Here’s Why Asian Americans Shifted Right by 9 points

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The problem for Dems and liberals is that they constantly whine about equity, racism, inclusion, white supremacy, yadda yadda, but the fact of the matter remians is that ASIANS actually have the highest median household income and wealth out of all racial groups in the country. How is that possible if there is lack of equity, systemic racism and white supremacy?

The uncomfortable truth is that you CAN actually make it in America if you work hard and have strong family values and discipline. It's not a govt or societal problem, it is the fact that other groups besides Asians simply don't have the same traditions and values that Asians do. No one ever wants to take personal responsibility for their own outcomes, it must be because of white supremacy and inequality. It is just amazing how so many Asians can come here with nothing and in one generation produce offspring who have more wealth than the average American.

People need to fix themselves if they want equity. You can socially engineer being a good parent.

Please explain the government sponsored policies that prevented Asians from achieving in the last 2 generations like some other groups have experienced.

1) Public universities have discriminated against Asian American applicants and pandered to black applicants for decades and it will take several more Court decisions to completely eliminate this effect due to universities resisting and coming up with ways to circumvent the Court ruling;
2) Public high schools such as TJ and others in other states have deliberately changed merit based system to subjective 'holistic' admissions process to decrease Asian students and increase black students.

There are others but those are 2.

This absolutely kills me. Black students never took your spots, white students did. I am so sick of Asian students complaining that somehow when Harvard is 6% black and they didn't get in, it's the black student's fault. You are so brainwashed.

Universities want a diversity of students whether it's race, geography, economic status, etc. No school is based on just merit. And while I am at it, just because you score high on a test means nothing when you are in the working world. I attended an HBCU. I have several ivy league employees who report to me. Engineers and computer scientists are a commodity. Leadership and strategy traits are not. Some of the smartest (on paper) people I know can't think their way out of a paper bag.

People want fairness, not affirmative action. It's that simple. Colleges DID discriminate against asians. That's it. Full stop. Stop defending it.

They may have but black students didn't take their spots. I'm going to keep defending it. Women were the biggest beneficiaries of Affirmative Action. Just stay mad. It's stupid. You are fighting the wrong group of people. Do you think you will be respected more by white people? You won't.

Your simplification of this as if we want to all fight for white people is hilarious and wrong. AA doesn't work, is unfair, and is hateful towards Asian Americans. Plain and simple.

Nobody is "fighting" any group except you, against Asians.

And the overall educational system is hateful for kids from low-income and/or URM families.

Viewing people as perpetual victims tends to not work out in the long run. And is exactly why Trump won again.

I don't view anyone as a perpetual victim. I actually don't care. You are going to FAFO. Trump is VERY anti-China. You will have more things to think about than affirmative action and someone taking away those precious spots that you believe you deserve more than anyone else.

Agree, there will be some FA/FO regret to come.
It seems pretty clear to me that a lot of people on this board have already forgotten about the huge spike in anti-Asian hate crimes, anti-Asian sentiment and distrust that arose and was driven by Trump when the pandemic happened.

And who was committing those hate crimes?

The amount of people hoping for FAFO is pathetic.

Everyone trying to disrupt privilege will FAFO, why would it be any different this time.

Blacks just happen to believe their ancestors earned this privilege over the last 400 years (even though most AA benficiaries are immigrants or the children of immgirants) so even if it comes at the expense of people who had nothing to do with thei 400 year history of oppression, they think they deserve it.

Black Americans did not choose to come to America. We were brought here as slaves. So tell me, where your people hanging from trees just 60 years ago because they spoke to a white woman? Were you prevented from buying houses in neighborhoods until the 1970s? My father could not go to a state school because they did not allow black people to attend the state university. So legacy would not even work for me. Did your people go through that to?

Don't lecture me about something you do not understand. Do not get all of the benefits of coming to American and then sh*t on my experience and oppression. Do not discount my people building all of our great institutions for free and then sit here and lecture about why we should be over it already. Yes, I am a FAFO person. No one is coming to your aid when things go south. You've made no allies and we are tired of fighting for people who don't appreciate it and don't care about us.

