Cops in TX tackle & block desperate parents, while they let shooter rampage thru the school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

I thought it was confirmed he was not wearing body armor? I find it hard to believe anything coming out of TX at this point. Will wait for DOJ.

He's not a TX official

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is anyone else afraid for Biden and his trip to Texas. Every elected republican official in the state has gone right up to the line in threatening Biden and out and out said he is not the legitimate president. Biden stole the election. The police force who will be providing the perimeter security is incompetent and openly hostile to Biden. It is very worrying.

Presumably he knows what security he can and can't trust. Mike pence knew not to get in that car on Jan 6th.

Of the rhetoric pushed out by Fox News and the elected republicans is very scary. This is the type of environment where you do not know what will happen.

A coup from the secrets service? The suspects that would attempt such a thing would be known. Pence knew so why wouldn't others?

I mean, I think I know what you're saying, but I'm confused. Are y'all suggesting Pence was worried for his safety with certain SS agents? That sounds far out, but I don't know the facts here ... ?

He never mentioned his own safety that I read. He refused to get in a car and be driven away from the capital because he understood that would help enable the coup plot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

I thought it was confirmed he was not wearing body armor? I find it hard to believe anything coming out of TX at this point. Will wait for DOJ.

He's not a TX official

Me again. He was apparently wearing a tactical vest without the plates so they thought he was wearing armor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is anyone else afraid for Biden and his trip to Texas. Every elected republican official in the state has gone right up to the line in threatening Biden and out and out said he is not the legitimate president. Biden stole the election. The police force who will be providing the perimeter security is incompetent and openly hostile to Biden. It is very worrying.

Presumably he knows what security he can and can't trust. Mike pence knew not to get in that car on Jan 6th.

Of the rhetoric pushed out by Fox News and the elected republicans is very scary. This is the type of environment where you do not know what will happen.

A coup from the secrets service? The suspects that would attempt such a thing would be known. Pence knew so why wouldn't others?

I mean, I think I know what you're saying, but I'm confused. Are y'all suggesting Pence was worried for his safety with certain SS agents? That sounds far out, but I don't know the facts here ... ?

He never mentioned his own safety that I read. He refused to get in a car and be driven away from the capital because he understood that would help enable the coup plot.

Do you honestly think Pence was that heroic? Y'all spend four years demonizing him.

[Anonymous]

If active shooters do not have these assault weapons a group of adults and our children could likely rush them and take them with a pretty good chance of survival.
These semi-automatic and automatic weapons need to be banned illegal to sell illegal to have with very strong maximum prisons sentences.

[Anonymous]

The cops failed. They could have broken through the wall creating a target if themselves to save the kids

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is anyone else afraid for Biden and his trip to Texas. Every elected republican official in the state has gone right up to the line in threatening Biden and out and out said he is not the legitimate president. Biden stole the election. The police force who will be providing the perimeter security is incompetent and openly hostile to Biden. It is very worrying.

Presumably he knows what security he can and can't trust. Mike pence knew not to get in that car on Jan 6th.

Of the rhetoric pushed out by Fox News and the elected republicans is very scary. This is the type of environment where you do not know what will happen.

A coup from the secrets service? The suspects that would attempt such a thing would be known. Pence knew so why wouldn't others?

I mean, I think I know what you're saying, but I'm confused. Are y'all suggesting Pence was worried for his safety with certain SS agents? That sounds far out, but I don't know the facts here ... ?

He never mentioned his own safety that I read. He refused to get in a car and be driven away from the capital because he understood that would help enable the coup plot.

Do you honestly think Pence was that heroic? Y'all spend four years demonizing him.

No one said anything about heroics. Just that he was very aware of the situation and would not cooperate. Not cooperating with a coup is expected behavior got most.

[Anonymous]

Anyway. President biden and the first lady made their visit to uvalde safely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

I thought it was confirmed he was not wearing body armor? I find it hard to believe anything coming out of TX at this point. Will wait for DOJ.

So you are also saying that a school feature built to keep the kids safe from guns did not work as intended........again, the source of all these problems are guns.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

The whole premise of that scenario is that the couldn't get a key. They got a key. We don't know when they started looking for one or why the School's Chief of Police didn't have one of his own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

The whole premise of that scenario is that the couldn't get a key. They got a key. We don't know when they started looking for one or why the School's Chief of Police didn't have one of his own.

Exactly. Not to mention that the training isn’t that they wait for backup. It’s go in and take them out. Or distract them so they’re not shooting at kids. It explicitly states they’ll likely risk their own lives and that if that’s not okay with them, they need a different job.

Also, who is this guy and why does he have more relevant inside info than anyone else? Seems like conjecture and theory mixed with his bias and a helping of wishful thinking sprinkled on top, that he wrote while wearing his rose colored glasses.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

I thought it was confirmed he was not wearing body armor? I find it hard to believe anything coming out of TX at this point. Will wait for DOJ.

