ECNL moving to school year part 2

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

Not to everyone -- maybe for people who like to paint people with a broad brush and say nasty things about them.

If a college coach has 100s of players reaching out to them to play on their team They're not going to waste their time messing around with an Aug birthday that chose to play down a grade.

Sorry that reality doesnt align with the candyland you've put together in your head.

Telling someone they can't do something is just the fuel they need to make it happen.

Hahaha ok, fuel yourself to be ignored twice as much.

Hey, it's about how to develop and become better. And those players who can use the extra minutes/touches will reach their goals.

Development is over by the time players are Sophmores in high school. Either you have or you dont at that point. College coaches who are receuiting players make that decision for you.

No, players continue to develop, even the ones who have "it". This is also when a ton of players, even some who were/are promising quit OR decide to pursue other sports. When you stop developing/think you're already in is exactly how these players go to college end up on the bench and/or transferring. This is why you have also all these college coaches still checking out HS games OR the smaller regional showcases. And it's why anyone deciding misaligned players are doomed miss the whole picutre.

What you dont understand is that the pool of players you're describing has already been picked over. College coaches have moved onto the next group of Sophmore soon to be Junior players looking to lock down the most talented players.

This is why playing down and being misaligned is so bad for players that want to be recruited to play in college. You're not in sync with college coach expectations and schedules which have been defined years in advance. Believe it or not but Aug-Dec birthdays in BY experience the same challenges. However their saving grace is that they're playing up a level when compared to their graduating year competition. SY Aug birthdays that are playjng down a level will be ignored by college coaches.

Those same coaches won't even SEE that player if there playing up on a B team because that team doesn't go to the national showcases. The best shot for that player -- even if it's a tougher climb -- may be the A team on age, especially if they get playing time and become a leader on the team.

"What are the most important factors a 13-15 year old player should be looking at when choosing what club/coach to play for to maximize their development as a player?

The experience and ability of the coach to develop players and people is a massive factor. Usually word of mouth means reputations become known over time. Choose a bad coach and everything else doesn't really matter. Pick the coach who is going to really push your kid and hold them accountable but love them at the same time.

Quality of teammates is next. If you are not being pushed by teammates in training, you're not maximizing your development.

Then it's quality of opponents. If you play too many easy games, again you're not being tested and this impacts your development.

Quality of coach

Quality of teammates

Quality of opponents"

https://www.reddit.com/r/youthsoccer/comments/1r2znnw/youth_prodigy_semipro_player_referee_and_coach_ama/

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

Not to everyone -- maybe for people who like to paint people with a broad brush and say nasty things about them.

If a college coach has 100s of players reaching out to them to play on their team They're not going to waste their time messing around with an Aug birthday that chose to play down a grade.

Sorry that reality doesnt align with the candyland you've put together in your head.

Telling someone they can't do something is just the fuel they need to make it happen.

Hahaha ok, fuel yourself to be ignored twice as much.

Hey, it's about how to develop and become better. And those players who can use the extra minutes/touches will reach their goals.

Development is over by the time players are Sophmores in high school. Either you have or you dont at that point. College coaches who are receuiting players make that decision for you.

No, players continue to develop, even the ones who have "it". This is also when a ton of players, even some who were/are promising quit OR decide to pursue other sports. When you stop developing/think you're already in is exactly how these players go to college end up on the bench and/or transferring. This is why you have also all these college coaches still checking out HS games OR the smaller regional showcases. And it's why anyone deciding misaligned players are doomed miss the whole picutre.

What you dont understand is that the pool of players you're describing has already been picked over. College coaches have moved onto the next group of Sophmore soon to be Junior players looking to lock down the most talented players.

This is why playing down and being misaligned is so bad for players that want to be recruited to play in college. You're not in sync with college coach expectations and schedules which have been defined years in advance. Believe it or not but Aug-Dec birthdays in BY experience the same challenges. However their saving grace is that they're playing up a level when compared to their graduating year competition. SY Aug birthdays that are playjng down a level will be ignored by college coaches.

Those same coaches won't even SEE that player if there playing up on a B team because that team doesn't go to the national showcases. The best shot for that player -- even if it's a tougher climb -- may be the A team on age, especially if they get playing time and become a leader on the team.

"What are the most important factors a 13-15 year old player should be looking at when choosing what club/coach to play for to maximize their development as a player?

The experience and ability of the coach to develop players and people is a massive factor. Usually word of mouth means reputations become known over time. Choose a bad coach and everything else doesn't really matter. Pick the coach who is going to really push your kid and hold them accountable but love them at the same time.