This really isn't a compelling argument in modern America. Most Americans are the fairly recent descendants from immigrants. The Irish, Armenians, Cambodians, Chinese, Jews, Rwandans, Poles, Salvadorans and many other groups all know suffering over the past 100 years.

But it is helpful when black folks straight up say "no one is coming to your aid when things go south."

So noted!

Your ignorance and indifference on the issue is noted.

It’s very compelling for many people who do actually understand our history, including recent, and ongoing struggles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:There isn't a wonderful solution.

When it comes to the top schools, people tend to want a meritocracy because it seems fair. And people tend to want a school that looks like America, because that too seems fair.

And none of those things are fair.

We all know test scores can be gamed with money - well-to-do families send their kids to schools with good teachers, and highly educated parents, and stable families, and invest in test prep. That's 500 points right there over any kid coming from Dunbar or Eastern.

People also tend to want racially-balanced schools, but we all know that's not fair either. Asian-Americans are only 6 percent of the US population. Anyone going to a college with just 6 percent Asian-American IS NOT GOING TO A GOOD SCHOOL.

Black folks are about 13 percent of the US population. It's a been a lot of easier for mediocre black students over the years because every college wants to hit al least 13 percent.

But no one wants racial preferences. And no one wants test score only college acceptances like in China and India.

It's a messy situation for the top 30 or so schools.

And France and The Netherlands and pretty much any other European country, you can name uses an exam or series of exams. Actually, I think it's the same in Africa and South America too. This is not a Chinese/Indian thing. European are just as shocked with our college admissions process as Asians are.

Using a combination of exit exams and entrance exams is more the norm than the exception in the rest of the world.

And why does it seem fair that colleges look like america in general? Consider this chart https://satsuite.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/s...r-race-ethnicity.pdf

What do you think the most selective colleges and universities should look like given that chart?

You can't ignore the founding of our country. America is truly unique.

And why should asians shoulder the burden of those original sins?

Because all of the shiny things that brought you to the US were forged by the sweat and blood of enslaved people.

[Anonymous]

PP

But in the U.S. now he has the freedom to be indifferent and ignorant. Our schools teach diversity instead of history, which sounds good but it is not--people just really spend a lot of showing off about themselves and their own people group. And again, it is a numbers game in the U.S.--our country has become an immigrant country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem for Dems and liberals is that they constantly whine about equity, racism, inclusion, white supremacy, yadda yadda, but the fact of the matter remians is that ASIANS actually have the highest median household income and wealth out of all racial groups in the country. How is that possible if there is lack of equity, systemic racism and white supremacy?

The uncomfortable truth is that you CAN actually make it in America if you work hard and have strong family values and discipline. It's not a govt or societal problem, it is the fact that other groups besides Asians simply don't have the same traditions and values that Asians do. No one ever wants to take personal responsibility for their own outcomes, it must be because of white supremacy and inequality. It is just amazing how so many Asians can come here with nothing and in one generation produce offspring who have more wealth than the average American.

People need to fix themselves if they want equity. You can socially engineer being a good parent.

Please explain the government sponsored policies that prevented Asians from achieving in the last 2 generations like some other groups have experienced.

1) Public universities have discriminated against Asian American applicants and pandered to black applicants for decades and it will take several more Court decisions to completely eliminate this effect due to universities resisting and coming up with ways to circumvent the Court ruling;
2) Public high schools such as TJ and others in other states have deliberately changed merit based system to subjective 'holistic' admissions process to decrease Asian students and increase black students.

There are others but those are 2.

This absolutely kills me. Black students never took your spots, white students did. I am so sick of Asian students complaining that somehow when Harvard is 6% black and they didn't get in, it's the black student's fault. You are so brainwashed.

