Racism / Classism on DCurbanmom trolls or true?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to claim that "unprepared students" is really some code word for poor and brown children, then please provide me the correct words to describe students who are unprepared.

I think you should just go ahead and use the term unprepared in any way you see fit, but then be prepared for the response it receives.

Maybe as a quid pro quo, you can share how you know that kids in a given school or classroom are unprepared and how you find schools where the kids are all prepared.

A lot of DC parents would be grateful if you could make the distinction discernible.

I am a NP. I lived for many years EOTP, have now moved to dark side. In my children's new school versus our old neighborhood, I can tell children are "prepared" in the following ways : they got enough sleep. They were not kept up by a party, or just not great parenting, or (in the case of my next door neighbor) what I was pretty sure was prostitution. They have enough to eat, so that they can concentrate and learn. They've been read to at some point in their lives. No one today has screamed obscenities at them. My heart absolutely breaks for so many of the kids I used to see on a daily basis. I don't want my kids away from them, or not to associate with them. None of this is their fault. But you are blind if you think it doesn't have an effect on schools and classrooms and peers. And it doesn't make those of us who admit that bad people, racist or classist, to worry about it. Navigating DC schools is hard. But I really think the vast majority of us are good people with good intentions, both for our kids and their classmates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think Banneker is actually a great example of the ways in which racism plays out. White parents in DC justify not sending their kids to any DC high school other than Wilson or Walls (if kid gets in). They say it's because they want academic rigor above all other criteria. If that's the case, then Banneker should be on their list, right? Academic rigor galore. But if you ask them about that, suddenly other criteria - like diversity and distance from home - become very important. I'm fine with diversity and distance from home being key criteria, but if you want academic rigor from a high school most and you don't even consider Banneker, I have a hard time putting my finger on what other reason you could possibly have.

I send my very Scandinavian looking daughter to our neighborhood school. She's not the most advanced student in her 19-kid first grade, but she's definitely in the top 5 at any given time. When I talk to other parents in this area about her school experience, they don't ask what they're learning in first grade. They ask about the "social issues" and them at some point pretty quick after bringing up social issues, they ask if it's hard for her to be the only "high SES white student" in her class (she's actually one of two, but that's irrelevant to these parents). They are desperately concerned about what their kid's social experience will be as a consequence of their kid's ethnicity, and I've watched for several years as they try to figure out ways to ask the question without actually asking the question.

That's where the microaggressions come in, on this board and elsewhere. They don't want to come right out and say they're concerned about too many poor and/or brown kids, but they do want to know how those kids will affect their kid's experience. So they say "unprepared students" or "students whose parents don't value education" or ask about "behavioral issues" as though those were unique to the kids they're concerned about.

I understand them wanting to know, but I truly think it would be better if we had a very candid conversation about the effects of race and class on the educational experiences of DC kids. There are effects, and our kids will all deal with them, whether we manage to scrape together the $700k+ to buy a house in bounds for "a good school" or move to Bethesda or whatever. Talking about things from a place of sincerity, rather than derision and skepticism, would be helpful for me, but I've been told repeatedly by this board that I'm doing my daughter a lifelong disservice by sending her to a school where there are few children who look like her.

excellent comment, thank you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wilson student SAT scores are higher than Banneker students.

So your argument is worthless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you want to claim that "unprepared students" is really some code word for poor and brown children, then please provide me the correct words to describe students who are unprepared.

We're talking about DC hon. We KNOW you are referring to black kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to claim that "unprepared students" is really some code word for poor and brown children, then please provide me the correct words to describe students who are unprepared.

I think you should just go ahead and use the term unprepared in any way you see fit, but then be prepared for the response it receives.

Maybe as a quid pro quo, you can share how you know that kids in a given school or classroom are unprepared and how you find schools where the kids are all prepared.

A lot of DC parents would be grateful if you could make the distinction discernible.

I am a NP. I lived for many years EOTP, have now moved to dark side. In my children's new school versus our old neighborhood, I can tell children are "prepared" in the following ways : they got enough sleep. They were not kept up by a party, or just not great parenting, or (in the case of my next door neighbor) what I was pretty sure was prostitution. They have enough to eat, so that they can concentrate and learn. They've been read to at some point in their lives. No one today has screamed obscenities at them. My heart absolutely breaks for so many of the kids I used to see on a daily basis. I don't want my kids away from them, or not to associate with them. None of this is their fault. But you are blind if you think it doesn't have an effect on schools and classrooms and peers. And it doesn't make those of us who admit that bad people, racist or classist, to worry about it. Navigating DC schools is hard. But I really think the vast majority of us are good people with good intentions, both for our kids and their classmates.

