What were your DC’s top schools they were deciding between and where are they committing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD choosing between UMD and Case Western for engineering. I'm pushing Case because I fear she will be swallowed up by a huge school like UMW, but many of her friends are going to UMD, and it's closer to home, and she's a homebody! We'll see. She's waiting until the very last moment to decide.

Of course I’m projecting my own issues. But I would be very happy if my children stayed close to home for college and went to a familiar environment with friends. I myself flew across the country, didn’t know anyone, and underwent bouts of depression. Wish I had stayed local even with a less name-brand school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

I think it's really just mine and another kid, but other people then weigh in on their experiences, so maybe it feels like more? Yes, I agree NU is the clear winner on theatre curriculum and departmental support/connections, but Brown might have potential for opportunities, but she would have to drive it. Brown would be better for her other interests. Hard choices!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

This is what I have been thinking or that it's a shame she changed her mind in a way that wasn't compatible with NU.

I have also been thinking it's a shame because we have visited many schools that touted the flexibility to take courses in any department, including top music programs.

But in the end, she has her two choices now. They are both great schools and I am sure she will succeed either way. Congrats and good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

Peabody is open to non-major involvement though. It’s on their web site.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

I think it's really just mine and another kid, but other people then weigh in on their experiences, so maybe it feels like more? Yes, I agree NU is the clear winner on theatre curriculum and departmental support/connections, but Brown might have potential for opportunities, but she would have to drive it. Brown would be better for her other interests. Hard choices!

I guess I missed that since I didn’t know people actually went to either of those schools for theater.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

This is what I have been thinking or that it's a shame she changed her mind in a way that wasn't compatible with NU.

I have also been thinking it's a shame because we have visited many schools that touted the flexibility to take courses in any department, including top music programs.

But in the end, she has her two choices now. They are both great schools and I am sure she will succeed either way. Congrats and good luck.

Yes, to all of this! She went with the BA for flexibility not thinking that it could be so restrictive on the other end. But, yes, two great choices, and there are ways to fill in the gaps on either end. Thanks for the well wishes!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

Peabody is open to non-major involvement though. It’s on their web site.

Yeah, they seem to have more options for proficient nonmajors, which is what we expected from NU. But, they don't have a Theatre degree. Ah, well. She just has so many interests!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

I think it's really just mine and another kid, but other people then weigh in on their experiences, so maybe it feels like more? Yes, I agree NU is the clear winner on theatre curriculum and departmental support/connections, but Brown might have potential for opportunities, but she would have to drive it. Brown would be better for her other interests. Hard choices!

I guess I missed that since I didn’t know people actually went to either of those schools for theater.

What do you mean? Northwestern has one of the most prolific theatre departments in the country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

I think it's really just mine and another kid, but other people then weigh in on their experiences, so maybe it feels like more? Yes, I agree NU is the clear winner on theatre curriculum and departmental support/connections, but Brown might have potential for opportunities, but she would have to drive it. Brown would be better for her other interests. Hard choices!

I guess I missed that since I didn’t know people actually went to either of those schools for theater.

What do you mean? Northwestern has one of the most prolific theatre departments in the country.

Prolific? It looks to be ranked around 20 or so but in any case, I’m not up on theatre rankings and am surprised people are willing to pay private schools, tuitions for theatre majors outside the tip top programs like Juilliard, Yale and NYU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD choosing between UMD and Case Western for engineering. I'm pushing Case because I fear she will be swallowed up by a huge school like UMW, but many of her friends are going to UMD, and it's closer to home, and she's a homebody! We'll see. She's waiting until the very last moment to decide.

Of course I’m projecting my own issues. But I would be very happy if my children stayed close to home for college and went to a familiar environment with friends. I myself flew across the country, didn’t know anyone, and underwent bouts of depression. Wish I had stayed local even with a less name-brand school.

