Do you believe the US is the best country in the world? If not, then which?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Netherlands is probably the best country when you add everything together that I care about: political and social freedom, a functional economy, excellent urban planning, health (not just access to affordable healthcare but an actually healthy population), moderately regulated capitalism, an educated and multilingual population, and at least the younger generation is less racist.

I should also add - it is well known that Netherlands has a problem with very low incomes and high costs for housing/rent. If you don't make enough, you get govt subsidies to afford housing. What do you think the net result is? People just work part time or hardly at all, because there is zero motivation to work full time and be more productive since you'll be taxed more and lose subsidies for housing that results in no improvement in disposable income. When's the last time you've ever heard about any great new technological advances or business leadership come out of the Netherlands? I mean I guess if you are fine with coasting through a mediocre life with low salaries and no chance of social mobility in exchange for the govt providing all basic necessities, ok.

At least 90% of people in the US live "mediocre" lifestyles.

When was the last time the US made top 10 most happiest countries? Netherlands is always in the top 10.

Here are the top 10 countries and their score:

Finland- 7.821
Denmark- 7.636
Iceland- 7.557
Switzerland- 7.512
Netherlands- 7.415
Luxembourg- 7.404
Sweden- 7.384
Norway- 7.365
Israel- 7.364
New Zealand- 7.200


US #16 - behind Canada and the UK

What good is all the "advancements" when so many Americans are unhappy?

So your measurement for best country to live in is based on some subjective measure like 'happiness', lol. The US is far more innovative than the Netherlands and pretty much all of Europe. Look, if you want a mediocre lifestyle with extremely low incomes, high levels of taxation, high costs of living, no chance of ever climbing the wealth ladder, and having the govt take care of all basic necessities in life for you, that's fine - go move to Europe and the Netherlands. If you want much higher incomes, lower levels of taxation, lower costs of living and less safety nets from the govt in exchange for better opportunities to climb the wealth ladder, the stock with the US. Believe it or not, many of US would rather control our wealth than want the govt to do it. My wife makes $95k after her base salary her plus bonus for just being an administrative staff member. Tell me where in Europe she'd get that kind of salary. It doesn't exist and she'd be lucky to make 30k euros before taxes. I'm sure there are millions of Americans living medicore lives - the point is though that you are least have the opportunity to climb the ladder in the US while it is impossible to climb the ladder in a country like the Netherlands because there is zero innovation going on that builds wealth for the country. My father immigrated here with virtually $0 and a high school education. He started as a bus boy at a local restaurant. He eventually learned English, made it through community college and became a nurse. It was enough to send his children both to university. My brother started his own extremely successful business. I earned my PhD in engineering. My father's kids will likely retire with well over $1M in wealth, and our kids will be even better off than us. We have climbed the wealth ladder because of opportunities in the US and because the US rewards education and drive. I'm sorry there are unhappy Americans out there.m, but there are plenty of us out here in the US who have made it.

Two things. It's sort of telling that you think it was a huge thing to send children to university, when in most of Europe you wouldn't have had to save your entire life to educate your children. They'd be able to enter university and it would not have been a financial burden for the family.

And second, the Global Social Mobility index disagrees with you because it ranks the US as #27, behind most of Europe.

+1

https://reports.weforum.org/social-mobility-report-2020/social-mobility-rankings/

Denmark is #1. Netherlands is #6. USA all the way down at #27.

What’s interesting is that Northern Europe consistently wins on metrics provided by data but USA wins on rags-to-riches anecdotes. I’m not saying the USA is terrible. I think the USA beats Northern Europe on general diversity, entertainment, and certainly geographic diversity and better weather. It’s not all the abject poverty of the rundown neighborhoods of Detroit or impoverished Appalachia or Cancer Alley in Louisiana. But it’s not all McLean Virginia either. For every single rags-to-riches story of an immigrant coming with $10 and starting a business and selling products to defense contractors and living in a northern Virginia McMansion, there’s ten stories of families who never break out of the cycle of poverty, and 100 stories of just normal people who are attempting to climb the ladder but never quite make it there, but give up all their mental and physical health in their pursuit to do so.

It’s not JUST that the American Dream is hard, but that it is impossible for 99% by design. By definition only 1% can be in the 1%.

If that 1% shot is the most important thing to you, then by all means, of course you think America is the best. But does America’s collection of anecdotes translate to overall greater happiness, health, quality of life, and social mobility? The data states otherwise.

