DUI and Death on Harrison

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This group of kids have been drinking in Cherry Valley Park for almost a year now, on and off. They sit on the park benches until late at night by the entrance to Custis Trail. I have filed several reports with Arlington County Police asking them to stop, called the non-emergency line. And now one of those kids is dead. Shame on this kid and his parents, but shame on the Arlington Police, absolutely worthless…

You think Cherry Valley Park (not near the accident- 2 mi away) is the only spot where kids drink? What a strange assertion with no evidence.

Much closer is the playing field behind Cardinal Elementary School.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These kids were home from college on fall break. Many lives were ruined for stupid mistakes. It could have been anyone.

I agree many lives were ruined for stupid mistakes and it could have anffected anyone who was out on that road with them that night who was minding their own business in the wrong place and wrong time. Thank god that didn’t happen.

However I also don’t think acting like this is some random lightening strike act of fate is correct either for the kids who were in that car. Actions have consequences and these ones are far bigger than anyone should ever have to pay. It sucks.

It did affect the people who had their cars parked on Harrison St. The driver crashed into them before flipping the car over.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many adults in this community enable and look the other way and normalize a high school drinking culture. Most kids aren’t a part of it but the ones who are, everyone knows it. That’s just how it is and for those of you getting your first window into it, you should be shocked. Don’t let that feeling wear off.

Terrible tragedy for all those affected.

These were college kids FWIW. Agree though there’s a huge drinking culture in APS. The parents are just as guilty; so many happy hour then drive to football games. I don’t let anyone else drive my teens at night.

I know. They were kids who had been at college about 6 weeks. Barely out of high school.

If it were 1943, they would be in either the Pacific war or European war. When does the helicopter parenting stop?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was a young adult with an undeveloped brain who drank a lot and I never drove impaired. IT WAS EASY. This “mistake” and “accident” thing is so stupid. It’s a “mistake” or “accident” like he had picked up a gun.

I don’t care about the parents, they can just live with the shame forever. But the “kid” is an adult who needs to go to jail for at least a few years.

Just so we know, what did you do when you drove your friends somewhere, drank, and then everyone was ready to go home at 2am? Did you call your parents, and then go pick up your car together the next day? So your parents knew what you were up to? Just checking whether you had supportive parents and/or figured out how to live with the fallout.

I am not the person you are responding to but what we did in our day was 1) sleepovers or 2) designated drivers and the designated drivers didn't drink. Not a drop. We took turns.

It sounds like what you were suggesting is these kids have no other choice but to drive to a party where they know they plan to drink to excess, do drink to excess, and then drive all their friends home at 2am. Because otherwise their parents would be mad at them. But maybe I read that wrong.

No. What I'm saying is that if you are a kid living at home or visiting at home during college and you don't work out a plan in advance with your parents, or had parents that were not amenable to hearing that you were drinking, or did not work out a plan ahead with your friends, you might get caught in a situation that you hadn't fully thought through beforehand without having worked out a solution to it before you were drunk.

I notice that PP is listing sleepovers as a potential solution to this issue, which suggests to me that the drinking was going on/sponsored at one of the kid's own houses. That is also a course of action that has its own separate liabilities, which it seems like you might not have fully considered or thought through, but YMMV.

Good for you on the taking turns though, that seems like a good solution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Bare and friend he killed were high school classmates at W-L.

Bare graduated from the HB Woodlawn Program; Rados graduated from W-L.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Shame on parents? Do you think children are robots who always follow the rules? I ou think kids are a reflection of their parents at all times? This kid made a terrible, deadly mistake. You have no idea about his parents or what they have taught him.

Just as a point of fact. The 18 year old was likely driving his parents car around at 2am. Unless he owned his own vehicle. So at a minimum we know they allowed that. Which on its face is not a great plan.

Good point. The families will probably sue the pants off the bare family.

Bare is an adult and can be sued but he may not have anything to his name. I doubt the parents can be.

Mid course they can if he was on their insurance which he almost certainly was. This could easily bankrupt them.

I know tow families of drivers in a death case. Both families lost their houses because they spent a lot of money trying to keep their sons out of jail. Both were fairly successful in that they only spent under 5 years in jail.

Why would you do that? The kid is 18 and does something stupid, I am not spending money defending him. I will spend money protecting my assets but the kid goes to jail.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The driver and other passengers all walked away with minor injuries. The story should include information about who was belted or not, because seatbelts do save lives and young people too often overlook them.

