Do some parents just have bad luck in the kid department?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ignore 12:58, she's a smug fool.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ignore 12:58, she's a smug fool.

Another +1

[Anonymous]

Our three teen children are all very different from each other in interests, physical aptitude, academic interest, and sociability, among other factors.

They are all basically good kids, but one is an insanely easy child who is extremely helpful all almost all the time, another does things as we ask, and with the third it's a constant struggle over everything.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think easy kids necessarily make for successful adults, so I wouldn't judge too soon. I know I was a kid who challenged authority constantly and was not an easy personality. But I've become a very successful adult who now challenges authority by litigating. As an attorney it's made me quite successful and I enjoy it. With a professional outlet for that aspect of my personality, I have successful relationships with my husband and kids.

I know a lot of easy kids who it became directionless adults when they didn't have anyone telling them what to do anymore. They floundered and have really struggled as adults.

Then maybe they weren’t so easy. My kid is outwardly easy but his problem is that he doesn’t have any persistence or grit. Maybe it’s precisely what makes him easy. However it’s a struggle to make him work hard and be accountable. I can totally see him as directionless when he’s older.

pathetic and sad

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's the parents fault.

Not always.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think easy kids necessarily make for successful adults, so I wouldn't judge too soon. I know I was a kid who challenged authority constantly and was not an easy personality. But I've become a very successful adult who now challenges authority by litigating. As an attorney it's made me quite successful and I enjoy it. With a professional outlet for that aspect of my personality, I have successful relationships with my husband and kids.

I know a lot of easy kids who it became directionless adults when they didn't have anyone telling them what to do anymore. They floundered and have really struggled as adults.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom was super self-righteous about how her superior parenting with my older sister and me. Then she had my younger sister who was a total nightmare from day one.

Op here. My daughter has a friend who is lovely. Mom and dad are amazing. She has a sister who is the meanest unkind girl I have ever met. The mom said she has been difficult from the day she came home from the hospital screaming and basically never stopped. We have known this family for a long time and the girl physically abuses her sister and parents.

But some kids are difficult from day one and still turn out great because they have great parents. There is a lot you can do to help a kid who might have challenges. The idea that a baby came home from the hospital screaming (an infant, a totally defenseless and unself-aware newborn baby) and these great parents just never figured out how to help her? I don't buy it. I think what happens is that some kids have challenges and their parents aren't up to the task. They might be okay with an easy kid who doesn't have those challenges, but they can't accept or are not willing to do the greater level of parenting work that it takes to parent a child who isn't easy, so they give up and say "oh it's just nature."

But some parents do figure out how to parent those kids, and the kids don't become the meanest, unkind children you've ever met and they don't physically abuse their family members. Because their needs (which were higher than most kids' needs) were met. Their parents are better parents than that girl's parents.

Some kids do fine with Parenting 101. Other kids require a PhD in Parenting, Nutirion, Psychology, and training in medicine, physical therapy, OT, speech and languge, and special education, plus a bit of law thrown in. It's hard to judge the parents who are not experts in all of the latter if they struggle with that kid.

[Anonymous]

It’s up to parenting quite a bit. Too many parents give empty threats early on and create monsters. Consequences, follow through and things change and become a whole lot easier.

[Anonymous]

Of course-good parents can have rotten kids. And vice-versa. One of the kindest people I ever met had a father who beat her regularly.

[Anonymous]

Too many parents are inconsistent with boundaries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ignore 12:58, she's a smug fool.

Another +1

Wow + 1000

[Anonymous]

I have so many friends and colleagues who have kids with special needs of one kind or another and to varying degrees of special. This quantity is so much higher than when I was a kid - must be some environmental change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:both. But I have noticed it usually takes until 3 kids+ for parents to realize "for real" it's not them. Parents of 2 or 1 kid have an outblown sense of their impact esp. if they don't have a harder to parent kid.

This. Parenting does play a role, but some kids are just difficult and problematic. Mothers with 3+ kids all know this. If you have at least 3 kids, chances are high at least one of them is more difficult than the others. While they may not be a total train wreck, it definitely enforces that how you kids behave and turn out isn’t all because of your parenting and influence.

You have this backwards. Parenting plays the biggest role in the kids who are "difficult and problematic." That's the difference between very good parents and mediocre or bad parents.

Most parents can raise an easy kid with few challenges. The key there is just not to screw it up (which even some parents can't manage). But you don't have to *work* that hard at it if the kid is just kind of naturally flexible and easy going with no special needs or learning challenges.