What a ridiculous comparison. As if it is fair to compare a country with 330+ million people to tiny countries like Denmark and the Netherlands 20-50x smaller populations. It's almost as if scaling out wealth and combating poverty is harder when you have 50x the size. Gee, who knew? Name another country in the world the size of the US that provides anywhere near the same level of median incomes per capita. I'll wait.

DP.. do you understand OP's question? It's not "do you believe the US is the best country in the world compared to the same size country".. it's a general question compared to *all* countries in the world.

In general, there are other countries where their people are healthier, safer and happier than the general population in the US.

Compared to all the developed countries in the world, only the US has a high rate of illiteracy, bankruptcy from medical bills, more gun deaths per capita.

That doesn't mean the US is complete trash. Of course not. You can have a good life in the US *if* you have enough money, and live in an affluent area with low crime.

But a lot of people in the US don't have enough money to cover everything.. from healthcare costs, housing, to education. That's why we have so many people with college debt, high number of medical bankruptcies. Heck, you are not even immune to school shootings even if you live in a nice suburban area.

We have friends in the UK. They *never ever* worry about school shootings. Here, it's always in the back of my mind. Today, my kids' school is going through a lockdown/shelter in place drill. I feel so sad for them that this is their reality compared to my friends' kids who never have to worry about sh1t like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Netherlands is probably the best country when you add everything together that I care about: political and social freedom, a functional economy, excellent urban planning, health (not just access to affordable healthcare but an actually healthy population), moderately regulated capitalism, an educated and multilingual population, and at least the younger generation is less racist.

I should also add - it is well known that Netherlands has a problem with very low incomes and high costs for housing/rent. If you don't make enough, you get govt subsidies to afford housing. What do you think the net result is? People just work part time or hardly at all, because there is zero motivation to work full time and be more productive since you'll be taxed more and lose subsidies for housing that results in no improvement in disposable income. When's the last time you've ever heard about any great new technological advances or business leadership come out of the Netherlands? I mean I guess if you are fine with coasting through a mediocre life with low salaries and no chance of social mobility in exchange for the govt providing all basic necessities, ok.

At least 90% of people in the US live "mediocre" lifestyles.

When was the last time the US made top 10 most happiest countries? Netherlands is always in the top 10.

Here are the top 10 countries and their score:

Finland- 7.821
Denmark- 7.636
Iceland- 7.557
Switzerland- 7.512
Netherlands- 7.415
Luxembourg- 7.404
Sweden- 7.384
Norway- 7.365
Israel- 7.364
New Zealand- 7.200


US #16 - behind Canada and the UK

What good is all the "advancements" when so many Americans are unhappy?

So your measurement for best country to live in is based on some subjective measure like 'happiness', lol. The US is far more innovative than the Netherlands and pretty much all of Europe. Look, if you want a mediocre lifestyle with extremely low incomes, high levels of taxation, high costs of living, no chance of ever climbing the wealth ladder, and having the govt take care of all basic necessities in life for you, that's fine - go move to Europe and the Netherlands. If you want much higher incomes, lower levels of taxation, lower costs of living and less safety nets from the govt in exchange for better opportunities to climb the wealth ladder, the stock with the US. Believe it or not, many of US would rather control our wealth than want the govt to do it. My wife makes $95k after her base salary her plus bonus for just being an administrative staff member. Tell me where in Europe she'd get that kind of salary. It doesn't exist and she'd be lucky to make 30k euros before taxes. I'm sure there are millions of Americans living medicore lives - the point is though that you are least have the opportunity to climb the ladder in the US while it is impossible to climb the ladder in a country like the Netherlands because there is zero innovation going on that builds wealth for the country. My father immigrated here with virtually $0 and a high school education. He started as a bus boy at a local restaurant. He eventually learned English, made it through community college and became a nurse. It was enough to send his children both to university. My brother started his own extremely successful business. I earned my PhD in engineering. My father's kids will likely retire with well over $1M in wealth, and our kids will be even better off than us. We have climbed the wealth ladder because of opportunities in the US and because the US rewards education and drive. I'm sorry there are unhappy Americans out there.m, but there are plenty of us out here in the US who have made it.

Two things. It's sort of telling that you think it was a huge thing to send children to university, when in most of Europe you wouldn't have had to save your entire life to educate your children. They'd be able to enter university and it would not have been a financial burden for the family.

