STOP COMING IN SICK

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

The problem is, a lot of people only say that until they're on the receiving end of the consequences of changing those cultural expectations.

Health care is a good example. My wife is a doctor. She knows people get mad when she comes in while sick (she does wear a mask then, at least). But the anger communicated to her and her coworkers in those situations is *dwarfed* by the anger of patients who have the appointment they needed to schedule 3-months out cancelled at the last minute. And that is dwarfed by the people who have their procedures cancelled after they spent the night clearing out their bowels.

At one point they tried calling patients and giving them the option to reschedule when the provider was sick, but that just seemed to make them even more mad.

The health care case is more extreme than most, but the basic idea broadly applies. If you give people the option between *potentially* getting sick due to an exposure, or *definitely* being inconvenienced by someone not working, most will accept the risk of illness. Not everyone feels that way, but it doesn't seem anywhere close to an even split. The vast majority seem to at most grumble and then want to carry on.

Doctors need to call patients and give them the option to reschedule. A simple cold is several rounds of antibiotics and steroids and possible hospitalization. I’ve gotten sick twice by doctors and now I’ll just leave the appointment and reschedule as I go to the doctor for serious health issues and the last thing I need is the doctor to add to that. At least give a virtual option. Any doctor that risks their patients health should find a new profession.

Well, I'd say any doctor they prescribes several rounds of antibiotics for a "simple cold" should probably find a new profession...

The reality is, whether or not the doctor you see is visibility and knowingly sick doesn't change the fact that you risk exposure to infections whenever you go out in public. A visit with bilateral mask wearing with a sick provider may not be any more of a risk compared to the other interactions you'll have just to get there.

And if you're one of those patients that yells at the office staff for not wearing masks before your arrival-- or even worse, for not telling other patients in the waiting area to wear masks-- then just stop. That's never going to happen. The ones who come in and try to hand out KN-95s are at least better intentioned, but I find that pretty inappropriate, too.

If that describes you, I'd tell you to find a different provider, but you're unlikely to find any provider willing to do what you want.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

Great, find a way to implement universal sick leave for all US workers. Until you do, you’ll just have to get over people being sick at work.

I understand some people have limited options, but if you have leave or telework options and you come in anyway, you are a jackass and should be shunned. People should feel free to make you miserable in other ways so you get the message to wise up and be courteous.

Lol. So pathetic. Now wear a mask if you’re afraid of germs.

When you act shamefully, you should be made to feel shame. When you are rude, you should be made to feel shame. It's part of growing up to learn these lessons and be courteous to others. Being a jerk is pathetic.

No one is going to feel shame for doing what they need to in order to get paid. If you weren’t so privileged you’d get that. So yea, it’s pathetic that you can’t see beyond yourself to how the majority of this country has to do what is has to do to survive.

Did you miss the part about how this applies to people who have leave and the ability to telework. Yes, yes you did. Too busy being a jerk to read.

We all understand there are horrible work environments where people don't get adequate leave and are worried about being paid. Not talking about those circumstances. Talking about cases where perfectly entitled people with options still act this way and then try to gaslight their coworkers who are annoyed.

You have no idea what anyone’s situation is like. No one has enough sick leave for their own illnesses or time to care for their children so your little disclaimer was pointless and of course ignored.

That is untrue. Stop making excuses for yourself.

Really? What organization provides enough sick leave to cover every cold the worker and their children has?

This is what I’m saying. I truly do not believe posters saying there is no problem with unlimited pto or remote work at their jobs.

And this is especially true if coworkers are showing up sick. I would strongly suspect that they are doing so because they feel like they have to, not because they would prefer to be in office than in bed at home.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

Great, find a way to implement universal sick leave for all US workers. Until you do, you’ll just have to get over people being sick at work.

I understand some people have limited options, but if you have leave or telework options and you come in anyway, you are a jackass and should be shunned. People should feel free to make you miserable in other ways so you get the message to wise up and be courteous.

Lol. So pathetic. Now wear a mask if you’re afraid of germs.

When you act shamefully, you should be made to feel shame. When you are rude, you should be made to feel shame. It's part of growing up to learn these lessons and be courteous to others. Being a jerk is pathetic.

No one is going to feel shame for doing what they need to in order to get paid. If you weren’t so privileged you’d get that. So yea, it’s pathetic that you can’t see beyond yourself to how the majority of this country has to do what is has to do to survive.

