without actually telling us you're delusional. Good grief.

Guessing you haven’t seen the border thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a theory that the left has so many gaffes because the right is wealthier, more coordinated and hires professional political consulting firms at a higher frequency than the left does.

I think what happened is that the same Russians who herded Republicans to the hateful right herded Democrats to the loony left. Democrats often have trouble presenting rational arguments for a lot of positive because a. many of us refuse to take funding or market forces seriously; and b. a lot of our positions came from a meme on Twitter and have no substance, or value.

The Democrats haven’t really drifted, but the GOP has. Their own positions from a few years ago are now derided as “liberal” policies. That’s insane.

And let’s not forget:

The only reason that the GOP has messaging hegemony is because they have the corporate media in their pocket and that’s how people frame issues. I know everyone likes to pretend that they’re independent thinkers, but the fact is that the way the message is filtered changes how we view it.

DP. I absolutely love it when liberals post tweets from far-left people no one has ever heard of, and try to pass off their words as gospel. Never fails to amuse me.

As for the bolded - tell us you're delusional without actually telling us you're delusional. Good grief.

Guessing you haven’t seen the border thread.

The border thread is full of tweets from reporters whose beat *is* the border. Kind of hard to argue with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a theory that the left has so many gaffes because the right is wealthier, more coordinated and hires professional political consulting firms at a higher frequency than the left does.

I think what happened is that the same Russians who herded Republicans to the hateful right herded Democrats to the loony left. Democrats often have trouble presenting rational arguments for a lot of positive because a. many of us refuse to take funding or market forces seriously; and b. a lot of our positions came from a meme on Twitter and have no substance, or value.

That sounds about right ideology and identity politics wise.

However in reality, many policy positions cast as part of the “loony left” (universal health care, sensible gun controls, livable wages and early childhood education for example) are centrist pragmatic in other rich countries. We come from two wealthy countries but have lived in DMV for many years. We love it here. Dear spouse votes conservative in home country. Yet He/ she supports livable wages, universal health care, public early education and sensible gun controls, and believes in science informed responses to climate change and the pandemic. All that is good for the private sector.

The right wing positions in US are increasingly not rational and hyper focus on fringe social issues such as transgender bathrooms, CRT in schools even though it is not taught anywhere, anti woke-ism, and weird conspiracy theories.

The left here should really get the message across that many of their policies are good for business, people and the planet.

You’re responding to me here. I apologize for my inability to proofread.

Anyhow: I think that, most of the time, Democrats have reasonable goals. They’re talking about proposals based on programs other countries have.

Right-wing groups often support proposals that are pretty nuts.

I think the overall quality of think tank papers on both sides has gone down a lot since 2000. If you looked at a major policy proposal analysis released in 2000, it would have been full of all sorts of interesting, original analysis.

Now, even though it’s a lot easier to get and analyze data, a lot of think tank “analyses” are just collections of talking points.

Sanders , etc. will talk about setting up a Medicare 4 All program, and the bill looks long and detailed. But then you see how the French and UK programs work and realize that Sanders et al. have made no serious effort to understand how the European programs work and the trade-offs the programs make. Sanders et al. seem to think you can make socialism happen just by waving your hands and saying you want to be social, and taxing rich people.

But, really, to copy France, you need all kinds of complicated government machinery, and you need to tax people like me to help pay for it.

And I’m actually fine with paying more for a French-style system, but, as bright and well-meaning as they may be, Sanders and AOC have no idea how to create that system. Partly because the think tank system fell apart. The think tanks just aren’t giving Sanders and AOC the information they need to do complicated things.

Hi again - I often forget to proof read and edit so no worries. 😅 I go for content anyway as many interesting people are busy and write in a rush.

I will have to look more into the French system - I am not terribly familiar with it.

So maybe we need simpler messaging for the masses and more complex guidance for political leaders. We need competition for democracies to work well so I would like to see both left and right think tanks churning out good ideas and solutions to big problems.

I really do think a lot of what passes for loony left here is mainstream and accepted in many other rich countries though. Maybe we need better definitions for left and right so that policies are better evaluated on their merits rather than arbitrary affiliations.

