Anonymous wrote:Where's that poster that said UK would be fine. Look at the UK now..it is collapsing. Currency is falling to the weakest ever. To save their money, the BoE may have to massively jack up rates. It will lead to a depression in England. Meanwhile, Italy elected a far right govt.for the first time since like WW2. The euro is tanking.
You scoffed at the notion that Europe was on fire. Look at it now. It's economically imploding. Let's go see how many progressives want to move to Europe now with currencies collapsing and being worth toilet paper at this rate and the rise of the right on the continent. Let's see how many social.bemefits they're able to handout after their money collapses or their economies get pushed to a depression in order to save their currencies from collapse.
Everyone always takes for granted just how stable the US economy and banking system is for the most part. Look at the rest of the world now. They're flooding into the US with their money because they want safe haven from the mess everywhere else in the world.
I like Europe myself, not their politics so much, but some lifestyle and cultural elements.
But the US has survived in a stable way so many European cycles of insanity, anyone who idolizes Europe isn't looking very far back.
Anonymous wrote:Where's that poster that said UK would be fine. Look at the UK now..it is collapsing. Currency is falling to the weakest ever. To save their money, the BoE may have to massively jack up rates. It will lead to a depression in England. Meanwhile, Italy elected a far right govt.for the first time since like WW2. The euro is tanking.
You scoffed at the notion that Europe was on fire. Look at it now. It's economically imploding. Let's go see how many progressives want to move to Europe now with currencies collapsing and being worth toilet paper at this rate and the rise of the right on the continent. Let's see how many social.bemefits they're able to handout after their money collapses or their economies get pushed to a depression in order to save their currencies from collapse.
Everyone always takes for granted just how stable the US economy and banking system is for the most part. Look at the rest of the world now. They're flooding into the US with their money because they want safe haven from the mess everywhere else in the world.
I like Europe myself, not their politics so much, but some lifestyle and cultural elements.
But the US has survived in a stable way so many European cycles of insanity, anyone who idolizes Europe isn't looking very far back.
You say this but it's not like America isn't getting worse, too. Roe & Wade decision has altered the American landscape for the worse. There is a right wing brand of American crazy that's poisoning the country.
Anonymous wrote:Homes here are built from sticks and cardboard. You can definitely own a house in the middle of nowhere with no good schools or employment opportunities. Or normal healthcare and hospitals nearby.
Even if you can't afford a home, you can still afford to rent a small apartment in a decent area, which may be magnitudes above anything that poor migrants have to contend with in their countries.
Anonymous wrote:Where's that poster that said UK would be fine. Look at the UK now..it is collapsing. Currency is falling to the weakest ever. To save their money, the BoE may have to massively jack up rates. It will lead to a depression in England. Meanwhile, Italy elected a far right govt.for the first time since like WW2. The euro is tanking.
You scoffed at the notion that Europe was on fire. Look at it now. It's economically imploding. Let's go see how many progressives want to move to Europe now with currencies collapsing and being worth toilet paper at this rate and the rise of the right on the continent. Let's see how many social.bemefits they're able to handout after their money collapses or their economies get pushed to a depression in order to save their currencies from collapse.
Everyone always takes for granted just how stable the US economy and banking system is for the most part. Look at the rest of the world now. They're flooding into the US with their money because they want safe haven from the mess everywhere else in the world.
I like Europe myself, not their politics so much, but some lifestyle and cultural elements.
But the US has survived in a stable way so many European cycles of insanity, anyone who idolizes Europe isn't looking very far back.
You say this but it's not like America isn't getting worse, too. Roe & Wade decision has altered the American landscape for the worse. There is a right wing brand of American crazy that's poisoning the country.
Radicalism on both sides is what's poisoning the country.
Anonymous wrote:For a professional couple (empty nesters) living in the midwest, we have it very very good. We are spoiled with space, among other things in this country.
I often wonder why Americans don't just try other cities or states before leaving the U.S.