Quality of teammates is next. If you are not being pushed by teammates in training, you're not maximizing your development.

Then it's quality of opponents. If you play too many easy games, again you're not being tested and this impacts your development.

Quality of coach

Quality of teammates

Quality of opponents"

https://www.reddit.com/r/youthsoccer/comments/1r2znnw/youth_prodigy_semipro_player_referee_and_coach_ama/

This is a Q&A with a lot of wisdom ...

"Hi Paul. Specifically for SoCal:

What are the biggest myths about club soccer in SoCal?

What are some cold realities that most parents (or new club players) don't understand?

There are so many clubs and leagues here, it's honestly just kind of confusing to know where there is value, and where there isn't.

Footnote: through the lens of a parent of a competitive player, with no illusions nor aspirations of a pro or even D1 path.

The number of leagues is ridiculous. It waters down talent, confuses parents and does nothing to serve development.

Myth: You have to play in a top league (MLS/ECNL/GA) if you want good competition and if you want to play in college.

Reality: For most families with no pro/D1 dream, it's overpriced college prep theater. There are good players and teams everywhere. If you are a strong player on a strong MLS/ECNL team, it makes sense to get the exposure. Too many players/families chase the dream and sit on the bench on a team that is too good for them, realistically. College coaches do not care about you if you are not playing.

Myth: You need private training to stay competitive.

Reality: Most of the best local kids have zero private trainers. Good club training plus pickup/futsal/street soccer is way better than $100/hr Instagram trainers.

SoCal is one of the most competitive soccer hotbeds in the nation. If we got our act together and structured leagues properly, 95% of players and families would not need to travel more than 60 minutes every weekend for a competitive game against similar level opponents. It's crazy how much we travel, especially going to other states!

Cold realities:

- Coaches do not make a lot of money and clubs do not make a lot of money either, aside from the huge juggernauts.

- Big % of your monthly or annual fee is subsidizing the top teams that the club uses for marketing.

- Most big clubs have 1–2 good teams and 3-4 mediocre ones. I think most people know that."

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

The 2-grade dynamic will continue to exist in SY but the number of outliers will be smaller. Last time roughly 5% of all players were misaligned or an average of 1 per team. The only way you can completely eliminate it would be to have a GY system -- which would completely blow up any 12-month window.

You love that article from 2015 that you found.

I was around in 2017 and I dont remember ever hearing about players playing down a grade in SY. All people talked about was playing up and who was thinking about graduating early to play in college. But this was in a highly competitive environment with highly competitive clubs and players.

My guess is your kid plays on a much lower level club and team. So maybe there will be play downers. But this diesnt change the fact college coaches /recruiters will ignore them because they're misaligned.

When I coached prior to the BY switch (started in 2012), we never considered grade. It was a huge club, with kids from 20 different schools, the only thing that mattered was what bracket your birth date fell in. That's it. No one questioned it, no one complained about grade stuff, it just was what it was. We never even asked what grade kids were in. I didn't know of any clubs that did it any different. There were outlier players who played up of course, but that had nothing to do with what grade they were in and was completely based on physical/technical aspects. Currently, under BY, no one cares about grade. You play by your age bracket, just like before BY.

I can't imagine that will change now all of a sudden. We will obviously have to wait and see what the clubs actually do (not just what they say) of course. My bet is that for 99% of them, tryouts will be by strict age bracket with nary a mention of grade to be found.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

You talked your way into a corner on this.

You say when it was SY last their weren't any August kids playing on age but below their grade and then you turn around and say that these kids that didn't exist didn't get recruited for college.

Also the last time SY was being used colleges didn't have most of their teams from transfers and foreign players. Any insights from that period wouldn't be relevant to today.

College coaches take the best players that are interested in their program. They said they don't care about your age or age group as posted by clubs.

You have no proof of what will happen and keep nonsensically barfing it out with more than a trust me bro, I'm a random parent when it goes against what those in the business actually say.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

The 2-grade dynamic will continue to exist in SY but the number of outliers will be smaller. Last time roughly 5% of all players were misaligned or an average of 1 per team. The only way you can completely eliminate it would be to have a GY system -- which would completely blow up any 12-month window.

You love that article from 2015 that you found.

I was around in 2017 and I dont remember ever hearing about players playing down a grade in SY. All people talked about was playing up and who was thinking about graduating early to play in college. But this was in a highly competitive environment with highly competitive clubs and players.

