Let's have the abortion talk here. Right here. This thread.

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:I would be devastated if I had to have an abortion - no matter how early on. I absolutely think the baby is alive, etc.

I am definitely pro-life.

I think it is a serious matter, is not birth control, and I imagine for many women is heartbreaking. But I absolutely think it is better for women who are not ready to have children, not to have them. And though I hope to never, ever be in this situation, if I found out my child would likely not be born alive, or die within a few months because of an abnormality like the debate going on a few weeks ago on DCUM, I would have an abortion later than the first trimester.





I meant to say pro-choice, if it's not obvious by the follow up statement. still think women should have the right to make the (heartbreaking, gut-wrenching) choice.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:First anyone can be ashamed of anything medical. Roe v Wade was about privacy.
Second, there is growing evidence that this is not just about religion. Women suffer, even if they were not raised to be anti-abortion.
Third, we need to stiffen up child support laws, then talk pro life.
BTW, I am pro life, anti death penalty.


Oxymoron, and the fundamental flaw with the anti-abortion movement.


Don't generalize. Ther are many of us that are truly pro life, in all cases.



And what you people do not get is that abortions have always been and always be around. The only difference is in the past 30plus years they have been safe and legal. A woman who feels she needs an abortion will always find a way to get one. The anti-choice people have no respect for a woman's privacy or safety.


Exactly. In my opinion, I'd much rather my friends or my daughter have the choice to have an abortion performed in a medically safe environment, rather than having it performed by some quack 'doctor' using a coat hanger.

There is a New York Times article today about deaths related to illegal abortions - http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/02/health/02abort.html?hpw

In the end, abortion is one of those moral questions that does not have a right or wrong answer. It's a matter of personal judgment. At least our government recognizes the fact that women are going to have abortions whether they are legal or not, and provides us with the opportunity to do it in a safe environment.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:First anyone can be ashamed of anything medical. Roe v Wade was about privacy.
Second, there is growing evidence that this is not just about religion. Women suffer, even if they were not raised to be anti-abortion.
Third, we need to stiffen up child support laws, then talk pro life.
BTW, I am pro life, anti death penalty.


Oxymoron, and the fundamental flaw with the anti-abortion movement.


Don't generalize. Ther are many of us that are truly pro life, in all cases.



And what you people do not get is that abortions have always been and always be around. The only difference is in the past 30plus years they have been safe and legal. A woman who feels she needs an abortion will always find a way to get one. The anti-choice people have no respect for a woman's privacy or safety.


Exactly. In my opinion, I'd much rather my friends or my daughter have the choice to have an abortion performed in a medically safe environment, rather than having it performed by some quack 'doctor' using a coat hanger.

There is a New York Times article today about deaths related to illegal abortions - http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/02/health/02abort.html?hpw

In the end, abortion is one of those moral questions that does not have a right or wrong answer. It's a matter of personal judgment. At least our government recognizes the fact that women are going to have abortions whether they are legal or not, and provides us with the opportunity to do it in a safe environment.

In my opinion, why not learn -and teach- how to avoid having to think about getting an abortion in the first place?
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:First anyone can be ashamed of anything medical. Roe v Wade was about privacy.
Second, there is growing evidence that this is not just about religion. Women suffer, even if they were not raised to be anti-abortion.
Third, we need to stiffen up child support laws, then talk pro life.
BTW, I am pro life, anti death penalty.


Oxymoron, and the fundamental flaw with the anti-abortion movement.


Don't generalize. Ther are many of us that are truly pro life, in all cases.



And what you people do not get is that abortions have always been and always be around. The only difference is in the past 30plus years they have been safe and legal. A woman who feels she needs an abortion will always find a way to get one. The anti-choice people have no respect for a woman's privacy or safety.


Exactly. In my opinion, I'd much rather my friends or my daughter have the choice to have an abortion performed in a medically safe environment, rather than having it performed by some quack 'doctor' using a coat hanger.

There is a New York Times article today about deaths related to illegal abortions - http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/02/health/02abort.html?hpw

In the end, abortion is one of those moral questions that does not have a right or wrong answer. It's a matter of personal judgment. At least our government recognizes the fact that women are going to have abortions whether they are legal or not, and provides us with the opportunity to do it in a safe environment.

In my opinion, why not learn -and teach- how to avoid having to think about getting an abortion in the first place?