So you are also saying that a school feature built to keep the kids safe from guns did not work as intended........again, the source of all these problems are guns.

Again, the door was left open

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

I thought it was confirmed he was not wearing body armor? I find it hard to believe anything coming out of TX at this point. Will wait for DOJ.

So you are also saying that a school feature built to keep the kids safe from guns did not work as intended........again, the source of all these problems are guns.

Again, the door was left open

I'm an aerospace engineer. In grad school, I took a human factors engineering class. You need to design systems around how people are likely to use, and potentially misuse, them. People prop open secure doors. It happens everywhere and has happened forever. If a door is your only defense against a massacre, then you've failed as a solution developer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here is a good explanation of what went down from Tim Sumner:

"The steel doors designed to keep killers out were used by the shooter to keep police out. w/o a key to open them, police would've had to use infantry techniques (explosives) to breech the outer walls. The kids and teachers were not the enemy. Blowing holes in walls, police indiscriminately spraying the room with bullets, or engaging a full body armored shooter using kids as human shields were NOT good options. (Imagine THAT forensic pathology report it would have generated, proof police killed X number of the innocent during entry). police entered Robb Elementary hallway (inverted T-shaped) 2-3 minutes after the shooter. The shooter had locked the doors and was slaughtering. From doorway, shooter sprayed police (who lacked cover) with bullets, wounding 2. Shooter wore full body armor. Police best option was to fall back to 2 corners feet away from CRs 111 and 112 doors and get backup. They needed keys or tools to open those doors. The police could not yet know who was alive, wounded, or dead in those CRs. Police needed level 4 shields to survive long enough upon entry to take down shooter for they did not know where within the 2 adjoining classrooms he would be when they entered. 9-1-1 calls were coming in. However, the police still lacked entry tools. Small kids playing dead, disoriented, crying for help provided little useful information (NOT at all the kids' fault). Sporadic fire from inside 2 adjoining CRs only momentarily provided police a fix on shooter, and he'd shot at police trying to peek through small windows on doors. Again, police could not place effective fire on moving shooter. He was barricaded in, could move within and between 2 CRs, and there were still living innocents inside. Were the police supposed to crashed through the outer windows, spray those 2 classrooms with bullets, and return fire once the shooter showed himself? That might be the right way during war but saving lives (not accepting "collateral damage") is what police are trained to do. So, the police waited for an entry team (drove 70 miles in 40 minutes), located a master key, listened, watched, and planned the entry of two doors. Meanwhile, "spotters"peering through the outer windows tried to get a fix on the shooter's location inside and relay to the entry team(s). If he was below the outer window, they would not have seen him. THIS IS IMPORTANT: Police told a Congressman afterwards the shooter emerged from a closet and and fired at them once entry was made. Upon entry, at least 1 police officer was wounded from the shooter's bullets passing above, below, outside those shields. The police had to expose body parts to get a shot. That is NOT cowardice on the part of the police; they wanted to live long enough to eliminate the shooter.

The ONLY people responsible for the deaths & wounded innocent kids & teachers ARE the shooter and anyone who helped him commit mass murder.

God bless the children, teachers, & police

P.S. If shooter positioned inside in the doorway between the 2 classrooms, he would have shielded himself from police viewing & snipers outside the school wing. He could observe police attempting to peak through small windows on doors. Adjoining door likely looked like a closet.Inner doorway between classrooms 111 & 112 was not a flat structure. It was a closet with doors on both sides through which teachers and students and the shooter could pass. Inside it, shooter could observe outer doors, both classrooms, and be shielded from outside window view. Uvalde gunman emerged from classroom closet firing as Border Patrol agents entered, officials say

Graphic of layout of classrooms/closet here:

https://ibb.co/qysc9pt

I thought it was confirmed he was not wearing body armor? I find it hard to believe anything coming out of TX at this point. Will wait for DOJ.

So you are also saying that a school feature built to keep the kids safe from guns did not work as intended........again, the source of all these problems are guns.

Again, the door was left open

I'm an aerospace engineer. In grad school, I took a human factors engineering class. You need to design systems around how people are likely to use, and potentially misuse, them. People prop open secure doors. It happens everywhere and has happened forever. If a door is your only defense against a massacre, then you've failed as a solution developer.

Very nice point. Unfortunately you’re talking to people who think Covid is a hoax and science is the devil.

[Anonymous]

If that description above of the timeline is true then it shows why the only solution here is to ban assault rifles (I’d love to ban all guns but I’ll take ARs for now).

Steel doors- meant to protect kids, made the situation more dangerous
Locked doors- meant to protect kids, made the situation more dangerous
Good guys with guns- meant to protect kids, didn’t do that at all

ARs are weapons of mass destruction. They need to be banned