The White Lotus season 2

[Anonymous]

My latest theory is that Lucia confronts Cameron and Daphne interrupts. Probably in their hotel room. There's a big fight and Daphne kills Lucia (hitting her on the head with a statue or something like that). Cameron tells Daphne to get out of there and lie on the beach and he'll take care of the body. Daphne brushes against a dead body in the water and freaks out, but the dead body is not actually Lucia but someone else (Portia or Tanya maybe? Though I know everyone thinks Tanya will be back next season).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mike White famously loves the show Survivor and even appeared in a season of the show. I think there are a ton of Survivor parallels in White Lotus and since I have nothing better to do this morning (just kidding, I have a long to do list but zero desire to tackle it) here are some of the parallels I see. Obviously the show is not strictly a game and no one is getting "voted out", but White is clearly playing with some of the tropes of the game in my eyes:

Alliances

Alliances are central to Survivor game play and are the source of the vast majority of interpersonal drama. Some alliances can form early on in the game and last to the bitter end, essentially securing the final two or the winner's win. But most alliances shift throughout the game as people are eliminated and other players have to hop to new alliances with better numbers to protect themselves.

The most obvious alliances parallel involves Portia, who arrives with Tanya but is immediately banished by Greg (early alliances are often based purely on who you like and don't like, personality-wise). She then gloms onto Albie and his dad and grandad. Nursing a flirtation from an interested party to form an alliance is a Survivor classic, and one way that younger women on the show who might otherwise be considered liabilities early on for lacking physical strength, secure safety during the early part of the game.

There are other alliances going on as well. The foursome start out with to obvious alliances -- the Spillers and the Babcocks. But then Daphne clearly tries to recruit Harper to her alliance (is it her individual alliance or one she shares with Cameron? it's unclear) when they go to Noto. Noticeably, no one seems to be recruiting Ethan. If Harper turns against him, he has no protection.

Tanya has been recruited by the gays to their alliance but it feels nefarious. Mia and Lucia were allied with Dom but they crossed to many lines with Albie and the grandad, so he's told them he's through with them.

Blindsides

This is when a player flips on an alliance at the last minute, voting against someone they'd previously promised to help protect. Blindsides are a survivor classic. You can see blindside parallels in the way Portia ditches Albie for Jack, effectively switching her alliance from the Di Grassos to the gays. But Tanya's discovery at the end of the last episode indicate a blindside is in the works with the gays as well, though it's not clear exactly what it will be. I suspect, as others do, that the gays are secretly allied with Greg, putting both Tanya and Portia in danger.

Harper's discovery of the condom wrapper felt like a blindside, since Ethan had in fact been lying to her all day about what happened with Cameron. On the other hand, I think the ultimate alliances in the foursome are very much up in the air and Harper might be looking to convince both Cameron and Daphne that she's joining their alliance against Ethan, only to blindside them in the end in an act of loyalty to her husband.

Whoever dies is likely getting the ultimate blindside and I do think White is trying to make this as surprising for the audience as possible, so I think the biggest blindside is yet to come and likely to be a shock.

Swing Votes

A Survivor classic, this is what happens when you have two equally sized alliances and one or two people who are unaligned. The wooing of the swing votes is a Survivor mainstay. I think the most obvious swing votes are Mia and Lucia, who have a tight alliance with each other but very weak alliances with others (Dom, Albie, Cam, Valentina) often based on temporary goodwill or a financial transaction. They are playing games and swing votes often get caught up in their temporary power only to get quickly punished for this as soon as the number shift and they are no longer needed. I fear this is what will happen with Lucia for sure. Mia seems a little more cautious and thus maybe safer but we'll see.

Portia is also a potential swing vote and could help or hurt Tanya with the dangerous situation in Palermo.

