Taylor Swift is awful (and her music isn't even very good)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s such a sad reach to say “All Too Well” is cribbed off of “one”
They are songs and that’s where the similarity ends.
Almost as embarrassing as comparing “Graceland” to “blank space”
I don’t know what is going on with this thread, but everyone needs to stick to their day jobs.

LOL seriously. I like both these songs, but they're both written in English and the similarity ends there.

The PP started with the conclusion that TS song X is inferior to non-TS song Y and then tried to fit supporting facts into it. It is a juvenile way to argue and also ineffective in engendering trust and willing people over.

I am a semi-fan but will always love the anthems “Shake it Off” (self-esteem especially for teenagers) and “The Man” (self-esteem especially for women and minorities). The lyrics may be puerile but I do not care. I love the messages and that they are accessible for the current generation and I hope they will stick around for future generations.

I’m PP, I assure you as soon as I saw the lyrics of “All Too Well” it immediately reminded me of “One.” I recognize that the words are not the same, at least not all of them, but for me, conceptually, it is the same song. I am not trying to fit supporting facts to fit an argument to prove a point. It’s what I see, a very strong similarity between the songs. I’m not the only one who sees it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:today i learned that taylor lives rent free in the minds of a lot of dcum posters. i will never understand why someone would spend so much time trashing another person’s taste in music.
music is so personal to people, why do you care what someone else loves?

I’m here because I enjoy a good debate about something completely irrelevant. It’s fun and bonus points for all the Swifties with their panties in a twist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The two extremes are weird. She’s not the best lyricist, not compared to some of my faves like Joni Mitchell, Lucinda Williams, and Stevie Nicks. but she is very clever and writes easily understood yet pretty lyrics that conjure up specific feelings and imagery. Not everyone does that. Regina Spektor is incredible but sometimes you need an a clinical exegesis to understand what she’s talking about. It’s worthwhile to make beautiful and resonating art that isn’t challenging to consume.

It’s funny that Paul Simon was brought up because I was listening to Graceland the other day and thought this line reminded me of something Taylor Swift would write:

And I see losing love
Is like a window in your heart
Well, everybody sees you're blown apart
Everybody feels the wind blow

Dead simple, but beautiful, and the imagery is so evocative and relatable.

That verse came to me, too. Except, Taylor wouldn’t write that. She”d write something more like:

“You dropped my hand,
Like a shattered glass,
And now everyone knows how I feel inside,
Oh, oh, oh, I’m so exposed and broken,
I’m chilled to the core,
And the-eeey all know.”

I can’t understand how people don’t see the mediocrity of her lyrics. But then I suppose, I must be a gaslighting abuser to question her lyric writing abilities.

Hmm, I doubt you’ve listened to many Taylor Swift songs. She has plenty of purely metaphorical lines that aren’t at all what you describe.

I’ve literally looked at every single song PPs have said has great lines. And I strongly stand by my interpretation of her lyrics.

I keep asking posters to provide examples and all I get is crap like: ” darling, I’m a nightmare dressed up as a daydream.” Which I’ve already pointed out is cheesy play on “wolf in sheep’s clothing.”

Where are these metaphorical lyrics? Please do share!

But please do share

You kept me like a secret and I kept you like an oath.

You call me up again just to break me like a promise
So casually cruel in the name of being honest

I’d like to be my old self but I am still trying to find it.

Also, listen to the lyrics of Champagne Problems or Only The Young. Beautiful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. Because I was in the car with DD today, I listened to “invisible string”… and thought of this thread.

My dd is a megafan. I’m very familiar with her music, but not all, I’m a normal-level fan. I can see the successes and the justified criticism.

I thought invisible string had good lyrics. Now to look up if she wrote it alone…
“Time, curious time
Gave me no compasses, gave me no signs
Were there clues I didn't see?
And isn't it just so pretty to think
All along there was some
Invisible string
Tying you to me?”

beautiful song! aaron dessner of the national has a songwriting credit on invisible string.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s such a sad reach to say “All Too Well” is cribbed off of “one”
They are songs and that’s where the similarity ends.
Almost as embarrassing as comparing “Graceland” to “blank space”
I don’t know what is going on with this thread, but everyone needs to stick to their day jobs.

LOL seriously. I like both these songs, but they're both written in English and the similarity ends there.

The PP started with the conclusion that TS song X is inferior to non-TS song Y and then tried to fit supporting facts into it. It is a juvenile way to argue and also ineffective in engendering trust and willing people over.