And second, the Global Social Mobility index disagrees with you because it ranks the US as #27, behind most of Europe.

+1

https://reports.weforum.org/social-mobility-report-2020/social-mobility-rankings/

Denmark is #1. Netherlands is #6. USA all the way down at #27.

What’s interesting is that Northern Europe consistently wins on metrics provided by data but USA wins on rags-to-riches anecdotes. I’m not saying the USA is terrible. I think the USA beats Northern Europe on general diversity, entertainment, and certainly geographic diversity and better weather. It’s not all the abject poverty of the rundown neighborhoods of Detroit or impoverished Appalachia or Cancer Alley in Louisiana. But it’s not all McLean Virginia either. For every single rags-to-riches story of an immigrant coming with $10 and starting a business and selling products to defense contractors and living in a northern Virginia McMansion, there’s ten stories of families who never break out of the cycle of poverty, and 100 stories of just normal people who are attempting to climb the ladder but never quite make it there, but give up all their mental and physical health in their pursuit to do so.

It’s not JUST that the American Dream is hard, but that it is impossible for 99% by design. By definition only 1% can be in the 1%.

If that 1% shot is the most important thing to you, then by all means, of course you think America is the best. But does America’s collection of anecdotes translate to overall greater happiness, health, quality of life, and social mobility? The data states otherwise.

What a ridiculous comparison. As if it is fair to compare a country with 330+ million people to tiny countries like Denmark and the Netherlands 20-50x smaller populations. It's almost as if scaling out wealth and combating poverty is harder when you have 50x the size. Gee, who knew? Name another country in the world the size of the US that provides anywhere near the same level of median incomes per capita. I'll wait.

DP.. do you understand OP's question? It's not "do you believe the US is the best country in the world compared to the same size country".. it's a general question compared to *all* countries in the world.

In general, there are other countries where their people are healthier, safer and happier than the general population in the US.

Compared to all the developed countries in the world, only the US has a high rate of illiteracy, bankruptcy from medical bills, more gun deaths per capita.

That doesn't mean the US is complete trash. Of course not. You can have a good life in the US *if* you have enough money, and live in an affluent area with low crime.

But a lot of people in the US don't have enough money to cover everything.. from healthcare costs, housing, to education. That's why we have so many people with college debt, high number of medical bankruptcies. Heck, you are not even immune to school shootings even if you live in a nice suburban area.

We have friends in the UK. They *never ever* worry about school shootings. Here, it's always in the back of my mind. Today, my kids' school is going through a lockdown/shelter in place drill. I feel so sad for them that this is their reality compared to my friends' kids who never have to worry about sh1t like that.

I'm.glad you have friends in the UK who don't worry about shootings. Meanwhile, they're probably worried about jobs and being able to afford to live with double digit inflation and the British pound crashing. Holy Toledo, have you seen what's happened to the pound today?

Why is everyone fleeing the European continent for investment? The outlook over there is very bleak.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

The U.S. provides access to university education to a very broad range of the population. In countries where university is close to free, entrance requirements are set very high and huge swaths of the population are not eligible to attend university based on their performance in lower levels of education.

The U.S. university system is much friendlier to the late bloomer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

I see you are under the impression that America was the first country to develop a COVID vaccine?

It wasn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

Where is all the innovation?

Let's ask the Global Innovation Index, shall we?

1. Switzerland
2. Sweden
3. United States of America

https://www.globalinnovationindex.org/userfiles/file/reportpdf/GII-2021/GII_at_a_glance.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

I see you are under the impression that America was the first country to develop a COVID vaccine?

It wasn't.

Bullcrap. Please go ahead and claim it was Germany and BioNTech. That is complete revisionist history from Europeans. Newsflash: Americans did ALL of the heavy lifting for BioNTech. The fundamental scientific discoveries that even allowed mRNA technology to work are due to methyl pseudo uridine substitution into mRNA. All of those discoveries were conducted at the University of Wisconsin and the University of Pennsylvania. BioNTech had to license technology from UPenn to develop COVID vax. All BioNTech did was change out a sequence to target COVID. That is easy. The hard part was derisking the entire technology in the first place and discovering how to get the technology to work in cells in the first place. The latter was entirely funded by the US govt and was discovered at American institutions. If there are any Nobel Prizes, they will go to U Wisconsin and U Penn for the work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

Where is all the innovation?