[Anonymous]

Marketing 101: emotional appeals are more effective than intellectual ones. The Left has a continuing history of overestimating the intelligence of their audience, which makes them over-reliant on appeals to reason. The Right does not have this problem. It really is that simple.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The left struggles with marketing because the right has the massive advantage of just being able to make everything up wholesale and telling the largely uninformed masses that some imaginary boogeyman is coming to get them unless they vote Republican is exponentially easier than trying to make those masses understand the often complex truth.

See Critical Race Theory for the perfect example of this:

GOP: "Schools are trying to teach your kids to hate themselves for being white, and they're trying to take away parents' ability to have input on curriculum."

Masses: "OMG that's terrifying!"

Dems: "Well actually, CRT is an advanced theory that is not being taught directly in primary education, though there are certain concepts stemming from CRT that may lead to changes in curriculum to more accurately reflect the historical experiences of POC. And while school boards have in fact been making changes to reduce the impact of parents who have literally no idea what they are talking about trying to change curriculum to reflect whatever they saw on FOX news last night, they are not discounting the input of parents wholesale."

Masses: "Huh? Were you still talking? I tuned out after 'well, actually.'"

In other words, CRT is indeed being taught in a sneaky manner.

[Anonymous]

The left has a lot to offer but completely sucks at prioritizing and messaging.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The left struggles because their messages suck.

It’s not the framing that sucks. It’s the actual messages and actual proposals.

Speaking as a Democrat who plans to cast (an hopefully one-time) backlash vote in November, I agree. First of all, the far left lunatics who have hijacked the party are hardheaded and fascistic. They accuse anyone who doesn’t sign onto all of their excesses of being a Republican plant and they have plans to take the party even further left. They are every bit as beholden to white multimillionaires and billionaires as Republicans are, except that their masters are the fringe elements of the LGBTQ and race pimp lobby. The Democratic Party needs to suffer some painful and humiliating losses in order to abandon this foray into madness and get back on track.

Before anyone starts carrying on with a white nationalist accusations, I’m a racial minority. The idea that racial minorities sign onto this bullsh-t is complete nonsense. The numbers show that Democrats are losing racial minorities. Compare 2016 percentages to 2020 if you dare face reality.

Good plan. While you are sending “woke twitter” a message, the lunatics that republicans are electing to office are going to more forward with actual government sanctioned and enforced fascism. They are looking to roll back the clock on birth control and inter racial marriage. Good plan.

And Democrats propose to have disturbed men in women’s spaces, indoctrinate children with trans talking points under the guise of education, forgive student loans (a wealth transfer primarily to upper middle class white people NOT to the poor), and release criminals into already unsafe, predominantly minority communities. Have the white Brooklynites behind these insane criminal justice policies ever considered that impoverished Black people DO NOT WANT the local criminals back? You’re virtual signaling at the expense of my relatives’ safety. Look at how Krasner dismissed the families of Black murder victims in Philly. Not to mention Gascon putting a transgender rapist with juveniles in the name of criminal justice.

I cannot wait for November.

Literally nothing you posted is happening in my community.
I do live in a state that is on the precipice of a constitutional crisis because the republicans to gerrymander and it’s against our state constitution.
Republicans are destroying the foundation of democracy. Nothing is worse than that.

I am so very happy for you that none of the issues I mentioned affect you. Unfortunately for you, you are not my prime concern. The issues I mentioned are affecting me and my community and I will vote accordingly.

None of that matters if we don’t have democracy.

I’ll opt out of a “democracy” in which my relatives are getting assaulted and murdered by derelicts Democrats released on no bail or gave slaps on the wrist. I’ll opt out of a “democracy” in which my daughters and I have to watch an adult male dangling his penis in a woman’s locker room and then get attacked and subjected to smear campaigns a la the LA spa. I’ll opt out of a “democracy” in which upper middle class adults who graduate from top schools with top degrees get bailed out with taxpayer money never mind that the majority of Black people and the poor don’t even get degrees. That’s progressive, huh? I could go on and on, but you DGAF. We’re just faceless bodies to be sacrificed for you. My vote in November will be a very heartfelt slap in your face.

No wonder Trump loves the uneducated.

Zing! I know. As you have already written, nothing I describe is real because it doesn’t affect you personally. So, time to insult my intelligence, even though you are the one too foolish to comprehend that your condescension and solipsism are undermining support for your ideas. I hope you stay exactly as you are. The backlash is here and I wouldn’t want you and your kind turning things around before we can vote you into irrelevance first in November 2022 and then in 2024. Keep calling the rest of us stupid because we won’t let you define our priorities according to your preferences. You’re going to cry harder than you did when Hillary lost.

