Why do Atheists care? Here is one scary reason:

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whether it actually happens or not is not the concern. The concern is that people are out there actively wanting it, and these people have influence in many many places, at the state, local and federal levels. From school boards to the supreme court. We’ve seen this at all those levels recently and it is terrifying and religion is the core part of the problem.

And before anybody explodes, I’m not saying all religious people are this way. But religion itself is a problem. It’s the 21st-century and we hang onto these beliefs at our own peril.

Religion is not a problem.

+1. Simplistic and ignorant statements like this never win arguments. They just make the speaker look … simple and ignorant. Maybe bigoted too.

Oh yes it is a problem. Would you like a list?

As for simple and ignorant, I can present evidence for what I think, can you? And you always resort to ad hominem. So ironic.

Your list is pointless. Stalin, Lenin, Mai and Pol Pot also killed millions, and with recent memory. Plus they oppressed their citizens for decades. If you want to chest-bump about lists, it’s just going to look silly.

I guess you require it being repeated yet again: Those guys did not do those things in the name of atheism, or even because of it. You are just plain wrong. There is no equivocation, as much as you wish there were.

It appears you do not need a list of terrible things in the name of religion, so thanks for saving me the trouble. Of course all you need is the original post and link in this very thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Christian Democrats and lots of Republican Christians and other religious are against that too, OP. Atheists don't hold a monopoly on fighting to maintain the separation of church and state.

That's true. And Christians don't believe in any supernatural phenomena other than their own. But they do believe in their own, and that is a political problem, and a problem for the rest of us who do not believe in it.

I just think we'll be a much better, stronger and smarter country once people have voluntarily, logically, and of their own accord given up reliance on supernatural beliefs.

You don’t have to believe in anything, but people in America have the right to believe any religion they want, and that makes us better, stronger, and smarter right now. Freedom of religion is what this country was founded on. Our government does not force anyone to believe in any religion. There is no state religion.

State enforced atheism is something that has ended in disaster for the citizens of each country it has been enforced in the past, and it is currently enforced in presently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whether it actually happens or not is not the concern. The concern is that people are out there actively wanting it, and these people have influence in many many places, at the state, local and federal levels. From school boards to the supreme court. We’ve seen this at all those levels recently and it is terrifying and religion is the core part of the problem.

And before anybody explodes, I’m not saying all religious people are this way. But religion itself is a problem. It’s the 21st-century and we hang onto these beliefs at our own peril.

Religion is not a problem.

+1. Simplistic and ignorant statements like this never win arguments. They just make the speaker look … simple and ignorant. Maybe bigoted too.

Oh yes it is a problem. Would you like a list?

As for simple and ignorant, I can present evidence for what I think, can you? And you always resort to ad hominem. So ironic.

Your list is pointless. Stalin, Lenin, Mai and Pol Pot also killed millions, and with recent memory. Plus they oppressed their citizens for decades. If you want to chest-bump about lists, it’s just going to look silly.

I guess you require it being repeated yet again: Those guys did not do those things in the name of atheism, or even because of it. You are just plain wrong. There is no equivocation, as much as you wish there were.

It appears you do not need a list of terrible things in the name of religion, so thanks for saving me the trouble. Of course all you need is the original post and link in this very thread.

Your little semantics game around “in the name of” atheism/religion doesn’t fool anyone or make a difference to the argument that atheist states have terrible track records.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whether it actually happens or not is not the concern. The concern is that people are out there actively wanting it, and these people have influence in many many places, at the state, local and federal levels. From school boards to the supreme court. We’ve seen this at all those levels recently and it is terrifying and religion is the core part of the problem.

And before anybody explodes, I’m not saying all religious people are this way. But religion itself is a problem. It’s the 21st-century and we hang onto these beliefs at our own peril.

Religion is not a problem.

+1. Simplistic and ignorant statements like this never win arguments. They just make the speaker look … simple and ignorant. Maybe bigoted too.

Oh yes it is a problem. Would you like a list?

As for simple and ignorant, I can present evidence for what I think, can you? And you always resort to ad hominem. So ironic.

Your list is pointless. Stalin, Lenin, Mai and Pol Pot also killed millions, and with recent memory. Plus they oppressed their citizens for decades. If you want to chest-bump about lists, it’s just going to look silly.

I guess you require it being repeated yet again: Those guys did not do those things in the name of atheism, or even because of it. You are just plain wrong. There is no equivocation, as much as you wish there were.

It appears you do not need a list of terrible things in the name of religion, so thanks for saving me the trouble. Of course all you need is the original post and link in this very thread.

Your little semantics game around “in the name of” atheism/religion doesn’t fool anyone or make a difference to the argument that atheist states have terrible track records.

No most people understand, I think! Maybe even you. False equivalence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Christian Democrats and lots of Republican Christians and other religious are against that too, OP. Atheists don't hold a monopoly on fighting to maintain the separation of church and state.

That's true. And Christians don't believe in any supernatural phenomena other than their own. But they do believe in their own, and that is a political problem, and a problem for the rest of us who do not believe in it.

