Angie Harmon's dog shot and killed by Instacart shopper

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The dog was on his owner’s property. Where is the obligation to leave before shooting if the dog isn’t in physical contact with you? It’s not the same as a police situation where the police are entering a potentially volatile and violent situation, it just isn’t.

Can you shoot if the dog growls? How about if he approaches to sniff? What is the obligation of the visitor?

Not saying this guy should be prosecuted without evidence, but the idea that you can just shoot a dog because you are invited onto the property isn’t justifiable either.

IMO a loose dog needs to be in an enclosed area unless it's a farm. And I'm a full, absolute dog lover. I frequently visit farm properties where loose dogs approach visitors freely. I think for an instacart driver those property owners would secure the dog, but maybe they don't need to for the regular UPS guy who knows them. But if it's a suburban neighborhood, you need to secure your dog.

That is absolutely the rule in terms of torts - the owner is responsible for a dog bite on their property is the dog is loose and unsupervised and especially if the guest was INVITED onto the property. 16 states have a 'one free bite' rule that limits liability if the owner had no prior reason to believe the dog would be aggressive, but most states do not - because DOGS BITE, and it is only common sense that they should be assumed to be capable of biting a stranger who enters onto the property for the purposes of legitimate business.

North Carolina is NOT a 'one free bite' state. Any injury done to the driver by the dog would have been Harmon's responsibility, so he's saved her the cost by neutralizing the threat.

She's just another idiot entitled dog owner and SHE got her dog killed. Period.

What is the law in NC about bringing a gun onto someone else’s property?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

Are you capable of reading? I was quoting “sweet shepherd” from the post before mine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

A man with a concealed, fake identity shooting a gun on my property would be a problem for me. He brought the gun before he knew there was a dog. He lied about who he was before he knew there was a dog. I don't let my dog loose. I hate loose dogs. In this case the man is the problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The dog was on his owner’s property. Where is the obligation to leave before shooting if the dog isn’t in physical contact with you? It’s not the same as a police situation where the police are entering a potentially volatile and violent situation, it just isn’t.

Can you shoot if the dog growls? How about if he approaches to sniff? What is the obligation of the visitor?

Not saying this guy should be prosecuted without evidence, but the idea that you can just shoot a dog because you are invited onto the property isn’t justifiable either.

IMO a loose dog needs to be in an enclosed area unless it's a farm. And I'm a full, absolute dog lover. I frequently visit farm properties where loose dogs approach visitors freely. I think for an instacart driver those property owners would secure the dog, but maybe they don't need to for the regular UPS guy who knows them. But if it's a suburban neighborhood, you need to secure your dog.

That is absolutely the rule in terms of torts - the owner is responsible for a dog bite on their property is the dog is loose and unsupervised and especially if the guest was INVITED onto the property. 16 states have a 'one free bite' rule that limits liability if the owner had no prior reason to believe the dog would be aggressive, but most states do not - because DOGS BITE, and it is only common sense that they should be assumed to be capable of biting a stranger who enters onto the property for the purposes of legitimate business.

North Carolina is NOT a 'one free bite' state. Any injury done to the driver by the dog would have been Harmon's responsibility, so he's saved her the cost by neutralizing the threat.

She's just another idiot entitled dog owner and SHE got her dog killed. Period.

What is the law in NC about bringing a gun onto someone else’s property?

https://giffords.org/lawcenter/state-laws/location-restrictions-in-north-carolina/

There is no prohibition against open or concealed carry on private property unless that property owner has posted prohibiting it. The link I've provided details the short list of sensitive locations where open and concealed carry are prohibited.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

The fact remains that postal workers and delivery drivers interact with dogs ALL THE TIME. If you are terrified of dogs, that isn’t the job for you. You can quote scary news articles all you want but the point stands.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The dog was on his owner’s property. Where is the obligation to leave before shooting if the dog isn’t in physical contact with you? It’s not the same as a police situation where the police are entering a potentially volatile and violent situation, it just isn’t.

Can you shoot if the dog growls? How about if he approaches to sniff? What is the obligation of the visitor?

Not saying this guy should be prosecuted without evidence, but the idea that you can just shoot a dog because you are invited onto the property isn’t justifiable either.