Did you miss the part about how this applies to people who have leave and the ability to telework. Yes, yes you did. Too busy being a jerk to read.

We all understand there are horrible work environments where people don't get adequate leave and are worried about being paid. Not talking about those circumstances. Talking about cases where perfectly entitled people with options still act this way and then try to gaslight their coworkers who are annoyed.

You have no idea what anyone’s situation is like. No one has enough sick leave for their own illnesses or time to care for their children so your little disclaimer was pointless and of course ignored.

That is untrue. Stop making excuses for yourself.

Really? What organization provides enough sick leave to cover every cold the worker and their children has?

This is what I’m saying. I truly do not believe posters saying there is no problem with unlimited pto or remote work at their jobs.

And this is especially true if coworkers are showing up sick. I would strongly suspect that they are doing so because they feel like they have to, not because they would prefer to be in office than in bed at home.

They don’t. And we know one of them is the non-working wife fighting about her husband’s coworkers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

The problem is, a lot of people only say that until they're on the receiving end of the consequences of changing those cultural expectations.

Health care is a good example. My wife is a doctor. She knows people get mad when she comes in while sick (she does wear a mask then, at least). But the anger communicated to her and her coworkers in those situations is *dwarfed* by the anger of patients who have the appointment they needed to schedule 3-months out cancelled at the last minute. And that is dwarfed by the people who have their procedures cancelled after they spent the night clearing out their bowels.

At one point they tried calling patients and giving them the option to reschedule when the provider was sick, but that just seemed to make them even more mad.

The health care case is more extreme than most, but the basic idea broadly applies. If you give people the option between *potentially* getting sick due to an exposure, or *definitely* being inconvenienced by someone not working, most will accept the risk of illness. Not everyone feels that way, but it doesn't seem anywhere close to an even split. The vast majority seem to at most grumble and then want to carry on.

Doctors need to call patients and give them the option to reschedule. A simple cold is several rounds of antibiotics and steroids and possible hospitalization. I’ve gotten sick twice by doctors and now I’ll just leave the appointment and reschedule as I go to the doctor for serious health issues and the last thing I need is the doctor to add to that. At least give a virtual option. Any doctor that risks their patients health should find a new profession.

Well, I'd say any doctor they prescribes several rounds of antibiotics for a "simple cold" should probably find a new profession...

The reality is, whether or not the doctor you see is visibility and knowingly sick doesn't change the fact that you risk exposure to infections whenever you go out in public. A visit with bilateral mask wearing with a sick provider may not be any more of a risk compared to the other interactions you'll have just to get there.

And if you're one of those patients that yells at the office staff for not wearing masks before your arrival-- or even worse, for not telling other patients in the waiting area to wear masks-- then just stop. That's never going to happen. The ones who come in and try to hand out KN-95s are at least better intentioned, but I find that pretty inappropriate, too.

If that describes you, I'd tell you to find a different provider, but you're unlikely to find any provider willing to do what you want.

Masking is not the fix as colds are also surface based. So, they touch a surface, you touch, you are exposed. They touch you, you are exposed.

I don't say anything to doctors about masking. A decent doctor who sees me masking, masks. A bad doctor, just ignores the situation. They have masks at the office so its not my responsibility to provide them.

What is the alternative to antibiotics and steroids? Hospitalization. You do get that they are trying to keep me out of the hospital and dying, right? You are lucky you don't have any serious medical challenges. But, for those of us who do, staying health, is important.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man some of you can rationalize anything to yourselves. Use your leave.

Wear a mask, not everyone has leave.

Then obviously the comment would not apply to you. WTF?

You and your ilk need to be frequently reminded of this since you freely spout “use your leave”. You can’t see down from your ivory tower that most workers in the US do not get paid leave. And even if someone does earn paid leave, they are not using leave for every cold or cough. Get over it.

For those that have paid leave, that's what it is for. My spouse has no paid leave, no telework options so they don't work, we don't have income, and yet they still take off when necessary (and not for vacations as we haven't had one in years). So, those who get weeks off, if you can take a vacation, you can take off sick and not spread it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man some of you can rationalize anything to yourselves. Use your leave.

Wear a mask, not everyone has leave.

Then obviously the comment would not apply to you. WTF?

You and your ilk need to be frequently reminded of this since you freely spout “use your leave”. You can’t see down from your ivory tower that most workers in the US do not get paid leave. And even if someone does earn paid leave, they are not using leave for every cold or cough. Get over it.