Let's ask the Global Innovation Index, shall we?

1. Switzerland
2. Sweden
3. United States of America

https://www.globalinnovationindex.org/userfiles/file/reportpdf/GII-2021/GII_at_a_glance.pdf

What a joke. Now do patents, quantities of publications in top end journals, etc. Name 3 things from Switzeland and Sweden each that have had trillion dollar impacts on the global economy. The crappy index you cite doesn't even consider the actual quality of innovations being churned out and their overall economic impacts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

Where is all the innovation?

Let's ask the Global Innovation Index, shall we?

1. Switzerland
2. Sweden
3. United States of America

https://www.globalinnovationindex.org/userfiles/file/reportpdf/GII-2021/GII_at_a_glance.pdf

What a joke. Now do patents, quantities of publications in top end journals, etc. Name 3 things from Switzeland and Sweden each that have had trillion dollar impacts on the global economy. The crappy index you cite doesn't even consider the actual quality of innovations being churned out and their overall economic impacts.

I don't know what to tell you. You reject every piece of evidence that contradicts your position so it's not an honest argument.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Netherlands is probably the best country when you add everything together that I care about: political and social freedom, a functional economy, excellent urban planning, health (not just access to affordable healthcare but an actually healthy population), moderately regulated capitalism, an educated and multilingual population, and at least the younger generation is less racist.

I should also add - it is well known that Netherlands has a problem with very low incomes and high costs for housing/rent. If you don't make enough, you get govt subsidies to afford housing. What do you think the net result is? People just work part time or hardly at all, because there is zero motivation to work full time and be more productive since you'll be taxed more and lose subsidies for housing that results in no improvement in disposable income. When's the last time you've ever heard about any great new technological advances or business leadership come out of the Netherlands? I mean I guess if you are fine with coasting through a mediocre life with low salaries and no chance of social mobility in exchange for the govt providing all basic necessities, ok.

At least 90% of people in the US live "mediocre" lifestyles.

When was the last time the US made top 10 most happiest countries? Netherlands is always in the top 10.

Here are the top 10 countries and their score:

Finland- 7.821
Denmark- 7.636
Iceland- 7.557
Switzerland- 7.512
Netherlands- 7.415
Luxembourg- 7.404
Sweden- 7.384
Norway- 7.365
Israel- 7.364
New Zealand- 7.200


US #16 - behind Canada and the UK

What good is all the "advancements" when so many Americans are unhappy?

So your measurement for best country to live in is based on some subjective measure like 'happiness', lol. The US is far more innovative than the Netherlands and pretty much all of Europe. Look, if you want a mediocre lifestyle with extremely low incomes, high levels of taxation, high costs of living, no chance of ever climbing the wealth ladder, and having the govt take care of all basic necessities in life for you, that's fine - go move to Europe and the Netherlands. If you want much higher incomes, lower levels of taxation, lower costs of living and less safety nets from the govt in exchange for better opportunities to climb the wealth ladder, the stock with the US. Believe it or not, many of US would rather control our wealth than want the govt to do it. My wife makes $95k after her base salary her plus bonus for just being an administrative staff member. Tell me where in Europe she'd get that kind of salary. It doesn't exist and she'd be lucky to make 30k euros before taxes. I'm sure there are millions of Americans living medicore lives - the point is though that you are least have the opportunity to climb the ladder in the US while it is impossible to climb the ladder in a country like the Netherlands because there is zero innovation going on that builds wealth for the country. My father immigrated here with virtually $0 and a high school education. He started as a bus boy at a local restaurant. He eventually learned English, made it through community college and became a nurse. It was enough to send his children both to university. My brother started his own extremely successful business. I earned my PhD in engineering. My father's kids will likely retire with well over $1M in wealth, and our kids will be even better off than us. We have climbed the wealth ladder because of opportunities in the US and because the US rewards education and drive. I'm sorry there are unhappy Americans out there.m, but there are plenty of us out here in the US who have made it.

Two things. It's sort of telling that you think it was a huge thing to send children to university, when in most of Europe you wouldn't have had to save your entire life to educate your children. They'd be able to enter university and it would not have been a financial burden for the family.

And second, the Global Social Mobility index disagrees with you because it ranks the US as #27, behind most of Europe.

+1

https://reports.weforum.org/social-mobility-report-2020/social-mobility-rankings/

Denmark is #1. Netherlands is #6. USA all the way down at #27.