I am a semi-fan but will always love the anthems “Shake it Off” (self-esteem especially for teenagers) and “The Man” (self-esteem especially for women and minorities). The lyrics may be puerile but I do not care. I love the messages and that they are accessible for the current generation and I hope they will stick around for future generations.

I’m PP, I assure you as soon as I saw the lyrics of “All Too Well” it immediately reminded me of “One.” I recognize that the words are not the same, at least not all of them, but for me, conceptually, it is the same song. I am not trying to fit supporting facts to fit an argument to prove a point. It’s what I see, a very strong similarity between the songs. I’m not the only one who sees it.

I’m a U2 fan. “one” is a song about reunification. Specifically in regards to Germany. But sure…. “All too well” , a song about dysfunctional and not fully requited young love also makes me think … about … the Berlin Wall.
Samsies!!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The two extremes are weird. She’s not the best lyricist, not compared to some of my faves like Joni Mitchell, Lucinda Williams, and Stevie Nicks. but she is very clever and writes easily understood yet pretty lyrics that conjure up specific feelings and imagery. Not everyone does that. Regina Spektor is incredible but sometimes you need an a clinical exegesis to understand what she’s talking about. It’s worthwhile to make beautiful and resonating art that isn’t challenging to consume.

It’s funny that Paul Simon was brought up because I was listening to Graceland the other day and thought this line reminded me of something Taylor Swift would write:

And I see losing love
Is like a window in your heart
Well, everybody sees you're blown apart
Everybody feels the wind blow

Dead simple, but beautiful, and the imagery is so evocative and relatable.

That verse came to me, too. Except, Taylor wouldn’t write that. She”d write something more like:

“You dropped my hand,
Like a shattered glass,
And now everyone knows how I feel inside,
Oh, oh, oh, I’m so exposed and broken,
I’m chilled to the core,
And the-eeey all know.”

I can’t understand how people don’t see the mediocrity of her lyrics. But then I suppose, I must be a gaslighting abuser to question her lyric writing abilities.

Hmm, I doubt you’ve listened to many Taylor Swift songs. She has plenty of purely metaphorical lines that aren’t at all what you describe.

I’ve literally looked at every single song PPs have said has great lines. And I strongly stand by my interpretation of her lyrics.

I keep asking posters to provide examples and all I get is crap like: ” darling, I’m a nightmare dressed up as a daydream.” Which I’ve already pointed out is cheesy play on “wolf in sheep’s clothing.”

Where are these metaphorical lyrics? Please do share!

But please do share

Okay, here’s a few examples that comes to mind immediately

While you were out building other worlds, where was I?
Where's that man who'd throw blankets over my barbed wire?
I made you my temple, my mural, my sky
Now I'm begging for footnotes in the story of your life
Drawing hearts in the byline
Always taking up too much space or time

——

Spider-boy, king of thieves
Weave your little webs of opacity
My pennies made your crown
Trick me once, trick me twice
Don't you know that cash ain't the only price?
It's coming back around
And I keep my side of the street clean
You wouldn't know what I mean

—

It rains when you’re here and it rains when you’re gone

—

You call me up again just to break me like a promise, so casually cruel in the name of being honest

—

Long were the nights when my days once revolved around you
Counting my footsteps
Praying the floor won’t fall through, again

—

Fighting with a true love is boxing with no gloves, chemistry 'til it blows up, 'til there's no us

I don’t see what you see. To me all of those lyrics are derivative. I can immediately recall the other specific lyrics they remind me of. It’s not plagiarism per se, but they are reductive, nothing new or interesting to me, and I prefer the original much better. I would go line by line and describe what’s derivative about all of them, but the last time I did, I was accused of being a gaslighting abuser. But if you’re interested, I suggest you look into U2’s music. So many of Taylor’s lines are “inspired” directly by Bono.

I don't think anyone ever said--I certainly didn't--that Taylor Swift's lyrics are groundbreaking or unique? Just that they accomplish something (being easy to understand, sound pretty, and are evocative and relatable) as well as better than your made up "lyrics" that you ascribe to Taylor. I've heard like, three U2 songs in my life (not memorable, most just sounds like scatting to me) so I don't notice or care that she seems to be influenced by Bono.

I’m not huge U2 fan, either, but if you were familiar with their music, you would see that Taylor copies their lyrics. If you’d like to see an example of this go and check out “One.”

NP, and I am a huge U2 fan. Maybe I’ve just not listened to enough of Taylor music, but can you point to the lyrics that are very similar? I am very familiar With the song one but I can’t think of what lyrics of Taylor you’re referring to that sound like that?

