Elders sometimes become abusive toward those they were closest to, so please don't insert yourself

[Anonymous]

I feel like this isn't discussed enough. As I dealt with abusive year after year I felt crazy. So many people just adore my mother and they saw we had a good relationship at one point. (We had a good relationship because I accepted the concerning qualities and tried to focus on the good ones. The good ones faded and now she is downright abusive.) She still can turn it on for others-occasionally slips and it scares people, but mostly can hold it together. I want her to enjoy other people. I distanced myself so avoid further damage, but I want her to feel loved. Sadly a lot of that love comes from people seeking financial gain, but that's another story.

It is not anyone's place to insert themselves and try to guilt trip, or push an adult child to be closer to someone when they don't know what has gone on behind closed doors. I regret every second of emotional and verbal abuse my children and husband witnessed, and they saw the most benign of it. The worst of it was before I stopped ever being along.

I get that people are well-meaning and just want to see family harmony. I understand people cannot fathom what a monster another person can be to family, even if they saw glimpses, they go into denial. However, as long as the person is well cared for-and my mother is by strangers who are trained to work with her even if she gets snippy (nothing like she is with me) ...as long as the person is cared for-stay out it.

It is such a horrid feeling to have someone try to push you back to something that was destructive. It is even worse when you share the truth and are not believed. I wish we talked about this more and people understood, if someone breaks away, there is a reason. I spent many years in therapy to stop the abuse from happening. I finally found the only way to stop it was to distance myself. it's amazing how a person trying to do the right thing gets dehumanized and a person who abuses with abandon, gets put on a pedestal. (And it was happening before early dementia set in).

Anyone relate?

[Anonymous]

What you are describing is very normal. Illness, old age, loneliness, tiredness can make elderly people abusive and angry.

[Anonymous]

Of course it is normal PP. OP is looking for acknowledgement of how others refuse to accept it and push her back toward the relative with dementia because they just don't get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What you are describing is very normal. Illness, old age, loneliness, tiredness can make elderly people abusive and angry.

Thank you. Yes, it is and yet some people don't think about how many years of this some of us go through. And they feel the need to say "It's so sad you don't visit much anymore. Your mom won't be around forever." I have spent years being in physical pain and feeling tormented and getting therapy to try to deal with the biting nastiness. I finally got my sanity back stepping backward more and more. I think some people don't realize it is not their place to try to push someone back into an abusive cycle even if it is exacerbated by an aging mind. "She won't be around forever" is the wrong to say to someone who has spent many years dealing with horrid deteriorating behavior. It certainly seems like forever. So you step back and get your joy in life back and your optimism and the parent is with people where the better sides can come out. Some people just cannot accept the safest option is to be apart.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Of course it is normal PP. OP is looking for acknowledgement of how others refuse to accept it and push her back toward the relative with dementia because they just don't get it.

Yes! Thank you. That part just makes it all the more painful. My sanity doesn't matter because some people just feel you must endure anything because "she's your mother!"

[Anonymous]

I get it. My mother is the same way right down to how I vowed never to be alone with her. I’m sorry your mother does this, OP, and that people don’t get it.

The most understanding friend I had texted me on Mother’s Day one year to express how he knew it was probably a hard day for people like us. With all the tributes of “my mother is my best friend,” a child of an abusive mother can feel bad.

That was the most empathetic thing anyone had ever done on that topic.

You sound like you are making healthy and smart choices. Keep doing what protects you and helps you feel whole. You are brave.

I agree with you, OP. People should not give advice when they don’t know the full story.

[Anonymous]

It’s so hard OP but there are lots of us who are experiencing similar issues and you are not alone. My mom is also great at being the loveliest, sweetest person around others but being incredibly nasty when we’re alone. You’ve probably seen me post before, I refer to myself as my mom’s dumpster because much of the time that’s all she does-dump on me. Her laundry list of complaints, issues and ailments is never ending.

She rarely rears her ugly head around others and it’s hard for them to understand my angst and frustrating being the figurative punching bag. Every so often her nastiness comes out in front of other people but it’s rare. My husband has only witnessed it personally once, when my mom was screaming at me with balled up fists and calling me a witch and saying I was trying to kill her. Fun times.

