UVA or Georgetown

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Condescension doesn't help your argument.

It's not condescension but a correction, of PP's misleading and borderline dishonest statement. Aggrieved over-reaction and deflection is a time-honored tactic of snowflakes and trolls.

Doubling down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t the UVA boosters get tired?

I don’t see any Harvard or Penn posters boost those schools nearly as much as UVA.

Go read BUM or PUM.

This! Exactly! This is DCUM - lots of Virginians here so natural that UVA comes up - from a Harvard grad

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:UVA also sweeps in the Marshall Scholarship. https://uvamagazine.org/articles/three_hoos_earn_marshall_scholarships

According to US News, UVA Med school is like 36 whereas Georgetown is 56 or 57, so not sure what that poster is smoking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t the UVA boosters get tired?

I don’t see any Harvard or Penn posters boost those schools nearly as much as UVA.

Go read BUM or PUM.

This! Exactly! This is DCUM - lots of Virginians here so natural that UVA comes up - from a Harvard grad

What is BUM or PUM? I googled it but nothing came up?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

How do you feel about the potential impact of Youngkin’s ability to appoint members to the BoV, which governs the school? (Within the next few years, virtually all appointees will be by Youngkin, which could have a lot of implications for what/how things are taught at UVA.)

Nothing will change.

+1

All governors appoint their cronies. The faculty teach what they want.

Ask professors in Florida if that’s true. Or ask the professors who’ve left Wisconsin-Madison after they weakened tenure protections. Who runs a state has real implications for public universities—especially when the people who run the state are Republicans who relied on the culture war to win their elections.

We're not talking about Florida. We're not talking about Wisconsin either. We're talking about Virginia, where among other things governors are limited to one term. Yes, Youngkin is nuts but he's not the first Republican governor Virginia has ever had. UVA will outlive him, trust me.

His BOV appointees will be there long after he’s gone. Republican BOV appointees are the ones who tried to push out UVA’s president ten years ago for not running the university like a business. The culture warrior folks Youngkin is appointing now will push their own agendas for years to come.

Blah blah blah. I hate Youngkin as much as the next poster but you're overstating this. The school is and will be fine. And, yes, Republican BOV appointees "tried" to push out President Sullivan. "Try" is the operative word, isn't it?

Look, I hope UVA is OK; I care about public education and want it to thrive. But it’s a perilous time for it, especially in states with Republicans in power. We ignore that at our peril.

Please. Take it to politics. It's not even an issue on campus

Except that one of Youngkin’s BOV appointees is the same guy who showed up on the Lawn with a razor blade to remove a sign he didn’t like from a Lawnie’s door last year. The Student Council called for his resignation in July (https://www.cavalierdaily.com/article/2022/07/student-council-executive-board-calls-for-resignation-of-bert-ellis?ct=content_open&cv=cbox_featured). So I think it is an issue on campus!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Don’t the UVA boosters get tired?

I don’t see any Harvard or Penn posters boost those schools nearly as much as UVA.

Go read BUM or PUM.

This! Exactly! This is DCUM - lots of Virginians here so natural that UVA comes up - from a Harvard grad

What is BUM or PUM? I googled it but nothing came up?

They don't exist. It's a play off of DCUM for DC Urban Moms but there are a lot of Marylands and Virginians here, hence lots of discussion about UMCP and virginia universities. For some reason the PP thinks there should be the same amount of discussion about schools in Massachusetts and Pennsylvania here, which makes no sense.

[Anonymous]

UVA also has more Schwarzman (global international affair) scholars than Georgetown. https://citizenscholars.virginia.edu/3-uva-students-receive-schwarzman-scholarships

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

This is such a ridiculous discussion.

Georgetown is way more selective than UVA: 16% vs 22%. And that's before taking into account the fact that all Common App colleges have artificially low acceptance rates, including UVA. Georgetown does not participate in the Common App.

But financially, instate UVA is OBVIOUSLY the better choice.
Academically, there is no question GU is more reputable.

Done.

End of discussion.