Maybe I’ve just not listened to enough of Taylor’s music, so not disagreeing with you just curious if you have time to refer me to the lyrics.

I’m not a huge connoisseur of Taylor’s music either. That’s why I asked people to give me examples of her good lyrics. This is from earlier in the thread, where I first noticed the similarities to U2.

From “All Too Well”

And maybe we got lost in translation
Maybe I asked for too much
But maybe this thing was a masterpiece 'til you tore it all up
Running scared, I was there
I remember it all too well
And you call me up again just to break me like a promise
So casually cruel in the name of being honest
I'm a crumpled up piece of paper lying here
'Cause I remember it all, all, all too well

It’s not plagiarism, but it’s so similar and derivative to the lyrics of “One,” only much worse.

I love U2 and I love Taylor. I don’t see a similarity, sorry. Other than both artists going through a break up - one a romantic relationship, the other one, the band - and writing about that experience. We are allowed to draw from our commonly shared experiences, aren’t we? That doesn’t make us copy cats, it makes us human.

[Anonymous]

some of my favorite lyrics. None are songs casual listeners are likely to know. There’s a lot more to swift then shake it off.
from ivy:
oh god da**
my pain fits in the palm of your freezing hand
but it’s been promised to another
oh i can’t
stop you putting roots in my dreamland
my house of stone
your ivy grows
and now i’m covered in you

from evermore:
hey december
guess i’m feeling unmoored
can’t remember what i used to fight for
i rewind the tape but all it does is pause
on the very moment all was lost
sending signals to be double crossed

bigger than the whole sky:
no words appear before me in the aftermath
salt streams out my eyes and into my ears
every single thing i touch becomes sick with sadness
because it’s all over now
all out to sea
goodbye goodbye goodbye
you were bigger than the whole sky
you were more than just a short time
and i’ve got a lot to pine about
i’ve got a lot to live without
i’m never gonna meet
what could’ve been would’ve been what should been
you


I could keep going with songs like happiness, tolerate it, my tears ricochet

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't get comparing One and All Too Well.

Two totally different perspectives. Bono was a grown man with years of a long marriage to a woman he fell in love with at age 15, and mother of his four children. I'm not saying the song is about her, but to me, it's at least written from a perspective of someone who has experienced love in that kind of relationship, where you've seen each other at your absolute worst, you have years of resentment, you blame each other, even in deep love. That's an element of any decades long relationship that has gone on between adults, even in the happiest and most loving marriages. The for better or for worse, in sickness and in health parts.

Taylor was young when she wrote All Too Well, she has a lyric about her 21st birthday, so the relationship probably started at age 20, and it's about the heartbreak of losing love in that ideal phase where you are all doped up on love hormones (The boy in the song "Almost ran the red when you were looking over at me"). That is new love. When you can't take your eyes off the person. That is a fun, wonderful phase but it doesn't last long even if the relationship does last.

I get totally different experiences and feelings listening to the two songs. Bono is talking about his soul mate, they are one, they carry each other. Taylor is heartbroken from all encompassing young love that ended. It was no less real, and it doesn't happen with every crush, it deeply resonated with her and they got serious, and he made her feel like a million bucks, but they are young and those kinds of relationships often end and that phase is not sustainable.

The song One was written when U2 was at crossroads, they were fighting and seriously discussing the dissolution of the band. We are one, but we are not the same Thank goodness it never happened! The songs is a masterpiece and one of my favorite songs of all time. It’s easy to interpret it the way you did too, two soulmates who are different and one has the upper hand and causes hurt - You ask me to enter, and then you make me crawl.

That being said, I think All Too Well is a masterpiece too. It is deeply personal and easy to relate to by millions of people who have been broken up with in a cruel way.

Both songs are beautiful, universally sad and heartbreaking. We don’t need to compare them, just enjoy them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s such a sad reach to say “All Too Well” is cribbed off of “one”
They are songs and that’s where the similarity ends.
Almost as embarrassing as comparing “Graceland” to “blank space”
I don’t know what is going on with this thread, but everyone needs to stick to their day jobs.

LOL seriously. I like both these songs, but they're both written in English and the similarity ends there.

The PP started with the conclusion that TS song X is inferior to non-TS song Y and then tried to fit supporting facts into it. It is a juvenile way to argue and also ineffective in engendering trust and willing people over.

