Mom Wants to Take My Kid to the Doctor

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So H has no job, you are starting a business of some sort (which a team? Venture backed? In your basement? Consumer or business facing?
Your parents provide free childcare, clothes, toys and now have health wellness concerns about all of you.
They want to take kid to the pediatrician next time.

Hmm. Hmm. Hmm.

Haha, are you my mom? My parents have always treated us this way. When we both worked in finance and had tons of money. Before we even had kids (back then, it was concerns about our health, our jobs, our vacations, whatever).

They criticized me for not taking care of my health when I was in banking (too much screentime, not enough sleep). Then for giving up a big salary when I changed to a lower-paying and less intense job later. They criticized me for taking my kid on pretty standard domestic vacations "because I was risking her life" (long before covid). They criticized me for not becoming a SAHM after the first kid was born. They criticized me for stopping breastfeeding at 10 months. For taking kid on playdates (again before COVID). They have always questioned all my life choices, point out all the potential risks and negative consequences of every single thing I do, and then when I tell them it's hurtful and not ok, they say that they love me and worry for me and this is what being a good parent looks like.

The things they buy are a way of controlling and bullying us. I explain that I'd rather kid not have items XYZ (overly pink/girly items, loud toys, screens, etc), and they buy those items and give to the kid without telling me. I buy a winter jacket, they say it's not warm enough and buy another one. I buy and cook organic food for my family, they bring over their own baby food (which is full of sweeteners and less healthy) because they believe baby MUST have purees, not chunks of real food.

When I started the business, of course they criticized me for that too. Yes, I started without any backers. Within months, I had an investor who now covers all costs of running it. I have a team working for me and thousands of customers. I don't have enough to take a salary for myself, but I am confident within a year I could get there if only I had more time to work and real childcare. It's not the kind of business that's going to make us rich, but the idea is for it to provide a solid salary, comparable to what I was making before.

Thanks for the color. Got it, I have many friends like you even around here in DC, but without the crazy parents.

Your mom, maybe your dad too-can’t tell, need to butt out.
Sometimes you can’t stop the gifts, but you need a way to stop the marginalizing and unwelcome advice.

Start by saying No to the dr visits.

If you send some kind of alienating of your kids due to the weekend time, stop or decrease that - all grabs a hike or pizza.

As for this family genetic secret, you (and your subs) needed to be told this yesterday. If it’s for real your parents owe you the details ASAP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A complicated genetic history they can’t explain to the person who shares all the relevant genes?

Forget letting her take the kid to the doctor I wouldn’t let her alone in a room with the kid. Your startup isn’t worth this.

Like Grandma & Grampa are closely related or something? That could be complicated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So H has no job, you are starting a business of some sort (which a team? Venture backed? In your basement? Consumer or business facing?
Your parents provide free childcare, clothes, toys and now have health wellness concerns about all of you.
They want to take kid to the pediatrician next time.

Hmm. Hmm. Hmm.

Haha, are you my mom? My parents have always treated us this way. When we both worked in finance and had tons of money. Before we even had kids (back then, it was concerns about our health, our jobs, our vacations, whatever).

They criticized me for not taking care of my health when I was in banking (too much screentime, not enough sleep). Then for giving up a big salary when I changed to a lower-paying and less intense job later. They criticized me for taking my kid on pretty standard domestic vacations "because I was risking her life" (long before covid). They criticized me for not becoming a SAHM after the first kid was born. They criticized me for stopping breastfeeding at 10 months. For taking kid on playdates (again before COVID). They have always questioned all my life choices, point out all the potential risks and negative consequences of every single thing I do, and then when I tell them it's hurtful and not ok, they say that they love me and worry for me and this is what being a good parent looks like.

The things they buy are a way of controlling and bullying us. I explain that I'd rather kid not have items XYZ (overly pink/girly items, loud toys, screens, etc), and they buy those items and give to the kid without telling me. I buy a winter jacket, they say it's not warm enough and buy another one. I buy and cook organic food for my family, they bring over their own baby food (which is full of sweeteners and less healthy) because they believe baby MUST have purees, not chunks of real food.