Tribal Council

Tribal Council, where someone is voted out or, in the last episode, where the winner is selected, happens at the end of every episode of survivor. This last episode had MAJOR tribal council vibes at the end, with both the dinner hour at the hotel and the opera in Palermo. Right down to classic Survivor imagery of fire and close ups of statues, plus the White Lotus scores always gives Survivor with the wordless chanting -- if you are much of a Survivor watcher, it's hard to avoid the obvious references.

Anyway, tribal council is where a lot of $hit goes down but because it's very public, with everyone sitting in a circle, it's hard to scheme. There are a LOT of meaningful glances. Kind of like the dinner with the foursome. Sometimes players will even have hurried, whispered conversations before the vote to try and change a plan last minute based on what has been said at Council. When Mia went off with Cameron in full view of Albie, it had that feeling of Lucia trying to swing a vote last minute using Cameron as a tool. The Di Grassos have also had a lot of Tribal Council-esque glances through the show during dinner, as gramps and Dom track the location of Mia/Lucia, and gramps also tracks Dom's tracking of Mia/Lucia.

The foursome always feels Tribal Council-y to me at their dinners, with revelations and accusations thrown out, never more so than in this last episode. Cameron grabbing Harper's knee under the table reminded me of the way players sometimes slip other people immunity idols at council, though I don't think Cameron wants to give Harper immunity, if you know what I mean (lol).

Often, after tribal council, the show will follow the tribe back to camp where they will go to sleep. Only sometimes some people don't go to sleep and there is activity -- idol hiding, alliance conversations, etc. Kind of like how Jack went to hide his idol after leaving Portia, wink-wink (I know I'm being silly, I enjoy the innuendo!).

That's all I've got for now. I saw some Survivor references in the first season but they are out of control in this season and I think it's clear White was heavily inspired by his fandom and likely also his experience on the show. It's also clearly a passionate interest of his -- I think his interest in class and hierarchies dovetails nicely with his interest in Survivor. It's also what I like about that show too -- it has a way of exposing people in the most fascinating ways, both their worst impulses (betrayal, exploitation, lying and stealing) and their surprising vulnerabilities and resiliency.

One thing about Survivor is that nasty people never win. They can't, everyone hates them. The winners are always schemers and pretty much no one ever wins without telling at least a few little lies. But the winners usually have strong social skills and are genuinely likable, or have qualities that help others respect them. That's how they get the votes at the end even after participating in voting off a lot of the jury. This aspect of Survivor makes me think it's unlike Mia or Lucia wind up dead (schemers, sure, but too plucky and likable to be hated) and also that Tanya probably makes it out alive. Cameron though... he's the sort who would make it deep in the game and then be gloriously ousted by the exact people he's been cruelest to. My money is on Daphne, Harper, or Ethan, or potentially all three, killing Cameron in an extremely satisfying way. The slaying of the villains has long been my favorite Survivor feature -- nasty people never win.

Fellow survivor fan here. I do think Mike has been heavily influenced by his time on survivor and this is interesting but it feels like a reach in a lot of places. One thing I'd actively push back on though is the bolded. This is kind of true on survivor (not universally though, see the OG Richard Hatch even), but it is not true in The White Lotus. To the contrary at the end of season one everyone basically went back to their lives. Steve Zahn's family left basically unchanged (except maybe the son, who saw an opportunity for transformation and took it). The person most severely effected was the guy who tried to steal from them for his girlfriend. The friend who orchestrated that goes unpunished. The guy who dies is not the worst person on the show but he was hardly the villain. The murderer gets off. Tanya destroys that massage workers dreams after leading her on for a week and then disappears with a man and her money. The White Lotus says that you can be horrible and rarely face consequences, and it is strongest when it is showing the mundane cruelty of people. The little things that happen everyday that show who a person is, and slowly corrupt them further. How one bad choice leads to another. How you can't contain the damage of being awful, but how other people are awful too.

This is not a show about the good guy winning.

