What is the Test for Highly Gifted Program Like?

[Anonymous]

Uh, there are truly gifted kids who are slackers and not motivated at all. What you "feel" is irrelevant.. Talented/gifted is very different from motivated. The HGC is actually full of not so gifted hyper motivated students.

This is because there are not enough truly gifted kids (slackers and non slackers) to fill those spots. Why don't you advise MCPS on how to spot the the gifted kids that are slackers? I'm not so sure these kids would do well in HGC since they would be left behind (gap) by the dumb but highly motivated kids!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Uh, there are truly gifted kids who are slackers and not motivated at all. What you "feel" is irrelevant.. Talented/gifted is very different from motivated. The HGC is actually full of not so gifted hyper motivated students.

This is because there are not enough truly gifted kids (slackers and non slackers) to fill those spots. Why don't you advise MCPS on how to spot the the gifted kids that are slackers? I'm not so sure these kids would do well in HGC since they would be left behind (gap) by the dumb but highly motivated kids!

Here is how to identify them - second grade raven test for all kids in school. MCPS should have kept this test. The nonverbal test in second grade given to all kids is a great way to find them.

[Anonymous]

Here is how to identify them - second grade raven test for all kids in school. MCPS should have kept this test. The nonverbal test in second grade given to all kids is a great way to find them.

But, how can you separate them out from the hard working dummies who have prepared for the Raven test, or SAT test, or SCAT test, or WPPSI test, or subject tests in school? I don't think you can separate them.

[Anonymous]

They still take InView even though they don't take Rav

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Here is how to identify them - second grade raven test for all kids in school. MCPS should have kept this test. The nonverbal test in second grade given to all kids is a great way to find them.

But, how can you separate them out from the hard working dummies who have prepared for the Raven test, or SAT test, or SCAT test, or WPPSI test, or subject tests in school? I don't think you can separate them.

Raven tests contain shapes and patterns so you will be able to find gifted kids that might otherwise be overlooked. It won't stop the prepped kids from scoring better as a result of being prepped (although at a younger age with non-memorizable testing it harder for prepping to help ) but it will identify the overlooked minority and low SES kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Here is how to identify them - second grade raven test for all kids in school. MCPS should have kept this test. The nonverbal test in second grade given to all kids is a great way to find them.

But, how can you separate them out from the hard working dummies who have prepared for the Raven test, or SAT test, or SCAT test, or WPPSI test, or subject tests in school? I don't think you can separate them.

Raven tests contain shapes and patterns so you will be able to find gifted kids that might otherwise be overlooked. It won't stop the prepped kids from scoring better as a result of being prepped (although at a younger age with non-memorizable testing it harder for prepping to help ) but it will identify the overlooked minority and low SES kids.

I don't think that any one test can identify all highly-gifted students (regardless of their home environment and personal characteristics) and nobody else. Or even any combination of tests.

Also, I doubt that the kids who almost got into the HGC differ meaningfully from the kids who barely got in. But then if the HGCs expand to admit those kids, it will be the same situation again: the kids who almost got into the HGC won't differ meaningfully from the kids who barely got in. All cut-offs are artificial.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Also, I doubt that the kids who almost got into the HGC differ meaningfully from the kids who barely got in. But then if the HGCs expand to admit those kids, it will be the same situation again: the kids who almost got into the HGC won't differ meaningfully from the kids who barely got in. All cut-offs are artificial.

A special school for all bright kids is not the answer. There could be more enrichment in the regular classrooms to challenge the kids who are bright and motivated but not at the HGC. For example, they did the Inview (?) testing to identify gifted kids, and we asked the 3rd grade teacher what it meant would happen and she said nothing would happen. I am not really sure what the point is of that test to identify them if the results aren't used for anything.

In any case, my 4th grader is at a HGC and absolutely loves it, loves the homework, the work, the projects, being challenged to think deeper, and loves her classmates. And she didn't prep. But yes she's the type of kid that reads a lot, was doing logic and other educational puzzles, etc. for fun.