What’s interesting is that Northern Europe consistently wins on metrics provided by data but USA wins on rags-to-riches anecdotes. I’m not saying the USA is terrible. I think the USA beats Northern Europe on general diversity, entertainment, and certainly geographic diversity and better weather. It’s not all the abject poverty of the rundown neighborhoods of Detroit or impoverished Appalachia or Cancer Alley in Louisiana. But it’s not all McLean Virginia either. For every single rags-to-riches story of an immigrant coming with $10 and starting a business and selling products to defense contractors and living in a northern Virginia McMansion, there’s ten stories of families who never break out of the cycle of poverty, and 100 stories of just normal people who are attempting to climb the ladder but never quite make it there, but give up all their mental and physical health in their pursuit to do so.

It’s not JUST that the American Dream is hard, but that it is impossible for 99% by design. By definition only 1% can be in the 1%.

If that 1% shot is the most important thing to you, then by all means, of course you think America is the best. But does America’s collection of anecdotes translate to overall greater happiness, health, quality of life, and social mobility? The data states otherwise.

What a ridiculous comparison. As if it is fair to compare a country with 330+ million people to tiny countries like Denmark and the Netherlands 20-50x smaller populations. It's almost as if scaling out wealth and combating poverty is harder when you have 50x the size. Gee, who knew? Name another country in the world the size of the US that provides anywhere near the same level of median incomes per capita. I'll wait.

DP.. do you understand OP's question? It's not "do you believe the US is the best country in the world compared to the same size country".. it's a general question compared to *all* countries in the world.

In general, there are other countries where their people are healthier, safer and happier than the general population in the US.

Compared to all the developed countries in the world, only the US has a high rate of illiteracy, bankruptcy from medical bills, more gun deaths per capita.

That doesn't mean the US is complete trash. Of course not. You can have a good life in the US *if* you have enough money, and live in an affluent area with low crime.

But a lot of people in the US don't have enough money to cover everything.. from healthcare costs, housing, to education. That's why we have so many people with college debt, high number of medical bankruptcies. Heck, you are not even immune to school shootings even if you live in a nice suburban area.

We have friends in the UK. They *never ever* worry about school shootings. Here, it's always in the back of my mind. Today, my kids' school is going through a lockdown/shelter in place drill. I feel so sad for them that this is their reality compared to my friends' kids who never have to worry about sh1t like that.

I'm.glad you have friends in the UK who don't worry about shootings. Meanwhile, they're probably worried about jobs and being able to afford to live with double digit inflation and the British pound crashing. Holy Toledo, have you seen what's happened to the pound today?

Why is everyone fleeing the European continent for investment? The outlook over there is very bleak.

nope, they don't fret over jobs. They know they can still go see a doctor and get medical care if they lose their job. They also have council housing, if they need it, but none of them need it. They also have better mass transit options than we do, and many take the train/bus to work.

Ups/downs hit all countries. Have you seen our inflation rates? We also had huge spikes in gas prices. When we were in the UK over the summer, the cost of gas (petrol) there was not that much higher than in the US.

Is *everyone* fleeing the European continent for investment? I hadn't heard that. So, everyone in Europe is unemployed?

[Anonymous]

For whom exactly? Rich will do fine in almost every place, standard of living for those with $$$ is great in most of the 1st world and developing world given you can integrate well into the local culture and know the language. For poor most places suck, it's just a fact, nobody wants unskilled and uneducated people or people with health issues, old age, etc.

There are countries better for young people working remotely, those for the retirees, those for ambitions people willing to work hard and take risks for big rewards, those for people who are risk averse and want good QOL even if upward mobility is limited.

People prioritize different things, so it's a difficult question to answer.

What makes USA special is its vast territory with different climate zones, coasts, mountains, and different states with different politics, you can choose. You can live in different states and it may feel like different countries. If you are healthy and ambitious you can try your luck in places with a lot of opportunities and $$$ at the expense of some QOL. If you are elderly you may want to live in the cities with better access to free public services and better medical facilities. If you are into living off the grid and being self sufficient, you can do this in the USA and not be bothered by a lot of things, you can find a place with regulations that fit your lifestyle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

Where is all the innovation?

Let's ask the Global Innovation Index, shall we?