I just think we'll be a much better, stronger and smarter country once people have voluntarily, logically, and of their own accord given up reliance on supernatural beliefs.

You don’t have to believe in anything, but people in America have the right to believe any religion they want, and that makes us better, stronger, and smarter right now. Freedom of religion is what this country was founded on. Our government does not force anyone to believe in any religion. There is no state religion.

State enforced atheism is something that has ended in disaster for the citizens of each country it has been enforced in the past, and it is currently enforced in presently.

This is a strawman point as no one is suggesting state enforced atheism. I've posted my point many times, please stop mis-representing it, that is dishonest.

I just think we'll be a much better, stronger and smarter country once people have voluntarily, logically, and of their own accord given up reliance on supernatural beliefs.

...voluntarily, logically, and of their own accord...

Once they realize the fact that there is zero evidence for the supernatural means there is likely no supernatural. On their own. As they consider it thoughtfully and with an open mind. It's happening at an all time rapid pace, as we learned from pew: https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/12/14/about-three-in-ten-u-s-adults-are-now-religiously-unaffiliated/

It's happening without anyone "mandating" it, people are simply giving up these supernatural beliefs. Because many people are smart, and figure things out when given the chance to without undue societal pressures.

That's my belief, anyway. I am entitled to it as you are to yours, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Christian Democrats and lots of Republican Christians and other religious are against that too, OP. Atheists don't hold a monopoly on fighting to maintain the separation of church and state.

That's true. And Christians don't believe in any supernatural phenomena other than their own. But they do believe in their own, and that is a political problem, and a problem for the rest of us who do not believe in it.

I just think we'll be a much better, stronger and smarter country once people have voluntarily, logically, and of their own accord given up reliance on supernatural beliefs.

You don’t have to believe in anything, but people in America have the right to believe any religion they want, and that makes us better, stronger, and smarter right now. Freedom of religion is what this country was founded on. Our government does not force anyone to believe in any religion. There is no state religion.

State enforced atheism is something that has ended in disaster for the citizens of each country it has been enforced in the past, and it is currently enforced in presently.

This is a strawman point as no one is suggesting state enforced atheism. I've posted my point many times, please stop mis-representing it, that is dishonest.

I just think we'll be a much better, stronger and smarter country once people have voluntarily, logically, and of their own accord given up reliance on supernatural beliefs.

...voluntarily, logically, and of their own accord...

Once they realize the fact that there is zero evidence for the supernatural means there is likely no supernatural. On their own. As they consider it thoughtfully and with an open mind. It's happening at an all time rapid pace, as we learned from pew: https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/12/14/about-three-in-ten-u-s-adults-are-now-religiously-unaffiliated/

It's happening without anyone "mandating" it, people are simply giving up these supernatural beliefs. Because many people are smart, and figure things out when given the chance to without undue societal pressures.

That's my belief, anyway. I am entitled to it as you are to yours, right?

Christian pp is (hopefully) not representative of the majority of Christians, although they often do have a habit of making pronouncements that they expect others to believe. I think it's something they learn in church. - just say stuff authoritatively and it becomes true.

As for giving up supernatural beliefs -- you're right - it's happening. People are figuring it out. Let's see how long it takes for more people to accept that belief in God is like belief in Santa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whether it actually happens or not is not the concern. The concern is that people are out there actively wanting it, and these people have influence in many many places, at the state, local and federal levels. From school boards to the supreme court. We’ve seen this at all those levels recently and it is terrifying and religion is the core part of the problem.

And before anybody explodes, I’m not saying all religious people are this way. But religion itself is a problem. It’s the 21st-century and we hang onto these beliefs at our own peril.

Religion is not a problem.

+1. Simplistic and ignorant statements like this never win arguments. They just make the speaker look … simple and ignorant. Maybe bigoted too.

Oh yes it is a problem. Would you like a list?

As for simple and ignorant, I can present evidence for what I think, can you? And you always resort to ad hominem. So ironic.

Your list is pointless. Stalin, Lenin, Mai and Pol Pot also killed millions, and with recent memory. Plus they oppressed their citizens for decades. If you want to chest-bump about lists, it’s just going to look silly.

I guess you require it being repeated yet again: Those guys did not do those things in the name of atheism, or even because of it. You are just plain wrong. There is no equivocation, as much as you wish there were.

It appears you do not need a list of terrible things in the name of religion, so thanks for saving me the trouble. Of course all you need is the original post and link in this very thread.

Your little semantics game around “in the name of” atheism/religion doesn’t fool anyone or make a difference to the argument that atheist states have terrible track records.

No most people understand, I think! Maybe even you. False equivalence.

+1 pp seems desperate

[Anonymous]

This is a strawman point as no one is suggesting state enforced atheism.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That will never happen.

Yeahhhh, sorry. The intelligent among us aren’t buying the “that will never happen” line anymore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That will never happen.

Yeahhhh, sorry. The intelligent among us aren’t buying the “that will never happen” line anymore.