so every black kid in that school was underfed and had an irresponsible prostitute parent? doubt it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think Banneker is actually a great example of the ways in which racism plays out. White parents in DC justify not sending their kids to any DC high school other than Wilson or Walls (if kid gets in). They say it's because they want academic rigor above all other criteria. If that's the case, then Banneker should be on their list, right? Academic rigor galore. But if you ask them about that, suddenly other criteria - like diversity and distance from home - become very important. I'm fine with diversity and distance from home being key criteria, but if you want academic rigor from a high school most and you don't even consider Banneker, I have a hard time putting my finger on what other reason you could possibly have.

I send my very Scandinavian looking daughter to our neighborhood school. She's not the most advanced student in her 19-kid first grade, but she's definitely in the top 5 at any given time. When I talk to other parents in this area about her school experience, they don't ask what they're learning in first grade. They ask about the "social issues" and them at some point pretty quick after bringing up social issues, they ask if it's hard for her to be the only "high SES white student" in her class (she's actually one of two, but that's irrelevant to these parents). They are desperately concerned about what their kid's social experience will be as a consequence of their kid's ethnicity, and I've watched for several years as they try to figure out ways to ask the question without actually asking the question.

That's where the microaggressions come in, on this board and elsewhere. They don't want to come right out and say they're concerned about too many poor and/or brown kids, but they do want to know how those kids will affect their kid's experience. So they say "unprepared students" or "students whose parents don't value education" or ask about "behavioral issues" as though those were unique to the kids they're concerned about.

I understand them wanting to know, but I truly think it would be better if we had a very candid conversation about the effects of race and class on the educational experiences of DC kids. There are effects, and our kids will all deal with them, whether we manage to scrape together the $700k+ to buy a house in bounds for "a good school" or move to Bethesda or whatever. Talking about things from a place of sincerity, rather than derision and skepticism, would be helpful for me, but I've been told repeatedly by this board that I'm doing my daughter a lifelong disservice by sending her to a school where there are few children who look like her.

Between this post and the person who posted this "I don't think Banneker needs white people. I think white people need Banneker". These are the best 2 post I seen all year. In all seriousness I will share my thoughts below:

As a native Washingtonian who had to go to school in another state due to my parents did not want me to attend DCPS (charters were not in existence when I was a kid). This is why I came to DCPS to hopefully help fix the situation a little so parents do not have to do what my parents did for me (I'm black). I can honestly say that I read these post every and I can personally tell you that DCPS on this forum gets slammed a lot "In some cases rightfully so" However, I can name Coolidge, Roosevelt, Any ward 4 middle or Ward 6 middle school and see people post things like this as I only going to focus on Coolidge

Coolidge posts:

Modest Proposal: Moratorium on New DCPS/DC Public Charter Seats , posted on DC Public and Public Charter Schools, at 05/24/2017 11:10, by Anonymous
How about giving the Coolidge building to schools that are doing well, like Appletree and BASIS?

Whittier PS , posted on DC Public and Public Charter Schools, at 06/07/2017 19:00, by Anonymous
Coolidge is *not* a good school, by any definition.

Does the principal still get in hair-pulling

Wilson overcrowding survey , posted on DC Public and Public Charter Schools, at 06/07/2017 21:44, by Anonymous
. We're also preparing to waste $200 million renovating Coolidge HS which has less than 400 students


Here's my Favorite!!![/b]

04/18/2017 09:54 Subject: Where will my Shepherd Elem kid go to middle/high school? [Up]
Anonymous



It's possible that 8 years from now Shepherd will still feed to Deal, but considering that Deal is currently pressing 1,500 students it seems likely some schools will need to be cut from the feeding system. Shepherd is one of the more logical choices to eliminate.

MacFarland is the most logical possibility. Considering Roosevelt is right next to MacFarland, there's no way it would be Coolidge (which is good, because Coolidge might as well be jail).


I'm pretty sure Latin, Wilson, and other school that this site likes will not call a school a "Jail" no matter how low the grades are in that school. For off of the things that is happening in D.C. "Which i'm glad it's happening". The city is still dealing with the issues in the late 80's early 90's and all those kids are adults raising kids "And their not all black by the way". What do you expect to see in just about any school in D.C. unless private? You are going to have kids mixed from all social economic status attending school. I will say that it's a lot or racist post concerning the poorer or majority AA schools on this site. It's sad. Just sad and i'm glad the person who started this post from page one spoke on it. The charter system was made as another option to help the education struggle in D.C. This sight though you would think it's for non black students only as I see everyday "HRCS" meaning it it's not HRCS, or a ward 3 school, or admission school, their terrible and only poor blacks, latinos, attend. Anyone can just type up and charter or DCPS school on this search thread and you will see all the hate and racist statements made with the schools that are not Ward 3, selective DCPS schools, and HRCS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to claim that "unprepared students" is really some code word for poor and brown children, then please provide me the correct words to describe students who are unprepared.