But some kids have real challenges and then parents have to work at it, and it's hard. And if you do it well, the kids with challenges can be great. If you do it poorly, it can in fact be a total train wreck. The job is harder and not everyone is up to the task. And this is what people are talking about when they say they thought they understood what it meant to be a good parent, and then had an additional kid who had more challenges. That's when you *really* find out what it is to be a good parent, when you realize the level of patience, emotional maturity, creativity, dedication, and faith it takes to to raise some kids to adulthood.

When I encounter a parent who says "oh parenting can only do so much, so kids are just problematic," that's when I know I've encountered a parent who just isn't up to the task.

Some kids are difficult and problematic no matter how good the parenting is. What you end up seeing is “the best” that kid can be. It may seem pretty bad to you as an outsider, but it could be so much worse with poor parents.

One of my good friends has a very difficult kid. They work so hard for him: therapy, parenting support, psychological treatment, on top of his school work. He still gets in a lot of trouble and isn’t passing all his classes. I have no doubt without such dedicated parents he would be a drug addict and in juvy or jail right now.

I really appreciate this. My kids are great kids but have a couple really significant struggles. One has a pretty limited diet despite YEARS of feeding therapy, working out butts off to do everything “right”. And sometimes it’s discouraging that we can’t go to many restaurants and I still have a lot of worries about how their social life will be affected by this. But they are a healthy weight with no nutritional deficiencies and have a food in every food group. I’m in some groups of children who have the same eating issues (ARFID) and it helps me realize these are huge wins. Many of those parents are also trying their best- they are posting and gathering ideas and trying all sorts of things. It’s just a good reminder to have some perspective- I hope the years of interventions HAVE made a difference! We will never really know. But I do know before we got professional help we were definitely making things worse for this child by trying to do the things that worked for us as typical eaters growing up. So I think we easily could have continued down the path of making things worse instead of better.

Why can’t you “go to many restaurants”? They don’t have to eat there, do they?
I have a friend who has a DD with eating challenges (only a few foods) and she just gives her what she brought for her when they go to restaurants with friends

PP you are responding to and my child is still completely disgusted by the sight of and smell of some foods and will literally vomit from having them in their proximity. They have also had full on panic attacks in challenging restaurants. They can go to many more than they could at 2! But it’s still incredibly stressful for the whole family and not something we take lightly. I am happy for your friend their child’s challenges are much more mild, but please don’t make the mid of thinking that approach works for everyone (and I hate to say it but restaurants start to push back on bringing outside food when the kid looks more like an adult, even if you explain the child’s difficulty in excruciating detail).

NP with a kid who has ARFID and I really feel you -- I have been there and it sucks because nobody understands and they all think it's just normal pickiness or that you just didn't offer enough food variety when your kid was a toddler or something.

That said, I do actually appreciate the PP's comment because I think the idea is that you don't have to do it the way other people do it. My kid also has those extreme food aversions to the point of gagging even at the sight or smell of food. But we'd look for any opening. So like for years we only went out to eat if it was one restaurant our kid could tolerate OR we could sit outside where our kid wouldn't have to smell the food and could even walk away from the table if necessary. Like for years that's what we did. So we'd eat out in the summer a lot more because there are lots of patios like that. With time and also lots of therapy that improved and now our kid can go in pretty much any restaurant, even though the range of foods she'll eat is still really narrow. I still bring food pretty much everywhere just to ensure she gets proper nutrition and we do staggered meals a lot (she'll eat her meal at home before we go out, and then DH and I will order food at the restaurant and she will just have a drink or maybe a small side or dessert).

The thing I had to get over was the judgment, because there's so much of it. But eventually I just hit a point where I accepted that no one was going to get it and lots of people would judge or think they knew better. Oh well. I live it so I know. My kid is never going to be an adventurous eater and who knows maybe we'll never have normal restaurant meals with her but we've found a way to make it work so we aren't shut ins for the rest of our lives and we can still travel. You deserve to have a life and not have to structure absolutely everything around your kids disability. I say that from experience and with empathy, not with judgment. I hope you find a way to have meals that are joyful and that nourish you. I know how hard it is when you are right in the thick of it and feel like your options are really restricted.

