Emotional needs of our students

[Anonymous]

Again, we don't live in California. I also don't see what connection you are trying to draw between the tenured teachers and the original purpose for this thread "Emotional needs of our students" Do you personally feel threatened because people in this thread have said things about the stress levels on students at least at some level coming from parental expectations? So now you need to attack teachers? Wow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A problem in this area is there is such a large concentration of parents who went to Ivies or other very good schools that the kids in this area feel a very palpable pressure to go to those schools. That puts a heavy burden to excel academically on kids, especially since there are so many other kids in the same class/school feeling the same way. The pressure could be self imposed or could be from real expectations imposed by parents, but, either way, it is magnified in this area because of the large number of kids competing to be among the chosen few. I'm not criticizing the drive to get into Ivies, I'm just pointing out that while most of the time the demographics in this area provides our kids with benefits, it can at times create unintended burdens. Each ivy will only take so many kids from one school, the kids know this, and the pressure begins. The kids also want to be as successful professionally as their parents, which is another high bar in this area. Again, this is not a criticism of having a drive to be successful, I'm just pointing out that sometimes we forget or don't notice some of the pressures our kids face.

As I said, quotas are a serious problem. Fairness isn't really fair.

No, the problem is the entitlement mentality implicit in this statement. Your child is not entitled to admission to an Ivy League school or to UVA. Nor, for that matter, are you or your child entitled to fairness. WTH does fairness even mean in this context? Why is your straight A student more entitled to admission than the tens of thousands of other straight A students? Why isn't it just as "fair" for a college to decide it wants students from a variety of different backgrounds?

There is a certain class of parent--bright, highly educated, overachieving and overpaid--who seems in some essential way to be stuck in 3rd grade emotionally. "That's not fair! My child works so hard, she deserves this!" My god, grow the fuck up! Life isn't fair. And you are doing a grave disservice to your children by encouraging them to just work a little harder so they can enjoy all those special opportunities they so richly deserve. The unspoken message you send to your child is: if I don't get what I want, it must be because I didn't deserve it. What you fail to teach your children is that no one gets what they want all the time, no matter how smart you are or how hard you work. What you fail to teach your children is to expect occasional disappointment and the resiliency to handle it when it comes.

No my child isn't entitled, nor did I say that. That IS MY POINT. T he child who gets in who doesn't make the cut grade-wise, standardized test wise isn't either. But that child gets in. Why? You know damn well what the answer is. "Fairness". It's not FAIR that you have money and they don't. It's not FAIR, so we are going to ensure there are tight quotas coming out of that school with wealthy kids. We are going to punish the KIDS simply because their PARENTS have done well.

You clearly aren't reading the thread. What you are doing is saying "Oh, Langley parents are wealthy and I hate them for that. Therefore they think they are entitled to everything."

You have colossally missed the point; but thanks for making *my* point so neatly.

You think that if things were "fair," your well-qualified child would get in. But that isn't true. There are tens of thousands of kids who look JUST LIKE YOUR KID. They can't all get into Harvard. There is no "fair" way to allow access to every one. Your child is working so hard not to get into Harvard but to be eligible to buy a lottery ticket to Harvard. It's not "fair," because there aren't enough spaces for all the eligible kids.

Even if there were enough space, you don't get to make the rules. Someone else had decided that there are benefits *to the school* to having kids from different backgrounds. It's THEIR school. They get to make the rules. THAT'S fair to them. It would not be fair to Harvard to make them play by YOUR rules. And that's the point: there is no objectively fair way to admit students to college. You can say it's not fair to allow the kids of wealhty alums in to Harvard, too. But if I'm an alum donating lots to Harvard, well admission for my kids seems pretty fair to me.

The other thing I will point out is that you are arguing that your child is disadvantaged in the game of life because she has well-off parents. Are you kidding? If you really think there is an advantage to raising your children in poorer circumstances and sending them to schools with fewer resources, then why haven't you done so?

This is exactly what I am talking about. You are so entitled in your thinking, you think someone is doing you a bad turn. You and your children are victims of discrimination. "It's not fair!!!"

