Making friends with immigrant families

[Anonymous]

Just a few idea (as an immigrant who came here in my 30's). Lots of people are not good or very comfortable with small talk, particularly if English is not their main language. Maybe they are not sure how to react to that kind of approach because they are not used to it. Also Americans are usually more outgoing and chatty than other nationalities. Lots of people value long-lasting friendships over the quick superficial ones. Making friends for the kids to have playdate is also not in everyone's culture. Drop off playdates are also not the norm for a lot of people. You need to establish a relationship with the adults first (have them over, not in a public place). They also be a bit distrustful given the current context.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a child of immigrants. My parents have been living in the US for 40 years and I don’t think they have any friends that are not from their native country.

When I was growing up, I played outside with my friends everyday. Parents were not involved. I just knew I had to be home for dinner. There were no cell phones back then.

Yes. My friend down the street was a girl from Cambodia. We played all the time, but her mom never really learned English and had her own community. So she and my folks never hung out or did playdates (my mom was always friendly and polite though). That wasn't a relationship that was going to happen.

OP, just be happy if the kids are all playing and having fun.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm going to try to tone down the snark I'm feeling here.

First of all, you've gotten some decent practical advice. Connect with families, over food, meet people where they are (metaphorically), don't have unrealistic expectations.

But please examine your motivations and attitudes, which are no doubt contributing to the issue as you perceive it.

You think it's super-cool to have lots of neighbors from all over the world. But your expectations of them are very (esp white) American. Organized playdates and so on. You seem largely to expect them to conform to your own way of doing things. Except maybe by making some "cool" food or wearing "cool" clothes or whatever bits of spice they add as a condiment to your life, which is the unquestioned main course.

You moved into a neighborhood that is largely comprised of immigrants and yet...?

"It feels like they want to stick to their “own kind” which defeats the whole purpose of living in a diverse area."

That's YOUR goal for living in a "diverse area." They may live in your neighborhood because it contains more people from their home country, because it's cheaper, because it's closer to whatever (public transport, ethnic church, etc.), because they assumed that a largely immigrant neighborhood, even if not only comprised of one immigrant group, wouldn't pressure them as much with white American expectations. And so on.

"Any ideas on how to encourage them to be friendlier?"

Surely you can understand how this statement makes them the problem. It's their fault for not being "friendlier" by your standards.

OP, you need to humble yourself and fit in with this community instead of expecting them to adjust their ways of doing things for your sake.

I am a white American living in a neighborhood like the one you described. Maybe even the same one. DH is an immigrant of color but largely grew up in the USA. This does help in 2 ways-- he gets where folks are coming from and can also be more of a bridge-- eg, immigrant neighbors trust him more than they would just me. That said, we face some of these same social challenges, but I never once thought to ascribe responsibility or blame to our neighbors. Instead my expectations are:

-Most of my DD's school friends from these communities will be school-only friends, especially in ES. That's okay.

-(Pre-COVID) We invite the entire class to birthday parties and the like and always make it clear parents are welcome to stay. That does not mean that most of her immigrant-family classmates will come, but a decent chunk absolutely do. Then we can chat and set up a connection. Sometimes they will then be available for some form of socializing.

-(Pre-COVID) We hang out at school pickup to chat with parents per above. We go to school events where the whole community comes out. We are involved in the PTA. Etc. All opportunities to connect.

-It is MY responsibility to reach out and make our family/home feel welcoming. Either I do that, or DD ends up overwhelmingly with friends who are vast-majority white and non-immigrants. That's the choice. I mean, I can complain about it, but it won't change anything.

A lot of this is easier absent COVID, of course, but it's completely possible *with effort on your part*. You seem willing to make some degree of effort, but I think you have to accept that it's mostly going to fall on you and that's okay, that there's nothing lacking about these families, that you don't have to change them and they don't have to change themselves. Good luck.

Really well put.

[Anonymous]

OP. I’m Arab born and raised abroad. My husband is Arab American. His parents moves to the US in the late 70s. DH grew very isolated from non-immigrants. His parents just didn’t trust white people and wouldn’t allow him to go to their houses unless they came with him. He definitely wasn’t allowed to go to any sleepovers. My MIL was a homemaker and had 5 kids. FIL worked two jobs. They didn’t have much time to socialize so when they did they socialized with their own kind. Fast forward to today. Most of DH and I’s friends are Arabs or if not from a Muslim background (we aren’t conservative or anything). We are friendly with the neighbors and with the parents in our kids schools but we won’t go out of our way to be friends with them. I just feel so different and don’t have much in common. I find myself more comfortable with immigrants and expats even expats that are European or British. That being said our kids do go on play dates and we reciprocate. We have a couple of friends from work that we are each close to but otherwise I don’t hang out with ppl from work. I don’t go to happy hours and I’m usually happy when the work week ends (super happy with covid now since I work from home).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m confused as to why you preface your post by claiming how you love living in a mostly immigrant neighborhood when it’s clear that the end result is that you and your children feel isolated and are struggling to make connections. It seems like you like the idea in theory/being able to claim your “woke” creds but not so much in practice.