You absolutely should feel no guilt or remorse from distancing yourself from the situation. At some point your moms safety has to come before her happiness. And if she was unhappy with you around more she’s going to continue being unhappy with you setting healthy boundaries for yourself.

My mom is in the throes of vascular dementia. What’s helped me deal with it is just accepting that this isn’t really her and a few years at the end of being just an awful human being shouldn’t negate all the years when she wasn’t so awful. Was she the perfect mom? No way. But she wasn’t who she is now. I’ve accepted that life is scary for her, I’m the person she’s closest to so I’m the one she’s comfortable letting her freak flag fly. I’ve been able to disassociate from her nastiness. This doesn’t mean you have to do anything different than you’re doing.

Anyone who has dealt with dementia will 100% understand your need to maintain your boundaries. Don’t feel judged. Those doing the judging haven’t been there (but they might be there eventually as our elderly live longer and longer). This didn’t seem to be an issue with our parents generation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I feel like this isn't discussed enough. As I dealt with abusive year after year I felt crazy. So many people just adore my mother and they saw we had a good relationship at one point. (We had a good relationship because I accepted the concerning qualities and tried to focus on the good ones. The good ones faded and now she is downright abusive.) She still can turn it on for others-occasionally slips and it scares people, but mostly can hold it together. I want her to enjoy other people. I distanced myself so avoid further damage, but I want her to feel loved. Sadly a lot of that love comes from people seeking financial gain, but that's another story.

It is not anyone's place to insert themselves and try to guilt trip, or push an adult child to be closer to someone when they don't know what has gone on behind closed doors. I regret every second of emotional and verbal abuse my children and husband witnessed, and they saw the most benign of it. The worst of it was before I stopped ever being along.

I get that people are well-meaning and just want to see family harmony. I understand people cannot fathom what a monster another person can be to family, even if they saw glimpses, they go into denial. However, as long as the person is well cared for-and my mother is by strangers who are trained to work with her even if she gets snippy (nothing like she is with me) ...as long as the person is cared for-stay out it.

It is such a horrid feeling to have someone try to push you back to something that was destructive. It is even worse when you share the truth and are not believed. I wish we talked about this more and people understood, if someone breaks away, there is a reason. I spent many years in therapy to stop the abuse from happening. I finally found the only way to stop it was to distance myself. it's amazing how a person trying to do the right thing gets dehumanized and a person who abuses with abandon, gets put on a pedestal. (And it was happening before early dementia set in).

Anyone relate?

Yes, I can relate.

I estranged myself from my abusive parents when I reached age 30 - I just couldn't take anymore of what had been three decades of physical abuse, psychological abuse and sexual abuse from my father in my early childhood. I was very low key about the estrangement and didn't say anything but basics to other family, keeping the details to myself as I'd been conditioned (beaten into submission) to do from early childhood.

My narcissistic abusive mother, obviously obsessed with her perception that her veneer of a perfect family was eroded, invested much time in writing long letters to family members describing what an awful, difficult, messed up child I'd always been from day one - never mind that she'd always praised me publicly over my many achievements and I had no reputation for bad behavior and by this point had earned four university degrees including one from elite law school so nobody in the family who knew me well gave any credence to the letters and allegations.

Except one cousin (my favorite cousin early childhood), who is so deluded about my parents she believed the sudden allegations that I was secretly a terrible ungrateful child and she berated me at every opportunity for almost two decades over my estrangement from my parents, until I finally told her to F off and never contact me again.

Over the last few years since I blocked her and told her to never contact me, I've considered writing her a letter explaining to her that my two narcissistic parents had for decades called her and her mother adulterous whores behind their backs; that they'd referred to my cousin as my uncle's little bastard - maybe! (they questioned her parentage for decades claiming her mother got around so much she could be anybody's kid, etc. - pre-DNA era) in her early childhood and then when she got knocked up by a married man at 19 they'd trashed her endlessly for being the apple that fell straight down from the tree, an adulterous whore who steals other women's husbands; that for years when I'd begged my parents to bring my cousin to visit us after we moved several states away they'd told me she was trash and not worth the investment of funds, etc.