It's like the opposite of the old saying. You weren't born on 3rd base and think you hit a triple. Your child was born on third base and you think she is stuck on first.

Missing out on Harvard is not a "punishment." But if you think so, no wonder your kids are so anxious.

Do you believe black and Hispanic children should have a lower threshold (grades and lower test scores) to college entry than a white person or Asian person? Yes or no

[Anonymous]

Disadvantaged Black or Hispanic? Yes of course. That's only fair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Again, we don't live in California. I also don't see what connection you are trying to draw between the tenured teachers and the original purpose for this thread "Emotional needs of our students" Do you personally feel threatened because people in this thread have said things about the stress levels on students at least at some level coming from parental expectations? So now you need to attack teachers? Wow.

If you can't fire bad teachers because the process is arduous, then kids suffer. That article was clear. I am not attacking all teachers. But you do seem to be blaming all parents because you know what I am saying about unions is correct.

If you teach, you should know not living in CA doesn't make this article applicable. If you think it does? Wow

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Disadvantaged Black or Hispanic? Yes of course. That's only fair.

That's incredibly insulting to those children. I personally believe they are capable of achieving what white kids and Asians do. They are equally as smart. People like yourself, the 'do-gooders', are the ones that keep them disadvantaged due to low expectations.

Do you want a paramedic for whom the bar was lowered to help you in an emergency as well?

[Anonymous]

Actually, I don't think what you are saying about unions or VA's "education associations" is correct. CA and NY probably have very strong unions, but VA doesn't. Outside of advice, I have not known anyone personally here in VA who has been aided by the FEA or similar group in keeping their job. If you talk to any teachers that belong to VEA or anything like that they'd tell you what I am going to tell you - we join for the liability insurance to protect ourselves and our families from financial ruin from crackpots suing us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Disadvantaged Black or Hispanic? Yes of course. That's only fair.

That's incredibly insulting to those children. I personally believe they are capable of achieving what white kids and Asians do. They are equally as smart. People like yourself, the 'do-gooders', are the ones that keep them disadvantaged due to low expectations.

Do you want a paramedic for whom the bar was lowered to help you in an emergency as well?

Is this because the kid from Buchanan County, Virginia was accepted to UVA and your 4.something kid was not?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Actually, I don't think what you are saying about unions or VA's "education associations" is correct. CA and NY probably have very strong unions, but VA doesn't. Outside of advice, I have not known anyone personally here in VA who has been aided by the FEA or similar group in keeping their job. If you talk to any teachers that belong to VEA or anything like that they'd tell you what I am going to tell you - we join for the liability insurance to protect ourselves and our families from financial ruin from crackpots suing us.

Let's hit closer to home, shall we? http://watchdog.org/59495/va-continuing-contracts-for-teachers-fuel-new-tenure-battle/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Disadvantaged Black or Hispanic? Yes of course. That's only fair.

That's incredibly insulting to those children. I personally believe they are capable of achieving what white kids and Asians do. They are equally as smart. People like yourself, the 'do-gooders', are the ones that keep them disadvantaged due to low expectations.

Do you want a paramedic for whom the bar was lowered to help you in an emergency as well?

Is this because the kid from Buchanan County, Virginia was accepted to UVA and your 4.something kid was not?

My kid's a junior and has no interest in UVA. I am not from here originally and care not one whit about VA schools. She'll attend where SHE feels most comfortable.

Do you think that kid from Buchanan county is not as smart as a kid from Langley? If so, why?

[Anonymous]

No my child isn't entitled, nor did I say that. That IS MY POINT. T he child who gets in who doesn't make the cut grade-wise, standardized test wise isn't either. But that child gets in. Why? You know damn well what the answer is. "Fairness". It's not FAIR that you have money and they don't. It's not FAIR, so we are going to ensure there are tight quotas coming out of that school with wealthy kids. We are going to punish the KIDS simply because their PARENTS have done well.