I kind of agree with this jerk. There’s just something so cringe-inducing about this whole thing. Like “hey I love the immigrants in my immigrant neighborhood so much!” Except they don’t ever talk to me, we aren’t friends or even acquaintances, and I can’t seem to trick them into a relationship.

They’re not zoo animals or collectible commemorative plates. They’re just people. And apparently they don’t want to hang out with some random white people over the weekend.

They are her neighbors and parents of her child’s school friends. She isn’t trying to catch em all like Pokémon, she is seeking advice about forming genuine connections with them. My parents were immigrants and while I rolled my eyes at some of the generalizations in this thread, I don’t see what the point is of shitting on OP.

Arab poster here. I agree with you PP. No need to be mean. OP has good intentions. OP I’m reading the suggestions - I like the idea of the PP who had a neighborhood party and told everyone that the whole family was invited. Immigrants tend to worry about their kids hanging out with ppl they don’t know or don’t share their values. I know amongst Arabs the questions are always: do they have guns in the house? Do they drink alcohol/can their kids access alcohol? Do they smoke weed? Is the house clean? Etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm going to try to tone down the snark I'm feeling here.

First of all, you've gotten some decent practical advice. Connect with families, over food, meet people where they are (metaphorically), don't have unrealistic expectations.

But please examine your motivations and attitudes, which are no doubt contributing to the issue as you perceive it.

You think it's super-cool to have lots of neighbors from all over the world. But your expectations of them are very (esp white) American. Organized playdates and so on. You seem largely to expect them to conform to your own way of doing things. Except maybe by making some "cool" food or wearing "cool" clothes or whatever bits of spice they add as a condiment to your life, which is the unquestioned main course.

You moved into a neighborhood that is largely comprised of immigrants and yet...?

"It feels like they want to stick to their “own kind” which defeats the whole purpose of living in a diverse area."

That's YOUR goal for living in a "diverse area." They may live in your neighborhood because it contains more people from their home country, because it's cheaper, because it's closer to whatever (public transport, ethnic church, etc.), because they assumed that a largely immigrant neighborhood, even if not only comprised of one immigrant group, wouldn't pressure them as much with white American expectations. And so on.

"Any ideas on how to encourage them to be friendlier?"

Surely you can understand how this statement makes them the problem. It's their fault for not being "friendlier" by your standards.

OP, you need to humble yourself and fit in with this community instead of expecting them to adjust their ways of doing things for your sake.

I am a white American living in a neighborhood like the one you described. Maybe even the same one. DH is an immigrant of color but largely grew up in the USA. This does help in 2 ways-- he gets where folks are coming from and can also be more of a bridge-- eg, immigrant neighbors trust him more than they would just me. That said, we face some of these same social challenges, but I never once thought to ascribe responsibility or blame to our neighbors. Instead my expectations are:

-Most of my DD's school friends from these communities will be school-only friends, especially in ES. That's okay.

-(Pre-COVID) We invite the entire class to birthday parties and the like and always make it clear parents are welcome to stay. That does not mean that most of her immigrant-family classmates will come, but a decent chunk absolutely do. Then we can chat and set up a connection. Sometimes they will then be available for some form of socializing.

-(Pre-COVID) We hang out at school pickup to chat with parents per above. We go to school events where the whole community comes out. We are involved in the PTA. Etc. All opportunities to connect.

-It is MY responsibility to reach out and make our family/home feel welcoming. Either I do that, or DD ends up overwhelmingly with friends who are vast-majority white and non-immigrants. That's the choice. I mean, I can complain about it, but it won't change anything.

A lot of this is easier absent COVID, of course, but it's completely possible *with effort on your part*. You seem willing to make some degree of effort, but I think you have to accept that it's mostly going to fall on you and that's okay, that there's nothing lacking about these families, that you don't have to change them and they don't have to change themselves. Good luck.

Really well put.

Agree with this poster too although I would have put it in more polite terms.

[Anonymous]

I don’t think this is an immigrant/non immigrant phenomenon (people are available or responsive to new socializing).

People of all stripes are busy - either with work, kids, extended family or community, school, health.

My kids have best friends that designate their whole weekend to sports or grandparents. They are little kids so maybe someday.

We lucked out and have 1 friend in the neighborhood that we can “stop by at” and vice versa. Growing up I had a few of those but now it’s all call ahead of time or schedule it. Yuck. I hate managing two adults and two kids schedules.

Just find social people who are open minded and can make time. It’s not everyone or even half. There were some weeks I never saw neighbors in my apartment building or on my house block.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just chiming in to say that I found it difficult as well. Many don't know English well and aren't willing to learn and I'm not keen on learning their language. One would think that immigrants would want to communicate with their "new" society, but in my experience, they tend to isolate themselves by only communicating with people from their culture. When I was in other countries, I made every effort to communicate in the dominant language, even if I wasn't great at it. I made an effort. Op, if you really want to reach out to them on their terms, send your neighbors a note in their native language. See if that breaks the ice.