There is definitely something to be said for this - depression runs in families - I have anxiety and depression and while my DC doesn't display depression yet (nor did I at his age, though not long after), he has lots of anxiety that sometimes gets to him. I too know I'm projecting, but would be happy if he goes to school within a drivable distance, or somewhere with family in the area. I think of it as scaffolding and want to give him a little, even if he doesn't think he needs it. That said, I also want him to know that I believe in him and that I know he can stand on his own two feet and flourish.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

I think it's really just mine and another kid, but other people then weigh in on their experiences, so maybe it feels like more? Yes, I agree NU is the clear winner on theatre curriculum and departmental support/connections, but Brown might have potential for opportunities, but she would have to drive it. Brown would be better for her other interests. Hard choices!

I guess I missed that since I didn’t know people actually went to either of those schools for theater.

What do you mean? Northwestern has one of the most prolific theatre departments in the country.

Prolific? It looks to be ranked around 20 or so but in any case, I’m not up on theatre rankings and am surprised people are willing to pay private schools, tuitions for theatre majors outside the tip top programs like Juilliard, Yale and NYU.

Uh, what? Northwestern is most definitely considered a "tip top program" alongside the likes of Juilliard, Yale and NYU, and has been for a long, long time. Like, we're talking "since the Golden Age of Hollywood" long. No idea what "ranking" you're looking at.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

I think it's really just mine and another kid, but other people then weigh in on their experiences, so maybe it feels like more? Yes, I agree NU is the clear winner on theatre curriculum and departmental support/connections, but Brown might have potential for opportunities, but she would have to drive it. Brown would be better for her other interests. Hard choices!

I guess I missed that since I didn’t know people actually went to either of those schools for theater.

What do you mean? Northwestern has one of the most prolific theatre departments in the country.

Prolific? It looks to be ranked around 20 or so but in any case, I’m not up on theatre rankings and am surprised people are willing to pay private schools, tuitions for theatre majors outside the tip top programs like Juilliard, Yale and NYU.

Tell me you don't know anything about theatre without telling me you don't know anything about theatre. And NU is a dream school for plenty of theatre nerds across the country. I think rankings are dumb and ineffectual for a field like this, but fwiw Niche ranks Northwestern #1 for performing arts in the country.

https://www.niche.com/colleges/search/best-colleges-for-theater/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down to Brown and Northwestern. Still deciding.

Brown, definitely. Not even close.

Northwestern, without question. Not even close.

hahahaha. they are both great and both have something the other doesn't.

NU offers way more in content and industry connections for the major. Better food and dorms. BUT, that music school restriction is killing her. She'd have to declare a 2nd major just to take theory classes and still wouldn't get faculty instrument lessons. She'd have to audition, get accepted and do a 5 year dual degree to get the lessons, and that would come w/ extra ensembles and classes. If there was a way she could do the BA Music as a double major and be allowed to get lessons, that might sway her. NU outranks Brown on some lists.

Brown was her dream school. LOVES the open curriculum. Major offerings are meager, and hers is the one (or one of few) department they don't let UGs take grad courses. But, she would definitely double and possibly triple major there. And, Brown is probably better for her secondary interests. She has many interests! So, now she needs to find out if/how she can supplement the main major w/ study abroad or summer programs, and if Brown will help financially w/ that. Brown has been better on FA so far. Not jazzed about the dorms/food there. Students seem more deep thinking and less superficial at Brown, but that is just casual observation. She would find her people at NU as well. And, then there's the Ivy status. DH and I are from no-name schools, so we're thrilled w/ all the choices, but having a kid at an Ivy would be cool. Not gonna lie.

As a former music major and an amauter musican now, when looking for a place to study music, its all about the teacher you will study with, and becoming a music double major just to take theory classes isn't worth it. Also important is playing the music school ensembles. If NU will not let her study with the music school's professor for her instrument, or let her play in the school's main ensembles (which I suspect is the case) without being a one major music major, she should think twice about choosing NU if she really wants to continue to pursue music in college. Even if she does the double major, the scheduling of classes could be difficult between the requirements for the 2 majors. An alternative is to see if the music professor has a private studio she can join, or find another teacher in Chicago and take lessons outside of college- there are lots of musicians in Chicago offering lessons. And there are plenty of summer music program for college students to supplement ensemble playing.
Both schools are excellent- congrats to your DD and good luck with your choice.