Universities want a diversity of students whether it's race, geography, economic status, etc. No school is based on just merit. And while I am at it, just because you score high on a test means nothing when you are in the working world. I attended an HBCU. I have several ivy league employees who report to me. Engineers and computer scientists are a commodity. Leadership and strategy traits are not. Some of the smartest (on paper) people I know can't think their way out of a paper bag.

People want fairness, not affirmative action. It's that simple. Colleges DID discriminate against asians. That's it. Full stop. Stop defending it.

They may have but black students didn't take their spots. I'm going to keep defending it. Women were the biggest beneficiaries of Affirmative Action. Just stay mad. It's stupid. You are fighting the wrong group of people. Do you think you will be respected more by white people? You won't.

You are the one begging white people to take from asians and give to you. Have some dignity. Stop begging the people you claim are oppressing you for favors at the expense of other minorities.

Black students are absolutely taking spots from asians. Everybody knows this, including you.

WTF? PP isn’t begging for anything.

If you have an issue with colleges selecting a diverse class then take it up with the colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There isn't a wonderful solution.

When it comes to the top schools, people tend to want a meritocracy because it seems fair. And people tend to want a school that looks like America, because that too seems fair.

And none of those things are fair.

We all know test scores can be gamed with money - well-to-do families send their kids to schools with good teachers, and highly educated parents, and stable families, and invest in test prep. That's 500 points right there over any kid coming from Dunbar or Eastern.

People also tend to want racially-balanced schools, but we all know that's not fair either. Asian-Americans are only 6 percent of the US population. Anyone going to a college with just 6 percent Asian-American IS NOT GOING TO A GOOD SCHOOL.

Black folks are about 13 percent of the US population. It's a been a lot of easier for mediocre black students over the years because every college wants to hit al least 13 percent.

But no one wants racial preferences. And no one wants test score only college acceptances like in China and India.

It's a messy situation for the top 30 or so schools.

And France and The Netherlands and pretty much any other European country, you can name uses an exam or series of exams. Actually, I think it's the same in Africa and South America too. This is not a Chinese/Indian thing. European are just as shocked with our college admissions process as Asians are.

Using a combination of exit exams and entrance exams is more the norm than the exception in the rest of the world.

And why does it seem fair that colleges look like america in general? Consider this chart https://satsuite.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/s...r-race-ethnicity.pdf

What do you think the most selective colleges and universities should look like given that chart?

You can't ignore the founding of our country. America is truly unique.

And why should asians shoulder the burden of those original sins?

Because all of the shiny things that brought you to the US were forged by the sweat and blood of enslaved people.

Every country in the world had slavery at one point or another. It just comes down to timelines and recency.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem for Dems and liberals is that they constantly whine about equity, racism, inclusion, white supremacy, yadda yadda, but the fact of the matter remians is that ASIANS actually have the highest median household income and wealth out of all racial groups in the country. How is that possible if there is lack of equity, systemic racism and white supremacy?

The uncomfortable truth is that you CAN actually make it in America if you work hard and have strong family values and discipline. It's not a govt or societal problem, it is the fact that other groups besides Asians simply don't have the same traditions and values that Asians do. No one ever wants to take personal responsibility for their own outcomes, it must be because of white supremacy and inequality. It is just amazing how so many Asians can come here with nothing and in one generation produce offspring who have more wealth than the average American.

People need to fix themselves if they want equity. You can socially engineer being a good parent.

Please explain the government sponsored policies that prevented Asians from achieving in the last 2 generations like some other groups have experienced.

1) Public universities have discriminated against Asian American applicants and pandered to black applicants for decades and it will take several more Court decisions to completely eliminate this effect due to universities resisting and coming up with ways to circumvent the Court ruling;
2) Public high schools such as TJ and others in other states have deliberately changed merit based system to subjective 'holistic' admissions process to decrease Asian students and increase black students.

There are others but those are 2.

This absolutely kills me. Black students never took your spots, white students did. I am so sick of Asian students complaining that somehow when Harvard is 6% black and they didn't get in, it's the black student's fault. You are so brainwashed.

