Therapy for Infidelity
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Anonymous
| Seems to be a type of sleep disorder? |
Anonymous
My nephew was diagnosed with this at 22. They were hesitant to positively label it bipolar. They eventually did. He’s the sweetest guy and it’s only about every 2 years or so he has a manic episode where he loses reality, talks nonsense, will wander. His wife now (herself a psychiatrist) can see the first signs and adjusts medication. He does not get the depressive episodes. His showed first as not being able to sleep. When he’s under a lot of change or stress it will sometimes manifest. |
Anonymous
I'm the PP who described all that. Yes, I think it's very possible, given your DH's form of cheating, which sounds impulsive and risky. My husband was diagnosed with bipolar II at 40 after incorrectly being treated with antidepressants for a few years, which actually make bipolar mania worse. I think you should search this and the health forum for "hypomania" and see if anything sounds familiar. Again, I'll stress that my STBX has never ever ever acted overtly, noticeably manic, upbeat, happy, excited, reckless, none of that. His hypomania presents as agitation, impatience, and anxiety, which looks a lot like depression. |
Anonymous
I am the PP w/ bipolar ex at 18:51 to whom PP above previously responded. I would also say bipolar is a possible diagnosis for several reasons: 1) you previously mentioned that your DH was diagnosed with ADHD, anxiety and depression. ADHD is often (mis)diagnosed when bipolar is the true root cause. Is he hyperactive type ADHD? Does he feel driven by a motor sometimes like he can't sit still or stay inside? That is my exDH when the hypomania kicks in. He finds it hard to focus. His conversation is a bit disjointed -- very subtle, but he responds to questions with answers that are not on point or are a non-sequitar but not so far off the mark that you wouldn't just assume he was a bit rude in not responding to you. It's a basic principle of medicine to look for one diagnosis that explains all symptoms instead of 3 separate co-occurring conditions. Bipolar comes with all three of those symptoms in different phases. 2) There are two types of bipolar -- Type I is depresssion with cycles of florid mania. Florid mania is the kind of disconnected from reality mania -- special messages from religion, think you can fly, fell in love with a prostitute in another state and moving out of the marriage, gambling all the money away, etc. Hypomania is a lower kind of mania that often appears to be a behavioral choice -- an affair because your H is unhappy with the "marriage", a porn addiction (without losing all the money), periods of being "up" and "happy" and starting new projects. Most of us think of mania as "euphoric" or "happy". But, people can also have a "dysphoric" mania. The florid manic state might be very hostile and physically agressive. The hypomanic dysphoria might be anxious or agitated and irritable or very mixed. To make things even more confusing, we usually think of depression as "sadness". But many people experience depression as a period when they are increasingly inrritable or angry, have a very negative view of everything (almost like being mildly paranoid). But, depression is more than just "mood". It is also a psychomotor state. In depression, my exDH often proclaimed to be sick or even really he was sick more often, staying in bed and avoiding events (either work or social) because he didn't "feel well". He would sleep a lot and still take naps during the day. By contrast, in hypomania, he started staying up late, chatting with everyone, crossing boundaries, missing social cues, increasingly energetic, etc. Sleep patterns are a big tell in bipolar depression. 3) you husband's pattern of sexuality -- which you described in one place as something he was "uncomfortable with" and doesn't "relate well too" sounds like sex in depressive phase to me. It is not uncommon for people to be diagnosed with bipolar late in life --- not because it was "triggered" but because it had been present for a long time but perceived as something else -- another diagnosis, a "choice," a "relationship problem," boredom, etc. Average time to correct diagnosis for bipolar patients is 7 YEARS. Think about that -- some people are diagnosed sooner than 7 years but a significant number are not properly diagnosed for longer than 7 years! If your DH is seeing a psychiatrist, you should be attending 5-10 minutes of each session to be an "independent reporter" of mood and behavior. People with bipolar are notorious for only reporting the depressive aspects of their illness. The depression feels so bad, they know something is wrong. But the mania or hypomania feels good. It feels like how they think life should be. Who would want to give up the hypomanic state which makes them happy, gets them into sexual relationships, makes them productive and active and doing lots of fun stuff? If your DH and your DH"s psychiatrist don't let you regularly participate in psychiatry appointments, then, IMO, that is 1) a sign that your DH doesn't have a good psychiatrist because it is actually an accepted part of "best practices" to involve a close friend or family member in this way in treatment, while maintaining privacy. A good psychiatrist will let you provide a few minutes of independent reporting, spend the rest of the session talking with the patient, and then bring the family member in to hear the treatment decisions. Is there a change in medication? What side effects should be watched for? etc. If your DH isn't willing to involve you in this way, then, IMO, the relationship is not likely to succeed. FWIW, my exDH's bipolar is seasonal -- he begins to go up as soon as January and stays up until about August when he becomes increasingly anxious and irritable, really crashing down in the Sept-Dec. range (Thanksgiving and Xmas are so fun - not!) You should read more about bipolar and see what you think about the symptoms and whether there is a cycle. Cycles can be any length -- multi-year, one year like my exDH's or rapid (as PP's STBX DH was diagnosed). Some people are ultra-rapid cyclers, with up/down cycles within one day.) Please read up. I like Francis Mondimore's, "Bipolar Disorder: A Guide for Patients and Families" and David Miklowitz's book Bipolar Disorder Survival Guide. (Miklowitz is the creator of Family Focused Therapy, which together with Ellen Frank's Interpersonal and Social Rythm Therapy are two therapies demonstrated to be effective with bipolar, along with CBT and DBT, I think). I also like "I'm not Sick; I don't Need Help" by Xavier Amador, which gives some insight about why people with mental illness don't recognize that they are ill. NAMI is also an excellent resource. They have a great website, support groups and classes for family members and "consumers" aka "patients". I particularly like their Family to Family course, which you can now take online. (Free!) So, whether your DH has anxiety or depression or bipolar, any of those would be addressed. There is also a NAMI Basics, but I think that is for parents of mentally ill kids under 18. FWIW, my exDH, like PP was initially diagnosed with depression and prescribed anti-depressants which made his hypomania worse. The STEP-BD trials ( a large multi-arm controlled trial conducted by NIMH to try to develop best treatment practices) concluded that anti-depressant treatment is, in most cases, NOT appropriate in bipolar depression. See -- https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/case-against-antidepressants-bipolar-depression-findings-step-bd Good luck! |
Anonymous
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See what I'm talking about? PP is amazing! 🤗 Seriously, I thank you.
