GuHetero women should stay out of gay spaces?

[Anonymous]

I can’t stop thinking about this Twitter thread. The OP claims straight women shouldn’t invade gay safe spaces like gay bars.

Many people responded that women should have their own spaces to be safe, instead of using gay-friendly establishments. I can’t help but think this is the exact same argument women make about keeping women’s restrooms and dressing rooms safe by keeping them for biological women use only.

Why does it seem like gay people get to use the same argument biological women are excoriated for?

[Anonymous]

TITLE: “GuHetero” is a typo; it should just be “Hetero.”

[Anonymous]

1. Trans women ARE women.
2. When there are more bachelorette party attendees than gay men at a gay bar, my sympathy is with the gay men.

[Anonymous]

False equivalency. Gay bars become gay bars because of the clientele they attract - you can’t “make” a space inaccessible to people based on their sexual orientation. Women and girls - historically and currently under threat by biological males in cases of childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence (to say nothing of systemic sexism) - seek to have places and situations where they are most vulnerable to be free from biological males. I think that is a reasonable expectation.

[Anonymous]

Probably the grooms feel safer with their bride to be in a gay space

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:False equivalency. Gay bars become gay bars because of the clientele they attract - you can’t “make” a space inaccessible to people based on their sexual orientation. Women and girls - historically and currently under threat by biological males in cases of childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence (to say nothing of systemic sexism) - seek to have places and situations where they are most vulnerable to be free from biological males. I think that is a reasonable expectation.

But they shouldn’t take over another group’s safe space.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:False equivalency. Gay bars become gay bars because of the clientele they attract - you can’t “make” a space inaccessible to people based on their sexual orientation. Women and girls - historically and currently under threat by biological males in cases of childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence (to say nothing of systemic sexism) - seek to have places and situations where they are most vulnerable to be free from biological males. I think that is a reasonable expectation.

I agree completely. Shouldn’t this apply to women’s bathrooms and dressing rooms?

My main question is why the double standard? Why can gays have protected safe spaces, but biological women cannot?

[OP]

[Anonymous]

I'm a heterosexual woman and I agree with the Twitter thread. I do think it depends on the place a little bit. Some gay dance clubs, for instance, welcome groups of heterosexual women, including bachelorettes, because the vibe is to just have fun on the dance floor and enjoy yourself. Others are really meant to be a welcoming space for LGBTQ+ people, and to give them a place where they can meet one another and hook up, and a bachelorette is really out of place in that setting.

It also depends on how the heterosexual women behave, though. Many bachelorette parties are absolutely obnoxious. Don't go to a gay club and expect everyone there to devote their evening to celebrating "the bride". But I've been to bachelorette parties where we went to drag shows at gay bars and had a great time because we were there to enjoy the show and had fun with it, not to make ourselves the center of everything.

I think there's a huge difference between a public bathroom (which is a place to go to the bathroom, wash your hands, and maybe check yourself in the mirror) and a bar or club. No one is arguing that heterosexual women are predators who make gay spaces less safe. They aren't being demonized. What people are saying is that it sucks to create a space specifically to be yourself and meet others like you, and then have another group come in and claim it for themselves. There's really no analogy to the attack on trans women in restrooms at all. The twitter thread is saying "this is annoying and kind of killing my fun time." Whereas the argument about trans women in bathrooms is "this person is a threat to me and I hate them." Very different vibe.

[Anonymous]

In case my OP is too muddled…

THIS tweet, in particular, struck me. Why do biological women get excoriated for saying the exact same thing??

[OP]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Then keep the "t's" out of women's safe spaces....

I agree with you and with the man who wrote the Tweet.

Cishet bachelorette parties at a gay bar just feels like other-tourism. Go to a drag show or something if you don't want a ton of straight guys around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In case my OP is too muddled…

THIS tweet, in particular, struck me. Why do biological women get excoriated for saying the exact same thing??

[OP]

Trans women are not a threat to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In case my OP is too muddled…

THIS tweet, in particular, struck me. Why do biological women get excoriated for saying the exact same thing??

[OP]

Trans women are not a threat to you.

Biological women aren't a threat to anyone in a gay bar. 🤷🏽‍♀️🤷🏽‍♀️

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Trans women are not a threat to you.

Biological straight women aren't a threat to anyone in a gay bar. 🤷🏽‍♀️🤷🏽‍♀️

[Anonymous]

We need to lay to rest the bachelorette/bachelor parties. They are dumb and harassing in every location.

Gender reveals are next.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:False equivalency. Gay bars become gay bars because of the clientele they attract - you can’t “make” a space inaccessible to people based on their sexual orientation. Women and girls - historically and currently under threat by biological males in cases of childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence (to say nothing of systemic sexism) - seek to have places and situations where they are most vulnerable to be free from biological males. I think that is a reasonable expectation.

Historically gays have been prosecuted, arrested(with lose of employment to follow), beaten, sexual violence, rape, discriminated against, etc and it stills goes on today. If some gays want a place safe from straights you should respect their rights. You should also not bring a bachelorette party to a gay bar to look at the “gays”. I find it troubling that you seem to say only women experience this and are dismissive of other groups experiences because they are not women.