My guess is your kid plays on a much lower level club and team. So maybe there will be play downers. But this diesnt change the fact college coaches /recruiters will ignore them because they're misaligned.

When I coached prior to the BY switch (started in 2012), we never considered grade. It was a huge club, with kids from 20 different schools, the only thing that mattered was what bracket your birth date fell in. That's it. No one questioned it, no one complained about grade stuff, it just was what it was. We never even asked what grade kids were in. I didn't know of any clubs that did it any different. There were outlier players who played up of course, but that had nothing to do with what grade they were in and was completely based on physical/technical aspects. Currently, under BY, no one cares about grade. You play by your age bracket, just like before BY.

I can't imagine that will change now all of a sudden. We will obviously have to wait and see what the clubs actually do (not just what they say) of course. My bet is that for 99% of them, tryouts will be by strict age bracket with nary a mention of grade to be found.

So now you're impersonating coaches 🤣 😂 😆 😅 So desperate to encourage parents to play down grade.

Clubs 100% group top teams by grade. I was around before 2017 and I never saw or heard of Aug brirthday players playing down in SY. All anyone discussed was playing up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

You talked your way into a corner on this.

You say when it was SY last their weren't any August kids playing on age but below their grade and then you turn around and say that these kids that didn't exist didn't get recruited for college.

Also the last time SY was being used colleges didn't have most of their teams from transfers and foreign players. Any insights from that period wouldn't be relevant to today.

College coaches take the best players that are interested in their program. They said they don't care about your age or age group as posted by clubs.

You have no proof of what will happen and keep nonsensically barfing it out with more than a trust me bro, I'm a random parent when it goes against what those in the business actually say.

Theres no talking into a corner. Aug birthdays playing down a grade didn't exist so they were never recruited. Pretty simple.

You really should just enroll your kid in a private school so you can play them down without any restrictions. If you're going to go through all the effort to be a square peg in club soccer and do all the outreach to college coaches yourself play where that is the norm dont push your nonsense where its not wanted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

You talked your way into a corner on this.

You say when it was SY last their weren't any August kids playing on age but below their grade and then you turn around and say that these kids that didn't exist didn't get recruited for college.

Also the last time SY was being used colleges didn't have most of their teams from transfers and foreign players. Any insights from that period wouldn't be relevant to today.

College coaches take the best players that are interested in their program. They said they don't care about your age or age group as posted by clubs.

You have no proof of what will happen and keep nonsensically barfing it out with more than a trust me bro, I'm a random parent when it goes against what those in the business actually say.

Theres no talking into a corner. Aug birthdays playing down a grade didn't exist so they were never recruited. Pretty simple.

You really should just enroll your kid in a private school so you can play them down without any restrictions. If you're going to go through all the effort to be a square peg in club soccer and do all the outreach to college coaches yourself play where that is the norm dont push your nonsense where its not wanted.

With you are saying all August births all played on grade under the old SY, essentially almost all playing up an age group then you would have zero insight into whether they could be recruited for college if they played on age back then or now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

The 2-grade dynamic will continue to exist in SY but the number of outliers will be smaller. Last time roughly 5% of all players were misaligned or an average of 1 per team. The only way you can completely eliminate it would be to have a GY system -- which would completely blow up any 12-month window.

You love that article from 2015 that you found.

I was around in 2017 and I dont remember ever hearing about players playing down a grade in SY. All people talked about was playing up and who was thinking about graduating early to play in college. But this was in a highly competitive environment with highly competitive clubs and players.

My guess is your kid plays on a much lower level club and team. So maybe there will be play downers. But this diesnt change the fact college coaches /recruiters will ignore them because they're misaligned.

When I coached prior to the BY switch (started in 2012), we never considered grade. It was a huge club, with kids from 20 different schools, the only thing that mattered was what bracket your birth date fell in. That's it. No one questioned it, no one complained about grade stuff, it just was what it was. We never even asked what grade kids were in. I didn't know of any clubs that did it any different. There were outlier players who played up of course, but that had nothing to do with what grade they were in and was completely based on physical/technical aspects. Currently, under BY, no one cares about grade. You play by your age bracket, just like before BY.

I can't imagine that will change now all of a sudden. We will obviously have to wait and see what the clubs actually do (not just what they say) of course. My bet is that for 99% of them, tryouts will be by strict age bracket with nary a mention of grade to be found.

So now you're impersonating coaches 🤣 😂 😆 😅 So desperate to encourage parents to play down grade.

Clubs 100% group top teams by grade. I was around before 2017 and I never saw or heard of Aug brirthday players playing down in SY. All anyone discussed was playing up.