Look I know you are trying to be helpful, I KNOW you are, but it would be so great if you, as a fellow ARFID parent, could just hear that I am not asking for advice in this thread. I’m explaining how incredibly hard we have worked and how far my child has come even if it doesn’t look like it to you and my kid still looks “subpar” in this respect. We are still on our journey, and as I described we do go to restaurants and my child can go to more than they could previously, a lot more! This has been a huge goal for our whole family since this child was two, that we have worked one with a team of professionals, and I really don’t appreciate a lecturing post from someone who really doesn’t know our particular situation. We have to go VERY SLOWLY with increasing my child’s tolerance or it’s counter productive. I wish you well and I’m glad your child has a milder form of ARFID than mine.

[Anonymous]

Genes are very important. Some parents can do everything right and their kid still ends up being a train wreck. This is a little bit more likely to happen to affluent families that adopt because their adopted kids are often genetically average ( or below average) unlike the parents that tend to be genetically above average.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH and I were "golden" children who went to the best schools, made money, became famous in our respective fields. Our first child is off the charts brilliant but ASD, aggressive and has numerous health problems. His childhood has been something that most DCUM parents (and I say "most" because *thank you* SN forum and there is a huge spectrum on this board) have never dreamed of. I make my living being clever and an out of the box thinker but nothing has compared to trying to help DS. He will always lead a different life. And DH and I have a second child who is not such an outlier but as we have "parenting on hard mode" (shall I say expert mode, honestly?) it is a challenge to balance it all and be human.

I have lots of first-world problems in my professional life, but I have been reading DCUM for 10+ years. I simply and more and more amazed and how lucky people are with their children. May you never need to visit a psychiatric hospital for your elementary school aged child. And may you never judge me for having to have had to do so. May you never have to worry that your child who weights 35 lbs could hurt someone and fear sending them to school.

It's been a hard road, but I'm delighted to be the Ivy professor who gives your child the guidance to make it to the next level. It's what's keeping me sane in my own personal fate, which, cruel as it seems often, is nothing like that of parents watching their children die of cancer. There are no guarantees on this Earth.

And to those of you who are still quick to judge in middle age, all I can say is that probably haven't learned much. I hope you have spent the spare time the world has given you without life sh*tting on you on some pretty seriously good work for the world. Tell us about eradicating Polio or a poem you wrote that kept a political prisoner alive or a nursing home population that finds new meaning. Or a rainforest you are saving or documenting or both. Because otherwise please do not talk to me unless it is to offer to take DS for care for a week. (I am fine if you are just chilling, or life has dealt you shitty cards, but if you are judging me, come prepared to play on karma and metaphysics front or stay home.) I'm still trying to cure cancer, but some weeks it is hard with a child who threatens to kill you when asked to do his homework.

Thanks OP for this topic.

You aren't going to want to hear this but oh well.

Your post is full of red flags indicating that your issues with your son are linked to choices and behaviors you and your spouse have made.

Just for starters, touting your achievements from the outset and highlighting external signifiers of high status indicates possible narcissism and likely a household with high expectations and little room for difference or failure. It's the kind of home that can cause anxiety in kids from a very, very young age, and when not treated or exacerbated, that can grow and cause a wide variety of mental health problems. Two parents with extremely demanding, high status jobs means less one on one time with either parent, more time with paid caregivers -- this may cause attachment issues. Very likely your son has anxious or (even more likely) disorganized attachment which can lead to depression and diagnosis of personality disorders.

You are looking at the whole situation as though parenting is similar to your other life experiences and accomplishments, something that can be mastered via brute force or dedication. It's not. Parenting is the ultimate finesse skill, it can't be hacked or crammed for or multitasked into submission. Using the approach you might use to ascend to the top of a competitive field is unlikely to be effective unless you get the most amenable and adaptable child, and even then that kid will almost certainly wind up in therapy as an adult, they just won't cause you as much trouble as a child.

If it helps, it's highly likely your deficiencies as parents can be traced back to dysfunction in your own childhoods, you could unpack that in therapy and it could help with a lot of things including your son. But it will require real vulnerability and being open to the idea that you have made mistakes and have real accountability for the problems with your on. It might also mean admitting that all the work you've put in for him has been misdirected, and that solutions like more in tough personal choices (like scaling back at work, being willing to admit your wrong, and opening your hear and your ears to your son who might have more intelligent things to say on this subject than you've ever given him credit for) rather than throwing money or "expertise" at it.

Good luck. It's hard to fail at something, especially if it's your first time and you have not cultivate the skill of failing and adapting before.

Who granted you a PhD is psychology, TikTok or Instagram?

If it helps, it’s likely that your deficiencies as a human are not due to your mental abilities, and you are just a jerk. You could unpack it in therapy, but it would require some tough personal choices like admitting that you are full of it.

Good luck. With your personality, you’ll need it.