For those that have paid leave, that's what it is for. My spouse has no paid leave, no telework options so they don't work, we don't have income, and yet they still take off when necessary (and not for vacations as we haven't had one in years). So, those who get weeks off, if you can take a vacation, you can take off sick and not spread it.

No, paid leave is not for a cold. Again, no one gets enough leave for every sickness that they or their kids may have. Sickness is everywhere in the world. Wear a mask if you don’t want to be exposed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

The problem is, a lot of people only say that until they're on the receiving end of the consequences of changing those cultural expectations.

Health care is a good example. My wife is a doctor. She knows people get mad when she comes in while sick (she does wear a mask then, at least). But the anger communicated to her and her coworkers in those situations is *dwarfed* by the anger of patients who have the appointment they needed to schedule 3-months out cancelled at the last minute. And that is dwarfed by the people who have their procedures cancelled after they spent the night clearing out their bowels.

At one point they tried calling patients and giving them the option to reschedule when the provider was sick, but that just seemed to make them even more mad.

The health care case is more extreme than most, but the basic idea broadly applies. If you give people the option between *potentially* getting sick due to an exposure, or *definitely* being inconvenienced by someone not working, most will accept the risk of illness. Not everyone feels that way, but it doesn't seem anywhere close to an even split. The vast majority seem to at most grumble and then want to carry on.

I guess I'm not most people, because I would just reschedule and I wouldn't yell at anybody. Grumble to myself maybe if I had done the colon cleanse! I wouldn't want a sick provider working on me. Not just because I could get sick, either. They need to rest. I want them at top speed when they are working on me. Of course it would be inconvenient, but sh*t happens.

That's pretty much what everyone said when the topic was floated as a hypothetical, but when faced with the actual choice and consequence, the overwhelming majority wanted to to keep their appointments after complaining that there wasn't someone else who could magically step in that day.

The magnitude might be exaggerated in the case of medicine, but I don't think the (begrudged) preference is unique. Everyone is busy and just trying to do everything they need to do.

It doesn't surprise me. A lot of the urgency is self-created. We really are an F-d up work culture in this country.

No, again, we're busy. I have doctors who schedule out 9 months. A cancellation is a huge deal.

In the case of my wife, she's booked up three months out. So, if her own personal medical appointment is cancelled at the last minute, she still has to wait three months to reschedule it even if her provider has earlier appointments.

If she were to have to cancel procedures, then the hourly workers that would support those cases aren't going to get paid, either. Nor will the other providers involved that might bill independently. People's livelihoods are affected.

My own job doesn't have effects like that. When I have to cancel, everyone will still get paid. No one will have to wait 9 months to reschedule. But there might be 100 people that have to wait another day or two for something. And those people are busy, too.

Some level of illnesses in the community is practically unavoidable, even with the best and most cautious of intents. There are asymptomatic cases. Pre-symptomatic but still contagious. Cases that present with all the signs as allergies but happen to be infections. So just living life requires an acceptance of illness. How much *additional* acceptance of illness is rational to avoid inconvenience? For most people, probably a fair bit.

If the main "cost" of illness is inconvenience and discomfort while recovering-- which, for most people
and illnesses, it is-- then it's going to be awfully hard to come out ahead by accepting guaranteed inconvenience just to avoid a potential illness.

As unpleasant as my recent case of (probably) flu was, I'd certainly prefer to go through that again rather than fall further behind in work or deal with the discomfort of masks all the time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

The problem is, a lot of people only say that until they're on the receiving end of the consequences of changing those cultural expectations.

Health care is a good example. My wife is a doctor. She knows people get mad when she comes in while sick (she does wear a mask then, at least). But the anger communicated to her and her coworkers in those situations is *dwarfed* by the anger of patients who have the appointment they needed to schedule 3-months out cancelled at the last minute. And that is dwarfed by the people who have their procedures cancelled after they spent the night clearing out their bowels.

At one point they tried calling patients and giving them the option to reschedule when the provider was sick, but that just seemed to make them even more mad.

The health care case is more extreme than most, but the basic idea broadly applies. If you give people the option between *potentially* getting sick due to an exposure, or *definitely* being inconvenienced by someone not working, most will accept the risk of illness. Not everyone feels that way, but it doesn't seem anywhere close to an even split. The vast majority seem to at most grumble and then want to carry on.