Basically, my narcissistic parents were incapable of loving their own kids much less this cousin who adores them and thinks they love her too because they've patted her on the head and been nice to her face on a half dozen, dozen at most occasions over 4 decades that they've even spent time with her (we have always lived several states apart). Part of me that is rigidly adherent to truth at this stage of life wants to spill the beans to my cousin, so she can know that she threw away a cousin who loved her for an auntie and uncle who laughed at her and mocked her behind her back for decades. But the bigger part of me says, what's the point?

She aligned herself with abusers - and she knew enough from my siblings to know that my parents were far from perfect, but didn't want to hear anything from me about what they'd inflicted on me growing up - so we aren't suited by matter of core values to have a close relationship anyway, there is nothing to salvage. If I told her the truth, I'd simply be blowing up one of her cherished delusions that helps her navigate her life. Her biological father, my uncle, died of cancer when she was six weeks old - after having blown up his life and marriage over his fling with her mother, a late teens/early twenties barmaid. Then her mother died of cancer when my cousin was only in her mid 20s. (My narcissistic mother, by the way, considers both of these early deaths to be karma for their infidelity - I'm telling you, my mom was a gem!) So my cousin looked to my parents, who she barely knew, as some kind of lifeline/connection to her dead parents and she doesn't want to hear about how my drunken raging violent father routinely raped his wife and beat her and his children, fingered his toddler daughter while reading her little golden books after drinking all night at the bar, raised his son to be an abusive narcissist who routinely abused his siblings and pimped his sister to his high school friends (I lost my virginity at age 14 to one of my older brother's high school friends who date raped me to win a bet with my brother over which of his friends could deflower me first), etc.

Wow that's a rant but it felt good to purge it. Should I write my cousin a letter telling her these and all the other ugly truths? Or let her keep thinking that auntie and uncle loved her?

[Anonymous]

Ha.

I knew that as a teen, when my mother was lovely to everyone in public, and the most horribly smothering and controlling nag in private, to my father and me.

I escaped as soon as I could, and now live on the other side of the Atlantic. I have no idea how they're going to manage when they start needing help - they've scared away all the housecleaners, and are very suspicious of strangers.

[Anonymous]

She might need antidepressants. They made a big difference in my elderly relative's mood. Even when everything is perfect (you have a nice house, money, surrounded by family), it's a hard stage of life. Your friends, family and spouse are dying. You're getting older and nothing works right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I feel like this isn't discussed enough. As I dealt with abusive year after year I felt crazy. So many people just adore my mother and they saw we had a good relationship at one point. (We had a good relationship because I accepted the concerning qualities and tried to focus on the good ones. The good ones faded and now she is downright abusive.) She still can turn it on for others-occasionally slips and it scares people, but mostly can hold it together. I want her to enjoy other people. I distanced myself so avoid further damage, but I want her to feel loved. Sadly a lot of that love comes from people seeking financial gain, but that's another story.

It is not anyone's place to insert themselves and try to guilt trip, or push an adult child to be closer to someone when they don't know what has gone on behind closed doors. I regret every second of emotional and verbal abuse my children and husband witnessed, and they saw the most benign of it. The worst of it was before I stopped ever being along.

I get that people are well-meaning and just want to see family harmony. I understand people cannot fathom what a monster another person can be to family, even if they saw glimpses, they go into denial. However, as long as the person is well cared for-and my mother is by strangers who are trained to work with her even if she gets snippy (nothing like she is with me) ...as long as the person is cared for-stay out it.

It is such a horrid feeling to have someone try to push you back to something that was destructive. It is even worse when you share the truth and are not believed. I wish we talked about this more and people understood, if someone breaks away, there is a reason. I spent many years in therapy to stop the abuse from happening. I finally found the only way to stop it was to distance myself. it's amazing how a person trying to do the right thing gets dehumanized and a person who abuses with abandon, gets put on a pedestal. (And it was happening before early dementia set in).

Anyone relate?

Yes, I can relate.

I estranged myself from my abusive parents when I reached age 30 - I just couldn't take anymore of what had been three decades of physical abuse, psychological abuse and sexual abuse from my father in my early childhood. I was very low key about the estrangement and didn't say anything but basics to other family, keeping the details to myself as I'd been conditioned (beaten into submission) to do from early childhood.