1. Switzerland
2. Sweden
3. United States of America

https://www.globalinnovationindex.org/userfiles/file/reportpdf/GII-2021/GII_at_a_glance.pdf

What a joke. Now do patents, quantities of publications in top end journals, etc. Name 3 things from Switzeland and Sweden each that have had trillion dollar impacts on the global economy. The crappy index you cite doesn't even consider the actual quality of innovations being churned out and their overall economic impacts.

I don't know what to tell you. You reject every piece of evidence that contradicts your position so it's not an honest argument.

Switzerland and Sweden are such innovative powerhouses that any person on the street could name 3 things off the top of their heads from those countries that have changed their lives.....not. Have you even looked at the methodology in the index? What a joke. Factors such as:


“Ease of Paying Taxes“, “Electricity Output“ (half-weightage) and “Ease of Protecting Minority Investors” are factors alongside “Ease of Getting Credit” and “Venture Capital Deals“

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the components of the social mobility index. It is very heavily weighted towards social safety net provisions. I see very few components on the list that would correspond with what most in the US would associate with opportunities to be socially mobile.

If the #1 predictor of social mobility is education, then free or lower cost university education has quite a bit to do with social mobility.

Again, if Europe has so much access to university education, then where is all the innovation out of countries like Denmark, Netherlands, etc. Where were they to invent vaccines that saved the planet from COVID? Once again, the technology used to save the world on its knees was fundamentally based on American technology and scientific discovery.

Where is all the innovation?

Let's ask the Global Innovation Index, shall we?

1. Switzerland
2. Sweden
3. United States of America

https://www.globalinnovationindex.org/userfiles/file/reportpdf/GII-2021/GII_at_a_glance.pdf

What a joke. Now do patents, quantities of publications in top end journals, etc. Name 3 things from Switzeland and Sweden each that have had trillion dollar impacts on the global economy. The crappy index you cite doesn't even consider the actual quality of innovations being churned out and their overall economic impacts.

DP.. the interesting thing about the number of patents is that a huge number of them were created by immigrants from all over. So, we agree, the US is the "best" because we have so many immigrants.

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Anonymous wrote:The Netherlands is probably the best country when you add everything together that I care about: political and social freedom, a functional economy, excellent urban planning, health (not just access to affordable healthcare but an actually healthy population), moderately regulated capitalism, an educated and multilingual population, and at least the younger generation is less racist.

I should also add - it is well known that Netherlands has a problem with very low incomes and high costs for housing/rent. If you don't make enough, you get govt subsidies to afford housing. What do you think the net result is? People just work part time or hardly at all, because there is zero motivation to work full time and be more productive since you'll be taxed more and lose subsidies for housing that results in no improvement in disposable income. When's the last time you've ever heard about any great new technological advances or business leadership come out of the Netherlands? I mean I guess if you are fine with coasting through a mediocre life with low salaries and no chance of social mobility in exchange for the govt providing all basic necessities, ok.

At least 90% of people in the US live "mediocre" lifestyles.

When was the last time the US made top 10 most happiest countries? Netherlands is always in the top 10.

Here are the top 10 countries and their score:

Finland- 7.821
Denmark- 7.636
Iceland- 7.557
Switzerland- 7.512
Netherlands- 7.415
Luxembourg- 7.404
Sweden- 7.384
Norway- 7.365
Israel- 7.364
New Zealand- 7.200


US #16 - behind Canada and the UK

What good is all the "advancements" when so many Americans are unhappy?

So your measurement for best country to live in is based on some subjective measure like 'happiness', lol. The US is far more innovative than the Netherlands and pretty much all of Europe. Look, if you want a mediocre lifestyle with extremely low incomes, high levels of taxation, high costs of living, no chance of ever climbing the wealth ladder, and having the govt take care of all basic necessities in life for you, that's fine - go move to Europe and the Netherlands. If you want much higher incomes, lower levels of taxation, lower costs of living and less safety nets from the govt in exchange for better opportunities to climb the wealth ladder, the stock with the US. Believe it or not, many of US would rather control our wealth than want the govt to do it. My wife makes $95k after her base salary her plus bonus for just being an administrative staff member. Tell me where in Europe she'd get that kind of salary. It doesn't exist and she'd be lucky to make 30k euros before taxes. I'm sure there are millions of Americans living medicore lives - the point is though that you are least have the opportunity to climb the ladder in the US while it is impossible to climb the ladder in a country like the Netherlands because there is zero innovation going on that builds wealth for the country. My father immigrated here with virtually $0 and a high school education. He started as a bus boy at a local restaurant. He eventually learned English, made it through community college and became a nurse. It was enough to send his children both to university. My brother started his own extremely successful business. I earned my PhD in engineering. My father's kids will likely retire with well over $1M in wealth, and our kids will be even better off than us. We have climbed the wealth ladder because of opportunities in the US and because the US rewards education and drive. I'm sorry there are unhappy Americans out there.m, but there are plenty of us out here in the US who have made it.

