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Safe schools for a Jewish kid.
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Anonymous
Expressing objections to the government of Israel is fine. Carry on doing that. Being antizionist, which means opposing the state of Israel, is going to be taken by most Jews as antisemitic. You can say that you don’t mean it that way, but calling for the elimination of a country that is the sole Jewish country in the world and the home of the majority of Jews, many of whom have lived there for generations, is going to be taken as antisemitic. The protestors who have posters putting the Star of David in the trash and so on are not peacefully protesting the current policies of the Israeli government and it is naive and disingenuous to say that they are. Anti Trump protestors, for example, don’t typically have posters with a U.S. flag in the trash. |
Anonymous
+1 |
Anonymous
| Alleged Cornell poster is in custody... |
Anonymous
Correct. Because Gaza is run by a terrorist state. To answer the OP's question, University of Florida. Go Gators! |
Anonymous
You’re right, but that is a different point. This discussion is about why people argue that only one state, Israel, has no right to exist. |
Anonymous
+100 |
Anonymous
And this is why no one will take you seriously. You hurt the cause you are fighting for by being a liar. |
Anonymous
Uhm, no. It is exactly the point. It is the whole point. I think Israel should be a sovereign nation. But Palestinians have a right to have a nation too. |
Anonymous
+1. I have not read the whole thread but there are multiple fb groups that discuss this daily. You don’t know who is replying here and if they are Jewish. If you are not on fb, talk to your friends and relatives about what their students are experiencing. It is very tricky too bc an administrator/college president could have sent out a lackluster statement but the school could have a high Jewish presence and/or a strong Hillel and/or Chabad. I do feel for you but worry the rest of the thread will not be productive- I hope I’m wrong. |
Anonymous
You may find an antizionist statement to be antisemitic. But there are people who do not wish any harm to Jewish people and still don't think Israel should exist, or that if it exists, and should not exist as a Jewish state. You might say, but the elimination of Israel would de facto result in harm to Jewish people. I might agree with you. But the quagmire of mideast politics does not allow for easy black and white answer to these questions. The alignment of Jewish interests with Israeli interests is a problem for both Jews and those who support Palestinians for humanitarian reasons. Because the Israeli government currently and historically has done many terrible things in the name of preserving the Jewish state. For Zionists, these actions can be considered justified because of the hostility towards Israel in the region. Certainly Israel is not a welcome entity in the region. The argument of the current Israeli government (and many past Israeli governments) is that their hard line and the killing of Palestinians, including many innocent civilians, is necessary to preserve the existence of the state. This is their argument, not mine. So you cannot perfectly separate anti-Zionism from opposition to the current Israeli government and its policies. That government explicitly argues that these policies are necessary to ensure the survival of a Jewish state in a hostile region. I honestly don't know if that's true or not. Does anyone? There are very few black and white truths in this situation. But yes, a person could argue against the existence of Israel without wishing any harm to Jews. It is not a practical position, but it's a possible one. Just as it is also possible for someone to believe the existence of Israel is necessary to the the survival of the Jewish people and also argue that Israel's treatment of Palestinians is unacceptable. And it's possible to argue that Hamas is an anti-semitic terrorist organization that murders Jewish people, but also to argue that not all Palestinians who give or receive support to Hamas hate Jews -- some of them are doing it for their own protection and survival. I know, this conversation SUCKS. It feels impossible all the time. Everything is a minefield. But trying to impose one side's black and white absolutes on the more nuanced positions of the many people caught in the middle does not resolve anything. It just heightens conflict and makes everyone less safe. |
Anonymous
Where’s the lie? And who is the “you” of whom you speak? So many different people are commenting here to point out the ignorance and hate. |
Anonymous
“Nuance” is your pseudo-intellectual effort to traffic in antisemitism. Here is a black and white fact for you: if the Arab states and Muslims put down their arms against Israel, there would be peace. If Israel put down their arms, Jews would be slaughtered and Israel would be gone. |
Anonymous
Yes - good point: - how many Jews are their in the Hamas pseudo-government in Gaza? - how many Jews in Gaza, for that matter?? (not to mention Gaza’s intolerance for LGTBQIA+ people). None? No tolerance for Jewish people?? No, I did not think so. |
Anonymous
couldn't it also be that they aren't at all anti-semitic, but arguing for better treatment of palestinians? to me protesting having people not be able to escape while bombing the $hit out of that territory does NOT = anti-semitic. |
Anonymous
I don't disagree with you. But what this means is that as long as Israel exists as a Jewish state in the Mid-East, there will be conflict and death. For people who oppose conflict and death, this poses a problem. Which is why I don't consider anti-zionism to be de facto anti-semitic. |