Any updates re the Hoggle children?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

Sure it's not hard. You don't have a CLUE.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

Sure it's not hard. You don't have a CLUE.

Yes I have a clue. I don’t let crazy people take my or their kids in a car with them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

She took the daughter out of the house while everyone was asleep. How would you have prevented that, PP. Be specific.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

Sure it's not hard. You don't have a CLUE.

You are an apologist and it’s disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

She took the daughter out of the house while everyone was asleep. How would you have prevented that, PP. Be specific.

Her father was watching her, he let her take her son out alone. That was not allowed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

She took the daughter out of the house while everyone was asleep. How would you have prevented that, PP. Be specific.

No she didn’t. She killed the both before the h arrived home when she was in the care of her father.

He never checked their beds before he went to bed, so he didn’t know they were both dead until the next morning. She woke up early and fled

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

She took the daughter out of the house while everyone was asleep. How would you have prevented that, PP. Be specific.

No she didn’t. She killed the both before the h arrived home when she was in the care of her father.

He never checked their beds before he went to bed, so he didn’t know they were both dead until the next morning. She woke up early and fled

Inaccurate. You need to review the details more carefully, and lose the judgment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

It's a bit more complex than that.

Troy, the children's father and Catherine's former partner, was separated from Catherine but they were living together. They never married but had been together off and on for a long time.

The whole family knew Catherine's mental health was a significant danger. But, as many have mentioned here, it's extremely challenging to navigate. If you all are referring to Catherine's father being at fault, that's another matter. I think both of her parents displayed horrible decision making skills that day. They're both at least partially at fault, in my opinion. And I don't believe her mental health exists in a vacuum. I believe her parents are both despicable and created the monster that is Catherine.

May those babies RIP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

It's a bit more complex than that.

Troy, the children's father and Catherine's former partner, was separated from Catherine but they were living together. They never married but had been together off and on for a long time.

The whole family knew Catherine's mental health was a significant danger. But, as many have mentioned here, it's extremely challenging to navigate. If you all are referring to Catherine's father being at fault, that's another matter. I think both of her parents displayed horrible decision making skills that day. They're both at least partially at fault, in my opinion. And I don't believe her mental health exists in a vacuum. I believe her parents are both despicable and created the monster that is Catherine.

May those babies RIP.

The mother wasn’t even there that day. It’s all in the dad.

[Anonymous]

On ^^

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

And for the record, people with paranoid schizophrenia are not typically violent. It’s not unreasonable the choices they made as real humans trying to live in a country with little support - the husband HAD to work, we only have unpaid family leave so it’s not like he could take leave to handle this family crisis. They were doing the best they could and better than some would have (making a whole supervision plan to begin with). It’s a TRAGEDY. For everyone - the mom with mental illness too.

Its not hard when she can only have supervised time with the kids. It’s not complicated, don’t leave her alone with the kids.

She took the daughter out of the house while everyone was asleep. How would you have prevented that, PP. Be specific.

No she didn’t. She killed the both before the h arrived home when she was in the care of her father.

He never checked their beds before he went to bed, so he didn’t know they were both dead until the next morning. She woke up early and fled

Inaccurate. You need to review the details more carefully, and lose the judgment.

Stop reading the internet and read the police report.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can someone please explain what evidence there is that she killed them? I can' think of a few other scenarios. Why assume the worst? What **actual** evidence is there?

Correction to the other post.

She was ordered to never be alone with the children. Her father let he be alone with them. He should be charged.

She killed them each in a separate events hours apart and dumped them in dumpsters. Their bodies will essentially never be found in the dump. She admitted the murder to a coworker but can’t be proved.

She’s intelligent. If she is competent to stand trial she will be found guilty. If she continues to pretend to be incompetent to stand trial she will remain in a mental facility.

She will remain in a mental facility.

Supposedly he dropped her and the kids off with her mother that afternoon before he went to work.

No. Wrong.

I saw him state that in an interview.

PP, what makes you think he's lying. And pretty sure even if he did leave her alone that's not illegal. If she was perceived as a danger to herself or others, she would have been placed on a psych hold not allowed some loose-goosey "care plan" right?

He’s lying.

She was under court order supervision by her family. The h had to work and the father watched her during the day. He is a loon and left her alone with the kids.

Catherine's father left her alone?

The story's a little convoluted but sounds like the family did the best they could in a horrible situation. Catherine and the kids often stayed at her mother's house while the husband Troy worked. The mother wasn't home that day but Catherine's father (the ex) had agreed to come over to stay with them. Catherine said she was going to get pizza and Jacob wanted to go. They left, she came back without Jacob claiming he was at a sleepover with a friend. Everyone went to bed. The next morning the father left early, Catherine disappeared with the daughter, and the husband then realized the three were missing. More details here:

https://www.cnhinews.com/news/article_8abe57a6-69aa-11e4-9e0c-2bc85ebd6450.html

Catherine’s father let her take the son alone. She killed him and dumped his body.

They thought she was doing better. It's very sad.

No they didn’t. The father broke the law.

There is absolutely no mention of any custody agreement - there is nothing legal about it. She was married to her husband and they were all taking care of the kids. She was receiving treatment in an outpatient program. The family had gotten her a psychiatric eval and inpatient treatment but she was discharged quickly. This is how it works. There is little you can do. So they developed a plan as a family even though she was doing better, to try to provide as much supervision as possible and have another adult there. This is complex and it isn’t on the father. Don’t be cruel. Have you had a family member with severe and persistent mental illness? It’s truly one of the worst uphill battles.

It's a bit more complex than that.

Troy, the children's father and Catherine's former partner, was separated from Catherine but they were living together. They never married but had been together off and on for a long time.

The whole family knew Catherine's mental health was a significant danger. But, as many have mentioned here, it's extremely challenging to navigate. If you all are referring to Catherine's father being at fault, that's another matter. I think both of her parents displayed horrible decision making skills that day. They're both at least partially at fault, in my opinion. And I don't believe her mental health exists in a vacuum. I believe her parents are both despicable and created the monster that is Catherine.

May those babies RIP.

No matter how terrible of a parent you are, you can’t make your child psychotic. That’s something even the best parent will struggle with.

[Anonymous]

In other words, there is no evidence she killed those kids. None.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In other words, there is no evidence she killed those kids. None.

Yes there is but she is not competent to stand trial so it can’t go to trial.