Doctors need to call patients and give them the option to reschedule. A simple cold is several rounds of antibiotics and steroids and possible hospitalization. I’ve gotten sick twice by doctors and now I’ll just leave the appointment and reschedule as I go to the doctor for serious health issues and the last thing I need is the doctor to add to that. At least give a virtual option. Any doctor that risks their patients health should find a new profession.

Well, I'd say any doctor they prescribes several rounds of antibiotics for a "simple cold" should probably find a new profession...

The reality is, whether or not the doctor you see is visibility and knowingly sick doesn't change the fact that you risk exposure to infections whenever you go out in public. A visit with bilateral mask wearing with a sick provider may not be any more of a risk compared to the other interactions you'll have just to get there.

And if you're one of those patients that yells at the office staff for not wearing masks before your arrival-- or even worse, for not telling other patients in the waiting area to wear masks-- then just stop. That's never going to happen. The ones who come in and try to hand out KN-95s are at least better intentioned, but I find that pretty inappropriate, too.

If that describes you, I'd tell you to find a different provider, but you're unlikely to find any provider willing to do what you want.

Masking is not the fix as colds are also surface based. So, they touch a surface, you touch, you are exposed. They touch you, you are exposed.

I don't say anything to doctors about masking. A decent doctor who sees me masking, masks. A bad doctor, just ignores the situation. They have masks at the office so its not my responsibility to provide them.

What is the alternative to antibiotics and steroids? Hospitalization. You do get that they are trying to keep me out of the hospital and dying, right? You are lucky you don't have any serious medical challenges. But, for those of us who do, staying health, is important.

You know virus don't transmit through your skin, right? Touch covid all you want. Just don't touch covid and then immediately pick your nose.

The things you seem to be worried about really can be very strongly mitigated by: 1) wearing a respirator, and 2) washing your hands before touching your mouth/nose/eyes.

And to the extent you don't do those two things, people staying home when they happen to know they're sick isn't going to be enough to stop you from getting sick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man some of you can rationalize anything to yourselves. Use your leave.

Wear a mask, not everyone has leave.

Then obviously the comment would not apply to you. WTF?

You and your ilk need to be frequently reminded of this since you freely spout “use your leave”. You can’t see down from your ivory tower that most workers in the US do not get paid leave. And even if someone does earn paid leave, they are not using leave for every cold or cough. Get over it.

For those that have paid leave, that's what it is for. My spouse has no paid leave, no telework options so they don't work, we don't have income, and yet they still take off when necessary (and not for vacations as we haven't had one in years). So, those who get weeks off, if you can take a vacation, you can take off sick and not spread it.

No, paid leave is not for a cold. Again, no one gets enough leave for every sickness that they or their kids may have. Sickness is everywhere in the world. Wear a mask if you don’t want to be exposed.

Yes, it is for a cold.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

The problem is, a lot of people only say that until they're on the receiving end of the consequences of changing those cultural expectations.

Health care is a good example. My wife is a doctor. She knows people get mad when she comes in while sick (she does wear a mask then, at least). But the anger communicated to her and her coworkers in those situations is *dwarfed* by the anger of patients who have the appointment they needed to schedule 3-months out cancelled at the last minute. And that is dwarfed by the people who have their procedures cancelled after they spent the night clearing out their bowels.

At one point they tried calling patients and giving them the option to reschedule when the provider was sick, but that just seemed to make them even more mad.

The health care case is more extreme than most, but the basic idea broadly applies. If you give people the option between *potentially* getting sick due to an exposure, or *definitely* being inconvenienced by someone not working, most will accept the risk of illness. Not everyone feels that way, but it doesn't seem anywhere close to an even split. The vast majority seem to at most grumble and then want to carry on.

Doctors need to call patients and give them the option to reschedule. A simple cold is several rounds of antibiotics and steroids and possible hospitalization. I’ve gotten sick twice by doctors and now I’ll just leave the appointment and reschedule as I go to the doctor for serious health issues and the last thing I need is the doctor to add to that. At least give a virtual option. Any doctor that risks their patients health should find a new profession.

Well, I'd say any doctor they prescribes several rounds of antibiotics for a "simple cold" should probably find a new profession...

The reality is, whether or not the doctor you see is visibility and knowingly sick doesn't change the fact that you risk exposure to infections whenever you go out in public. A visit with bilateral mask wearing with a sick provider may not be any more of a risk compared to the other interactions you'll have just to get there.