PP here. I agree that in Season 1, this wasn't White's m.o. at all -- it was very clear that he was making a point about how wealth helps people escape accountability. I also don't think Season One had as many Survivor vibes generally, other than the tropical locale and some of the music.

However, I think this season, which has a lot more intrigue and aligning and re-aligning of characters, is much more heavily influenced by White's Survivor fandom. It really hit me during this week's episode because there was a musical interlude that was literally just close ups of fire of Survivor-esque chanting music in the background. That's straight out of the Survivor playbook.

Regarding the whole "nasty people never win", it really is true. Hatch was grating at times, but never nasty. People were bothered by the fact that he walked around naked, but he genuinely just liked doing it -- he wasn't mean to people. And he was the first person to create the whole concept of an alliance on Survivor. There was talk in the first season about whether this was even allowable. So he gets this reputation for being devious, but only because he essentially invented a core feature of Survivor gameplay that has been present in every season of Survivor since. That's not nasty, it's smart. Smart people with strong strategy are often rewarded on Survivor.

No, when I say nasty, I'm talking about players like Russel Hantz. Nasty, mean-spirited players who are frequently put down other players and constantly betray alliance-mates for a short term advantage. These people never, ever win survivor because it pisses people off, and then no one will vote for them to win in the end. If you are going to screw people over on Survivor, you have to do it in a way that makes people still like, or at least respect you. You can't just openly be a jerk.

Applying this to this season, I think it's likely that Cameron gets a comeuppance in the way that Shane from last season didn't. Unlike in last season, Cameron's nemesis is not someone from a "lower" social class. The people who pose a threat to Cameron are all also wealthy, all seem to have some dirt on him, and all feel betrayed or harmed by him. I do think Cameron is one of the bodies in the water at the end, and I expect that Harper, Daphne, and/or Ethan will play a role in putting him there.

I also think Greg is plotting against Tanya, likely working with the gays in doing so, and that he's going to be unsuccessful because, again, he's too nasty and unlikeable to come out on top. And again, this won't be some plucky hotel worker succeeding against him. It will be Tanya, who is rich af.

This season isn't about how the rich and privileged escape accountability when they harm people with less privilege. This season is about the Catholic concepts of sin and punishment, which lend themselves well to themes and plots form Survivor.

I don't think the two seasons can be so easily bifurcated. It isn't that one is about social justice/elitism and one is about toxic masculinity. It is just slightly different focuses on the general concept of how people are yes, always trying to survive, in a world where the scales are tipped for or against them in various ways and how people use what they have to navigate that. And that overall is the essence of Survivor, and so I fully agree the themes are reflected here I just don't think it is so one to one. And as I said on the last page, the fact that Angelina is making an appearance here I think is not an accident and a really interesting choice. Angelina was quite pregnant when they started filming and he says it was really difficult to get her on set. He could have chosen anyone but he chose her.

I would not hope for some satisfying comeuppance, I don't think MW believes in that. Although I did read an interview with him and he said that he was surprised at how very very dark season 1 was, how it seemed to evoke a hopelessness that there was no good in the world and he felt that as a reaction to that this season would not be quite so bleak in it's portrayal of people.

I do think your observations about alliances are really interesting though and agree and I think what this really gets to (and is still survivor relevant) is power. This season is about power in relationships. Who has it, and what they do with it when they get it, and how that either sets them up in a stronger position or a weaker position going forward.

When Daphne decides to use her power (staying the night in Noto, having a kid with her trainer) she is strengthening her position in her marriage. She makes Cameron afraid of losing her, she ensures that no matter what he does, she is the powerful member of the couple. Cameron is afraid of Daphne, she is not afraid of him. He is afraid he could do something that would make her leave, he is afraid of not keeping her happy, he was afraid that she might die. She is on the surface the less powerful member of the couple but deep down she is the one in control. Harper has been the partner without power in her marriage (she didn't make the money, she wants a baby but he won't have s*x with her, etc) but until this point she didn't KNOW that. She thought they were equal, and she sees in this other couple that Ethan has the control over her. And that this is the source of her unhappiness. Ethan is not afraid of Harper. And I think Ethan showed in this recent episode that he is more aware of his power than he let on when he pulled that stunt with Cameron at the table. And you could see that there too, Ethan has control over Cameron, not the other way around. Cameron is full of bravado and is one of the least powerful characters on the show in a practical sense. And likely knows that his only real source of power is his money, and clearly there is a lot to suggest that that is not as it seems.