My narcissistic abusive mother, obviously obsessed with her perception that her veneer of a perfect family was eroded, invested much time in writing long letters to family members describing what an awful, difficult, messed up child I'd always been from day one - never mind that she'd always praised me publicly over my many achievements and I had no reputation for bad behavior and by this point had earned four university degrees including one from elite law school so nobody in the family who knew me well gave any credence to the letters and allegations.

Except one cousin (my favorite cousin early childhood), who is so deluded about my parents she believed the sudden allegations that I was secretly a terrible ungrateful child and she berated me at every opportunity for almost two decades over my estrangement from my parents, until I finally told her to F off and never contact me again.

Over the last few years since I blocked her and told her to never contact me, I've considered writing her a letter explaining to her that my two narcissistic parents had for decades called her and her mother adulterous whores behind their backs; that they'd referred to my cousin as my uncle's little bastard - maybe! (they questioned her parentage for decades claiming her mother got around so much she could be anybody's kid, etc. - pre-DNA era) in her early childhood and then when she got knocked up by a married man at 19 they'd trashed her endlessly for being the apple that fell straight down from the tree, an adulterous whore who steals other women's husbands; that for years when I'd begged my parents to bring my cousin to visit us after we moved several states away they'd told me she was trash and not worth the investment of funds, etc.

Basically, my narcissistic parents were incapable of loving their own kids much less this cousin who adores them and thinks they love her too because they've patted her on the head and been nice to her face on a half dozen, dozen at most occasions over 4 decades that they've even spent time with her (we have always lived several states apart). Part of me that is rigidly adherent to truth at this stage of life wants to spill the beans to my cousin, so she can know that she threw away a cousin who loved her for an auntie and uncle who laughed at her and mocked her behind her back for decades. But the bigger part of me says, what's the point?

She aligned herself with abusers - and she knew enough from my siblings to know that my parents were far from perfect, but didn't want to hear anything from me about what they'd inflicted on me growing up - so we aren't suited by matter of core values to have a close relationship anyway, there is nothing to salvage. If I told her the truth, I'd simply be blowing up one of her cherished delusions that helps her navigate her life. Her biological father, my uncle, died of cancer when she was six weeks old - after having blown up his life and marriage over his fling with her mother, a late teens/early twenties barmaid. Then her mother died of cancer when my cousin was only in her mid 20s. (My narcissistic mother, by the way, considers both of these early deaths to be karma for their infidelity - I'm telling you, my mom was a gem!) So my cousin looked to my parents, who she barely knew, as some kind of lifeline/connection to her dead parents and she doesn't want to hear about how my drunken raging violent father routinely raped his wife and beat her and his children, fingered his toddler daughter while reading her little golden books after drinking all night at the bar, raised his son to be an abusive narcissist who routinely abused his siblings and pimped his sister to his high school friends (I lost my virginity at age 14 to one of my older brother's high school friends who date raped me to win a bet with my brother over which of his friends could deflower me first), etc.

Wow that's a rant but it felt good to purge it. Should I write my cousin a letter telling her these and all the other ugly truths? Or let her keep thinking that auntie and uncle loved her?

I relate to this. Write the letter, but DON'T send it. I do not defend myself at all. I simply remain quiet and removed. All the people who support my mother have no idea how she is disgusted with them behind their back for being "fat" or "A phony" or "I think he's secretly gay and probably had gap affairs cheating on his wife" or "a loser." I have a cousin my mom suddenly pretends to adore. The cousin came to visit with her spouse and kids and my mother was afraid for the neighbors to see how fat they all are. She also thinks the husband is a loser. They think she is kindest most generous person. They have no idea how she obsesses about sneaking them in the door, hoping they wear black so they don't look so fat, worrying they will speak to neighbors and people will know they are losers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I feel like this isn't discussed enough. As I dealt with abusive year after year I felt crazy. So many people just adore my mother and they saw we had a good relationship at one point. (We had a good relationship because I accepted the concerning qualities and tried to focus on the good ones. The good ones faded and now she is downright abusive.) She still can turn it on for others-occasionally slips and it scares people, but mostly can hold it together. I want her to enjoy other people. I distanced myself so avoid further damage, but I want her to feel loved. Sadly a lot of that love comes from people seeking financial gain, but that's another story.