And if you're one of those patients that yells at the office staff for not wearing masks before your arrival-- or even worse, for not telling other patients in the waiting area to wear masks-- then just stop. That's never going to happen. The ones who come in and try to hand out KN-95s are at least better intentioned, but I find that pretty inappropriate, too.

If that describes you, I'd tell you to find a different provider, but you're unlikely to find any provider willing to do what you want.

Masking is not the fix as colds are also surface based. So, they touch a surface, you touch, you are exposed. They touch you, you are exposed.

I don't say anything to doctors about masking. A decent doctor who sees me masking, masks. A bad doctor, just ignores the situation. They have masks at the office so its not my responsibility to provide them.

What is the alternative to antibiotics and steroids? Hospitalization. You do get that they are trying to keep me out of the hospital and dying, right? You are lucky you don't have any serious medical challenges. But, for those of us who do, staying health, is important.

You know virus don't transmit through your skin, right? Touch covid all you want. Just don't touch covid and then immediately pick your nose.

The things you seem to be worried about really can be very strongly mitigated by: 1) wearing a respirator, and 2) washing your hands before touching your mouth/nose/eyes.

And to the extent you don't do those two things, people staying home when they happen to know they're sick isn't going to be enough to stop you from getting sick.

There are a lot more viruses than Covid, how do you not understand that. We are talking about a cold, not covid.

And even if you do those things, you can still get sick. I always mask in public and wash my hands as well as do sinus rinses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

Great, find a way to implement universal sick leave for all US workers. Until you do, you’ll just have to get over people being sick at work.

I understand some people have limited options, but if you have leave or telework options and you come in anyway, you are a jackass and should be shunned. People should feel free to make you miserable in other ways so you get the message to wise up and be courteous.

Lol. So pathetic. Now wear a mask if you’re afraid of germs.

When you act shamefully, you should be made to feel shame. When you are rude, you should be made to feel shame. It's part of growing up to learn these lessons and be courteous to others. Being a jerk is pathetic.

No one is going to feel shame for doing what they need to in order to get paid. If you weren’t so privileged you’d get that. So yea, it’s pathetic that you can’t see beyond yourself to how the majority of this country has to do what is has to do to survive.

Did you miss the part about how this applies to people who have leave and the ability to telework. Yes, yes you did. Too busy being a jerk to read.

We all understand there are horrible work environments where people don't get adequate leave and are worried about being paid. Not talking about those circumstances. Talking about cases where perfectly entitled people with options still act this way and then try to gaslight their coworkers who are annoyed.

You have no idea what anyone’s situation is like. No one has enough sick leave for their own illnesses or time to care for their children so your little disclaimer was pointless and of course ignored.

And yet these same people can take weeks off for vacations.

So now you’re omniscient and know every person’s future plans?

OP here and the poster who came in sick today just spent a week in Disney (which is probably why she was sick). So, PP is correct at least in this instance, she did have enough leave (and again, we can telework!)

Look, I am not referring to people where they can't call out for every cold they get. But at my job, we can work from home. If you can work from home when you're sick...why would you not?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

Great, find a way to implement universal sick leave for all US workers. Until you do, you’ll just have to get over people being sick at work.

I understand some people have limited options, but if you have leave or telework options and you come in anyway, you are a jackass and should be shunned. People should feel free to make you miserable in other ways so you get the message to wise up and be courteous.

Lol. So pathetic. Now wear a mask if you’re afraid of germs.

When you act shamefully, you should be made to feel shame. When you are rude, you should be made to feel shame. It's part of growing up to learn these lessons and be courteous to others. Being a jerk is pathetic.

No one is going to feel shame for doing what they need to in order to get paid. If you weren’t so privileged you’d get that. So yea, it’s pathetic that you can’t see beyond yourself to how the majority of this country has to do what is has to do to survive.

Did you miss the part about how this applies to people who have leave and the ability to telework. Yes, yes you did. Too busy being a jerk to read.

We all understand there are horrible work environments where people don't get adequate leave and are worried about being paid. Not talking about those circumstances. Talking about cases where perfectly entitled people with options still act this way and then try to gaslight their coworkers who are annoyed.

You have no idea what anyone’s situation is like. No one has enough sick leave for their own illnesses or time to care for their children so your little disclaimer was pointless and of course ignored.

OP here.

We get like two weeks of sick leave a year, three personal days, two mental health days...this woman's leave bank was FINE. Again, this was not a post about "Hey, poor people: Skip work when you're sick! I don't care if missing a shift means you can't put dinner on the table that night!" On top of 2-3 weeks vacation depending on tenure.