Tanya gave Greg the power, but not ALL of it. The pre-nup means she does understand the power of her money. Greg is trying to go behind her back in some way to wrest power from her. Will she find out soon enough to make a countermove? Clearly yes.

The power dynamics between the three sicilians are also constantly at play. Albie has the power with his father, the power to influence his mother. But the father and even more the grandfather bristle at the idea that he has this power. The grandfather pushes against it. The father is like Cameron, has all the money but none of the power.

Lucia has no power at all for much of the season so far, flipping from side to side (survivor!) to get to the next day at the resort. To get one more night, to stay on the island. And suddenly here in this episode she gets some power and it is interesting that she immediately seizes it and tries to use it without hesitation. I imagine she is looking for a ticket to LA. And she is walking a tightrope of using the power she has over Albie, who has power over Dom, to have power over both of them and extract what she wants. But her power is fragile, and I think she will overplay her hand.

But men and women are acting badly here, women and men are seeing, identifying, grasping or losing their grip on their power in the relationships around them. Portia is the most unhappy because she has absolutely no power and no belief in her ability to have power, until suddenly she has power over Albie and the Essex guy and she blossoms.

So I think this season DOES have parallels to survivor, but I don't think it is about the good guys winning, I think the whole thesis of the show is that life is unfair and brutal. I am a philosophy major and the most interesting and intense argument I ever had in school was a discussion with a professor about whether altruism truly exists. Is it even possible for someone to do something entirely devoid of self interest, entirely for another. And I think of that conversation often when watching this show, as it shows that every decision made, big and small is informed by the power dynamics at play in the situation around them.

I think the bolded is a really astute read, but I'd add another layer that Harper (while jealous of the physical relationship/affection between them) has genuine contempt for what Cameron and Daphne represent individually and as a couple - idle, empty-headed rich people jet-setting around a burning world playing emotional games on each other to make the imbalance in their marriage palatable. It's all the things she holds herself (and Ethan) above: they're grounded, they're generous, they're politically active, they're egalitarian. But like Daphne said in an early episode: a lot of guys *become* this kind of guy after they get a lot of money. Harper is worried about the money changing them ("I feel like we're LARPing as rich people"). In Noto she tells Daphne "we don't play games like that" but as soon as she finds the condom wrapper she finds herself playing games with Ethan - first to see if he'll tell her and then to punish him for not telling her. And when she tells Daphne "I think something happened last night" and Daphne gives her advice re: how to make peace with being in 'this kind of relationship,' Harper tears up because she's starting to realize how her relationship could end up exactly like Daphne and Cameron's, but she's not sure how to prevent it. Once your husband has already partied with hookers and gotten basically no repercussions, how do you stop the slide that ends up with constant cheating on one side and consumerism and a "trainer" on the other to mask the hurt?

Also not sure if it's been pointed out, but regarding Daphne's "I'll never cut your dick off, but I could" references: Theo James' fresco is a statue with no dick. Make of that what you will.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really think that in every season of White Lotus there should be a nice middle aged couple that has good values and is well off but not super rich and makes good, decent choices and doesn’t kill anyone or take advantage of the help and has a really nice vacation. Just for contrast.

Still trying to catch up on the thread, sorry if this has been addressed, but I think that’s at least implied by some of the non-character guests in the background. Or at least, I *hope* it’s implied and White isn’t arguing that every person has the capacity to be so awful! The nice people would be wonderful in real life but probably boring as tv characters.