Two of the kids were treated at the scene and the driver, the deceased and one other passenger were taken to VHC. The driver also refused a blood alcohol test.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was a young adult with an undeveloped brain who drank a lot and I never drove impaired. IT WAS EASY. This “mistake” and “accident” thing is so stupid. It’s a “mistake” or “accident” like he had picked up a gun.

I don’t care about the parents, they can just live with the shame forever. But the “kid” is an adult who needs to go to jail for at least a few years.

Just so we know, what did you do when you drove your friends somewhere, drank, and then everyone was ready to go home at 2am? Did you call your parents, and then go pick up your car together the next day? So your parents knew what you were up to? Just checking whether you had supportive parents and/or figured out how to live with the fallout.

I am not the person you are responding to but what we did in our day was 1) sleepovers or 2) designated drivers and the designated drivers didn't drink. Not a drop. We took turns.

It sounds like what you were suggesting is these kids have no other choice but to drive to a party where they know they plan to drink to excess, do drink to excess, and then drive all their friends home at 2am. Because otherwise their parents would be mad at them. But maybe I read that wrong.

No. What I'm saying is that if you are a kid living at home or visiting at home during college and you don't work out a plan in advance with your parents, or had parents that were not amenable to hearing that you were drinking, or did not work out a plan ahead with your friends, you might get caught in a situation that you hadn't fully thought through beforehand without having worked out a solution to it before you were drunk.

I notice that PP is listing sleepovers as a potential solution to this issue, which suggests to me that the drinking was going on/sponsored at one of the kid's own houses. That is also a course of action that has its own separate liabilities, which it seems like you might not have fully considered or thought through, but YMMV.

Good for you on the taking turns though, that seems like a good solution.

You still seem to be presenting this as some sort of acceptable excuse to driving drunk. I understand what you’re saying. This is how it happens. This is how they get to this place of making this choice. I think it’s reasonable to expect more from young adults. We really have to expect more because the outcomes are too terrible. And honestly most of them don’t do this and the ones who do it are usually blatant repeat offenders.

As the kid participating in the drunk sleepovers, my liability was zilch. But agree it’s a bad option for the parents who own the house who are either clueless or pretending to be clueless. It’s better than kids driving away from their house though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was a young adult with an undeveloped brain who drank a lot and I never drove impaired. IT WAS EASY. This “mistake” and “accident” thing is so stupid. It’s a “mistake” or “accident” like he had picked up a gun.

I don’t care about the parents, they can just live with the shame forever. But the “kid” is an adult who needs to go to jail for at least a few years.

Just so we know, what did you do when you drove your friends somewhere, drank, and then everyone was ready to go home at 2am? Did you call your parents, and then go pick up your car together the next day? So your parents knew what you were up to? Just checking whether you had supportive parents and/or figured out how to live with the fallout.

Called my parents. When I was home during freshman year of college my friends and I were going out and would be drinking. My parents are not fools and were fully aware of this so my dad told me "call me and I will give you and and friends who want it a ride home". So that is what I did. Other friends at the same party decided to drive home after drinking. One was actually pulled over that might but the cop immediately let them go because something more important came up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think people get so angry at the parents because this is so horrible and they feel like they need to blame someone, and if they think the other parents are bad parents then they feel safe that it won’t ever happen to their own kids, because they feel confident that they themselves are good parents.

Very well said.

I hate all of these posts blaming the families. You don't know them, yet you are assuming they condone drinking. They may or may not. Two families are irreparably harmed by the decision to a) drive while drinking and b) not wear a seatbelt. Many more kids are harmed by losing a friend. I feel sorry for all involved.

And, no, I don't let my teenager and friends drink at my house. I just recognize that these things unfortunately do happen especially with 18/19 year olds who think they are invincible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think people get so angry at the parents because this is so horrible and they feel like they need to blame someone, and if they think the other parents are bad parents then they feel safe that it won’t ever happen to their own kids, because they feel confident that they themselves are good parents.

Very well said.

I hate all of these posts blaming the families. You don't know them, yet you are assuming they condone drinking. They may or may not. Two families are irreparably harmed by the decision to a) drive while drinking and b) not wear a seatbelt. Many more kids are harmed by losing a friend. I feel sorry for all involved.

And, no, I don't let my teenager and friends drink at my house. I just recognize that these things unfortunately do happen especially with 18/19 year olds who think they are invincible.

