Do you think cotillion is racist?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:No it’s not racist. It’s traditional. The lazy discourse that passes for intellectualism among self-loathing white liberals just assumes anything that isn’t radically post-modern is bad and racist. I happen to think that having some tradition is a good thing. Kids need structure and need norms. This is one way to do it. Might not work for everyone.

Isn’t it liberals who send their kids to cotillion

Not in my experience. The people I know who have done it are very conservative.

No. When was the last time you sent a kid to cotillion?

I haven't. Because the people I know who do are of a very different mindset than I am (i.e. super Republican).

Well if u sent your kids you see that is incorrect

Cotillion didn’t teach you how to write a simple sentence so what’s it really worth in the end?

Somebody mad when people don’t agree with them.. anger mgmt classes stat

More like I find it annoying when people act like they are in-the-know while demonstrating an obvious streak of ignorance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to a small town cotillion. It’s not always a debutante ball. We just went to a dance every month. We wore a nice day dress, listened to a manners lesson, took a dance lesson, then danced with the other middle schoolers. No different than any other after school activity.

In the partner dance world, it’s very common for members of the lgbtq community to learn to both lead and follow. In dances, I’d occasionally dance with someone of the same gender. The teachers referred to leaders and followers for this reason. It was nbd.

Same here, I did Cotillion in Winston Salem NC. tons of middle class kids did. We all went to the same place_ Floretta Baylin Ballroom and Cotillion. Weekly dance class, one big final dance at a country club. This was middle school. None of us ever became debutantes or were members of a country club. It was fun. not sure if I will ever need to know how to waltz again though. And watching Bridgerton, I was one of the few of my friends who knew what a dance card was. its very very old school!

I think people are confusing cotillion and debutant balls.

I definitely am--I always thought that the debutante ball was the culmination of the cotillion classes. Is that not correct?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No it’s not racist. It’s traditional. The lazy discourse that passes for intellectualism among self-loathing white liberals just assumes anything that isn’t radically post-modern is bad and racist. I happen to think that having some tradition is a good thing. Kids need structure and need norms. This is one way to do it. Might not work for everyone.

Isn’t it liberals who send their kids to cotillion

Not in my experience. The people I know who have done it are very conservative.

No. When was the last time you sent a kid to cotillion?

I haven't. Because the people I know who do are of a very different mindset than I am (i.e. super Republican).

Well if u sent your kids you see that is incorrect

Cotillion didn’t teach you how to write a simple sentence so what’s it really worth in the end?

Somebody mad when people don’t agree with them.. anger mgmt classes stat

More like I find it annoying when people act like they are in-the-know while demonstrating an obvious streak of ignorance.

Your so easy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to a small town cotillion. It’s not always a debutante ball. We just went to a dance every month. We wore a nice day dress, listened to a manners lesson, took a dance lesson, then danced with the other middle schoolers. No different than any other after school activity.

In the partner dance world, it’s very common for members of the lgbtq community to learn to both lead and follow. In dances, I’d occasionally dance with someone of the same gender. The teachers referred to leaders and followers for this reason. It was nbd.

Same here, I did Cotillion in Winston Salem NC. tons of middle class kids did. We all went to the same place_ Floretta Baylin Ballroom and Cotillion. Weekly dance class, one big final dance at a country club. This was middle school. None of us ever became debutantes or were members of a country club. It was fun. not sure if I will ever need to know how to waltz again though. And watching Bridgerton, I was one of the few of my friends who knew what a dance card was. its very very old school!

I think people are confusing cotillion and debutant balls.

I definitely am--I always thought that the debutante ball was the culmination of the cotillion classes. Is that not correct?

https://www.southernliving.com/culture/debutante-cotillion

debutante is something where you introduce your daughter to society

cotillion is a bunch of etiquette classes with a final dinner/dance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to a small town cotillion. It’s not always a debutante ball. We just went to a dance every month. We wore a nice day dress, listened to a manners lesson, took a dance lesson, then danced with the other middle schoolers. No different than any other after school activity.

In the partner dance world, it’s very common for members of the lgbtq community to learn to both lead and follow. In dances, I’d occasionally dance with someone of the same gender. The teachers referred to leaders and followers for this reason. It was nbd.