After the last episode, my husband said to me “I wouldn’t want to be at that hotel for anything.” I was confused because the area looks beautiful. But he clarified that he wouldn’t want to be any one of those characters, or part of those families, despite their wealth. Awkward dinners like the ones in this show are fun to watch but would be so depressing in real life.

Yes, I'm PP and I agree that it's sort of implied. And I see what you and others are saying about that being boring. But I also think that it would be sort of hilarious if, after we see Tanya checking in with 115 bags we see John and Abby going to their room for the first time and finding it beautiful and leaving Rocco a nice tip. And then after Tanya loses it with her fortune teller we could check in with John and Abby who are getting a couples spa service and are totally relaxed. Maybe one day at breakfast they have to send an order back because they ordered an omelette and not french toast but they do it with a smile and the waiter who brings them the replacement gives them a complimentary bottle of champagne or something, and everyone is happy. It would be sort of like the shots of the ocean in between scenes, showing the passage of time and life moving on, except completely without the malevolent undertones.

I know nobody else wants this, but I think it would ground everything in reality in a kind of hilarious way, because right now even though I am enjoying it, it's all completely ridiculous. Almost none of these characters, though amusing, are remotely based in reality. Tanya is ridiculous. The hotel owner is ridiculous. The people who befriend Tanya are ridiculous. Portia being so filled with anxiety staying at a 5 star hotel is ridiculous. The idea of Ethan taking this vacation with Cameron out of the blue when Cameron was a jerk to him in college is ridiculous. Cameron wanting to make money off Ethan and also trying to seduce his wife is crazily not real.

It's all interesting and entertaining and I've participated in this thread with a lot of enjoyment. But it is also absolutely crazy and not approaching reality. Some of the ideas in here, sure, but most of the behavior, no.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oh and I totally forgot that Cameron has been so aggressively coming on to Harper this whole time including showing her his junk and rubbing her leg under the table across from his wife!!!!

Tell me again how much Cam loves Daphne and would never humiliate her or hurt her. Such a great marriage those two have. They will definitely make it, no question.

Again, reading comprehension. You don't understand what people are saying.

+1. What is the deal with this poster? I have to believe it just one person with terrible reading comprehension? No one thinks Cameron is wonderful and would never hurt his wife. It is made abundantly clear that he would. It’s also clear that there are aspects they appear to love about each other. This does not make their relationship less troubled or Cameron less terrible. They are a deeply dysfunctional couple and I have not seen one post indicating otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My latest theory is that Lucia confronts Cameron and Daphne interrupts. Probably in their hotel room. There's a big fight and Daphne kills Lucia (hitting her on the head with a statue or something like that). Cameron tells Daphne to get out of there and lie on the beach and he'll take care of the body. Daphne brushes against a dead body in the water and freaks out, but the dead body is not actually Lucia but someone else (Portia or Tanya maybe? Though I know everyone thinks Tanya will be back next season).

I think this is a very real possibility for the death. The first scenario that feels true. I think Lucia is almost certainly one of the bodies given the story of St Lucia and the symbolism tying her to St Lucia all through the show and I think it will tie to her overplaying the hand she's been dealt in some way.

I think potentially adding to this that Ethan or Harper encounter Cameron doing something with the body and one of them ends up collateral damage in the aftermath. I could see this similar situation happening with Laura Dern as the killer as well. Or Mia. But in some way the girls confronting one of their targets will get one of them killed, I think there is a lot to suggest that will happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oh and I totally forgot that Cameron has been so aggressively coming on to Harper this whole time including showing her his junk and rubbing her leg under the table across from his wife!!!!

Tell me again how much Cam loves Daphne and would never humiliate her or hurt her. Such a great marriage those two have. They will definitely make it, no question.

Again, reading comprehension. You don't understand what people are saying.