I am a semi-fan but will always love the anthems “Shake it Off” (self-esteem especially for teenagers) and “The Man” (self-esteem especially for women and minorities). The lyrics may be puerile but I do not care. I love the messages and that they are accessible for the current generation and I hope they will stick around for future generations.

I’m PP, I assure you as soon as I saw the lyrics of “All Too Well” it immediately reminded me of “One.” I recognize that the words are not the same, at least not all of them, but for me, conceptually, it is the same song. I am not trying to fit supporting facts to fit an argument to prove a point. It’s what I see, a very strong similarity between the songs. I’m not the only one who sees it.

I’m a U2 fan. “one” is a song about reunification. Specifically in regards to Germany. But sure…. “All too well” , a song about dysfunctional and not fully requited young love also makes me think … about … the Berlin Wall.
Samsies!!!!

No, it’s inspired by the band’s fractured relationships when they arrived in Germany following its recent reunification. The band members found the environment itself surprisingly bleak and they were not getting along.

That’s what makes it a great song. It can be interpreted in many different ways, not so with “All Too Well.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m dying laughing at the idea that Taylor subconsciously ripped off some obscure Bono song written the year she was born because they share….one turn of phrase and a similar concept of…get this: reflecting on a past relationship. I’m the same age as Taylor and have literally never heard it before, or it’s an extremely forgettable song.

Ok, l love Taylor but you really need to listen to more music. “One” is not forgettable! It’s a very famous song by a very famous band!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. Because I was in the car with DD today, I listened to “invisible string”… and thought of this thread.

My dd is a megafan. I’m very familiar with her music, but not all, I’m a normal-level fan. I can see the successes and the justified criticism.

I thought invisible string had good lyrics. Now to look up if she wrote it alone…
“Time, curious time
Gave me no compasses, gave me no signs
Were there clues I didn't see?
And isn't it just so pretty to think
All along there was some
Invisible string
Tying you to me?”

beautiful song! aaron dessner of the national has a songwriting credit on invisible string.

Lol, I seriously hate to go down this road, AGAIN, but that reminds me of “Hazy Shade of Winter.”

“Time, time, time,
see what’s become of me,
when I looked around for my possibilities,
I was so hard to please….”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s such a sad reach to say “All Too Well” is cribbed off of “one”
They are songs and that’s where the similarity ends.
Almost as embarrassing as comparing “Graceland” to “blank space”
I don’t know what is going on with this thread, but everyone needs to stick to their day jobs.

LOL seriously. I like both these songs, but they're both written in English and the similarity ends there.

The PP started with the conclusion that TS song X is inferior to non-TS song Y and then tried to fit supporting facts into it. It is a juvenile way to argue and also ineffective in engendering trust and willing people over.

I am a semi-fan but will always love the anthems “Shake it Off” (self-esteem especially for teenagers) and “The Man” (self-esteem especially for women and minorities). The lyrics may be puerile but I do not care. I love the messages and that they are accessible for the current generation and I hope they will stick around for future generations.

I’m PP, I assure you as soon as I saw the lyrics of “All Too Well” it immediately reminded me of “One.” I recognize that the words are not the same, at least not all of them, but for me, conceptually, it is the same song. I am not trying to fit supporting facts to fit an argument to prove a point. It’s what I see, a very strong similarity between the songs. I’m not the only one who sees it.

I’m a U2 fan. “one” is a song about reunification. Specifically in regards to Germany. But sure…. “All too well” , a song about dysfunctional and not fully requited young love also makes me think … about … the Berlin Wall.
Samsies!!!!

No, it’s inspired by the band’s fractured relationships when they arrived in Germany following its recent reunification. The band members found the environment itself surprisingly bleak and they were not getting along.

That’s what makes it a great song. It can be interpreted in many different ways, not so with “All Too Well.”

What the songs have in common is that they illicit feeling in the listener. Once a song, or any art, is out in the world it stops being only about whatever inspired it and becomes about how each listener interrupts and connects with it. It becomes about the memories we tie to it. Both songs are beautiful and can exist alongside each other without one being labeled as derivative or lesser than the other.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s such a sad reach to say “All Too Well” is cribbed off of “one”
They are songs and that’s where the similarity ends.
Almost as embarrassing as comparing “Graceland” to “blank space”
I don’t know what is going on with this thread, but everyone needs to stick to their day jobs.

LOL seriously. I like both these songs, but they're both written in English and the similarity ends there.

The PP started with the conclusion that TS song X is inferior to non-TS song Y and then tried to fit supporting facts into it. It is a juvenile way to argue and also ineffective in engendering trust and willing people over.