We also have the option to telework when sick. We are on the same team. Our manager is totally flexible about us WFH when ill.

This was a post about upper middle class white women who just spent a week at Disneyworld with PLENTY of leave time showing up and coughing everywhere.

And also: I like this coworker! I think she's nice! But it's completely irresponsible behavior when she had multiple options to avoid coming in today. (Well, now yesterday)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

The problem is, a lot of people only say that until they're on the receiving end of the consequences of changing those cultural expectations.

Health care is a good example. My wife is a doctor. She knows people get mad when she comes in while sick (she does wear a mask then, at least). But the anger communicated to her and her coworkers in those situations is *dwarfed* by the anger of patients who have the appointment they needed to schedule 3-months out cancelled at the last minute. And that is dwarfed by the people who have their procedures cancelled after they spent the night clearing out their bowels.

At one point they tried calling patients and giving them the option to reschedule when the provider was sick, but that just seemed to make them even more mad.

The health care case is more extreme than most, but the basic idea broadly applies. If you give people the option between *potentially* getting sick due to an exposure, or *definitely* being inconvenienced by someone not working, most will accept the risk of illness. Not everyone feels that way, but it doesn't seem anywhere close to an even split. The vast majority seem to at most grumble and then want to carry on.

Doctors need to call patients and give them the option to reschedule. A simple cold is several rounds of antibiotics and steroids and possible hospitalization. I’ve gotten sick twice by doctors and now I’ll just leave the appointment and reschedule as I go to the doctor for serious health issues and the last thing I need is the doctor to add to that. At least give a virtual option. Any doctor that risks their patients health should find a new profession.

Well, I'd say any doctor they prescribes several rounds of antibiotics for a "simple cold" should probably find a new profession...

The reality is, whether or not the doctor you see is visibility and knowingly sick doesn't change the fact that you risk exposure to infections whenever you go out in public. A visit with bilateral mask wearing with a sick provider may not be any more of a risk compared to the other interactions you'll have just to get there.

And if you're one of those patients that yells at the office staff for not wearing masks before your arrival-- or even worse, for not telling other patients in the waiting area to wear masks-- then just stop. That's never going to happen. The ones who come in and try to hand out KN-95s are at least better intentioned, but I find that pretty inappropriate, too.

If that describes you, I'd tell you to find a different provider, but you're unlikely to find any provider willing to do what you want.

Masking is not the fix as colds are also surface based. So, they touch a surface, you touch, you are exposed. They touch you, you are exposed.

I don't say anything to doctors about masking. A decent doctor who sees me masking, masks. A bad doctor, just ignores the situation. They have masks at the office so its not my responsibility to provide them.

What is the alternative to antibiotics and steroids? Hospitalization. You do get that they are trying to keep me out of the hospital and dying, right? You are lucky you don't have any serious medical challenges. But, for those of us who do, staying health, is important.

You know virus don't transmit through your skin, right? Touch covid all you want. Just don't touch covid and then immediately pick your nose.

The things you seem to be worried about really can be very strongly mitigated by: 1) wearing a respirator, and 2) washing your hands before touching your mouth/nose/eyes.

And to the extent you don't do those two things, people staying home when they happen to know they're sick isn't going to be enough to stop you from getting sick.

There are a lot more viruses than Covid, how do you not understand that. We are talking about a cold, not covid.

And even if you do those things, you can still get sick. I always mask in public and wash my hands as well as do sinus rinses.

Do you think rhinoviruses infect through your skin and are treated with antibiotics?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

Great, find a way to implement universal sick leave for all US workers. Until you do, you’ll just have to get over people being sick at work.

I understand some people have limited options, but if you have leave or telework options and you come in anyway, you are a jackass and should be shunned. People should feel free to make you miserable in other ways so you get the message to wise up and be courteous.

Lol. So pathetic. Now wear a mask if you’re afraid of germs.

When you act shamefully, you should be made to feel shame. When you are rude, you should be made to feel shame. It's part of growing up to learn these lessons and be courteous to others. Being a jerk is pathetic.

No one is going to feel shame for doing what they need to in order to get paid. If you weren’t so privileged you’d get that. So yea, it’s pathetic that you can’t see beyond yourself to how the majority of this country has to do what is has to do to survive.

Did you miss the part about how this applies to people who have leave and the ability to telework. Yes, yes you did. Too busy being a jerk to read.