Yeah, I am actually pretty sure that there were presentations being made to church folk in the 1970s about this. My mother occasionally admits that this was the case, and that she is totally in favor of a church-led government. Other times, she pretends she is just a fox-news'watching "regular" conservative. So she is insane, and possibly not the best source, but I do believe there was some organizing around this idea in the 70s/80s that led to insane voting populations that include my mother.

[Anonymous]

LOL !I read the thread title too quickly; I thought it was "Why do Athletes care ? Here is one scary reason." I was ready to read about a tragic football injury.

FWIW Many athletes pray before, during, and after athletic contests--especially football players.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That will never happen.

Yeahhhh, sorry. The intelligent among us aren’t buying the “that will never happen” line anymore.

Yeah, I am actually pretty sure that there were presentations being made to church folk in the 1970s about this. My mother occasionally admits that this was the case, and that she is totally in favor of a church-led government. Other times, she pretends she is just a fox-news'watching "regular" conservative. So she is insane, and possibly not the best source, but I do believe there was some organizing around this idea in the 70s/80s that led to insane voting populations that include my mother.

Really? You are “pretty sure” “presentations” were made to “church folk” in the 1970s? Please, link some credible sources. Who gave these presentations? What church populations did they speak to? What did their material instruct them to say?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That will never happen.

Yeahhhh, sorry. The intelligent among us aren’t buying the “that will never happen” line anymore.

Yeah, I am actually pretty sure that there were presentations being made to church folk in the 1970s about this. My mother occasionally admits that this was the case, and that she is totally in favor of a church-led government. Other times, she pretends she is just a fox-news'watching "regular" conservative. So she is insane, and possibly not the best source, but I do believe there was some organizing around this idea in the 70s/80s that led to insane voting populations that include my mother.

Really? You are “pretty sure” “presentations” were made to “church folk” in the 1970s? Please, link some credible sources. Who gave these presentations? What church populations did they speak to? What did their material instruct them to say?

Haha, as I said, I am a secondhand, noncredible source. The reason I believe it is because my mother doesn't have strong opinions unless they were presented to her in a big-setting, emotionally manipulative way, and (less credibly) occasionally she says it happened (and other times, denies same), in an independent, fundamentalist, evangelical church in Virginia. I am just passing on some anecdotal crap, as one does on an internet forum . I am not reporting to the nytimes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That will never happen.

Yeahhhh, sorry. The intelligent among us aren’t buying the “that will never happen” line anymore.

Yeah, I am actually pretty sure that there were presentations being made to church folk in the 1970s about this. My mother occasionally admits that this was the case, and that she is totally in favor of a church-led government. Other times, she pretends she is just a fox-news'watching "regular" conservative. So she is insane, and possibly not the best source, but I do believe there was some organizing around this idea in the 70s/80s that led to insane voting populations that include my mother.

Really? You are “pretty sure” “presentations” were made to “church folk” in the 1970s? Please, link some credible sources. Who gave these presentations? What church populations did they speak to? What did their material instruct them to say?

Haha, as I said, I am a secondhand, noncredible source. The reason I believe it is because my mother doesn't have strong opinions unless they were presented to her in a big-setting, emotionally manipulative way, and (less credibly) occasionally she says it happened (and other times, denies same), in an independent, fundamentalist, evangelical church in Virginia. I am just passing on some anecdotal crap, as one does on an internet forum . I am not reporting to the nytimes.

In my imagination, the presentation has 2 parts:

Part 1: The Founding Fathers of our country intended USA to be Christian nation (despite all that moving to America for religious freedom). The country should be Christ-led. We will elect leaders who are Christian OR chosen by our Lord (supposedly Trump was chosen by the evangelicals' lord)

Part 2: Abortion, even though you had no problems with it before, is actually baby-murder. Women, be subservient. Think of the baby Jesus! Also: do not be sluts. Etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Whether it actually happens or not is not the concern. The concern is that people are out there actively wanting it, and these people have influence in many many places, at the state, local and federal levels. From school boards to the supreme court. We’ve seen this at all those levels recently and it is terrifying and religion is the core part of the problem.

And before anybody explodes, I’m not saying all religious people are this way. But religion itself is a problem. It’s the 21st-century and we hang onto these beliefs at our own peril.

Religion is not a problem.

+1. Simplistic and ignorant statements like this never win arguments. They just make the speaker look … simple and ignorant. Maybe bigoted too.

Oh yes it is a problem. Would you like a list?

As for simple and ignorant, I can present evidence for what I think, can you? And you always resort to ad hominem. So ironic.

Your list is pointless. Stalin, Lenin, Mai and Pol Pot also killed millions, and with recent memory. Plus they oppressed their citizens for decades. If you want to chest-bump about lists, it’s just going to look silly.

I guess you require it being repeated yet again: Those guys did not do those things in the name of atheism, or even because of it. You are just plain wrong. There is no equivocation, as much as you wish there were.

It appears you do not need a list of terrible things in the name of religion, so thanks for saving me the trouble. Of course all you need is the original post and link in this very thread.

Your little semantics game around “in the name of” atheism/religion doesn’t fool anyone or make a difference to the argument that atheist states have terrible track records.

Your little semantics game doesn't fool anyone either.