I am a semi-fan but will always love the anthems “Shake it Off” (self-esteem especially for teenagers) and “The Man” (self-esteem especially for women and minorities). The lyrics may be puerile but I do not care. I love the messages and that they are accessible for the current generation and I hope they will stick around for future generations.

I’m PP, I assure you as soon as I saw the lyrics of “All Too Well” it immediately reminded me of “One.” I recognize that the words are not the same, at least not all of them, but for me, conceptually, it is the same song. I am not trying to fit supporting facts to fit an argument to prove a point. It’s what I see, a very strong similarity between the songs. I’m not the only one who sees it.

I’m a U2 fan. “one” is a song about reunification. Specifically in regards to Germany. But sure…. “All too well” , a song about dysfunctional and not fully requited young love also makes me think … about … the Berlin Wall.
Samsies!!!!

No, it’s inspired by the band’s fractured relationships when they arrived in Germany following its recent reunification. The band members found the environment itself surprisingly bleak and they were not getting along.

That’s what makes it a great song. It can be interpreted in many different ways, not so with “All Too Well.”

What the songs have in common is that they illicit feeling in the listener. Once a song, or any art, is out in the world it stops being only about whatever inspired it and becomes about how each listener interrupts and connects with it. It becomes about the memories we tie to it. Both songs are beautiful and can exist alongside each other without one being labeled as derivative or lesser than the other.

“All Too Well” doesn’t do any of that for me. It’s like a lingering ghost of a much better song.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. Because I was in the car with DD today, I listened to “invisible string”… and thought of this thread.

My dd is a megafan. I’m very familiar with her music, but not all, I’m a normal-level fan. I can see the successes and the justified criticism.

I thought invisible string had good lyrics. Now to look up if she wrote it alone…
“Time, curious time
Gave me no compasses, gave me no signs
Were there clues I didn't see?
And isn't it just so pretty to think
All along there was some
Invisible string
Tying you to me?”

beautiful song! aaron dessner of the national has a songwriting credit on invisible string.

Lol, I seriously hate to go down this road, AGAIN, but that reminds me of “Hazy Shade of Winter.”

“Time, time, time,
see what’s become of me,
when I looked around for my possibilities,
I was so hard to please….”

invisible string is about being in a happy relationship and looking back at the journey you took to get there. being grateful for the exes, fights and flaws that you learned and grew from.
hazy shade of winter, to me, is also about reflecting on lessons learned from one’s past. it’s always reminded me of turn, turn, turn. and the reference to leaves on the ground reminds me of california dreamin. neither of these connections make the song any more derivative.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. Because I was in the car with DD today, I listened to “invisible string”… and thought of this thread.

My dd is a megafan. I’m very familiar with her music, but not all, I’m a normal-level fan. I can see the successes and the justified criticism.

I thought invisible string had good lyrics. Now to look up if she wrote it alone…
“Time, curious time
Gave me no compasses, gave me no signs
Were there clues I didn't see?
And isn't it just so pretty to think
All along there was some
Invisible string
Tying you to me?”

beautiful song! aaron dessner of the national has a songwriting credit on invisible string.

Lol, I seriously hate to go down this road, AGAIN, but that reminds me of “Hazy Shade of Winter.”

“Time, time, time,
see what’s become of me,
when I looked around for my possibilities,
I was so hard to please….”

invisible string is about being in a happy relationship and looking back at the journey you took to get there. being grateful for the exes, fights and flaws that you learned and grew from.
hazy shade of winter, to me, is also about reflecting on lessons learned from one’s past. it’s always reminded me of turn, turn, turn. and the reference to leaves on the ground reminds me of california dreamin. neither of these connections make the song any more derivative.

I’ve never been able to understand what Hazy Shade of Winter is about. I think it’s about finding peace and happiness unexpectedly. I see the lyrics as very open to interpretation.

I see Turn, Turn, Turn as being a beautiful constructed protest song that channels the Bible to stop the war in Vietnam. Its message is intentionally direct.

I see California Dreamin’ as a song about longing. I’m not sure what’s being longed for beyond warm weather because it, too, is very open to interpretation.

Invisible String spells everything out. There is no room for any interpretation. It’s about the bad situations and seasons that led her to the right guy. And it’ll tell you, from the first beat you over the head line “Green was the color of the grass.”

I find the “Time, curious time,” line to be very unoriginal. It reminds me, personally, of “Hazy Shade of Winter,” but fifty years later and far less inspired. But ultimately, I’m just trying to add a little humor to this thread.