It is not anyone's place to insert themselves and try to guilt trip, or push an adult child to be closer to someone when they don't know what has gone on behind closed doors. I regret every second of emotional and verbal abuse my children and husband witnessed, and they saw the most benign of it. The worst of it was before I stopped ever being along.

I get that people are well-meaning and just want to see family harmony. I understand people cannot fathom what a monster another person can be to family, even if they saw glimpses, they go into denial. However, as long as the person is well cared for-and my mother is by strangers who are trained to work with her even if she gets snippy (nothing like she is with me) ...as long as the person is cared for-stay out it.

It is such a horrid feeling to have someone try to push you back to something that was destructive. It is even worse when you share the truth and are not believed. I wish we talked about this more and people understood, if someone breaks away, there is a reason. I spent many years in therapy to stop the abuse from happening. I finally found the only way to stop it was to distance myself. it's amazing how a person trying to do the right thing gets dehumanized and a person who abuses with abandon, gets put on a pedestal. (And it was happening before early dementia set in).

Anyone relate?

Yes, I can relate.

I estranged myself from my abusive parents when I reached age 30 - I just couldn't take anymore of what had been three decades of physical abuse, psychological abuse and sexual abuse from my father in my early childhood. I was very low key about the estrangement and didn't say anything but basics to other family, keeping the details to myself as I'd been conditioned (beaten into submission) to do from early childhood.

My narcissistic abusive mother, obviously obsessed with her perception that her veneer of a perfect family was eroded, invested much time in writing long letters to family members describing what an awful, difficult, messed up child I'd always been from day one - never mind that she'd always praised me publicly over my many achievements and I had no reputation for bad behavior and by this point had earned four university degrees including one from elite law school so nobody in the family who knew me well gave any credence to the letters and allegations.

Except one cousin (my favorite cousin early childhood), who is so deluded about my parents she believed the sudden allegations that I was secretly a terrible ungrateful child and she berated me at every opportunity for almost two decades over my estrangement from my parents, until I finally told her to F off and never contact me again.

Over the last few years since I blocked her and told her to never contact me, I've considered writing her a letter explaining to her that my two narcissistic parents had for decades called her and her mother adulterous whores behind their backs; that they'd referred to my cousin as my uncle's little bastard - maybe! (they questioned her parentage for decades claiming her mother got around so much she could be anybody's kid, etc. - pre-DNA era) in her early childhood and then when she got knocked up by a married man at 19 they'd trashed her endlessly for being the apple that fell straight down from the tree, an adulterous whore who steals other women's husbands; that for years when I'd begged my parents to bring my cousin to visit us after we moved several states away they'd told me she was trash and not worth the investment of funds, etc.

Basically, my narcissistic parents were incapable of loving their own kids much less this cousin who adores them and thinks they love her too because they've patted her on the head and been nice to her face on a half dozen, dozen at most occasions over 4 decades that they've even spent time with her (we have always lived several states apart). Part of me that is rigidly adherent to truth at this stage of life wants to spill the beans to my cousin, so she can know that she threw away a cousin who loved her for an auntie and uncle who laughed at her and mocked her behind her back for decades. But the bigger part of me says, what's the point?

She aligned herself with abusers - and she knew enough from my siblings to know that my parents were far from perfect, but didn't want to hear anything from me about what they'd inflicted on me growing up - so we aren't suited by matter of core values to have a close relationship anyway, there is nothing to salvage. If I told her the truth, I'd simply be blowing up one of her cherished delusions that helps her navigate her life. Her biological father, my uncle, died of cancer when she was six weeks old - after having blown up his life and marriage over his fling with her mother, a late teens/early twenties barmaid. Then her mother died of cancer when my cousin was only in her mid 20s. (My narcissistic mother, by the way, considers both of these early deaths to be karma for their infidelity - I'm telling you, my mom was a gem!) So my cousin looked to my parents, who she barely knew, as some kind of lifeline/connection to her dead parents and she doesn't want to hear about how my drunken raging violent father routinely raped his wife and beat her and his children, fingered his toddler daughter while reading her little golden books after drinking all night at the bar, raised his son to be an abusive narcissist who routinely abused his siblings and pimped his sister to his high school friends (I lost my virginity at age 14 to one of my older brother's high school friends who date raped me to win a bet with my brother over which of his friends could deflower me first), etc.