We're talking about DC hon. We KNOW you are referring to black kids.

You know? You sound like a racist. Try opening your mind for once, you bigot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to claim that "unprepared students" is really some code word for poor and brown children, then please provide me the correct words to describe students who are unprepared.

We're talking about DC hon. We KNOW you are referring to black kids.

You know? You sound like a racist. Try opening your mind for once, you bigot.

um what? so you expect me to think you are NOT referring to black kids when you say "unprepares"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to claim that "unprepared students" is really some code word for poor and brown children, then please provide me the correct words to describe students who are unprepared.

I think you should just go ahead and use the term unprepared in any way you see fit, but then be prepared for the response it receives.

Maybe as a quid pro quo, you can share how you know that kids in a given school or classroom are unprepared and how you find schools where the kids are all prepared.

A lot of DC parents would be grateful if you could make the distinction discernible.

I am a NP. I lived for many years EOTP, have now moved to dark side. In my children's new school versus our old neighborhood, I can tell children are "prepared" in the following ways : they got enough sleep. They were not kept up by a party, or just not great parenting, or (in the case of my next door neighbor) what I was pretty sure was prostitution. They have enough to eat, so that they can concentrate and learn. They've been read to at some point in their lives. No one today has screamed obscenities at them. My heart absolutely breaks for so many of the kids I used to see on a daily basis. I don't want my kids away from them, or not to associate with them. None of this is their fault. But you are blind if you think it doesn't have an effect on schools and classrooms and peers. And it doesn't make those of us who admit that bad people, racist or classist, to worry about it. Navigating DC schools is hard. But I really think the vast majority of us are good people with good intentions, both for our kids and their classmates.

PP here. We're all anonymous so you have no way of knowing that I've posted several times in this thread that I don't judge other parents for the decisions they make for their families. My eyes are wide open and I can plainly see what an unprepared student looks like and the effect that can have on a classroom.

My response is unchanged. Say you don't want a school with unprepared students, but be prepared for the response. Everyone reading the word knows precisely what you mean, without your explanation about sleep and food. You really can't do anything about how others feel about that, just as I can't do anything about you possibly, maybe, probably assuming that my brown kid is unprepared if he shows up in your school over on the dark side. Judging from a lot of other anonymous posts in the DC schools forum over many years, it's a worthwhile concern.

My concern as a parent is that it's not the students who are unprepared, it's the schools. Unprepared to handle kids who's parents are unprepared to handle kids. For my tax dollars, I'd like to see schools better prepared to counteract the effects of unprepared parents. Safe spaces where kids get their needs met for six or nine hours every day. But we don't live in a culture that values kids in a way that makes them productive, self-sustaining adults.

That's not a judgment on you and the choices you've made for your family. But I can understand your defensiveness, because judgement of each other is definitely something we value. Especially in DC.

It's interesting someone posted about Coolidge. I went to the parents forum there a couple of years to discuss boundary changes and I think 4/5ths of the 400 or so parents who showed up were outraged - OUTRAGED - ward 3 residents. I couldn't stop staring at the ceiling and walls that were literally crumbling all around us. That's what outraged me.

[Anonymous]

^^whose, not who's. My schools learned me good english.

[Anonymous]

NP responding to 23:23. I appreciate your long and well written post. I am right with you on the criticism need to do better for all our children.

But what you seem to be saying loud and clear is that you will judge anyone who is white, or who you even think might be white based on an anonymous post, as prejudiced against you. No matter what explanation that person gives, you will judge her by what you think her skin color might be. I can't stand with the sort of bigotry you display.

I hope we both continue to work to improve D.C. schools. I am sad though that your mistrust and judgment means we each will have to work separately, and cannot work together toward common goals.

[Anonymous]

Should be "critical need" not "criticism need". Autocorrect error

[Anonymous]

Just face it, the details don't matter. DC govt and its public schools suck! The police dept sucks, the courts suck, gun laws suck, parking sucks....it all sucks. They spend over 25k per student each year!! Why deal with the BS?? Even if you live in NW, you still live around a bunch of weenies. Move to Great Falls/McLean and enjoy your new life!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP responding to 23:23. I appreciate your long and well written post. I am right with you on the criticism need to do better for all our children.