I think people assume they might condone drinking because we all know a lot of people who condone drinking or look the other way and pretend (which is the same thing as a practical matter) in our real lives. Just calling a spade a spade.

I have teenagers and it’s not hard at all to figure out what your kid is up to if you’re paying attention, talk to other parents, know their friends. What you do about it is what you do about it. It’s not blaming anyone’s families. I’d rather see people feel a little uncomfortable after these things and think more and maybe it helps prevent something in the future. No one on this planet deserves what these people are going through or deserves blame.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Shame on parents? Do you think children are robots who always follow the rules? I ou think kids are a reflection of their parents at all times? This kid made a terrible, deadly mistake. You have no idea about his parents or what they have taught him.

Just as a point of fact. The 18 year old was likely driving his parents car around at 2am. Unless he owned his own vehicle. So at a minimum we know they allowed that. Which on its face is not a great plan.

Good point. The families will probably sue the pants off the bare family.

Bare is an adult and can be sued but he may not have anything to his name. I doubt the parents can be.

Mid course they can if he was on their insurance which he almost certainly was. This could easily bankrupt them.

I know tow families of drivers in a death case. Both families lost their houses because they spent a lot of money trying to keep their sons out of jail. Both were fairly successful in that they only spent under 5 years in jail.

Why would you do that? The kid is 18 and does something stupid, I am not spending money defending him. I will spend money protecting my assets but the kid goes to jail.

Yes they both served time in jail, but would you try your kid’s life to a public defender? Most people with means would not. Is serving 20 years really going to do any good for anyone? His life is ruined anyway and he will have a felony on his record and will be basically unemployable .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Shame on parents? Do you think children are robots who always follow the rules? I ou think kids are a reflection of their parents at all times? This kid made a terrible, deadly mistake. You have no idea about his parents or what they have taught him.

Just as a point of fact. The 18 year old was likely driving his parents car around at 2am. Unless he owned his own vehicle. So at a minimum we know they allowed that. Which on its face is not a great plan.

Good point. The families will probably sue the pants off the bare family.

Bare is an adult and can be sued but he may not have anything to his name. I doubt the parents can be.

Mid course they can if he was on their insurance which he almost certainly was. This could easily bankrupt them.

I know tow families of drivers in a death case. Both families lost their houses because they spent a lot of money trying to keep their sons out of jail. Both were fairly successful in that they only spent under 5 years in jail.

Why would you do that? The kid is 18 and does something stupid, I am not spending money defending him. I will spend money protecting my assets but the kid goes to jail.

Yikes. Sorry you don't love your kid.

[Anonymous]

As the parent of a sophomore in APS, we were required to attend a meeting with our kid last week before he can obtain his learner’s permit. Lots of information about teaching young drivers and the dangers of having multiple young people in the car at once, even without alcohol (I know, I know, these kids were 18/19, but for those of us with teenagers it’s clear the principle still applies). I think the same presentation is scheduled to take place this week at W-L. I would encourage parents of new drivers to attend one of these sessions. Lots of videoclips, unfortunately, of parents whose children died or were seriously injured in crashes.

If an adult supplied the alcohol or left it out in the open such that it could easily be taken by underage family members, they should be the target of any civil suit brought by the victim’s family or the estate of the victim. And do we actually know if there was a “party”? If so, somebody will know where the alcohol came from.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Shame on parents? Do you think children are robots who always follow the rules? I ou think kids are a reflection of their parents at all times? This kid made a terrible, deadly mistake. You have no idea about his parents or what they have taught him.

Just as a point of fact. The 18 year old was likely driving his parents car around at 2am. Unless he owned his own vehicle. So at a minimum we know they allowed that. Which on its face is not a great plan.

Good point. The families will probably sue the pants off the bare family.

Bare is an adult and can be sued but he may not have anything to his name. I doubt the parents can be.

Mid course they can if he was on their insurance which he almost certainly was. This could easily bankrupt them.

I know tow families of drivers in a death case. Both families lost their houses because they spent a lot of money trying to keep their sons out of jail. Both were fairly successful in that they only spent under 5 years in jail.

Why would you do that? The kid is 18 and does something stupid, I am not spending money defending him. I will spend money protecting my assets but the kid goes to jail.

Yikes. Sorry you don't love your kid.

Wow. This is amazing. PP's money is more important than helping their own child. What a piece of garbage.