You clearly aren't reading the thread. What you are doing is saying "Oh, Langley parents are wealthy and I hate them for that. Therefore they think they are entitled to everything."

You have colossally missed the point; but thanks for making *my* point so neatly.

You think that if things were "fair," your well-qualified child would get in. But that isn't true. There are tens of thousands of kids who look JUST LIKE YOUR KID. They can't all get into Harvard. There is no "fair" way to allow access to every one. Your child is working so hard not to get into Harvard but to be eligible to buy a lottery ticket to Harvard. It's not "fair," because there aren't enough spaces for all the eligible kids.

Even if there were enough space, you don't get to make the rules. Someone else had decided that there are benefits *to the school* to having kids from different backgrounds. It's THEIR school. They get to make the rules. THAT'S fair to them. It would not be fair to Harvard to make them play by YOUR rules. And that's the point: there is no objectively fair way to admit students to college. You can say it's not fair to allow the kids of wealhty alums in to Harvard, too. But if I'm an alum donating lots to Harvard, well admission for my kids seems pretty fair to me.

The other thing I will point out is that you are arguing that your child is disadval.p.ntaged in the game of life because she has well-off parents. Are you kidding? If you really think there is an advantage to raising your children in poorer circumstances and sending them to schools with fewer resources, then why haven't you done so?

This is exactly what I am talking about. You are so entitled in your thinking, you think someone is doing you a bad turn. You and your children are victims of discrimination. "It's not fair!!!"

It's like the opposite of the old saying. You weren't born on 3rd base and think you hit a triple. Your child was born on third base and you think she is stuck on first.

Missing out on Harvard is not a "punishment." But if you think so, no wonder your kids are so anxious.

Do you believe black and Hispanic children should have a lower threshold (grades and lower test scores) to college entry than a white person or Asian person? Yes or no





So now the Langley suicides were because black and Hispanic kids have a lower threshold than whites and Asians. Wow, didn't see that one coming. You do realize there are many more kids who get into Harvard with a lower threshold because of money/legacy than because they are black or Hispanic, right? Keep telling yourself that all the stress the kids in this area face is because of lower thresholds for blacks and Hispanics,that will help find a solution

[Anonymous]

Speaking from experience as someone who has taught in California and also had my own children as students in that state, tenured teachers coasting to retirement are the very last people in a school that you need to worry about putting undo pressure on or destroying the fragile self esteem of students.

You who keeps blaming them is barking up the wrong tree without a doubt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

No my child isn't entitled, nor did I say that. That IS MY POINT. T he child who gets in who doesn't make the cut grade-wise, standardized test wise isn't either. But that child gets in. Why? You know damn well what the answer is. "Fairness". It's not FAIR that you have money and they don't. It's not FAIR, so we are going to ensure there are tight quotas coming out of that school with wealthy kids. We are going to punish the KIDS simply because their PARENTS have done well.

You clearly aren't reading the thread. What you are doing is saying "Oh, Langley parents are wealthy and I hate them for that. Therefore they think they are entitled to everything."

You have colossally missed the point; but thanks for making *my* point so neatly.

You think that if things were "fair," your well-qualified child would get in. But that isn't true. There are tens of thousands of kids who look JUST LIKE YOUR KID. They can't all get into Harvard. There is no "fair" way to allow access to every one. Your child is working so hard not to get into Harvard but to be eligible to buy a lottery ticket to Harvard. It's not "fair," because there aren't enough spaces for all the eligible kids.

Even if there were enough space, you don't get to make the rules. Someone else had decided that there are benefits *to the school* to having kids from different backgrounds. It's THEIR school. They get to make the rules. THAT'S fair to them. It would not be fair to Harvard to make them play by YOUR rules. And that's the point: there is no objectively fair way to admit students to college. You can say it's not fair to allow the kids of wealhty alums in to Harvard, too. But if I'm an alum donating lots to Harvard, well admission for my kids seems pretty fair to me.