+1. What is the deal with this poster? I have to believe it just one person with terrible reading comprehension? No one thinks Cameron is wonderful and would never hurt his wife. It is made abundantly clear that he would. It’s also clear that there are aspects they appear to love about each other. This does not make their relationship less troubled or Cameron less terrible. They are a deeply dysfunctional couple and I have not seen one post indicating otherwise.

Agreed, there is one (maybe more?) people who keep insisting that people in this thread love Daphne, aspire to be her, and think everything about her life is awesome. There are no posts to that effect. It's a weird, simple-minded read of the conversation and it's been derailing the conversation, which I think would have moved on from Daphne by now otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really think that in every season of White Lotus there should be a nice middle aged couple that has good values and is well off but not super rich and makes good, decent choices and doesn’t kill anyone or take advantage of the help and has a really nice vacation. Just for contrast.

Still trying to catch up on the thread, sorry if this has been addressed, but I think that’s at least implied by some of the non-character guests in the background. Or at least, I *hope* it’s implied and White isn’t arguing that every person has the capacity to be so awful! The nice people would be wonderful in real life but probably boring as tv characters.

After the last episode, my husband said to me “I wouldn’t want to be at that hotel for anything.” I was confused because the area looks beautiful. But he clarified that he wouldn’t want to be any one of those characters, or part of those families, despite their wealth. Awkward dinners like the ones in this show are fun to watch but would be so depressing in real life.

Yes, I'm PP and I agree that it's sort of implied. And I see what you and others are saying about that being boring. But I also think that it would be sort of hilarious if, after we see Tanya checking in with 115 bags we see John and Abby going to their room for the first time and finding it beautiful and leaving Rocco a nice tip. And then after Tanya loses it with her fortune teller we could check in with John and Abby who are getting a couples spa service and are totally relaxed. Maybe one day at breakfast they have to send an order back because they ordered an omelette and not french toast but they do it with a smile and the waiter who brings them the replacement gives them a complimentary bottle of champagne or something, and everyone is happy. It would be sort of like the shots of the ocean in between scenes, showing the passage of time and life moving on, except completely without the malevolent undertones.

I know nobody else wants this, but I think it would ground everything in reality in a kind of hilarious way, because right now even though I am enjoying it, it's all completely ridiculous. Almost none of these characters, though amusing, are remotely based in reality. Tanya is ridiculous. The hotel owner is ridiculous. The people who befriend Tanya are ridiculous. Portia being so filled with anxiety staying at a 5 star hotel is ridiculous. The idea of Ethan taking this vacation with Cameron out of the blue when Cameron was a jerk to him in college is ridiculous. Cameron wanting to make money off Ethan and also trying to seduce his wife is crazily not real.

It's all interesting and entertaining and I've participated in this thread with a lot of enjoyment. But it is also absolutely crazy and not approaching reality. Some of the ideas in here, sure, but most of the behavior, no.

I grew up Waspy and interestingly I find almost all the characters quite believable!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My latest theory is that Lucia confronts Cameron and Daphne interrupts. Probably in their hotel room. There's a big fight and Daphne kills Lucia (hitting her on the head with a statue or something like that). Cameron tells Daphne to get out of there and lie on the beach and he'll take care of the body. Daphne brushes against a dead body in the water and freaks out, but the dead body is not actually Lucia but someone else (Portia or Tanya maybe? Though I know everyone thinks Tanya will be back next season).

I think this is a very real possibility for the death. The first scenario that feels true. I think Lucia is almost certainly one of the bodies given the story of St Lucia and the symbolism tying her to St Lucia all through the show and I think it will tie to her overplaying the hand she's been dealt in some way.

I think potentially adding to this that Ethan or Harper encounter Cameron doing something with the body and one of them ends up collateral damage in the aftermath. I could see this similar situation happening with Laura Dern as the killer as well. Or Mia. But in some way the girls confronting one of their targets will get one of them killed, I think there is a lot to suggest that will happen.