Universities want a diversity of students whether it's race, geography, economic status, etc. No school is based on just merit. And while I am at it, just because you score high on a test means nothing when you are in the working world. I attended an HBCU. I have several ivy league employees who report to me. Engineers and computer scientists are a commodity. Leadership and strategy traits are not. Some of the smartest (on paper) people I know can't think their way out of a paper bag.

People want fairness, not affirmative action. It's that simple. Colleges DID discriminate against asians. That's it. Full stop. Stop defending it.

They may have but black students didn't take their spots. I'm going to keep defending it. Women were the biggest beneficiaries of Affirmative Action. Just stay mad. It's stupid. You are fighting the wrong group of people. Do you think you will be respected more by white people? You won't.

Your simplification of this as if we want to all fight for white people is hilarious and wrong. AA doesn't work, is unfair, and is hateful towards Asian Americans. Plain and simple.

Nobody is "fighting" any group except you, against Asians.

And the overall educational system is hateful for kids from low-income and/or URM families.

And yet low income asians still thrive.

Not all of them.
https://publications.csba.org/issue/summer-20...n-american-students/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There isn't a wonderful solution.

When it comes to the top schools, people tend to want a meritocracy because it seems fair. And people tend to want a school that looks like America, because that too seems fair.

And none of those things are fair.

We all know test scores can be gamed with money - well-to-do families send their kids to schools with good teachers, and highly educated parents, and stable families, and invest in test prep. That's 500 points right there over any kid coming from Dunbar or Eastern.

People also tend to want racially-balanced schools, but we all know that's not fair either. Asian-Americans are only 6 percent of the US population. Anyone going to a college with just 6 percent Asian-American IS NOT GOING TO A GOOD SCHOOL.

Black folks are about 13 percent of the US population. It's a been a lot of easier for mediocre black students over the years because every college wants to hit al least 13 percent.

But no one wants racial preferences. And no one wants test score only college acceptances like in China and India.

It's a messy situation for the top 30 or so schools.

And France and The Netherlands and pretty much any other European country, you can name uses an exam or series of exams. Actually, I think it's the same in Africa and South America too. This is not a Chinese/Indian thing. European are just as shocked with our college admissions process as Asians are.

Using a combination of exit exams and entrance exams is more the norm than the exception in the rest of the world.

And why does it seem fair that colleges look like america in general? Consider this chart https://satsuite.collegeboard.org/media/pdf/s...r-race-ethnicity.pdf

What do you think the most selective colleges and universities should look like given that chart?

You can't ignore the founding of our country. America is truly unique.

And why should asians shoulder the burden of those original sins?

Because all of the shiny things that brought you to the US were forged by the sweat and blood of enslaved people.

Every country in the world had slavery at one point or another. It just comes down to timelines and recency.

Ok, we get it, you think we need to get over American history and move on. What is the point of telling us this over and over and over again? For months on end? What do you want us to do now. Let us know, we will do it, honestly, so you will be quiet.

[Anonymous]

Did you look at the lenient sentence for the killer of 87 year old war veteran, Mr Kim in NYC. Prosecutor went for the lightest sentence possible. WTF

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem for Dems and liberals is that they constantly whine about equity, racism, inclusion, white supremacy, yadda yadda, but the fact of the matter remians is that ASIANS actually have the highest median household income and wealth out of all racial groups in the country. How is that possible if there is lack of equity, systemic racism and white supremacy?

The uncomfortable truth is that you CAN actually make it in America if you work hard and have strong family values and discipline. It's not a govt or societal problem, it is the fact that other groups besides Asians simply don't have the same traditions and values that Asians do. No one ever wants to take personal responsibility for their own outcomes, it must be because of white supremacy and inequality. It is just amazing how so many Asians can come here with nothing and in one generation produce offspring who have more wealth than the average American.

People need to fix themselves if they want equity. You can socially engineer being a good parent.