Two things. It's sort of telling that you think it was a huge thing to send children to university, when in most of Europe you wouldn't have had to save your entire life to educate your children. They'd be able to enter university and it would not have been a financial burden for the family.

And second, the Global Social Mobility index disagrees with you because it ranks the US as #27, behind most of Europe.

+1

https://reports.weforum.org/social-mobility-report-2020/social-mobility-rankings/

Denmark is #1. Netherlands is #6. USA all the way down at #27.

What’s interesting is that Northern Europe consistently wins on metrics provided by data but USA wins on rags-to-riches anecdotes. I’m not saying the USA is terrible. I think the USA beats Northern Europe on general diversity, entertainment, and certainly geographic diversity and better weather. It’s not all the abject poverty of the rundown neighborhoods of Detroit or impoverished Appalachia or Cancer Alley in Louisiana. But it’s not all McLean Virginia either. For every single rags-to-riches story of an immigrant coming with $10 and starting a business and selling products to defense contractors and living in a northern Virginia McMansion, there’s ten stories of families who never break out of the cycle of poverty, and 100 stories of just normal people who are attempting to climb the ladder but never quite make it there, but give up all their mental and physical health in their pursuit to do so.

It’s not JUST that the American Dream is hard, but that it is impossible for 99% by design. By definition only 1% can be in the 1%.

If that 1% shot is the most important thing to you, then by all means, of course you think America is the best. But does America’s collection of anecdotes translate to overall greater happiness, health, quality of life, and social mobility? The data states otherwise.

What a ridiculous comparison. As if it is fair to compare a country with 330+ million people to tiny countries like Denmark and the Netherlands 20-50x smaller populations. It's almost as if scaling out wealth and combating poverty is harder when you have 50x the size. Gee, who knew? Name another country in the world the size of the US that provides anywhere near the same level of median incomes per capita. I'll wait.

DP.. do you understand OP's question? It's not "do you believe the US is the best country in the world compared to the same size country".. it's a general question compared to *all* countries in the world.

In general, there are other countries where their people are healthier, safer and happier than the general population in the US.

Compared to all the developed countries in the world, only the US has a high rate of illiteracy, bankruptcy from medical bills, more gun deaths per capita.

That doesn't mean the US is complete trash. Of course not. You can have a good life in the US *if* you have enough money, and live in an affluent area with low crime.

But a lot of people in the US don't have enough money to cover everything.. from healthcare costs, housing, to education. That's why we have so many people with college debt, high number of medical bankruptcies. Heck, you are not even immune to school shootings even if you live in a nice suburban area.

We have friends in the UK. They *never ever* worry about school shootings. Here, it's always in the back of my mind. Today, my kids' school is going through a lockdown/shelter in place drill. I feel so sad for them that this is their reality compared to my friends' kids who never have to worry about sh1t like that.

I'm.glad you have friends in the UK who don't worry about shootings. Meanwhile, they're probably worried about jobs and being able to afford to live with double digit inflation and the British pound crashing. Holy Toledo, have you seen what's happened to the pound today?

Why is everyone fleeing the European continent for investment? The outlook over there is very bleak.

nope, they don't fret over jobs. They know they can still go see a doctor and get medical care if they lose their job. They also have council housing, if they need it, but none of them need it. They also have better mass transit options than we do, and many take the train/bus to work.

Ups/downs hit all countries. Have you seen our inflation rates? We also had huge spikes in gas prices. When we were in the UK over the summer, the cost of gas (petrol) there was not that much higher than in the US.

Is *everyone* fleeing the European continent for investment? I hadn't heard that. So, everyone in Europe is unemployed?

Yes, pretty much anyone of importance is. Yes, pretty soon everyone in Europe will be unemployed. Everyone is fleeing to the US for safety and stability. Europe is currently in a world of economic trouble. Kiss all of those social mobility programs good bye.