IMO a loose dog needs to be in an enclosed area unless it's a farm. And I'm a full, absolute dog lover. I frequently visit farm properties where loose dogs approach visitors freely. I think for an instacart driver those property owners would secure the dog, but maybe they don't need to for the regular UPS guy who knows them. But if it's a suburban neighborhood, you need to secure your dog.

That is absolutely the rule in terms of torts - the owner is responsible for a dog bite on their property is the dog is loose and unsupervised and especially if the guest was INVITED onto the property. 16 states have a 'one free bite' rule that limits liability if the owner had no prior reason to believe the dog would be aggressive, but most states do not - because DOGS BITE, and it is only common sense that they should be assumed to be capable of biting a stranger who enters onto the property for the purposes of legitimate business.

North Carolina is NOT a 'one free bite' state. Any injury done to the driver by the dog would have been Harmon's responsibility, so he's saved her the cost by neutralizing the threat.

She's just another idiot entitled dog owner and SHE got her dog killed. Period.

What is the law in NC about bringing a gun onto someone else’s property?

https://giffords.org/lawcenter/state-laws/location-restrictions-in-north-carolina/

There is no prohibition against open or concealed carry on private property unless that property owner has posted prohibiting it. The link I've provided details the short list of sensitive locations where open and concealed carry are prohibited.

Thank you! I was curious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

A man with a concealed, fake identity shooting a gun on my property would be a problem for me. He brought the gun before he knew there was a dog. He lied about who he was before he knew there was a dog. I don't let my dog loose. I hate loose dogs. In this case the man is the problem.

That may be your opinion, but you know what they say about opinions.

As a matter of law, the delivery driver was within his rights and the dog owner was negligent. Facts, not opinion.

[Anonymous]

I agree that dogs should be put up if you are awaiting a delivery, especially food, but shooting the dog seems extreme.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

The fact remains that postal workers and delivery drivers interact with dogs ALL THE TIME. If you are terrified of dogs, that isn’t the job for you. You can quote scary news articles all you want but the point stands.

I never said this delivery driver was terrified of dogs, you just did.

He was within his rights to shoot a dog that charged at him.

Very compassionate of you to dismiss the statistics on postal workers and delivery drivers mauled and killed by dogs as 'scary news stories.'

The only bad guy here is Angie Harmon. She killed her dog.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

A man with a concealed, fake identity shooting a gun on my property would be a problem for me. He brought the gun before he knew there was a dog. He lied about who he was before he knew there was a dog. I don't let my dog loose. I hate loose dogs. In this case the man is the problem.

That may be your opinion, but you know what they say about opinions.

As a matter of law, the delivery driver was within his rights and the dog owner was negligent. Facts, not opinion.

You would have a point if you knew the facts of the case, which you do not. All posts in this thread about this are opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate untrained dogs. But shooting the animal is pretty extreme. Carrying pepper spray or a baton would seem to be a better option.

But yes, if you have an untrained dog that will jump happily or get aggressive with strangers, don't let it run around loose when you are expecting a delivery! Also, train your dogs to have better manners and know how to heel and get called off.

Please, enter a property with pit bulls present and let us know how baton and pepper spray work out for you.

Pit bulls were bred for thousands of doggy generations to be nearly impervious to pain - they will hang on to the death in a fight against a bull, a person, another dog, etc. Pepper spray is very likely to make them angrier and more lethal, but not very likely to make them whine and run away.

I used to live in Montana and engaged in back country hiking. Everyone with any common sense knew that carrying bear spray was only any good if you carried two cans, and a gun to boot. The bear (pepper) spray might make a grizzly back off initially, but they are very likely to come back more enraged and ready to kill.

Bullets are far more efficient than capsaicin spray or sticks.

The dog was not a pit bull. It looked like a small hound dog.

That doesn't matter. Dogs bite - ALL dogs are capable of biting. 4.5 MILLION Americans are bitten by dogs every single year. Pit bulls are responsible for more lethal attacks, but all breeds are represented in the dog bite statistics. These statistics are readily available many places online, go google it. GSDs are in the top 5 or 10 of lethal attacks and are a notoriously aggressive (POLICE DOGS, anyone?) breed which are quite often poorly trained in the hands of regular Joe owners.