I'm reminded by your post that the seasonal thing was another clue for me (he gets seasonal affective disorder...maybe...who knows what's what anymore). I got so much more info from you than all the professionals I called around to and the four therapists and psychiatrists we met with. It was incredibly frustrating. I was desperate to consult with someone knowledgeable about bipolar, and the few who had promise had no openings. I sobbed on the phone with the Johns Hopkins mood disorders clinic, but they couldn't take us on and also had zero recommendations. It was so incredibly frustrating and demoralizing. Our marriage and his life (suicidal thoughts) were on the line, and it felt like we were the first people to deal with bipolar, which is ridiculous. I signed up for the NAMI Family to Family course, and then COVID hit and it was canceled. There was no support structure in place in our moment of crisis, and now that window has closed and too much damage has been done. And the mental health team he has in place now is a damn joke. I overhear him telling his therapist over Zoom that he's doing great, when I could tell a very different story, but the therapist always takes him at face value, which just seems irresponsibly, unprofessionally naive. Sigh. |
Anonymous
One of the saddest posts. It's like saying Ted Bundy was a great guy except for that little nasty habit he had. He's not a good husband or father if he cheats. However you have kids and a SN child and obviously you want to keep your family together. I would too because their more important than the cheater or the garbage their with. Also, you don't want that kind of garbage around your kids. Not to mention what other kids the OW would have or problems they would cause your own. And yes I've seen that scenario with various friends. It's destroys families, but don't delude yourself. If he says he's not going to cheat then check up on him until he proves he's changed. It's also about your health which you should value. |
Anonymous
When restaurants etc. are open and your so called professional will only do Zoom there's the clue. Get off Zoom. Many people with Bi-polar don't cheat, another excuse I'm afraid. I think you're at the crossroad that either he changes or you need to divorce at some point. Only you know when you've had enough. Or at least when the kids are older. |
Anonymous
Thanks, pay it forward. Everything I learned, I learned by reading books, reputable websites like NAMI and NIMH and reading medical journal articles. It’s been a very time consuming process over years to understand what about mental illness. I also kept a journal, without which I never would have seen the patterns to his behavior. FWIW, NAMI Montgomery County is holding Family to Family classes now. I’m sorry that wasn’t happening earlier in the pandemic, but it is now, and it might even be possible to sign up for a class by Zoom at a NAMI in another county or state. Your story about having difficulty finding good doctors is very common. We also went thru several before finding qualified people. Add in considerations of in v out of network and all the insurance issues, and finding a good psychiatrist and therapist is a nightmare. |
Anonymous
Can we please not call other human beings garbage? People do terrible things sometimes, and it’s perfectly legitimate to recommend breaking up or cutting contact, but nothing justifies calling another person garbage, especially one driven by mental illness. I mean, honestly, the situation is tragic for everyone involved and calling the mentally ill cheater spouse garbage really doesn’t make a useful contribution in any way. It’s not necessary to denigrate other humans to such a degree to justify breaking up with him. In fact, IMO, this is one of the cultural concepts that keeps women in relationships with men that are not a good fit. Women can break up with boyfriends, fiancees and husbands for any reason whether they are good or bad humans. We women are allowed to determine what boundaries to have in life and we are not obligated to stay with guys because they are nice. OP’s DH could be a really great guy, but he is doing something (cheating) that is physically and emotionally unhealthy and unsafe for OP. That alone is reason to break up, if she wants to. But, she doesn’t really need any reason at all. |
Anonymous
Thank you to the person (people) who wrote in re hypomania, and BPD II. I had never heard of hypomania but this info explains A LOT that I could not make sense of in my situation w my spouse. WHO KNEW that a 'high' could be engineered to get oneself 'even lower'?? So what next? Here's the latest that has been really helpful to give me a sense of the stakes: https://infidelityrecoveryinstitute.com/affair-types/ |