Therapy for Infidelity

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s OK to leave your husband at any time in this process. The truth is that what you want is completely reasonable - a sense of remorse for the hurt he’s caused you as opposed to the hurt he’s experienced as a result of his own actions, some sense that he knows why he did it so he knows how not to do it again, transparency about the past and in the future, a sincere apology, and a long periods of acts on his part that show he is rebuilding and re-earning your trust in him.

But, the truth is that the same character qualities that lead a partner to cheat also lead a partner to be unable to do any of the above.

Add to that that individual counseling or psychotherapy in this issue (infidelity) is generally of very poor quality, well, the odds are extremely slim that your relationship will come back to a healthy place.

I’m sorry. Please get yourself an individual counselor who understands PTSD.

He is actually doing all of these things except the knowing why he did it. He is trying daily and weekly to do better. He just keeps asking when can we get over this and go back to normal and I'm wondering why he doesn't see that the process has just begun. We are far from being on a healthy path yet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A one night stand is a lapse of judgement and likely can be worked through if both parties want.

But this...be was engaging with multiple women in sex chat groups and trying to meet up with at least one of them. That is a very deliberate and probably went on for some time- gross and a HUGE character problem you can't therapy away.

Divorce.

OP. He definitely has issues with sex, yes that have manifested itself in different ways throughout the marriage. And he has an issue with lying which is mental health related. They are likely both mental health related. He wasn't looking for a relationship, just sex. As far as I know nothing ever actually happened. He just fantasized about it. It's a type of addiction to porn as I understand it. It's related to depression I've been told. So the talking about fun things is actually helpful, but it needs to be part of a bigger treatment that involves dealing with more difficult issues. IMO.

Is he a Duggar? Mental health issues never go away OP. Don't torture yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A one night stand is a lapse of judgement and likely can be worked through if both parties want.

But this...be was engaging with multiple women in sex chat groups and trying to meet up with at least one of them. That is a very deliberate and probably went on for some time- gross and a HUGE character problem you can't therapy away.

Divorce.

OP. He definitely has issues with sex, yes that have manifested itself in different ways throughout the marriage. And he has an issue with lying which is mental health related. They are likely both mental health related. He wasn't looking for a relationship, just sex. As far as I know nothing ever actually happened. He just fantasized about it. It's a type of addiction to porn as I understand it. It's related to depression I've been told. So the talking about fun things is actually helpful, but it needs to be part of a bigger treatment that involves dealing with more difficult issues. IMO.

Is he a Duggar? Mental health issues never go away OP. Don't torture yourself.

He went to catholic school all his life. I thought I was the one without enough morals with my parents not caring enough about me to send me to catholic as the saying in catholic school goes. It's just so strange. I agree they don't go away, but our catholic faith and my child at least compel me to work through this the next 3 years before he graduates and I'm just trying to do the best I can during that time making as much progress as possible. For me, for him, for our children. Even if we do divorce, I'll feel better about him being in a better place mentally with the kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here again. It also makes me nervous that I might feel betrayed for years to come. Both for me and my husband. That’s kind of why I wanted to deal with it in a deep way and get it into our past. But I guess it doesn’t work that way and we need to find someone to help us peel back the onion. Since therapists are virtual now, any recommendations are helpful.

You will. It takes an average of 2 years to "get over" an affair. Consider EFT therapy - Carol Corcoron is virtual but very good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A one night stand is a lapse of judgement and likely can be worked through if both parties want.

But this...be was engaging with multiple women in sex chat groups and trying to meet up with at least one of them. That is a very deliberate and probably went on for some time- gross and a HUGE character problem you can't therapy away.

Divorce.

OP. He definitely has issues with sex, yes that have manifested itself in different ways throughout the marriage. And he has an issue with lying which is mental health related. They are likely both mental health related. He wasn't looking for a relationship, just sex. As far as I know nothing ever actually happened. He just fantasized about it. It's a type of addiction to porn as I understand it. It's related to depression I've been told. So the talking about fun things is actually helpful, but it needs to be part of a bigger treatment that involves dealing with more difficult issues. IMO.

Talking and doing fun things is NOT going to change anything. You might get short term joy. That's it. WTF? I am so disappointed in therapy. This is such bullsh*t.

If he has narcissistic tendencies, histrionic disorder, bpd or any of these major mental health issues that are a direct result of childhood trauma, just doing 'fun' things is doing NOTHING.

He needs deep individual work and a very strong desire to want to change himself. He needs to hit rock bottom and want to get out.

Any person that thinks they 'got away with it'. A few weeks or a couple months of stress/remorse, and then loving spouse who forgives and they hysterically bond with lots of sex...IS JUST GOING TO DO IT AGAIN. The next time, he/she is going to be even more careful and they have learned where their weak point was at getting caught. IF it was a phone bill, well yeah they will never use phone again--they will use Skype or some other means that leaves no trace, etc.