LMAO. You just got owned as your own narrative was destroyed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:After lurking on all the threads on this topic, it seems like the misaligned August/September players are in a dawned if you do, dawned if you don't situation.

Either they "play on grade" where since they'll be the youngest they should be happy with the B team.

Or they "play in their new age bracket" against players a full grade behind them but they'll never amount to much playing against younger players and won't be recruited.

Seems like what most people really want to for August/September kids to go find a different sport to play.

I can tell you that it is not as simple a choice for most misaligned players in that birth range as people on these threads make it seem. Trying to navigate to the best situation coaching wise, development wise, recruiting wise and socially is like trying to solve a rubik's cube that's had the squares switched.

I agree it's a challenging decision. But perhaps we're lucky we have options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

The 2-grade dynamic will continue to exist in SY but the number of outliers will be smaller. Last time roughly 5% of all players were misaligned or an average of 1 per team. The only way you can completely eliminate it would be to have a GY system -- which would completely blow up any 12-month window.

You love that article from 2015 that you found.

I was around in 2017 and I dont remember ever hearing about players playing down a grade in SY. All people talked about was playing up and who was thinking about graduating early to play in college. But this was in a highly competitive environment with highly competitive clubs and players.

My guess is your kid plays on a much lower level club and team. So maybe there will be play downers. But this diesnt change the fact college coaches /recruiters will ignore them because they're misaligned.

When I coached prior to the BY switch (started in 2012), we never considered grade. It was a huge club, with kids from 20 different schools, the only thing that mattered was what bracket your birth date fell in. That's it. No one questioned it, no one complained about grade stuff, it just was what it was. We never even asked what grade kids were in. I didn't know of any clubs that did it any different. There were outlier players who played up of course, but that had nothing to do with what grade they were in and was completely based on physical/technical aspects. Currently, under BY, no one cares about grade. You play by your age bracket, just like before BY.

I can't imagine that will change now all of a sudden. We will obviously have to wait and see what the clubs actually do (not just what they say) of course. My bet is that for 99% of them, tryouts will be by strict age bracket with nary a mention of grade to be found.

So now you're impersonating coaches 🤣 😂 😆 😅 So desperate to encourage parents to play down grade.

Clubs 100% group top teams by grade. I was around before 2017 and I never saw or heard of Aug brirthday players playing down in SY. All anyone discussed was playing up.

All of the kids (with just rare exceptions) were playing with their age bracket and grade. No one cared. Most August kids started school late (where I was at) so they were with their actual grade! Were there kids that were mis-aligned with their grade? Sure, but no one cared or even knew about it! You are making a big deal out of something that is not going to be thought of at all by this time next year. If it (somehow) hurts their college recruitment well that is on them then. Who cares? These mis-aligned kids being 'un-recruitable' should actually help your daughter's recruitment chances I would think. Heck, using your logic, you should want more of them!

We all know it is just you, this one Delusional August Guy on all of these boards (and this one). You may have existed before 2017 but your daughter and soccer involvement were at the very u-little stage. Again, we all know this. You only started using this "I was around before 2017" nonsense once people who actually were called you out on what the environment was actually like back then.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After lurking on all the threads on this topic, it seems like the misaligned August/September players are in a dawned if you do, dawned if you don't situation.

Either they "play on grade" where since they'll be the youngest they should be happy with the B team.

Or they "play in their new age bracket" against players a full grade behind them but they'll never amount to much playing against younger players and won't be recruited.

Seems like what most people really want to for August/September kids to go find a different sport to play.

I can tell you that it is not as simple a choice for most misaligned players in that birth range as people on these threads make it seem. Trying to navigate to the best situation coaching wise, development wise, recruiting wise and socially is like trying to solve a rubik's cube that's had the squares switched.

I agree it's a challenging decision. But perhaps we're lucky we have options.

Is it really that challenging compared to right now? Teams are full of mis-aligned players, we have tons of players 'trapped' and I never see/saw 100s of pages of discussion screaming and yelling about what certain birth months should do under the BY system. And, after the switch to SY, you still have MLSN1 with BY teams that are (and will continue to be) full of mis-aligned players. Seriously, this is not hard. The age brackets were 1/1 - 12/31. For 26/27 they will be 8/1 - 7/31. How hard is that? Every parent/player should look after their own best interest (whatever that may be) do what they think is in the best interest of their player and within the rules. Simple.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After lurking on all the threads on this topic, it seems like the misaligned August/September players are in a dawned if you do, dawned if you don't situation.