But what you seem to be saying loud and clear is that you will judge anyone who is white, or who you even think might be white based on an anonymous post, as prejudiced against you. No matter what explanation that person gives, you will judge her by what you think her skin color might be. I can't stand with the sort of bigotry you display.

I hope we both continue to work to improve D.C. schools. I am sad though that your mistrust and judgment means we each will have to work separately, and cannot work together toward common goals.

What!? Some of my best friends are white. Cliche, but true.

For the sake of mental health, I haven't regularly read the DC Schools forum in years, but I bet I could still find perennial favorites indicating the assumptions made about people like me and kids like mine. Like I've said, I do appreciate the reality I've found on DCUM. It is what it is and, like every other parent with options, I've made choices accordingly. Who am I to judge others?

My criticism of DCPS is the relentless focus on testing to the detriment of just about everything else. And hey, who can blame them? Test scores matter to the people who matter - that just doesn't happen to be the kids. It's not like unprepared students are a surprise to anyone. What does it take to shift the focus to preparing them to do something other than take a test?

But in order to get more people (perhaps like you, she said, with no assumptions) DCPS needs to get those test scores up. And, unfortunately, for almost every DCPS outside of ward 3 the kids remaining in the testing cohorts are those with limited options.

It is what it is, and maybe what always will be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want to claim that "unprepared students" is really some code word for poor and brown children, then please provide me the correct words to describe students who are unprepared.

I think you should just go ahead and use the term unprepared in any way you see fit, but then be prepared for the response it receives.

Maybe as a quid pro quo, you can share how you know that kids in a given school or classroom are unprepared and how you find schools where the kids are all prepared.

A lot of DC parents would be grateful if you could make the distinction discernible.

I am a NP. I lived for many years EOTP, have now moved to dark side. In my children's new school versus our old neighborhood, I can tell children are "prepared" in the following ways : they got enough sleep. They were not kept up by a party, or just not great parenting, or (in the case of my next door neighbor) what I was pretty sure was prostitution. They have enough to eat, so that they can concentrate and learn. They've been read to at some point in their lives. No one today has screamed obscenities at them. My heart absolutely breaks for so many of the kids I used to see on a daily basis. I don't want my kids away from them, or not to associate with them. None of this is their fault. But you are blind if you think it doesn't have an effect on schools and classrooms and peers. And it doesn't make those of us who admit that bad people, racist or classist, to worry about it. Navigating DC schools is hard. But I really think the vast majority of us are good people with good intentions, both for our kids and their classmates.

PP here. We're all anonymous so you have no way of knowing that I've posted several times in this thread that I don't judge other parents for the decisions they make for their families. My eyes are wide open and I can plainly see what an unprepared student looks like and the effect that can have on a classroom.

My response is unchanged. Say you don't want a school with unprepared students, but be prepared for the response. Everyone reading the word knows precisely what you mean, without your explanation about sleep and food. You really can't do anything about how others feel about that, just as I can't do anything about you possibly, maybe, probably assuming that my brown kid is unprepared if he shows up in your school over on the dark side. Judging from a lot of other anonymous posts in the DC schools forum over many years, it's a worthwhile concern.

My concern as a parent is that it's not the students who are unprepared, it's the schools. Unprepared to handle kids who's parents are unprepared to handle kids. For my tax dollars, I'd like to see schools better prepared to counteract the effects of unprepared parents. Safe spaces where kids get their needs met for six or nine hours every day. But we don't live in a culture that values kids in a way that makes them productive, self-sustaining adults.

That's not a judgment on you and the choices you've made for your family. But I can understand your defensiveness, because judgement of each other is definitely something we value. Especially in DC.

It's interesting someone posted about Coolidge. I went to the parents forum there a couple of years to discuss boundary changes and I think 4/5ths of the 400 or so parents who showed up were outraged - OUTRAGED - ward 3 residents. I couldn't stop staring at the ceiling and walls that were literally crumbling all around us. That's what outraged me.

NP. I live WOTP, and no, I won't assume that just because you are black. If you send your kid to a WOTP school, I will assume that you either have the means to live here (and thus the education and professional success to get those) or care enough about education to lottery your kid into a good school. I won't make assumptions about your child's preparedness just because of your race. Granted, I'm from Europe, so I haven't been raised with the same racial stereotypes and tensions, but I give my American neighbors the benefit of the doubt that they think similarly.