Also, you as the victim will return to natural resentment for being lied to and deceived. After the honeymoon glow wears off, you will remember what he did and you will withdraw (even unintentionally).

Individual therapy with separate therapists is paramount for both of you. No talk of reconciliation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here again. It also makes me nervous that I might feel betrayed for years to come. Both for me and my husband. That’s kind of why I wanted to deal with it in a deep way and get it into our past. But I guess it doesn’t work that way and we need to find someone to help us peel back the onion. Since therapists are virtual now, any recommendations are helpful.

You will. It takes an average of 2 years to "get over" an affair. Consider EFT therapy - Carol Corcoron is virtual but very good.

2 years is a 'best' estimate. Nowadays, 5 years is more the range people are looking at and anyone that has been there will tell you they never get back 100% trust. That ship has sailed. There will always be memories of this deceit/abuse. It may become foggy over time, but you know they once were capable of this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s OK to leave your husband at any time in this process. The truth is that what you want is completely reasonable - a sense of remorse for the hurt he’s caused you as opposed to the hurt he’s experienced as a result of his own actions, some sense that he knows why he did it so he knows how not to do it again, transparency about the past and in the future, a sincere apology, and a long periods of acts on his part that show he is rebuilding and re-earning your trust in him.

But, the truth is that the same character qualities that lead a partner to cheat also lead a partner to be unable to do any of the above.

Add to that that individual counseling or psychotherapy in this issue (infidelity) is generally of very poor quality, well, the odds are extremely slim that your relationship will come back to a healthy place.

I’m sorry. Please get yourself an individual counselor who understands PTSD.

He is actually doing all of these things except the knowing why he did it. He is trying daily and weekly to do better. He just keeps asking when can we get over this and go back to normal and I'm wondering why he doesn't see that the process has just begun. We are far from being on a healthy path yet.

OP, I have been in your shoes. You mentioned mental illness. What is his diagnosis? Are you saying his mental illness is sex addiction? Is he seeing a psychiatrist? Is he on medication? Do you participate for 5-10 minutes at every psychiatry appointment to provide independent input about mood and behavior?

Sex addiction alone is not really a mental illness. It is a manifestation of personality disorder or mental illness. For example, a person can use sex to self-soothe anxiety. Or a person may be diagnosed as a sex addict for behaviors that are driven by underlying mania or hypomania that creates hypersexuality — common in bipolar depression. The right diagnosis is key to finding the right medication, and doing so is just the beginning to getting better. Or sex addiction could be a reflection of personality disorder like sociopathy or psychopathy.

IME with mentally ill family members, therapy doesn’t work until AFTER the family member is on the right medication.

For you, I encourage participation in SA-anon (like Al-anon but for partners of sex addicts).

As for when things can get back to normal - the answer is never. He broke the relationship. You will never get back to that relationship. You have a shot at building a new, healthier one. The sooner you both recognize that the better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A one night stand is a lapse of judgement and likely can be worked through if both parties want.

But this...be was engaging with multiple women in sex chat groups and trying to meet up with at least one of them. That is a very deliberate and probably went on for some time- gross and a HUGE character problem you can't therapy away.

Divorce.

OP. He definitely has issues with sex, yes that have manifested itself in different ways throughout the marriage. And he has an issue with lying which is mental health related. They are likely both mental health related. He wasn't looking for a relationship, just sex. As far as I know nothing ever actually happened. He just fantasized about it. It's a type of addiction to porn as I understand it. It's related to depression I've been told. So the talking about fun things is actually helpful, but it needs to be part of a bigger treatment that involves dealing with more difficult issues. IMO.

Is he a Duggar? Mental health issues never go away OP. Don't torture yourself.

He went to catholic school all his life. I thought I was the one without enough morals with my parents not caring enough about me to send me to catholic as the saying in catholic school goes. It's just so strange. I agree they don't go away, but our catholic faith and my child at least compel me to work through this the next 3 years before he graduates and I'm just trying to do the best I can during that time making as much progress as possible. For me, for him, for our children. Even if we do divorce, I'll feel better about him being in a better place mentally with the kids.

He needs to see a psychiatrist, not a therapist. Therapist for you maybe to talk through things you can’t talk to family/friends about. But he needs mental illness help a therapist is in no way qualified to give.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No.way.in.hell.

Couples therapy for infidelity is mostly bullsh@t. It usually doesn’t even scratch the surface and it always holds both parties responsible for the marriage trouble.

My spouse had deep seated personal issues that caused the acting out sexually: child abandonment in childhood, alcoholic, abusive father (died of alcoholism) and a mother that only looked out for herself and left the 2 kids by themselves a lot.

Yet- first marriage counselor was like “try threesomes and adventure”, talk more. Not once did he delve into the psychology behind the cheating. He also deemed us “cured” because we always got along really well, rarely fought and had a healthy sex life.

So much couples therapy discounts the fact that often it is one individual’s problem. It is an addiction to numb oneself in some situations.