Either they "play on grade" where since they'll be the youngest they should be happy with the B team.

Or they "play in their new age bracket" against players a full grade behind them but they'll never amount to much playing against younger players and won't be recruited.

Seems like what most people really want to for August/September kids to go find a different sport to play.

I can tell you that it is not as simple a choice for most misaligned players in that birth range as people on these threads make it seem. Trying to navigate to the best situation coaching wise, development wise, recruiting wise and socially is like trying to solve a rubik's cube that's had the squares switched.

I agree it's a challenging decision. But perhaps we're lucky we have options.

Is it really that challenging compared to right now? Teams are full of mis-aligned players, we have tons of players 'trapped' and I never see/saw 100s of pages of discussion screaming and yelling about what certain birth months should do under the BY system. And, after the switch to SY, you still have MLSN1 with BY teams that are (and will continue to be) full of mis-aligned players. Seriously, this is not hard. The age brackets were 1/1 - 12/31. For 26/27 they will be 8/1 - 7/31. How hard is that? Every parent/player should look after their own best interest (whatever that may be) do what they think is in the best interest of their player and within the rules. Simple.

It's difficult to figure out where to play an August misaligned player because right now you probably have the majority of players on a team within the same grade and a few players from a lower grade playing with them. So while yes, there is a mix of grades, you have a few players playing with majority older grade. Next year it will be the opposite, where a few players may play with majority lower grade if they choose not to play up.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Heres my family situation. My high flyer female with a decmber birthday and a potential in playing in college will age down for maximum visibility. My August boy who plays hg dev will stay with his age to be an older for the time ever. No aspirations other than playing good soccer and translating his level of travel to the hs game. Both win

I dont know if "age down" is the correct terminology although I get what you're saying. In BY your December birthday player was forced to play up a grade. Now since we're switching back to SY again they'll be grouped with players their grade in school which should be fun for them. This was/is the whole intent of switching back from BY to SY.

General fyi but did you know the reason BY works for other countries is because school cutoff for a certain grade is 1/1. However school start dates are usually around Aug Sept. When you think about it this makes it easier because all you need to do is ask a kid what year they were born and that tells you their grade in school. In America we combine school start date with cutoff date this is why BY doesnt work and SY better aligns all players to a specific grade here.

My December kid is in MLS Next and committed to a D1 school

I can't recall us having any discussions about school grade

Be obtuse if you want.

I guarantee at some point graduating year aka grade in school was discussed or your kids college coach wouldn't know what year to expect to see them on campus.

They of course knew his graduating year.

We provided that when we reached out and they also knew it before we gave them.

My point is that for his soccer development journey, school grade being different than his teammates was never an issue.

The situation is different now. Birth year created a situation where players in a specific grade had to play with kids in a higher grade because they missed the school cutoff. No one minded this because playing with kids in a higher grade feels more challenging and acceptable (of course depends on the players themselves being good, but just generally, a 9th grader playing with 10th graders was fine) College scouts looking at 10th graders might also see the 9th grader and just keep them in mind for the next recruiting year. All good there.

Now, you have a few months of kids who could potentially have to play with a team that is primarily a lower grade. So in this scenario, you have a 10th grader playing on a team full of 9th graders. College scouts aren't looking at 9th graders and probably aren't going to make a special trip over to a field full of 9th graders just to see the 1 or 2 10th graders.

It doesn't change the fact that most recruiting is done by the player/parents, with outreach and direct attendance at ID camps where coaches are - where of course you are aligned by graduation year. But the scenario above isn't really helping player development or recruiting - just clubs who potentially want to win more games. For younger grades, it's fine because maybe some smaller kids need more time in 7v7, 9v9 etc. But by high school, kids should be aligned with grad year if at all possible.

You do know the colleges are only looking at a few people to fill the small amount of available freshman spaces on their roster?

They aren't trawling the ocean

You are correct - it is such a small number that a kid playing with a younger grade will literally never end up playing college soccer. Hence the reason that even to have a remote chance, you have to play with your grad year.

The 10th grader with the skills, potential and attitude the college recruiter wants will get recruited if they are on a team with some 9th graders

Because the college recruiter is a soccer person, not guidance counselor

Why only play down in soccer?

Just hold your Aug birthday back in school and they'll be aligned and everything works. Why would you want to be s square peg trying to fit in a round hole.

Why do my child a disservice by holding them back in school while kids their age are a year advanced academically and in maturity?
Also, they can only play with their age group or up. So what's gained?
No one can play down

RAE says that being the oldest will give them an academic advantage over all the other students.