People die from legal abortions too.
Anonymous
and women and babies die from birth complications.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:First anyone can be ashamed of anything medical. Roe v Wade was about privacy.
Second, there is growing evidence that this is not just about religion. Women suffer, even if they were not raised to be anti-abortion.
Third, we need to stiffen up child support laws, then talk pro life.
BTW, I am pro life, anti death penalty.


Oxymoron, and the fundamental flaw with the anti-abortion movement.


Don't generalize. Ther are many of us that are truly pro life, in all cases.



And what you people do not get is that abortions have always been and always be around. The only difference is in the past 30plus years they have been safe and legal. A woman who feels she needs an abortion will always find a way to get one. The anti-choice people have no respect for a woman's privacy or safety.


Exactly. In my opinion, I'd much rather my friends or my daughter have the choice to have an abortion performed in a medically safe environment, rather than having it performed by some quack 'doctor' using a coat hanger.

There is a New York Times article today about deaths related to illegal abortions - http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/02/health/02abort.html?hpw

In the end, abortion is one of those moral questions that does not have a right or wrong answer. It's a matter of personal judgment. At least our government recognizes the fact that women are going to have abortions whether they are legal or not, and provides us with the opportunity to do it in a safe environment.

In my opinion, why not learn -and teach- how to avoid having to think about getting an abortion in the first place?



Because as much as you want to teach people about birth control, abstinence etc, people will have sex and they will have unprotected sex, or in the case of some posters here, they take the pill and get pregnant anyway! Let's be realistic. Humans are weak creatures with all their foibles, and many people end up having unprotected sex as educated and knowledgable as they are. It's not about lack of education. It's about being human.

It's the same with drugs (as educated as some people are, they will want to use them), but I guess we've got enough to keep us debating here without opening that can of worms!!
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:First anyone can be ashamed of anything medical. Roe v Wade was about privacy.
Second, there is growing evidence that this is not just about religion. Women suffer, even if they were not raised to be anti-abortion.
Third, we need to stiffen up child support laws, then talk pro life.
BTW, I am pro life, anti death penalty.


Oxymoron, and the fundamental flaw with the anti-abortion movement.


Don't generalize. Ther are many of us that are truly pro life, in all cases.



And what you people do not get is that abortions have always been and always be around. The only difference is in the past 30plus years they have been safe and legal. A woman who feels she needs an abortion will always find a way to get one. The anti-choice people have no respect for a woman's privacy or safety.


I don't think that those against abortion are anti-choice. They believe there are other choices that can, and should be made. They don't think that abortion is the answer.
Anonymous
I don't think that those against abortion are anti-choice. They believe there are other choices that can, and should be made. They don't think that abortion is the answer.


It's true. You can have the baby, OR you can have the baby. Abortion isn't the answer for everyone. But I trust women to make the best choice for themselves, their lives, their health, their families...

And to the PP before that - I don't think anyone disagrees that people will continue to have unprotected sex. We are a flawed and impulsive people. But I do believe there's a lot we can do to reduce the number of unintended pregnancies, and thus the number of women seeking abortions, with more/better sex ed, increased access to contraception...
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:

In my opinion, why not learn -and teach- how to avoid having to think about getting an abortion in the first place?



I tried. I was on the pill and used condoms every single time. I ended up having a surgery and didn't know (thanks, Doc!) that the antibiotics would interfere with the pill. During the time I was on the antibiotics, the condom failed. (and I didn't think about morning after pill because I thought I'd be safe being on the pill). It took just one time.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

Most people I know regret having to throw out a living plant, and if at all possible will instead find a new home for it.


Most people I know eat vegetables (once-living plants) and readily weed their gardens, with no regrets. Throwing out a beloved houseplant is a different story and just doesn't correlate to terminating an unwanted pregnancy.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think that those against abortion are anti-choice. They believe there are other choices that can, and should be made. They don't think that abortion is the answer.


It's true. You can have the baby, OR you can have the baby. Abortion isn't the answer for everyone. But I trust women to make the best choice for themselves, their lives, their health, their families...

And to the PP before that - I don't think anyone disagrees that people will continue to have unprotected sex. We are a flawed and impulsive people. But I do believe there's a lot we can do to reduce the number of unintended pregnancies, and thus the number of women seeking abortions, with more/better sex ed, increased access to contraception...


You can choose not to have sex. You can choose to have protected, or unprotected sex. You can choose to keep the baby. You can choose to give the baby up for adoption.

There are many choices that can be made. I have been faced with two unplanned pregnancies. One when I was young and a condom broke. I was stupid to have only used one form of birthcontrol, and paid the price for that. My choice was to give the baby up for adoption, but I miscarried at 14 weeks.