Anonymous wrote:For a professional couple (empty nesters) living in the midwest, we have it very very good. We are spoiled with space, among other things in this country.
I often wonder why Americans don't just try other cities or states before leaving the U.S.
Most people who leave do so because of the issues that impact the whole country, not just their state or region.
Gun violence
Healthcare
College costs
Lots of retirees leave the US because they want to live in a nice place with nice weather and afford good healthcare, but can't afford any of that here.
I have a friend who moved their entire family to Portugal. Their kids are enrolled in private school there.
Anonymous wrote:I have lived in several countries on various continents and my parents come from two vastly different countries. When they met, they had no common language, religion or culture.
So please believe me when I say that there is no "best" country.
Each country is good at something. Right now I live in the US on a visa. It's great for healthy young people who want professional opportunities. Not so great if you're poor and have to live in violent, gun-filled neighborhoods, with exorbitant medical care and intermittent access to clean water or internet. Other countries all have their advantages and disadvantages.
But if you're talking about what matters to global stability today, then I can think of two concepts:
1. Climate change - the USA is one of the worst offenders. This needs to change. Poor countries are dying now because of climate events, heat waves, drought and rising seas.
2. Democracy and spreading it around the world. Interestingly, even as democratic institutions are threatened domestically, the USA is still the defender of democracy abroad, confronting China and Russia, among others. That is something we need to sustain, with the help of our allies.
Very well said - we have lived on six continents and agree that there is no best country. As you said, every country has positives and negatives. It all depends on what people are looking for and value.
Anonymous wrote:The Netherlands is probably the best country when you add everything together that I care about: political and social freedom, a functional economy, excellent urban planning, health (not just access to affordable healthcare but an actually healthy population), moderately regulated capitalism, an educated and multilingual population, and at least the younger generation is less racist.
I should also add - it is well known that Netherlands has a problem with very low incomes and high costs for housing/rent. If you don't make enough, you get govt subsidies to afford housing. What do you think the net result is? People just work part time or hardly at all, because there is zero motivation to work full time and be more productive since you'll be taxed more and lose subsidies for housing that results in no improvement in disposable income. When's the last time you've ever heard about any great new technological advances or business leadership come out of the Netherlands? I mean I guess if you are fine with coasting through a mediocre life with low salaries and no chance of social mobility in exchange for the govt providing all basic necessities, ok.
At least 90% of people in the US live "mediocre" lifestyles.
When was the last time the US made top 10 most happiest countries? Netherlands is always in the top 10.
What good is all the "advancements" when so many Americans are unhappy?
So your measurement for best country to live in is based on some subjective measure like 'happiness', lol. The US is far more innovative than the Netherlands and pretty much all of Europe. Look, if you want a mediocre lifestyle with extremely low incomes, high levels of taxation, high costs of living, no chance of ever climbing the wealth ladder, and having the govt take care of all basic necessities in life for you, that's fine - go move to Europe and the Netherlands. If you want much higher incomes, lower levels of taxation, lower costs of living and less safety nets from the govt in exchange for better opportunities to climb the wealth ladder, the stock with the US. Believe it or not, many of US would rather control our wealth than want the govt to do it. My wife makes $95k after her base salary her plus bonus for just being an administrative staff member. Tell me where in Europe she'd get that kind of salary. It doesn't exist and she'd be lucky to make 30k euros before taxes. I'm sure there are millions of Americans living medicore lives - the point is though that you are least have the opportunity to climb the ladder in the US while it is impossible to climb the ladder in a country like the Netherlands because there is zero innovation going on that builds wealth for the country. My father immigrated here with virtually $0 and a high school education. He started as a bus boy at a local restaurant. He eventually learned English, made it through community college and became a nurse. It was enough to send his children both to university. My brother started his own extremely successful business. I earned my PhD in engineering. My father's kids will likely retire with well over $1M in wealth, and our kids will be even better off than us. We have climbed the wealth ladder because of opportunities in the US and because the US rewards education and drive. I'm sorry there are unhappy Americans out there.m, but there are plenty of us out here in the US who have made it.