Or ore you one of those selective RAE people that only uses it to get what you want?

Wow, to brazenly flaunt ignorance and stupidity with such pride

So, my kid being the oldest in 9th grade learning Economics 1 while kids her age are doing Economics 2/3 in 10th grade is a win for her?

RAE says that oldest is always better. Its science.

You just dont like it when you cant use RAE to get what you want.

If I was a club owner I say sure your August birthday can play down a grade. You just need to hold them back.

You are making up something that's not there.

Sure you can say playing with a lower grade may affect college recruiting, but to claim players HAVE to play with their grade is just not in the rule book. It is based on birth date.

If you want to play in college you need to align to a grade in school / graduating year mentality. Because this is how they function.

Then how do you explain how they function under BY across 2 grades per age group, how they can evaluate International players that don't neatly line up with grade (often older), players on bad teams and players on great teams. College coaches have to evaluate players in all these scenarios but now for some reason they blackball players playing in their own age group? And college coaches said the opposite of blackballing them. They don't care what age group you are in.

Your spitting out opinion without facts that goes against what is known, college coaches can evaluate players in many situations and they evaluate players not teams.

2 grades works in BY because the lower grade players are playing up a level and because of this are interesting to college coaches.

August birthdays playing down in SY is looked at as pathetic and players that choose this pathway will be ignored by college coaches

The 2-grade dynamic will continue to exist in SY but the number of outliers will be smaller. Last time roughly 5% of all players were misaligned or an average of 1 per team. The only way you can completely eliminate it would be to have a GY system -- which would completely blow up any 12-month window.

You love that article from 2015 that you found.

I was around in 2017 and I dont remember ever hearing about players playing down a grade in SY. All people talked about was playing up and who was thinking about graduating early to play in college. But this was in a highly competitive environment with highly competitive clubs and players.

My guess is your kid plays on a much lower level club and team. So maybe there will be play downers. But this diesnt change the fact college coaches /recruiters will ignore them because they're misaligned.

When I coached prior to the BY switch (started in 2012), we never considered grade. It was a huge club, with kids from 20 different schools, the only thing that mattered was what bracket your birth date fell in. That's it. No one questioned it, no one complained about grade stuff, it just was what it was. We never even asked what grade kids were in. I didn't know of any clubs that did it any different. There were outlier players who played up of course, but that had nothing to do with what grade they were in and was completely based on physical/technical aspects. Currently, under BY, no one cares about grade. You play by your age bracket, just like before BY.

I can't imagine that will change now all of a sudden. We will obviously have to wait and see what the clubs actually do (not just what they say) of course. My bet is that for 99% of them, tryouts will be by strict age bracket with nary a mention of grade to be found.

So now you're impersonating coaches 🤣 😂 😆 😅 So desperate to encourage parents to play down grade.

Clubs 100% group top teams by grade. I was around before 2017 and I never saw or heard of Aug brirthday players playing down in SY. All anyone discussed was playing up.

All of the kids (with just rare exceptions) were playing with their age bracket and grade. No one cared. Most August kids started school late (where I was at) so they were with their actual grade! Were there kids that were mis-aligned with their grade? Sure, but no one cared or even knew about it! You are making a big deal out of something that is not going to be thought of at all by this time next year. If it (somehow) hurts their college recruitment well that is on them then. Who cares? These mis-aligned kids being 'un-recruitable' should actually help your daughter's recruitment chances I would think. Heck, using your logic, you should want more of them!

We all know it is just you, this one Delusional August Guy on all of these boards (and this one). You may have existed before 2017 but your daughter and soccer involvement were at the very u-little stage. Again, we all know this. You only started using this "I was around before 2017" nonsense once people who actually were called you out on what the environment was actually like back then.

You realize people can have more than one kid don't you?

[Anonymous]

Already talked with one of the big ECNL girls clubs directors. ECNL has given guidance on how they want clubs to handle the transition.

If you’re an Aug-Dec 2010 born player but will be in the same grade as the Jan to July 2010 players you will be allowed to tryout and potentially stay with that group if you’re good enough to make it. Otherwise you will either find another club or play on the RL team 2009/2010 or play the new age group 2010/2011 and be a grade above.
However I was told this is not ideal as showcases will be split and ran differently.

[Anonymous]

This thread is fully certified asylum worthy

The guy talking about August players playing on school grade against the established age rules of the league knows he's just poking you sane people in the eyes

Yet you all keep arguing with the lunacy