Out of the 4.5 million people who are bitten by dogs every year, many of them develop ptsd and lifelong fear of dogs. They are not going to do a doggy dna test on the dog charging at them before deciding to be fearful for their well being. A dog that looks like a shepherd is going to scare a lot of people when it charges at them. I used to own a very sweet shepherd mix that I could clearly see some people were fearful of, because she was a shepherd and black to boot (black dogs are euthanized at 4x the rate of other dogs at animal shelters). I now have a freckle faced border collie mix that people beg me to pet when we are out on a walk.

People have fears of dogs for legitimate reasons. The eggshell-plaintiff doctrine protects the rights of a plaintiff whose pre-existing fragility makes them particularly susceptible to injury. The tort-feasor takes the injured plaintiff as she is found.

Sure, but also if you are so scared of dogs that a sweet shepherd bounding at you makes you want to shoot, being an instacart driver or post office worker or in-home technician etc isn’t the job for you.

You are thick. A stranger has no way to know that the dog is 'sweet,' and I've lost count of the lethal and nonlethal dog attacks I've read about where the clueless negligent owners blathered about how 'sweet' and loving their dog was before it mauled or killed a family member, neighbor, or stranger.

The only party at fault here is the dog's owner, PERIOD. Legally and morally she is at fault for the death of her dog.

Postal workers and delivery drivers are bitten, mauled and even killed by dogs every year. They are not the problem - the dog owners are the problem, PERIOD.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/amazon-delivery-driver-found-dead-apparent-dog-attack-rcna53834

https://about.usps.com/newsroom/national-releases/2023/0601-usps-releases-dog-bite-national-rankings.htm

The fact remains that postal workers and delivery drivers interact with dogs ALL THE TIME. If you are terrified of dogs, that isn’t the job for you. You can quote scary news articles all you want but the point stands.

I never said this delivery driver was terrified of dogs, you just did.

He was within his rights to shoot a dog that charged at him.

Very compassionate of you to dismiss the statistics on postal workers and delivery drivers mauled and killed by dogs as 'scary news stories.'

The only bad guy here is Angie Harmon. She killed her dog.

Wow. DP here. Our postal worker brings treats.

[Anonymous]

Why is everyone taking the side of the delivery person? There's no camera footage. The article I read said the police report stated there were no visible bites, scratches, wounds, or ripped clothing on the delivery driver. From a legal standpoint, the cops were wrong. Zero visible evidence of an attack in a he said vs. she said incident? I'm sure the police sided with the delivery driver to leave the situation to be fought as a civil matter. It washes their hands of being part of a situation involving a black delivery driver vs. a rich, white, famous actress.

My neighborhood had a mailwoman who was absolutely terrified of dogs. She pepper sprayed the neighbor's dog, which was caught on video, and the dog did nothing to her. She did not see the dog napping on the porch and entered the gate to deliver a package that wouldn't fit in the mailbox. The dog simply lifted its head and she screamed and started spraying. The mailwoman had her route transferred after that incident but before it there had been several others. She would freeze on the sidewalk and yell for anyone walking their dog to cross the street and not come near her or she'd spray them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Horrible, horrible situation but I don't know... the Ring camera was "conveniently" charging during this one incident so he said/she situation? Am I an @sshole for thinking that?

https://www.etonline.com/instacart-responds-after-angie-harmon-says-shopper-shot-and-killed-her-dog-mid-delivery-222681

My ring camera charges without ever leaving the door. It’s wireless. That part is so weird. I can’t believe she says the delivery person knew that.

Angie should have put her dog inside the house.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Horrible, horrible situation but I don't know... the Ring camera was "conveniently" charging during this one incident so he said/she situation? Am I an @sshole for thinking that?

https://www.etonline.com/instacart-responds-after-angie-harmon-says-shopper-shot-and-killed-her-dog-mid-delivery-222681

My ring camera charges without ever leaving the door. It’s wireless. That part is so weird. I can’t believe she says the delivery person knew that.

Angie should have put her dog inside the house.

I have to slide the cover off and take the battery out of my doorbell to charge it. It’s very obvious that there is no battery, so I guess this depends on whatever model of camera she owns.

Thinking down the road, If the camera was functional and recording, I wonder if Ring has a copy of the video, and if the police can subpoena that.