This is a decent theory but my money is still on Ethan doing something that leads to someone (Cameron? Harper? Lucia or Mia? Even someone unrelated to the foursome like Portia or Isabella?) dying. Just because he is the character who seems most homicidal at this point. Something is Wrong with Ethan. It wasn't just the way he was ripping into Cameron in the last episode, bringing up all these clearly longheld resentments. It's also how he responded to Mia's advances the night before. Not just turning her down, and not just turning her down in a regretful "I wish I could but don't want to betray my wife" way. But fully breaking down weeping over the situation which seems like a weird response. He's also had weird reactions to Harper walking in on him jerking off, and Harper trying to start something with him on another morning. Just strange and unexpected reactions to situations that make me feel like something is very off about him and he's got a ton of bottled up emotion that could explode out of him at any moment. Ethan is the guy I'd be most worried about being trapped in a room with at this point, followed immediately by Greg, then Cameron, then Albie, then Dom.

Daphne is the only one of the women I think is capable of cold blooded murder, but any of them could kill someone in self-defense. Except Mia. I don't think Mia kills anyone unless it's by accidental drug overdose.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My latest theory is that Lucia confronts Cameron and Daphne interrupts. Probably in their hotel room. There's a big fight and Daphne kills Lucia (hitting her on the head with a statue or something like that). Cameron tells Daphne to get out of there and lie on the beach and he'll take care of the body. Daphne brushes against a dead body in the water and freaks out, but the dead body is not actually Lucia but someone else (Portia or Tanya maybe? Though I know everyone thinks Tanya will be back next season).

Good theory

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My latest theory is that Lucia confronts Cameron and Daphne interrupts. Probably in their hotel room. There's a big fight and Daphne kills Lucia (hitting her on the head with a statue or something like that). Cameron tells Daphne to get out of there and lie on the beach and he'll take care of the body. Daphne brushes against a dead body in the water and freaks out, but the dead body is not actually Lucia but someone else (Portia or Tanya maybe? Though I know everyone thinks Tanya will be back next season).

Good theory

Good theory except for the Tanya part. I think she's too much of an expected character in the series now, and also well liked. People tune in to WL because of her character so I don't think they'd just kill her off like that. The rest of the theory I can get behind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I really think that in every season of White Lotus there should be a nice middle aged couple that has good values and is well off but not super rich and makes good, decent choices and doesn’t kill anyone or take advantage of the help and has a really nice vacation. Just for contrast.

Still trying to catch up on the thread, sorry if this has been addressed, but I think that’s at least implied by some of the non-character guests in the background. Or at least, I *hope* it’s implied and White isn’t arguing that every person has the capacity to be so awful! The nice people would be wonderful in real life but probably boring as tv characters.

After the last episode, my husband said to me “I wouldn’t want to be at that hotel for anything.” I was confused because the area looks beautiful. But he clarified that he wouldn’t want to be any one of those characters, or part of those families, despite their wealth. Awkward dinners like the ones in this show are fun to watch but would be so depressing in real life.

I don't know - is Theo James suggestively stroking my thigh?

Uh, I don't care that he looks like Theo James, Cameron has a major "consent is optional" vibe and no, I would not enjoy having my thigh stroked under the table by my husband's college roommate right after my husband has pointed out that the guy has a history of going after women after they express an interest in my DH.

I don't personally think Harper "likes" it either, just that she's in a very heightened state and looking to inflict damage, so views it as something that might be useful to her in that respect. She doesn't reciprocate or lean into it. She just lets it happen.

You are no fun.