When I started the business, of course they criticized me for that too. Yes, I started without any backers. Within months, I had an investor who now covers all costs of running it. I have a team working for me and thousands of customers. I don't have enough to take a salary for myself, but I am confident within a year I could get there if only I had more time to work and real childcare. It's not the kind of business that's going to make us rich, but the idea is for it to provide a solid salary, comparable to what I was making before.

Thanks for the color. Got it, I have many friends like you even around here in DC, but without the crazy parents.

Your mom, maybe your dad too-can’t tell, need to butt out.
Sometimes you can’t stop the gifts, but you need a way to stop the marginalizing and unwelcome advice.

Start by saying No to the dr visits.

If you send some kind of alienating of your kids due to the weekend time, stop or decrease that - all grabs a hike or pizza.

As for this family genetic secret, you (and your subs) needed to be told this yesterday. If it’s for real your parents owe you the details ASAP.

OP, you don't really sound like you're thinking straight. You chose to quit your job and do a start-up with two very young kids. Your husband simultaneously quit or lost his job. You need to focus like a laser on your job, which you have chosen to be this startup. If your out of work husband is not sufficient childcare then HIRE A NANNY. This is an investment in your future earning potential. Your mom sounds completely out of line.

[Anonymous]

Your mother has made clear that the price of her care is heavy involvement with your children's upbringing. It's a take it or leave it proposition, but the leave it part may end up being more costly to you in the long run - estrangement, etc. so I'd tread carefully.

It's not unusual for the older generation to give advice and think you are "doing it wrong." In your case, your parents' help may actually be really valuable if they are the ones doing the work involved around it - like making home-cooked meals, better enrichment type activities, more reading, etc.

I think if I were in your shoes I'd let my mom go to the appointment with me. One of two things is going to happen - most likely the doctor is going to tell you that nothing is wrong, the kid needs more sleep and that's it. If it ends up being something else, well at least you know. And your mom may push for a second opinion, and that's where I would push back. Don't get me wrong, I think the request is unreasonable, but you've got a pattern here, and some pretty valuable childcare and relationships.

As your kids get older and need less, you can all naturally pull back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She's crazy, but you said at the outset that you rely on her. It's clear you do.

What happens if you dig your heels in and don't let her come? You're starting a dangerous precedent but maybe in the future you'll have more money and bandwidth to piss her off and lose her help.

You should probably lose their help as soon as you can afford it...

Me again. Just reread your OP and saw this. Your mom is psychotic. Use as little of her help as possible and then ditch it completely as soon as you can. Forget the week off. Not worth it. You'll have to find another way to get a couple's break.

My mom says she must be there or no childcare for us

+1

And the kids' dad needs to care for them, or work. One or the other.

[Anonymous]

Op absolutely is missing something. There is no reason dh should be so exhausted he can’t provide childcare and needs grandparent help. In my household one of us has been out of work this whole pandemic. Guess what he has been doing??? Childcare!!! We have never had any need for a sitter or grandparents or whatever. Sounds like OP and her husband need to figure out how to live life as adults.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would say something like this: "Mom, thanks for your concern. Unfortunately, they are only allowing one adult to bring in the kids for their appointment during COVID so only I can take them. I will definitely ask about the undereye circles. We would love to have you continue to watch the kids occasionally, but if you prefer not to, we understand."

Op, this is the least drama way to approach this. Go with this. In a polite tone.

You two are not getting that OP and her mom do not have a functional relationship. Mom is manipulative. OP should say this, but there will be drama.

This. Holy cow, op. You need to learn how to separate ate from your mom. Are there any cultural issues at play? Are your parents from another country?

Get this book and read it. I think it will help you. https://m.barnesandnoble.com/w/boundaries-updated-and-expanded-edition-henry-cloud/1127017176

OP here. Yes, they're from another country where (they claim) these kinds of parent-child relationships are normal. The first time I mentioned boundaries to them, my dad got furious and my mom started crying and saying that I didn't love her and that real families who love each other don't have boundaries.

I'll try the book.

[Anonymous]

This wouldn’t even be a conversation I’d be willing to have. The answer is no. I’m guessing they won’t actually hold you to the no childcare because they will miss the kids. It will last a week or 2. Suck it up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So you don’t use her for “real” childcare - only on weekends to get some downtime? Since you don’t actually NEED her to watch the kids, I would put my foot down and decline her request. She’s way out of bounds.