Please explain the government sponsored policies that prevented Asians from achieving in the last 2 generations like some other groups have experienced.

1) Public universities have discriminated against Asian American applicants and pandered to black applicants for decades and it will take several more Court decisions to completely eliminate this effect due to universities resisting and coming up with ways to circumvent the Court ruling;
2) Public high schools such as TJ and others in other states have deliberately changed merit based system to subjective 'holistic' admissions process to decrease Asian students and increase black students.

There are others but those are 2.

This absolutely kills me. Black students never took your spots, white students did. I am so sick of Asian students complaining that somehow when Harvard is 6% black and they didn't get in, it's the black student's fault. You are so brainwashed.

Universities want a diversity of students whether it's race, geography, economic status, etc. No school is based on just merit. And while I am at it, just because you score high on a test means nothing when you are in the working world. I attended an HBCU. I have several ivy league employees who report to me. Engineers and computer scientists are a commodity. Leadership and strategy traits are not. Some of the smartest (on paper) people I know can't think their way out of a paper bag.

People want fairness, not affirmative action. It's that simple. Colleges DID discriminate against asians. That's it. Full stop. Stop defending it.

Funny how you only care about “fairness” for Asian students.

What do you think asians are asking for that others are not getting?

For colleges to focus solely on certain metrics that give most Asian students an unfair advantage.

Which metrics are those?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F0IRHiaacAA3cu-?format=jpg

Yes, those.

Not every student has access to high-quality activities, academic opportunities, supportive families, etc. That's why solely looking at those metrics, without context, is unfair.

That chart is comparing asians to whites. What unfair advantage do asians have over whites?

+1 there are more white legacies than Asian legacies.

Asian immigrants worked hard to make sure their kids got into good schools. Now, progressives are saying they should be punished for working so hard because of so called "unearned" privilege. Some people seem to be ignorant regarding this country's racist past against Asians that prevented them from being educated in the same schools as white people, owning property, and even becoming US citizens.

That chart does not include legacies.

It would be even more glaringly obvious discrimination against Asians if it did include legacies.

Regardless, the fact that there are more white legacies than Asian legacies means whites have more unearned privileges than Asians have ever had. Asian Americans have had to fight discrimination for 100 years, starting with the Chinese Exclusion Act decades after the end of the civil war, until 1965 with immigration reform, and again in 1990.

Ironically, banning legacy admission will make diversity worse at many schools now that affirmative action has been banned. The minority kids whose parents benefited from affirmative action will not get the same admission preferences that previous generations had. The main benefit of attending an elite college is the peer network. If the concentration of well connected and extremely wealthy students is diluted the value of degrees from elite schools will decline significantly. The rich will use different methods (private clubs, ect.) to confer advantages to their children that are less accessible to the average people. Forcing colleges to ban legacy and donor admission is a very misguided attempt to promote “fairness” that will have negative effects. It’s quite ironic and irritating that my minority children won’t get the benefit of legacy admission preference because woke democrats decided it’s unfair that some white people benefit from it as well.

AM I the only one thinking this guy got into a good school on AA and knows his kids would never get in without legacy and AA?

Legacy has nothing to do with race and it is no different than admitting people because they are an athlete, musician, or are from an underrepresented geographic area. It helps to cultivate connections with universities and generate funding. It also helps universities manage enrollment levels more accurately because legacy admits are significant more likely to enroll than non legacy admits. They are generally full pay students and help to subsidize educational expenses for students whose families cannot afford to pay tuition. Affirmative action is completely unrelated to legacy admission and it’s unfortunate that it will be taken away now that a substantial number of minority families are starting to benefit from it. The colleges without legacy admissions have seen larger drops in underrepresented minority students after affirmative action was banned. Amherst, MIT and JHU saw substantial declines in URM populations. The other schools that have legacy admissions saw much smaller declines in this student population.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/admission...t-affirmative-action

https://hub.jhu.edu/2024/09/19/johns-hopkins-...akeup-scotus-ruling/