Harper is attracted to Cameron for sure. You can see it in their earlier interactions, like in the ocean. She doesn't like him as a person, and she's (correctly) kind of scared of him, but there's definitely some sexual tension

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My latest theory is that Lucia confronts Cameron and Daphne interrupts. Probably in their hotel room. There's a big fight and Daphne kills Lucia (hitting her on the head with a statue or something like that). Cameron tells Daphne to get out of there and lie on the beach and he'll take care of the body. Daphne brushes against a dead body in the water and freaks out, but the dead body is not actually Lucia but someone else (Portia or Tanya maybe? Though I know everyone thinks Tanya will be back next season).

Not bad.

[Anonymous]

I think the frescoes are important so I'm going to post them

First Harper, a golden bird attacking another. Is money attacking her or is she attacking another bird (Daphne?)



Daphne, the mother. But also the shows creator says they are cherubs, known for being mischievous and playing games



Cameron, without his masculine parts, being humiliated by a dog. Showing that despite his bravado he is one of the least powerful characters on the show



Tanya, keeping a monkey shackled for entertainment and high in a window (linked to the woman on the island who falls to her death in the story Tom Holland tells)



Greg - a man and a woman on a pack mule with the pack mule staring at the camera



I'm having trouble finding the rest and I can't screenshot and post them so:

Nonno - An old man courting a young beautiful woman

Albie - A young man playing an instrument for a beautiful woman lying on the ground at his feet. A dog, not dissimilar to the dog in the Cameron fresco is gently jumping up on her

Mia - The Asian Sphinx, who will kill travelers who can't decipher her riddle, looking down from above. Strong and s*xual

Quentin - Four men, two looking longingly at one looking at the camera and another looking longingly at one of those men. The man looking at the camera is seated almost on a throne. A woman is facing away from them, walking in another direction

Valentina - Close up of that woman walking in another direction who is now looking at two women entangled in a bed

Dom - A man fallen to his knees in supplication before a beautiful woman who is holding a necklace out over a cliff

Portia - A girl with her head twisted almost unnaturally towards the sky, on the ground, seemingly doing some chore while a goat stares at her

Ethan - A beautiful woman holding up a hand to either take something or to push someone back and a man in front of her holding a bowl overflowing with goods. His head is downward and unreadable, staring at his goods and seemingly oblivious to the woman

Lucia - A leopard or some big cat holding its fish walking languidly

Essex Boy - One man sitting leaning against a column while another stands above him, seemingly bringing his pelvis towards the sitting man's face. Great intimacy implied between them

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know I will get flamed for this but I can’t understand this level of in-depth analysis about a second season TV show. Yes, it entertaining and clever in some aspects but I don’t even think the creator gave it this much thought.

Maybe it’s just me!?

I’m a huge fan of the show and was totally into this thread until about 5-6 pages back. The Daphne/Harper analyses have sort of lost me. Come to think of it, though, I think a huge portion of the drama on DCUM is Daphnes vs. Harpers, so if makes sense.

I’m a Harper that low key wishes I was a Daphne.

I'm a Harper too. I think a lot of us have Daphne fantasies. I don't ACTUALLY want to be Daphne (though I do want to look like her!) but there is some appeal to the idea of kind of floating through life being sunny and pleasant and kept

Ready to be mind blown?

I am a Harper married to a Cameron.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know I will get flamed for this but I can’t understand this level of in-depth analysis about a second season TV show. Yes, it entertaining and clever in some aspects but I don’t even think the creator gave it this much thought.

Maybe it’s just me!?

I’m a huge fan of the show and was totally into this thread until about 5-6 pages back. The Daphne/Harper analyses have sort of lost me. Come to think of it, though, I think a huge portion of the drama on DCUM is Daphnes vs. Harpers, so if makes sense.

I’m a Harper that low key wishes I was a Daphne.

I'm a Harper too. I think a lot of us have Daphne fantasies. I don't ACTUALLY want to be Daphne (though I do want to look like her!) but there is some appeal to the idea of kind of floating through life being sunny and pleasant and kept

Ready to be mind blown?

I am a Harper married to a Cameron.

And I know Daphnes that are married to Ethans.