Two things. It's sort of telling that you think it was a huge thing to send children to university, when in most of Europe you wouldn't have had to save your entire life to educate your children. They'd be able to enter university and it would not have been a financial burden for the family.
And second, the Global Social Mobility index disagrees with you because it ranks the US as #27, behind most of Europe.
Denmark is #1. Netherlands is #6. USA all the way down at #27.
What’s interesting is that Northern Europe consistently wins on metrics provided by data but USA wins on rags-to-riches anecdotes. I’m not saying the USA is terrible. I think the USA beats Northern Europe on general diversity, entertainment, and certainly geographic diversity and better weather. It’s not all the abject poverty of the rundown neighborhoods of Detroit or impoverished Appalachia or Cancer Alley in Louisiana. But it’s not all McLean Virginia either. For every single rags-to-riches story of an immigrant coming with $10 and starting a business and selling products to defense contractors and living in a northern Virginia McMansion, there’s ten stories of families who never break out of the cycle of poverty, and 100 stories of just normal people who are attempting to climb the ladder but never quite make it there, but give up all their mental and physical health in their pursuit to do so.
It’s not JUST that the American Dream is hard, but that it is impossible for 99% by design. By definition only 1% can be in the 1%.
If that 1% shot is the most important thing to you, then by all means, of course you think America is the best. But does America’s collection of anecdotes translate to overall greater happiness, health, quality of life, and social mobility? The data states otherwise.
What a ridiculous comparison. As if it is fair to compare a country with 330+ million people to tiny countries like Denmark and the Netherlands 20-50x smaller populations. It's almost as if scaling out wealth and combating poverty is harder when you have 50x the size. Gee, who knew? Name another country in the world the size of the US that provides anywhere near the same level of median incomes per capita. I'll wait.
DP.. do you understand OP's question? It's not "do you believe the US is the best country in the world compared to the same size country".. it's a general question compared to *all* countries in the world.
In general, there are other countries where their people are healthier, safer and happier than the general population in the US.
Compared to all the developed countries in the world, only the US has a high rate of illiteracy, bankruptcy from medical bills, more gun deaths per capita.
That doesn't mean the US is complete trash. Of course not. You can have a good life in the US *if* you have enough money, and live in an affluent area with low crime.
But a lot of people in the US don't have enough money to cover everything.. from healthcare costs, housing, to education. That's why we have so many people with college debt, high number of medical bankruptcies. Heck, you are not even immune to school shootings even if you live in a nice suburban area.
We have friends in the UK. They *never ever* worry about school shootings. Here, it's always in the back of my mind. Today, my kids' school is going through a lockdown/shelter in place drill. I feel so sad for them that this is their reality compared to my friends' kids who never have to worry about sh1t like that.
I'm.glad you have friends in the UK who don't worry about shootings. Meanwhile, they're probably worried about jobs and being able to afford to live with double digit inflation and the British pound crashing. Holy Toledo, have you seen what's happened to the pound today?
Why is everyone fleeing the European continent for investment? The outlook over there is very bleak.
nope, they don't fret over jobs. They know they can still go see a doctor and get medical care if they lose their job. They also have council housing, if they need it, but none of them need it. They also have better mass transit options than we do, and many take the train/bus to work.
Ups/downs hit all countries. Have you seen our inflation rates? We also had huge spikes in gas prices. When we were in the UK over the summer, the cost of gas (petrol) there was not that much higher than in the US.
Is *everyone* fleeing the European continent for investment? I hadn't heard that. So, everyone in Europe is unemployed?
Yeah, tell that to my UK relatives. LOL. They don't worry about any of that. They have free medical care, regardless of job, just to name one. Also better infrastructure (as PP notes). Many don't need cars if they don't want them.