I think you are new to college admissions. If you research it here or anywhere online you will learn that you cannot compare the selectivity/acceptance rates of our nation's public universities to that of private institutions. There are many reasons why but primarily, and certainly in Virginia and California, the applicant pool to the top public schools is self-selecting. Due to SCHEV and other statistical resources, applicants know exactly where they stand vis-a-vis the prior entering class, so can make a better call on chances of getting in than they can for privates. This is also done by the public high school counselor whose job it is to direct applicants to the most suitable public university. When we met with the Langley high school counselor there was absolutely no question that our DD was not UVA material. And if we had pushed on it, the counselor whips out the SCHEV statistics and Naviance to demonstrate why. We could readily see she had a chance of getting into GMU but never UVA or W&M. The public high school counselor will not support the application. Can a parent force it? I suppose so but I've never heard it done. And remember that public high school counselor (whose reputation is on the line with the public universities and often wants to move into admissions at one of those schools) won't be apt to work the letters of recommendation and check off the "most rigorous" box or rave about the student in the advisor's own letter of recommendation (in VA the public high school counselor writes their own letter to the public schools). Because of this system of screening and checks, the applicant pool to the top publics is very elite and primarily the top 6% of public high school students. Hence the rate of selectivity is lower than privates - and remember that privates can throw millions of dollars at marketing to inflate the applicant pool class in order to drive down the acceptance/selectivity numbers. Publics don't have those resources. This is why USNWR doesn't require institutions to submit selectivity numbers anymore . . . they are too easily manipulated by the private institutions, like Northwestern, U of Chicago and Northeastern.

The result is that the top publics have higher percentages of acceptance than top privates: U of Florida is 31.1%; the University of Michigan is 26.1%; UCLA 14.3%; Berkeley is 17.5%; the University of Texas (on a very different system) 32%; the University of North Carolina, 25% (OOS is 10.5%). All of these schools have become very difficult to get into - especially for OOS as states drive down on the number of OOS as demand by taxpayers increases.

So UVA at 22.6% (OOS 17%) is right in line with the other publics. But even amongst publics you can't compare precisely because of the system of applicants and the screening role of the public high school counselors. But all counselors will tell you that getting in OOS at UCLA, Berkeley, UNC, etc. is unlikely because of the quality of competition. In California, the OOS class is limited to only 10% as is UNC.

A better indicator of prestige and quality of student are the SCHEV statistics which show that the applicants who arrive on campus have higher stats than Georgetown. Last fall, the 75th percentile of enrolled (the students who actually showed up, not the accepted class, which is higher; some turn down UVA for Ivies or SLACs), was a 4.52 weighted GPA; a whopping 35 on the ACT and a 1510 SAT/=. The median has a 4.39, a whopping 34 ACT and a 1450. Even the bottom 25th percentile has a 4.23, a 32 ACT and a 1400. Now someone will come on and say SCHEV doesn't include all the entering students but SCHEV is a FAR BETTER tool than exists for the private schools in other states. Every Virginia parent should be using it as a reference guide for all privates (yes SCHEV covers privates too) and publics. All the stats you need to know are there. Just enter the name of the college and dig in. Then go to your high school Naviance or equivalent and compare your student's stats to those of his own class. Uou will come away with a very realistic view of your child's chances of getting into Virginia schools. Because we have this tool, applicants are better able to apply to the institutions that they have a chance of getting into. There is no equivalent in other states. https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This is such a ridiculous discussion.

Georgetown is way more selective than UVA: 16% vs 22%. And that's before taking into account the fact that all Common App colleges have artificially low acceptance rates, including UVA. Georgetown does not participate in the Common App.

But financially, instate UVA is OBVIOUSLY the better choice.
Academically, there is no question GU is more reputable.

Done.

End of discussion.

I think you are new to college admissions. If you research it here or anywhere online you will learn that you cannot compare the selectivity/acceptance rates of our nation's public universities to that of private institutions. There are many reasons why but primarily, and certainly in Virginia and California, the applicant pool to the top public schools is self-selecting. Due to SCHEV and other statistical resources, applicants know exactly where they stand vis-a-vis the prior entering class, so can make a better call on chances of getting in than they can for privates. This is also done by the public high school counselor whose job it is to direct applicants to the most suitable public university. When we met with the Langley high school counselor there was absolutely no question that our DD was not UVA material. And if we had pushed on it, the counselor whips out the SCHEV statistics and Naviance to demonstrate why. We could readily see she had a chance of getting into GMU but never UVA or W&M. The public high school counselor will not support the application. Can a parent force it? I suppose so but I've never heard it done. And remember that public high school counselor (whose reputation is on the line with the public universities and often wants to move into admissions at one of those schools) won't be apt to work the letters of recommendation and check off the "most rigorous" box or rave about the student in the advisor's own letter of recommendation (in VA the public high school counselor writes their own letter to the public schools). Because of this system of screening and checks, the applicant pool to the top publics is very elite and primarily the top 6% of public high school students. Hence the rate of selectivity is lower than privates - and remember that privates can throw millions of dollars at marketing to inflate the applicant pool class in order to drive down the acceptance/selectivity numbers. Publics don't have those resources. This is why USNWR doesn't require institutions to submit selectivity numbers anymore . . . they are too easily manipulated by the private institutions, like Northwestern, U of Chicago and Northeastern.