Double majoring in Music and anything else has been done at NU for decades. I graduated in 80s with an engineering and music performance degree back when not many did it. Now it's extremely common. the most challenging part would be getting into the music major and realizing that the first 2 years of the music major your group of 100-120 students is a cohort---you take Music history together both years, and break out into 4-5 music theory groups. As a non-major there are basic Theory and history Classes available. And yes, NU doesn't typically let non-majors study with a music professor for private lessons unless there is space in their studio. NU is a TOP 5 university for music, it compares with Eastman/Julliard/Curtis/etc. NU is not a university that just has a music major---NU seriously competes with the Music conservatories in the US, and who is "better" largely depends upon the individual professor. NU will have top Grad students your student could take private lessons with for probably $100 or less per lesson---much cheaper than paying for a quarter of 1 class at NU tuition, and if you don't want to be a music major, those grad students are TOP notch. You are allowed to perform in certain ensembles as a non-major---and those ensembles (concert band/sympohonic band/chamber orchestra) are better than the top ensembles at many universities.

So while you might be able to study with the same prof at brown university for your instrument as music majors, I've never heard of anyone attending Brown university that's serious about a music performance degree.

Thanks for his perspective. The issue (one of the issues!) is, she's no longer very interested in a music performance degree. Just wants theory/ear training as a basis for Composition minor as well as good lessons. Current teacher is Juilliard grad and head of dept at UMD. The classes w/ grads at NU are through the university, and, while they will tier voice for non-majors and offer faculty for upper tiers, they will not tier instruments, so only 100 level offered. The music dept office at NU was iffy about whether grad teachers would meet her needs. Do you know students in the grad programs? I think if she chooses NU, she tries the grad lessons, and sees how it goes for semester. Maybe, once there, an exception could be made or we can arrange private study w/ a faculty member if grad lessons are not a good fit. But, that still leaves the music theory problem. I hear you on Brown, it's not a conservatory, but wouldn't the name attract some good adjunct faculty?

I’m wondering why she eliminated Hopkins. It seems like Peabody would meet her needs.

Because she doesn't want a music performance degree. Have you all actually read what she wtote?! She wanted a theatre degree with the ability to take some theory and lessons. Hopkins doesn't have a theatre degree, and Peabody is a top school that would not be very open to nonmajor involvement. Terrible idea. Same to the person who suggested Case. Why would she want that? Also, people, she is not looking for new recommendations. She is comparing 2 options. Clearly, she did not dig deep enough into NU to see how restricting Bienen is, but there are ways to make either of her options work. Uninformed ideas are not helpful here.

I think the real question is… does Brown or NU have the better theatre department?

Northwestern has by far the superior theatre department.

On a separate note, is it just me or are there an abnormal number of kids studying music being talked about in this thread? Or am I getting confused? All this talk about music schools and conservatories and this here, that there. And all this time I thought we were talking about the PP's kid who was deciding between Brown and Northwestern!

I think it's really just mine and another kid, but other people then weigh in on their experiences, so maybe it feels like more? Yes, I agree NU is the clear winner on theatre curriculum and departmental support/connections, but Brown might have potential for opportunities, but she would have to drive it. Brown would be better for her other interests. Hard choices!

I guess I missed that since I didn’t know people actually went to either of those schools for theater.

What do you mean? Northwestern has one of the most prolific theatre departments in the country.

Prolific? It looks to be ranked around 20 or so but in any case, I’m not up on theatre rankings and am surprised people are willing to pay private schools, tuitions for theatre majors outside the tip top programs like Juilliard, Yale and NYU.

"Harvard? What's that? In any case, I'm surprised people are willing to pay private school tuition for schools outside the tippy top ones like Yale, Stanford and Princeton."