Yeah, this is the part I don't get. The husband DOESN'T WORK but he can't watch the kids during the week. The wife "works" but it is a start-up not bringing in any money and no health insurance, and SHE needs a break on the weekends??? There is something going really wrong in this household and it isn't the grandparents.

OP here. My husband does the bulk of the childcare during the week. My parents help on some weekends (usually one day, sometimes overnight). They had also promised to watch kids for a week so we could have a vacation.

We have good health insurance. We are comfortably covering our bills from savings, we just don't have $40K/year for a nanny.

I'm not sure if I'm missing something here, but we have two young kids and it's really hard. They need to constantly be watched, they wake up at night. When I'm not working, I watch them, husband applies to jobs or cooks or does laundry. We are both on every single minute 13-14 hours/day (except bathroom breaks). We both did investment banking in the past, and this is harder. When one kid is napping or calmly playing, the other is awake. If they're both occupied, we need to make lunch or dinner or take out the trash or pay the bills. We try not to do too much screentime and we cook our own food (no separate meals for kids).

Maybe there's some parenting secret we haven't figured out since the youngest was born, but yes, we are both working really hard all day every day to keep up with running the startup (me), applying to jobs (husband), and kids/house (both of us). Obviously if our kids were older and in school, this would not be a problem, but that's a few years away.

Millions of parents manage this with absolutely no help. Yes, infants and toddlers need to be constantly watched. That’s what parenting is.
Seriously.

[Anonymous]

I've posted a few times in this thread. I feel for you, OP. My mom is manipulative and borderline and is completely incapable of having healthy relationships. I am an only child and didn't have the tools to establish boundaries, so I always just tolerated her manipulation and emotional abuse.

She behaved in some really frustrating ways within the first few months of my wife and me becoming parents. My wife suggested we talk to a therapist to figure out how to get on the same page with regard to dealing with my mom. We didn't go to many sessions, maybe 5-8. But it helped tremendously, and I have far more control now.

By all means read some books, but you should probably talk to someone, too. Establishing boundaries will be very hard, but you will be so glad. Otherwise you will be in these patterns until your parents pass. They will manipulate your children, and you won't know how to stop it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op absolutely is missing something. There is no reason dh should be so exhausted he can’t provide childcare and needs grandparent help. In my household one of us has been out of work this whole pandemic. Guess what he has been doing??? Childcare!!! We have never had any need for a sitter or grandparents or whatever. Sounds like OP and her husband need to figure out how to live life as adults.

OP here. It's easy to write anonymous snarky posts, but if you're really in the same situation, how about some constructive advice?

My husband is actively job searching, which is taking upwards of 20 hours per week. Between searching for jobs, writing cover letters, reaching out to people to network, working with recruiters, interviews and prep for interviews, pro bono projects to develop skills and make contacts, it really is like a job. So it's not like he's just sitting on his ass. To get concrete, here's how our day looks:

Morning: he is on kid duty, I work frenetically to get a full day's work into 4-5 hours.
Afternoon: I am on kid duty, he does his job search stuff and catches up on groceries, bills, house repairs, mail, all that "adulting" fun. He makes dinner while I watch kids.
Evening: we eat dinner together, then bedtime routine. After kids in bed, we finish the work we didn't get done in the morning. We pass out from exhaustion and then get up and do it all over again.

Are there other families with young kids and similar workloads and no childcare? I'm sure. I know some of them. They are always tired and their romantic lives are nonexistent. I'm not really interested in living like that. I like having romantic evenings, spending time with my husband and having regular sex. I like going on vacation just the two of us every year. If you are satisfied being with your kids 24/7, all power to you, but there are plenty of families that do use sitters and grandparents to get much-needed time away from kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've posted a few times in this thread. I feel for you, OP. My mom is manipulative and borderline and is completely incapable of having healthy relationships. I am an only child and didn't have the tools to establish boundaries, so I always just tolerated her manipulation and emotional abuse.

She behaved in some really frustrating ways within the first few months of my wife and me becoming parents. My wife suggested we talk to a therapist to figure out how to get on the same page with regard to dealing with my mom. We didn't go to many sessions, maybe 5-8. But it helped tremendously, and I have far more control now.