The result is that the top publics have higher percentages of acceptance than top privates: U of Florida is 31.1%; the University of Michigan is 26.1%; UCLA 14.3%; Berkeley is 17.5%; the University of Texas (on a very different system) 32%; the University of North Carolina, 25% (OOS is 10.5%). All of these schools have become very difficult to get into - especially for OOS as states drive down on the number of OOS as demand by taxpayers increases.

So UVA at 22.6% (OOS 17%) is right in line with the other publics. But even amongst publics you can't compare precisely because of the system of applicants and the screening role of the public high school counselors. But all counselors will tell you that getting in OOS at UCLA, Berkeley, UNC, etc. is unlikely because of the quality of competition. In California, the OOS class is limited to only 10% as is UNC.

A better indicator of prestige and quality of student are the SCHEV statistics which show that the applicants who arrive on campus have higher stats than Georgetown. Last fall, the 75th percentile of enrolled (the students who actually showed up, not the accepted class, which is higher; some turn down UVA for Ivies or SLACs), was a 4.52 weighted GPA; a whopping 35 on the ACT and a 1510 SAT/=. The median has a 4.39, a whopping 34 ACT and a 1450. Even the bottom 25th percentile has a 4.23, a 32 ACT and a 1400. Now someone will come on and say SCHEV doesn't include all the entering students but SCHEV is a FAR BETTER tool than exists for the private schools in other states. Every Virginia parent should be using it as a reference guide for all privates (yes SCHEV covers privates too) and publics. All the stats you need to know are there. Just enter the name of the college and dig in. Then go to your high school Naviance or equivalent and compare your student's stats to those of his own class. Uou will come away with a very realistic view of your child's chances of getting into Virginia schools. Because we have this tool, applicants are better able to apply to the institutions that they have a chance of getting into. There is no equivalent in other states. https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp

Northeastern has nothing in common with the former two you mentioned. Man, Northeastern's marketing department has been on an absolute roll these last couple of years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This is such a ridiculous discussion.

Georgetown is way more selective than UVA: 16% vs 22%. And that's before taking into account the fact that all Common App colleges have artificially low acceptance rates, including UVA. Georgetown does not participate in the Common App.

But financially, instate UVA is OBVIOUSLY the better choice.
Academically, there is no question GU is more reputable.

Done.

End of discussion.

I think you are new to college admissions. If you research it here or anywhere online you will learn that you cannot compare the selectivity/acceptance rates of our nation's public universities to that of private institutions. There are many reasons why but primarily, and certainly in Virginia and California, the applicant pool to the top public schools is self-selecting. Due to SCHEV and other statistical resources, applicants know exactly where they stand vis-a-vis the prior entering class, so can make a better call on chances of getting in than they can for privates. This is also done by the public high school counselor whose job it is to direct applicants to the most suitable public university. When we met with the Langley high school counselor there was absolutely no question that our DD was not UVA material. And if we had pushed on it, the counselor whips out the SCHEV statistics and Naviance to demonstrate why. We could readily see she had a chance of getting into GMU but never UVA or W&M. The public high school counselor will not support the application. Can a parent force it? I suppose so but I've never heard it done. And remember that public high school counselor (whose reputation is on the line with the public universities and often wants to move into admissions at one of those schools) won't be apt to work the letters of recommendation and check off the "most rigorous" box or rave about the student in the advisor's own letter of recommendation (in VA the public high school counselor writes their own letter to the public schools). Because of this system of screening and checks, the applicant pool to the top publics is very elite and primarily the top 6% of public high school students. Hence the rate of selectivity is lower than privates - and remember that privates can throw millions of dollars at marketing to inflate the applicant pool class in order to drive down the acceptance/selectivity numbers. Publics don't have those resources. This is why USNWR doesn't require institutions to submit selectivity numbers anymore . . . they are too easily manipulated by the private institutions, like Northwestern, U of Chicago and Northeastern.