He is doing twice a week individual therapy for this and this therapist agrees he needs this before he can begin. To work to repair the damage his affair caused.

Therapy is not good to the victims of the abuse most of the time. They erroneously try to label the betrayed spouse as co-dependent or some other bullsh@t.

You have a shitty therapist. He/she is merely rug sweeping and not digging deep to address his faults that drove him to lie and cheat.

He needs to address his own issues before he can fully participate in couples therapy and you need your own therapist to address the damage his abuse (cheating is abuse) caused.

Please tell me that the bolded is a typo?! Marriage counselors actually recommend threesomes??

[Anonymous]

Nope.

Think of infidelity like this: your marriage is like a house that has termites, and we must get rid of the termites. But the affair had thrown a bomb into the house, setting it on fire. Gotta deal with the fire first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s OK to leave your husband at any time in this process. The truth is that what you want is completely reasonable - a sense of remorse for the hurt he’s caused you as opposed to the hurt he’s experienced as a result of his own actions, some sense that he knows why he did it so he knows how not to do it again, transparency about the past and in the future, a sincere apology, and a long periods of acts on his part that show he is rebuilding and re-earning your trust in him.

But, the truth is that the same character qualities that lead a partner to cheat also lead a partner to be unable to do any of the above.

Add to that that individual counseling or psychotherapy in this issue (infidelity) is generally of very poor quality, well, the odds are extremely slim that your relationship will come back to a healthy place.

I’m sorry. Please get yourself an individual counselor who understands PTSD.

He is actually doing all of these things except the knowing why he did it. He is trying daily and weekly to do better. He just keeps asking when can we get over this and go back to normal and I'm wondering why he doesn't see that the process has just begun. We are far from being on a healthy path yet.

OP, I have been in your shoes. You mentioned mental illness. What is his diagnosis? Are you saying his mental illness is sex addiction? Is he seeing a psychiatrist? Is he on medication? Do you participate for 5-10 minutes at every psychiatry appointment to provide independent input about mood and behavior?

Sex addiction alone is not really a mental illness. It is a manifestation of personality disorder or mental illness. For example, a person can use sex to self-soothe anxiety. Or a person may be diagnosed as a sex addict for behaviors that are driven by underlying mania or hypomania that creates hypersexuality — common in bipolar depression. The right diagnosis is key to finding the right medication, and doing so is just the beginning to getting better. Or sex addiction could be a reflection of personality disorder like sociopathy or psychopathy.

IME with mentally ill family members, therapy doesn’t work until AFTER the family member is on the right medication.

For you, I encourage participation in SA-anon (like Al-anon but for partners of sex addicts).

As for when things can get back to normal - the answer is never. He broke the relationship. You will never get back to that relationship. You have a shot at building a new, healthier one. The sooner you both recognize that the better.

So far he is diagnosed with ADHD, anxiety, and depression. He is getting medication for it. It's not really sex addiction because he really isn't that into sex most of his life. He has a peculiar behavior related to sex where he doesn't really trust himself or relate well to it. He doesn't deal with it well. I agree with you on the never getting back to the old relationship and starting a new one if possible or not.

[Anonymous]

BTW, thank you for all of this help. Honestly this is so much better than the therapy I've experienced so far. I feel like I have a much better path forward for myself with this help. My DH btw is seeing someone for his own personal issues and a psychologist/psychiatrist as well. I am getting my own help too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Nope.

Think of infidelity like this: your marriage is like a house that has termites, and we must get rid of the termites. But the affair had thrown a bomb into the house, setting it on fire. Gotta deal with the fire first.

Sorry but what is the termite and fire in this analogy? The fire is the affair, so what is the termite?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nope.

Think of infidelity like this: your marriage is like a house that has termites, and we must get rid of the termites. But the affair had thrown a bomb into the house, setting it on fire. Gotta deal with the fire first.

Sorry but what is the termite and fire in this analogy? The fire is the affair, so what is the termite?

No marriage is perfect. The termites are all the little things that eat away at your relationship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op again. Upon research I have seen people and other therapists say that just working on a positive relationship helps more than unpacking the hurt of infidelity, so just thought this is what the therapist was doing. I still don't know how I feel about the tactic and wanted to see what other options are out there.

It's not like we can't work on the relationship. Having fun together or talking about joy does strengthen it, but it seems very superficial and doesn't alleviate the fears that another horrible betrayal will happen the next time any sort of strain arises in the marriage. It doesn't seem to build strength. At some point soon I still feel like we need to revisit this very hurtful action to the marriage and see if we can get through it to make the marriage stronger.

Ask that therapist what is planned approach is, what milestones he's looking to achieve, in what order and when. If he doesn't have on- on to the next! Don't waste your time or money with someone that wants to beat around a bush and you're not interested. Therapists are as varied (and inept) as the general population, so not finding someone to be a good match isn't unusual.