The second time I was using the pill, faithfully, and I still got pregnant. That time I was older and married. I now have a beautiful child, and that child now has a sibling. My choice after having my second was to close my baby factory down for good, and had my tubes tied.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I don't think that those against abortion are anti-choice. They believe there are other choices that can, and should be made. They don't think that abortion is the answer.


It's true. You can have the baby, OR you can have the baby. Abortion isn't the answer for everyone. But I trust women to make the best choice for themselves, their lives, their health, their families...

And to the PP before that - I don't think anyone disagrees that people will continue to have unprotected sex. We are a flawed and impulsive people. But I do believe there's a lot we can do to reduce the number of unintended pregnancies, and thus the number of women seeking abortions, with more/better sex ed, increased access to contraception...


You can choose not to have sex. You can choose to have protected, or unprotected sex. You can choose to keep the baby. You can choose to give the baby up for adoption.

There are many choices that can be made. I have been faced with two unplanned pregnancies. One when I was young and a condom broke. I was stupid to have only used one form of birthcontrol, and paid the price for that. My choice was to give the baby up for adoption, but I miscarried at 14 weeks.

The second time I was using the pill, faithfully, and I still got pregnant. That time I was older and married. I now have a beautiful child, and that child now has a sibling. My choice after having my second was to close my baby factory down for good, and had my tubes tied.


I wanted to add that I have already stated my side earlier, and that while I would never have an abortion, my choice isnt' for everyone. I think they should be available for those who want them.
Anonymous
What I find interesting about this and most other abortion discussions is that no one ever calls themselves pro-abortion. You got your pro-lifers and you got your pro-choicers. We send young men and women to other countries to fight wars with other countries because we feel the rulers of those countries don't recognize or protect what we consider the unalienable rights we enjoy in this country. One of those basic rights is the right to make our own decisions as long as they do not infringe upon the rights and well-being of others. Before anyone says abortion is an infringement on the right of the fetus, the scientific fact is that fetuses grow within the wombs of grown women (at least in most cases) and the rights of that grown person over the governing of HER OWN BODY truly supercedes the rights of anyone else trying to impose their own beliefs on her. And I hate to say this, but why is it that pro-choice people usually argue about those rights in a succinct and coherent manner while the pro-lifers usually come down to spouting the Bible, posting gruesome pictures, a very few assassinating doctors or planting bombs in crowded places? Why is it that in America, of all places, there are still so many people that feel the burning need to tell other's what to do in regards to personal private decisions that have nothing to do with them in the first place?
Anonymous
Because: that it is a personal private decision doesn't make it right. and some people believe that abortion is a personal private decision equal to murder and therefore wrong. I believe it is murder but could see myself concluding it is not always wrong. Mostly though I just try not to think about the issue. The difficulty of the issue makes me sick.
Anonymous
To those who don't think complications would ever make it necessary for a woman to have a second- or third-trimester abortion:
Behold, the self-described "poster child for partial birth abortion."

Long story short, she was pregnant with twins, one died in utero at 22 weeks, she suffered severe pre-eclampsia and had to have a dilation and extraction to save her life. Here's an excerpt, in response to a comment on her blog calling her a murderer:

"So, Susan, let me say this to you. Since you clearly don't know my story, you may not realize that my life was saved by a surgical procedure that falls under the umbrella of the partial birth abortion ban. It happened four years ago this month, before the ban was upheld by the Supreme Court. You probably don't know about my sons Nicholas and Zachary, and how badly I wanted them, and how much I miss them today. You certainly don't know about my harrowing hospital experience, my severe preeclampsia, my near brush with death, or how my doctor cried while he performed the procedure that saved my life and killed my surviving son.

You certainly don't know about how, alone in my room that night feeling like nothing more than an empty womb, I cried and cried in a far corner of the maternity ward, away from the happy new moms. I was so lonely and sad; even the nurses stayed away from me. You don't know about the months of horribly post-partum depression, the agony I felt when my milk came in with no babies to nurse, the desire to start using drugs again to kill the pain despite my years of sobriety, or the fear that plagued me through the pregnancy with my daughter."

Here are two relevant posts in her blog. She's fiercely political, but that does not change her experiences.
http://www.uppercasewoman.com/wastedbirthcontrol/losing_my_twins_or_how_i_became_the_internet_poster_girl_for_partial_birth_abortion/
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