Omg. The judgment on this one!

Do you understand cultural nuances? Some of these immigrants are from countries that are culturally very different from US. A lot of other people don't indulge in small talk the way Americans do, so your questions/chit-chat might appear weird to them. And why are they supposed to be your friends? I see someone that I have nothing in common with, except that our kids are friends, I am not obligated to be their friends, that too when I have a social circle of my own. It's ok and legal for immigrants to learn or not learn English.

It's great for you that you had the confidence to go out of your way to make friends when you were in other countries. But making friends as an adult isn't easy for everyone. Adjusting to a new life, in a new place, you don't see your family for years, nothing seems familiar - that feeling is crippling for many people. So it's natural that they cling to the parts that seem familiar, to people that can speak the same language. Do you think they can't see the silent judgment about their lifestyle, food, habits, parenting, etc?

You are both saying the same thing.

There’s little assimilation.

You offer up opinions on why that is. But you’re agreeing with the bottom line: little assimilation and probably little allegiance to America beyond what it can do for you today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just chiming in to say that I found it difficult as well. Many don't know English well and aren't willing to learn and I'm not keen on learning their language. One would think that immigrants would want to communicate with their "new" society, but in my experience, they tend to isolate themselves by only communicating with people from their culture. When I was in other countries, I made every effort to communicate in the dominant language, even if I wasn't great at it. I made an effort. Op, if you really want to reach out to them on their terms, send your neighbors a note in their native language. See if that breaks the ice.

Omg. The judgment on this one!

Do you understand cultural nuances? Some of these immigrants are from countries that are culturally very different from US. A lot of other people don't indulge in small talk the way Americans do, so your questions/chit-chat might appear weird to them. And why are they supposed to be your friends? I see someone that I have nothing in common with, except that our kids are friends, I am not obligated to be their friends, that too when I have a social circle of my own. It's ok and legal for immigrants to learn or not learn English.

It's great for you that you had the confidence to go out of your way to make friends when you were in other countries. But making friends as an adult isn't easy for everyone. Adjusting to a new life, in a new place, you don't see your family for years, nothing seems familiar - that feeling is crippling for many people. So it's natural that they cling to the parts that seem familiar, to people that can speak the same language. Do you think they can't see the silent judgment about their lifestyle, food, habits, parenting, etc?

You are both saying the same thing.

There’s little assimilation.

You offer up opinions on why that is. But you’re agreeing with the bottom line: little assimilation and probably little allegiance to America beyond what it can do for you today.

I think you are putting words into PP's "mouth".

The recent immigrants are trying just as hard as OP is.

[Anonymous]

b/c we don't trust white ppl during Covid.

[Anonymous]

I think it might be as easy as what a previous poster said--it might be easier to meet the families once everyone is playing outside. We used to live in a really diverse neighborhood and it was easier to meet on the playground or on Saturday mornings when I'd take the kids to ride their bikes or scooters in the elementary school parking lot. These parents might need to see your smiling face and see the connection between their kid and yours to feel comfortable. I don't think you need to completely learn another language--I love how people throw that out like it is so easy -- but being open to learning a few words can be endearing. FWIW, now we live in a neighborhood that is far less diverse, and I'm kind of feeling like these white people are hard to get to know, too. I guess the grass is always greener.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We live in a similar neighborhood, and the best ice-breaker for us was to throw a full-class birthday party and put “parents and siblings welcome” on the invitation.

I didn’t get a lot of RSVPs, often just a vague “yeah, they said they could come” second hand from my kid, so I had no idea what to expect on the day. I knew from my Pakistani and Indian friends that it’s just sort of assumed the whole family will come along, and I thought the Ethiopian and Ghanan families might be the same. So I bought a ton of food that we could eat over the next week or two if there were leftovers, had plenty in reserve just in case, and hoped for the best.

Every single family showed up, sometimes with parents, grandparents, and all the kids in tow. I didn’t have a lot planned for kids younger/older than my kid’s class, but they didn’t care. They all had a fabulous time running around the backyard and eating every scrap of food, and the parents at least made an attempt to mingle before gradually separating into cultural and language groups. We all just kind of went with the flow, and let the kids take the lead.

After that, we never had trouble with play dates because the parents knew us. Not everyone reciprocated, though, I suspect in part because they had smaller living spaces. No biggie, the kids were polite and appreciative, and I didn’t mind.

My kid did have a few friends over the years whose parents just assumed the younger siblings would be invited, but most were fine if we occasionally said the kids were hoping to have some time on their own this time. I agonized over how to say no the first time one mom asked if the younger sister could come to a sleepover party, but she was totally chill about it.

How thoughtful and generous. OP, I'm a first generation immigrant, and have always thrown birthday parties like this, and think the drop off ones are odd (but I understand now that my oldest is 7 that I am the outlier here). The main thing is that they definitely don't do drop off's. They are likely very friendly, you just need to "open your home to them" and they will do the same.