We all understand there are horrible work environments where people don't get adequate leave and are worried about being paid. Not talking about those circumstances. Talking about cases where perfectly entitled people with options still act this way and then try to gaslight their coworkers who are annoyed.

You have no idea what anyone’s situation is like. No one has enough sick leave for their own illnesses or time to care for their children so your little disclaimer was pointless and of course ignored.

And yet these same people can take weeks off for vacations.

So now you’re omniscient and know every person’s future plans?

OP here and the poster who came in sick today just spent a week in Disney (which is probably why she was sick). So, PP is correct at least in this instance, she did have enough leave (and again, we can telework!)

Look, I am not referring to people where they can't call out for every cold they get. But at my job, we can work from home. If you can work from home when you're sick...why would you not?

You might not be able to do everything you need to do at home. Or maybe you don't have a good workspace at home. e.g., it's one thing to use a laptop for an hour for a basic task, but if you need to do something more complicated, having larger/multiple monitors may significantly improve productivity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If my husband gets it at work, I’m sending him right back to share it with you all. It’s really crummy as just a cold lasts weeks for me with multiple steroids and antibiotics. He gets no pto. No work, no pay.

Your husband has no PTO and doesn’t get paid if he doesn’t work but you think his coworkers shouldn’t come to work sick and just not get paid?

Most of the co-workers have PTO, as they are feds and with other contractor companies. It varies depending on who you work for. He gets no PTO or sick leave but if he gets sick its from work, so I'm sending him into work sick to protect me. You give it to him, you can have it back.

If you’re so fragile wear a mask at home.

I am that fragile and when someone is sick in our home they isolate. But, unlike you we are considerate.

People have been sick since the dawn of time. If your body is that weak, then you need to wear a mask at all times. Just like immunocompromised people do.

People like you are such jackasses. Sickness has been around forever, but guess what? We know more about how it spreads. We know more about long term effects. We have more awareness that consequences can be more severe for some people in our community etc etc etc

Stop making excuses for being rude and lacking compassion for those around you. Your job ain't that important.

Yea but my paycheck is. So you can shut it and wear a mask instead of expecting the rest of the world to take care of you. You clearly have the luxury to be at home worrying about what is happening at your husband’s job instead of having to go out and work in person.

I am a DP.

We should change the insane work culture of the US instead of pretending that there is something wrong with not wanting to be around other sick people at work or school. Those of you pretending it's NBD are FOS.

Great, find a way to implement universal sick leave for all US workers. Until you do, you’ll just have to get over people being sick at work.

I understand some people have limited options, but if you have leave or telework options and you come in anyway, you are a jackass and should be shunned. People should feel free to make you miserable in other ways so you get the message to wise up and be courteous.

Lol. So pathetic. Now wear a mask if you’re afraid of germs.

When you act shamefully, you should be made to feel shame. When you are rude, you should be made to feel shame. It's part of growing up to learn these lessons and be courteous to others. Being a jerk is pathetic.

No one is going to feel shame for doing what they need to in order to get paid. If you weren’t so privileged you’d get that. So yea, it’s pathetic that you can’t see beyond yourself to how the majority of this country has to do what is has to do to survive.

Did you miss the part about how this applies to people who have leave and the ability to telework. Yes, yes you did. Too busy being a jerk to read.

We all understand there are horrible work environments where people don't get adequate leave and are worried about being paid. Not talking about those circumstances. Talking about cases where perfectly entitled people with options still act this way and then try to gaslight their coworkers who are annoyed.

You have no idea what anyone’s situation is like. No one has enough sick leave for their own illnesses or time to care for their children so your little disclaimer was pointless and of course ignored.

OP here.

We get like two weeks of sick leave a year, three personal days, two mental health days...this woman's leave bank was FINE. Again, this was not a post about "Hey, poor people: Skip work when you're sick! I don't care if missing a shift means you can't put dinner on the table that night!" On top of 2-3 weeks vacation depending on tenure.

We also have the option to telework when sick. We are on the same team. Our manager is totally flexible about us WFH when ill.

This was a post about upper middle class white women who just spent a week at Disneyworld with PLENTY of leave time showing up and coughing everywhere.

And also: I like this coworker! I think she's nice! But it's completely irresponsible behavior when she had multiple options to avoid coming in today. (Well, now yesterday)

Interesting. If there are no potential negative repercussions, why do you think she came in?