Wow that's a rant but it felt good to purge it. Should I write my cousin a letter telling her these and all the other ugly truths? Or let her keep thinking that auntie and uncle loved her?

I relate to this. Write the letter, but DON'T send it. I do not defend myself at all. I simply remain quiet and removed. All the people who support my mother have no idea how she is disgusted with them behind their back for being "fat" or "A phony" or "I think he's secretly gay and probably had gap affairs cheating on his wife" or "a loser." I have a cousin my mom suddenly pretends to adore. The cousin came to visit with her spouse and kids and my mother was afraid for the neighbors to see how fat they all are. She also thinks the husband is a loser. They think she is kindest most generous person. They have no idea how she obsesses about sneaking them in the door, hoping they wear black so they don't look so fat, worrying they will speak to neighbors and people will know they are losers.

Sounds like your mom is a classic covert narcisisst like my mom. On the surface they are kindly, sweet, generous, and often wear the mantle of wifely and motherly martyrdom.

Behind the backs of people they trash, trash, trash - have nothing good to say about anybody except perhaps a golden child if there is one.

It's helpful to know that this sort of person has a broken brain and that brain was likely broken long before you ever existed. Nothing you did or said in your life was going to fix that broken brain and it is entirely because of their personality disorder that you have this unhealthy relationship with your parent, it isn't your fault. It's just an awful stroke of random chance that you were born to a broken person.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I feel like this isn't discussed enough. As I dealt with abusive year after year I felt crazy. So many people just adore my mother and they saw we had a good relationship at one point. (We had a good relationship because I accepted the concerning qualities and tried to focus on the good ones. The good ones faded and now she is downright abusive.) She still can turn it on for others-occasionally slips and it scares people, but mostly can hold it together. I want her to enjoy other people. I distanced myself so avoid further damage, but I want her to feel loved. Sadly a lot of that love comes from people seeking financial gain, but that's another story.

It is not anyone's place to insert themselves and try to guilt trip, or push an adult child to be closer to someone when they don't know what has gone on behind closed doors. I regret every second of emotional and verbal abuse my children and husband witnessed, and they saw the most benign of it. The worst of it was before I stopped ever being along.

I get that people are well-meaning and just want to see family harmony. I understand people cannot fathom what a monster another person can be to family, even if they saw glimpses, they go into denial. However, as long as the person is well cared for-and my mother is by strangers who are trained to work with her even if she gets snippy (nothing like she is with me) ...as long as the person is cared for-stay out it.

It is such a horrid feeling to have someone try to push you back to something that was destructive. It is even worse when you share the truth and are not believed. I wish we talked about this more and people understood, if someone breaks away, there is a reason. I spent many years in therapy to stop the abuse from happening. I finally found the only way to stop it was to distance myself. it's amazing how a person trying to do the right thing gets dehumanized and a person who abuses with abandon, gets put on a pedestal. (And it was happening before early dementia set in).

Anyone relate?

I do relate. In my case, the verbal and emotional abuse came from other family members. My sister was put on a pedestal while my truth was dismissed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What you are describing is very normal. Illness, old age, loneliness, tiredness can make elderly people abusive and angry.

x1000000

This topic needs to be discussed much more often.

[Anonymous]

I've been working in home health, mostly eldercare and often hospice status care, for the last near decade. The experience has been eye opening for me in terms of these issues. I'm the poster from the deeply dysfunctional family who posted above, so I have a lot of context I bring to the job. I consider myself a fairly perceptive empathic person - and I have definitely recognized on many occasions that the sweet patient who treated me so kindly was actually quite awful to the kids with whom they resided or who visited them. If you pay attention and you've had the experience yourself, you see the little tells that give away even a very manipulative person when they interact with their kids. You can see the pain in the kids faces, too.

I don't judge any kids who stay away from their parents. I always assume there is a very good reason they can't bear to see them.