The result is that the top publics have higher percentages of acceptance than top privates: U of Florida is 31.1%; the University of Michigan is 26.1%; UCLA 14.3%; Berkeley is 17.5%; the University of Texas (on a very different system) 32%; the University of North Carolina, 25% (OOS is 10.5%). All of these schools have become very difficult to get into - especially for OOS as states drive down on the number of OOS as demand by taxpayers increases.

So UVA at 22.6% (OOS 17%) is right in line with the other publics. But even amongst publics you can't compare precisely because of the system of applicants and the screening role of the public high school counselors. But all counselors will tell you that getting in OOS at UCLA, Berkeley, UNC, etc. is unlikely because of the quality of competition. In California, the OOS class is limited to only 10% as is UNC.

A better indicator of prestige and quality of student are the SCHEV statistics which show that the applicants who arrive on campus have higher stats than Georgetown. Last fall, the 75th percentile of enrolled (the students who actually showed up, not the accepted class, which is higher; some turn down UVA for Ivies or SLACs), was a 4.52 weighted GPA; a whopping 35 on the ACT and a 1510 SAT/=. The median has a 4.39, a whopping 34 ACT and a 1450. Even the bottom 25th percentile has a 4.23, a 32 ACT and a 1400. Now someone will come on and say SCHEV doesn't include all the entering students but SCHEV is a FAR BETTER tool than exists for the private schools in other states. Every Virginia parent should be using it as a reference guide for all privates (yes SCHEV covers privates too) and publics. All the stats you need to know are there. Just enter the name of the college and dig in. Then go to your high school Naviance or equivalent and compare your student's stats to those of his own class. Uou will come away with a very realistic view of your child's chances of getting into Virginia schools. Because we have this tool, applicants are better able to apply to the institutions that they have a chance of getting into. There is no equivalent in other states. https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp

SCHEV is fine, but offers very little that is no on the CDS. Per CDS 20-21 SAT 25-75 UVA- 1330-1490 (with 70% reporting SAT), GU- 1380-1530 (with 64% reporting SAT). Bolded is not true.

[Anonymous]

UVA also has more Schwarzman (global international affair) scholars than Georgetown. https://citizenscholars.virginia.edu/3-uva-student...eceive-schwarzman-scholarships

No, you're a liar. And a poor advocate for UVA.

The link you posted is from 2018.

Since the Schwarzman Scholars program's inception in 2016, graduates of Georgetown and UVA have won exactly the same number --11 -- of scholarships (to study at Tsinghua University in Beijing). And there's no discernible pattern separating the two schools -- UVA grads "won" one more this year, Georgetown grads won one more last year, Georgetown grads won two more the previous year, etc. https://www.schwarzmanscholars.org/

UVA's a fine school, but its boosters here do it no favors with easily debunked false claims.

[Anonymous]

Look at this, another thread that descends into hyperbolic rants and name calling by people that appear to be unhinged...so predictable.

[Anonymous]

Look at this, another thread that descends into hyperbolic rants and name calling by people that appear to be unhinged...so predictable.

Everyone's entitled to express their own opinion, but when one side (or party) to a debate is repeatedly citing made-up 'alternate facts' falsehoods, they need to be called out on it. And not coyly or discreetly but candidly.

If the past few years have taught us Americans anything, it's that we need to have a more effective response to public dishonesty than just wondering why both sides can't get along, or lamenting the decline of civil discourse.

[Anonymous]

This is such a ridiculous discussion.

Georgetown is way more selective than UVA: 16% vs 22%

What is ridiculous is the apparent assumption that “more selective” means academically better when the difference in selectivity is minor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

UVA also has more Schwarzman (global international affair) scholars than Georgetown. https://citizenscholars.virginia.edu/3-uva-student...eceive-schwarzman-scholarships

No, you're a liar. And a poor advocate for UVA.

The link you posted is from 2018.

Since the Schwarzman Scholars program's inception in 2016, graduates of Georgetown and UVA have won exactly the same number --11 -- of scholarships (to study at Tsinghua University in Beijing). And there's no discernible pattern separating the two schools -- UVA grads "won" one more this year, Georgetown grads won one more last year, Georgetown grads won two more the previous year, etc. https://www.schwarzmanscholars.org/

UVA's a fine school, but its boosters here do it no favors with easily debunked false claims.

Georgetown has had 286 Fulbright Scholars since 2010, versus 136 for UVA over the same period. UVA has about 2.4X as many undergraduates, so Georgetown undergraduates are about 5X as likely to earn Fulbright Scholarships.