The other thing I will point out is that you are arguing that your child is disadval.p.ntaged in the game of life because she has well-off parents. Are you kidding? If you really think there is an advantage to raising your children in poorer circumstances and sending them to schools with fewer resources, then why haven't you done so?

This is exactly what I am talking about. You are so entitled in your thinking, you think someone is doing you a bad turn. You and your children are victims of discrimination. "It's not fair!!!"

It's like the opposite of the old saying. You weren't born on 3rd base and think you hit a triple. Your child was born on third base and you think she is stuck on first.

Missing out on Harvard is not a "punishment." But if you think so, no wonder your kids are so anxious.

Do you believe black and Hispanic children should have a lower threshold (grades and lower test scores) to college entry than a white person or Asian person? Yes or no





So now the Langley suicides were because black and Hispanic kids have a lower threshold than whites and Asians. Wow, didn't see that one coming. You do realize there are many more kids who get into Harvard with a lower threshold because of money/legacy than because they are black or Hispanic, right? Keep telling yourself that all the stress the kids in this area face is because of lower thresholds for blacks and Hispanics,that will help find a solution

I never said that. You know it. You are twisting it because you or someone else like yourself admitted that you feel the bar should be lowered because these kids can't be expected to get in on their own merit. I, on the other hand believe they can.

When you have people like yourself legislating on this belief, the net result is one group has to work much harder than another for the same benefit. And you think that's not stressful? How do you feel when one or two people on your team don't do their share of the work and you have to work overtime and weekends to make up for it. Pretty damn stressed, right?

[Anonymous]

Quotes got messed up - this was my reply:

I never said that. You know it. You are twisting it because you or someone else like yourself admitted that you feel the bar should be lowered because these kids can't be expected to get in on their own merit. I, on the other hand believe they can.

When you have people like yourself legislating on this belief, the net result is one group has to work much harder than another for the same benefit. And you think that's not stressful? How do you feel when one or two people on your team don't do their share of the work and you have to work overtime and weekends to make up for it. Pretty damn stressed, right?

[Anonymous]

Did the kid from Buchanan County have AP courses, SAT study class, private tutors and multiple opportunities to take the SAT and ACTs? Did the same kid have the time and opportunity to play club volleyball, train with professional coaches and play tournaments all over the world? Has the kid seen in person the Taj Mahal, the Himeji Castle and attend the Pope's Easter Mass? I could go on and on and on.
So, yeah, if that kid gets an advantage in college admissions, I won't cry foul.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Speaking from experience as someone who has taught in California and also had my own children as students in that state, tenured teachers coasting to retirement are the very last people in a school that you need to worry about putting undo pressure on or destroying the fragile self esteem of students.

You who keeps blaming them is barking up the wrong tree without a doubt.

My friend, who has taught in CA for 20 years, begs to differ. She has sat on teams where they want to bring back ebonics and/or is told that she must grade improper English as correct because the bar must be lowered for these students. She refuses. She gets kids pushed through the system (she teaches 6th grade), thrown at her, with a 'good luck with this one'. As she put it, she's just narcissistic enough to want to prove those teachers wrong. And she does EVERY time. By the time those kids leave her classroom, they are prepared for 7th grade - she has brought some up multiple grade levels simply by changing how she teaches those children. And she has large classes - no excuse, she says. I have personally sent her iPads and other tools when she can't get them from the district. She does a lot of tactile projects. She had one kid who thought he was a failure, was always in detention, etc. Within two weeks she had pinpointed a suspected learning disability, set up testing, and had it confirmed. Kid went from failing to straight As. He was plenty smart - why didn't the other teachers notice or care? Did the parents care? Yes. They were Asian and spoke very little English and had no idea what was going on. They were at a loss. The administration didn't reach out to them. The guidance counselor did not reach out to them. The school board did not reach out to them. My friend did.

And THAT'S how you fix a school. By keeping teachers like my friend and getting RID of those that aren't.

This year, she happens to have the student of a parent who is a very famous businessman. She had no idea until he contacted her after her 'welcome to my classroom, this is how I teach' letter. She caught his attention in very positive ways. This should get good.