FYI- you are responding to several different posters here. Totally understandable, because they haven’t differentiated themselves.
But go right ahead… your vote will hurt you more than me.
I’m rich and white.

What an ally!! Scratch a progressive, find a racist. It never fails that when a person of color argues with you people, the hood slips on quickly. Why in the world wouldn’t I let someone who throws white, wealthy privilege in my face set my priorities for me? What an ally! Fortunately, since you’re wealthy and white, I’m sure you won’t mind your conservative white relatives taking another turn in power. It’s precisely because people like you have no stake in the outcome that you behave the way you do and do not hesitate to alienate the Democratic party from its base. You splinter the base with your petty, lunatic issues like how men in dresses are the new oppressed minority and then you sit back knowing you’re fine regardless. Disgusting.

You don’t know anything about me or my politics. I never said I was progressive.
Is it racist that I’m white or that I’m rich? Boy I thought only LWNJ’s threw around the “r” word without reason, but I guess not. You seem very comfortable puking it up.
I voted against my personal self interest in the last election. Skin in the game? B—- please. My family finally came into millions last year, and I voted for Biden. Even though it meant a potentially HUGE tax hike. So go ahead. Make me richer. My kid will be able to live in the nicest, safest, cleanest place. Go ahead and vote for the party that doesn’t believe in climate change. Go ahead and vote for the party that wants to suppress the opposition’s vote. Go ahead and vote for the party that wants to criminalize women’s choices. Go for it. If my kid gets knocked up, we’ll take a lovely European vacation. Your vote won’t hurt me. Slap away. You keep slapping me into a higher income bracket.

NP. Absolutely unhinged ^^^. That's all I needed to read to know this thread is just as idiotic as expected.

You sound triggered. Sucks when you realize you’re not “owning” the libz…
Just making your life worse.

"Own the libz"? You really are unhinged. I have no desire to "own" anyone. I just want people like you to stay far, far away from me. Perhaps seek help for your anger issues?

Not angry at all. Again, your vote doesn’t hurt me.
Your vote hurts you.

Here's a tip: you don't know what's best for anyone except yourself. If you can't accept that fact, you are more deeply deluded than previously suspected.

If your vote is cast as a “slap in the face” to your fellow citizens, you aren’t voting for what’s best for you.

[Anonymous]

I haven’t read any of the comments but as an R reading the headline: hahahahahahahahahah. Yes, it is definitely just professional marketing. Please don’t change anything else y’all are doing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read any of the comments but as an R reading the headline: hahahahahahahahahah. Yes, it is definitely just professional marketing. Please don’t change anything else y’all are doing.

Right back at ya.

[Anonymous]

The Left has the loudest most visible pulpit in the country. If the President refuses to use it, what are other members of the party supposed to do? It’s Biden’s party. If he can’t articulate what Democrats stand for, who else should?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read any of the comments but as an R reading the headline: hahahahahahahahahah. Yes, it is definitely just professional marketing. Please don’t change anything else y’all are doing.

Right back at ya.

I'm on the left... We need to change. A lot of my friends are moderate Republicans or Independent after Trump. They all admitted, bad in addition to Trump just being a obvious scumbag and his impeachments those Lincoln project ads hit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Left has the loudest most visible pulpit in the country. If the President refuses to use it, what are other members of the party supposed to do? It’s Biden’s party. If he can’t articulate what Democrats stand for, who else should?

As one of the other posters so clearly put used the CRT example we get too deep in the weeds. We just need to find something that we all find terrifying and say vote or else you'll get that... We need to let Donald Trump back on Twitter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Left has the loudest most visible pulpit in the country. If the President refuses to use it, what are other members of the party supposed to do? It’s Biden’s party. If he can’t articulate what Democrats stand for, who else should?

Biden is barely coherent and is most certainly not the person in charge of the Democratic Party.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Left has the loudest most visible pulpit in the country. If the President refuses to use it, what are other members of the party supposed to do? It’s Biden’s party. If he can’t articulate what Democrats stand for, who else should?

They have the pulpit, and unlike the "Party of No" Republicans actually do have solutions - but they totally suck at concise, consistent messaging.