Same here, I did Cotillion in Winston Salem NC. tons of middle class kids did. We all went to the same place_ Floretta Baylin Ballroom and Cotillion. Weekly dance class, one big final dance at a country club. This was middle school. None of us ever became debutantes or were members of a country club. It was fun. not sure if I will ever need to know how to waltz again though. And watching Bridgerton, I was one of the few of my friends who knew what a dance card was. its very very old school!

I think people are confusing cotillion and debutant balls.

I definitely am--I always thought that the debutante ball was the culmination of the cotillion classes. Is that not correct?

https://www.southernliving.com/culture/debutante-cotillion

debutante is something where you introduce your daughter to society

cotillion is a bunch of etiquette classes with a final dinner/dance.

Good to know..I honestly did not know there was a difference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I went to a small town cotillion. It’s not always a debutante ball. We just went to a dance every month. We wore a nice day dress, listened to a manners lesson, took a dance lesson, then danced with the other middle schoolers. No different than any other after school activity.

In the partner dance world, it’s very common for members of the lgbtq community to learn to both lead and follow. In dances, I’d occasionally dance with someone of the same gender. The teachers referred to leaders and followers for this reason. It was nbd.

Same here, I did Cotillion in Winston Salem NC. tons of middle class kids did. We all went to the same place_ Floretta Baylin Ballroom and Cotillion. Weekly dance class, one big final dance at a country club. This was middle school. None of us ever became debutantes or were members of a country club. It was fun. not sure if I will ever need to know how to waltz again though. And watching Bridgerton, I was one of the few of my friends who knew what a dance card was. its very very old school!

I think people are confusing cotillion and debutant balls.

I definitely am--I always thought that the debutante ball was the culmination of the cotillion classes. Is that not correct?

No. Obviously experiences differ, but in general kids go to cotillion for a couple of years and that's it. Deb balls are a whole different thing where you might use what you learned at cotillion, but one doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the other.

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

^ bizarre. They look like they are about to get married.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wish they did it at school because they teach far more than manners at cotillion.

Kids don’t know how to properly dance or chat with strangers.

Lots of kids don’t have positive role models to show them how to carry themselves in a dignified way.

We need more of this sort of thing…desperately.

The black community realizes this and there are programs designed and led by them. (Read this thread for examples.)

It’s ridiculous to label the entire construct as racist when kids from all walks of life participate.

And if you didn’t participate in cotillion, then your opinion simply isn’t an informed one. You are just assuming.

Not having proper role models might actually make you ineligible for Jack and Jill… just saying it’s a fairly classist organization. Got to have the 3 or for some chapters the 4 Bs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No it’s not racist. It’s traditional. The lazy discourse that passes for intellectualism among self-loathing white liberals just assumes anything that isn’t radically post-modern is bad and racist. I happen to think that having some tradition is a good thing. Kids need structure and need norms. This is one way to do it. Might not work for everyone.

Isn’t it liberals who send their kids to cotillion

They're talking about everyone who calls it racist.

[Anonymous]

NO.
Excellent way to learn manners etc.

[Anonymous]

OP here. FWIW… I’m pretty liberal. My kid is signed up to go again next year. We are in NOVA.

My oldest did it through part of high school and enjoyed it. And they identify LGBTQ.

I always considered it about manners, and yes, I do teach those at home. But sometimes kids hear it better from another adult. But I also see how the origins could be construed as either racist or classist.

[Anonymous]

No. Not at all what a dumb question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My grandmother (who was very traditional) taught us proper manners - she would regularly do high tea at the Ritz with her grandkids. The moms who send their kids to cotillion at our school actually have pretty atrocious table manners, which always made me laugh. Modeling at home and out so much more important.

The Ritz serves afternoon tea, not high tea (which is what I'd call "supper"). If you're about to post an image showing that the Ritz calls it "high tea," save yourself the trouble.

A mother I know was going to send her son to cotillion in hopes of improving his manners, and like you, I thought it was strange to wait until a kid was 12 to get on that, and I also wondered why they weren't doing it themselves. The cotillion in question wasn't what I think of as the real thing, though, just a paid series of classes open to anyone willing to write a check. More democratic, which seems not at all in the spirit of cotillion as I understand it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. Not at all what a dumb question.

+1
So stupid. My kids did cotillion and kids of all different races/ethnicities participated.