By all means read some books, but you should probably talk to someone, too. Establishing boundaries will be very hard, but you will be so glad. Otherwise you will be in these patterns until your parents pass. They will manipulate your children, and you won't know how to stop it.

Thank you! I have been to therapy about it. I even tried therapy with her but that blew up.

I absolutely need to do a better job with the boundaries. But it's so hard to give up the free childcare plus they do really love the grandkids and the grandkids love them (but you're totally right, soon enough she will start manipulating the grandkids too, I'm already starting to see it and it terrifies me). We were actually making progress but then COVID happened and then we didn't have any other childcare options that we felt safe with so we fell back into it. And then my husband lost his job and so getting paid childcare became a financial challenge too.

One challenge is that everything will be great for like a month and I start thinking, "Ok, we're good" and let down my guard and then out of nowhere, the manipulation and control reappears. And then I try to pull back, then everything is good again and the cycle happens again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would say something like this: "Mom, thanks for your concern. Unfortunately, they are only allowing one adult to bring in the kids for their appointment during COVID so only I can take them. I will definitely ask about the undereye circles. We would love to have you continue to watch the kids occasionally, but if you prefer not to, we understand."

Op, this is the least drama way to approach this. Go with this. In a polite tone.

You two are not getting that OP and her mom do not have a functional relationship. Mom is manipulative. OP should say this, but there will be drama.

This. Holy cow, op. You need to learn how to separate ate from your mom. Are there any cultural issues at play? Are your parents from another country?

Get this book and read it. I think it will help you. https://m.barnesandnoble.com/w/boundaries-updated-and-expanded-edition-henry-cloud/1127017176

OP here. Yes, they're from another country where (they claim) these kinds of parent-child relationships are normal. The first time I mentioned boundaries to them, my dad got furious and my mom started crying and saying that I didn't love her and that real families who love each other don't have boundaries.

I'll try the book.

First rule of boundaries, OP: You don’t talk about boundaries. You just implement them!

Rookie mistake.

[Anonymous]

Of course no one wants to live like that, and as soon as one of you is making money you can hire help who won't stomp all over your boundaries.

99% think the price for your mom's help is too high.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op absolutely is missing something. There is no reason dh should be so exhausted he can’t provide childcare and needs grandparent help. In my household one of us has been out of work this whole pandemic. Guess what he has been doing??? Childcare!!! We have never had any need for a sitter or grandparents or whatever. Sounds like OP and her husband need to figure out how to live life as adults.

OP here. It's easy to write anonymous snarky posts, but if you're really in the same situation, how about some constructive advice?

My husband is actively job searching, which is taking upwards of 20 hours per week. Between searching for jobs, writing cover letters, reaching out to people to network, working with recruiters, interviews and prep for interviews, pro bono projects to develop skills and make contacts, it really is like a job. So it's not like he's just sitting on his ass. To get concrete, here's how our day looks:

Morning: he is on kid duty, I work frenetically to get a full day's work into 4-5 hours.
Afternoon: I am on kid duty, he does his job search stuff and catches up on groceries, bills, house repairs, mail, all that "adulting" fun. He makes dinner while I watch kids.
Evening: we eat dinner together, then bedtime routine. After kids in bed, we finish the work we didn't get done in the morning. We pass out from exhaustion and then get up and do it all over again.

Are there other families with young kids and similar workloads and no childcare? I'm sure. I know some of them. They are always tired and their romantic lives are nonexistent. I'm not really interested in living like that. I like having romantic evenings, spending time with my husband and having regular sex. I like going on vacation just the two of us every year. If you are satisfied being with your kids 24/7, all power to you, but there are plenty of families that do use sitters and grandparents to get much-needed time away from kids.

OP - you realize this only a phase? They are not infants and toddlers forever. It’s a few short years where life is really hard.
Parenting is time consuming.
You don’t like how to your parents treat you, but you continue to let them trample on you.
If you truly want them to treat you like an adult, you need to act like one and not rely on them. When they question your choices, you need to stand your ground. You need to distance yourself from them.
Or you can continue this odd relationship for free childcare.
Your choice.