There is a lot more density in Europe and better transit options overall. We have a pretty robust public transit in high density places too, NYC, for example. You can go anywhere via subway, bus, train, including trips to the countryside, botanical gardens, and city beaches. But the world outside isn't so friendly for those without cars...` I used to live in DC, NYC, SF without a car just fine. But it does limit you a lot if you want to go outside of your urban cluster.
I don't know how good socialized medicine is in every country that uses it. I would expect there are limitations and it's more like HMO if you want free care, long waits for specialists, jumping through hoops to get imaging exams like MRIs, CT scans, advanced blood work. I heard that some people buy private insurance in addition to free healthcare to customize their treatments and have better access, better facilities, top specialists, etc.
The ENTIRE land area of the whole European Union is only *half* that of the US. People do not realize how friggin big the US really is. The US was also never devastated by war. Europe had the luxury of being able to build from scratch, in a much smaller land area, with much more population density. That's why public transport is viable in Europe. They have a smaller land area and population density to support it and were able to do it with a clean slate of land that was available when modern 20th century technology was available. You can't just force millions of people in the US off their land in order to build infrastructure for public transit. We are not communist like China. The only way we can do that is if our country were bombed to rubble during a war. It's really tiresome listen to Europeans brag about their public transit and Americans whining that we need similar types of transport when the US is much bigger, our lands our far less densely populated, and making an economically viable public transport system compared to Europe is a lot harder. The US is really, really friggin' big. I drove 13 hours from the Eastern Seaboard to the Mid-West and was no where near even half-way across the country. In Europe, if you drove 13 hours, you could cover nearly the entire country of most EU countries.
Really? Asked any Native Americans their opinion on that?
Anonymous wrote:For a professional couple (empty nesters) living in the midwest, we have it very very good. We are spoiled with space, among other things in this country.
I often wonder why Americans don't just try other cities or states before leaving the U.S.
Because that doesn't change some of the factors like cost of healthcare.
Australia is better than the U.S. on balance. Nicer people, better healthcare, cleaner cities, much less dangerous, fewer religious zealots, more laid-back, better retirement system, no recession in 2008, cheaper higher education, better weather.
I don't think people realize that there are a bee very influential people who control US politics. In a Democracy, it's possible for this to happen. Define Democracy because it's not like we have free choice over many things. This idea that people are still electing those who run our country is naive and I'm not talking about fair elections. There's money that buys how things go. Don't fool yourselves thinking that just because there is more freedom to express yourself in the US that it means we are all on the same terms. Money in the US works like anywhere else in the world. You need more to influence here but it buys you the same power abs influence as it does in those countries you all think are corrupt. It looks cleaner here but white collar crime as they say is just as bad if not worse than street.
I'm not suggesting the US is a corrupt society on the whole but at the very highest levels of government we live like everyone else - money buys you power.
Anonymous wrote:This thread just makes me think of the great opening scene from Aaron Sorkin's "Newsroom" series.
The best part starts around 1:04. Jeff Daniels is amazing.
Clap CLap Clap! Need to see this series. Is this series as good as this clip?
Yes. It's Aaron Sorkin (author of "A Few Good Men" and "The West Wing" among others). So the writing is good and the cast is good. We enjoyed this quite a lot.
BoE announced they're going to buy bonds. Pure insanity. This is after tax cuts and stimulus. I guess they've given up the fight and will eat 20% inflation. The pound may collapse to $.50. The UK is gonna turn into a destitute wasteland that will need another IMF bailout.
Feel really bad for British people. Their life savings are about to be worthless.
The grass is always greener until you move there and then the country is driven into the ground and their currency collapses.
BoE announced they're going to buy bonds. Pure insanity. This is after tax cuts and stimulus. I guess they've given up the fight and will eat 20% inflation. The pound may collapse to $.50. The UK is gonna turn into a destitute wasteland that will need another IMF bailout.
Feel really bad for British people. Their life savings are about to be worthless.
The grass is always greener until you move there and then the country is driven into the ground and their currency collapses.
Hmm I wonder if they had remained in the EU if they would be in such dire straits?
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