[Anonymous]

Quoting messed up - trying again without the quote of the post above mine.
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A special school for all bright kids is not the answer. There could be more enrichment in the regular classrooms to challenge the kids who are bright and motivated but not at the HGC. For example, they did the Inview (?) testing to identify gifted kids, and we asked the 3rd grade teacher what it meant would happen and she said nothing would happen. I am not really sure what the point is of that test to identify them if the results aren't used for anything.

In any case, my 4th grader is at a HGC and absolutely loves it, loves the homework, the work, the projects, being challenged to think deeper, and loves her classmates. And she didn't prep. But yes she's the type of kid that reads a lot, was doing logic and other educational puzzles, etc. for fun.

To add - I only say that last line because of what people said might be considered "prepping" - doing those things was in no way prepping for a magnet school test, we had absolutely no idea what type of test was administered and when we asked the 3rd grade teacher if there was any way to prepare for it, she said just a good night's sleep.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Here is how to identify them - second grade raven test for all kids in school. MCPS should have kept this test. The nonverbal test in second grade given to all kids is a great way to find them.

But, how can you separate them out from the hard working dummies who have prepared for the Raven test, or SAT test, or SCAT test, or WPPSI test, or subject tests in school? I don't think you can separate them.

Raven tests contain shapes and patterns so you will be able to find gifted kids that might otherwise be overlooked. It won't stop the prepped kids from scoring better as a result of being prepped (although at a younger age with non-memorizable testing it harder for prepping to help ) but it will identify the overlooked minority and low SES kids.

Oh thank God! My kid prepped for HGC and Magnet MS. He was also off the charts for Raven, TN2 and InView in 2nd grade (the transition year where all three were offered!) without any prep. I was having a twinge of guilt that maybe he did not deserve to be in the center programs because he had prepped, but now I am assured that he is where he needs to be.

So what should be my next steps? Prep for magnet HS? Prep for SAT? MCAT? LSAT? GMAT?

[Anonymous]

Chance favors the prepped mind

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I never helped my kids with homework, I feel to go to a magnet you need to be a motivated self starter. Besides either you can do the work it you can't. Truly gifted kids thrive on the challenge to try to do well. I know of no tutored kid in Magnet middle or HS, if your kid needs that than they are in the wrong program.

Defined Tutored. In Magnet Algebra teacher's instructions: "if you have questions ask family member or teacher for help." When my kids had questions they came to me for help. That did not happen every day, but it did happen.
So should my kids with As not be in the program because of this? Not according to Magnet teacher...
These kids cover very deep material, way beyond their age and grades. (I found that part of Algebra 1 course would be PreCalculus in normal school, and some optional things are really College Level!)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
It's fine if you believe that some kids are just 'smarter' and more 'gifted' than others. I might agree that some super 'gifted' kids might be. But, really, I think a good number of the smart, hard-working kids would do well at an HGC. There are just not enough spots. I think that's where we disagree. You feel that only some kids deserve to be there, but I think that if a kid is smart 'enough' and willing to do the work to keep up, he/she deserves a spot as well. And, if prepping gives the kids a small leg up by being familiar with the types of questions, then so be it.

Just so I'm clear, you're ok with a child who is intellectually in the top 3% being excluded because a child who is intellectually in the top 10% was prepped by their parents?

I think a child who is in the top 10% but works his ass off should be able to get into the HGC if he does well on tests and school recommendation. My child is an amazing test taker but does not have the motivation or drive to go the extra mile to get the best grades in school. Do I think my child should get the HGC spot or do I think some kid who is fairly smart and has put in more work get the spot? Frankly, I'm all for sending the other child.

[Anonymous]

I don't think prepping really helps much on this type of test.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I think a child who is in the top 10% but works his ass off should be able to get into the HGC if he does well on tests and school recommendation. My child is an amazing test taker but does not have the motivation or drive to go the extra mile to get the best grades in school. Do I think my child should get the HGC spot or do I think some kid who is fairly smart and has put in more work get the spot? Frankly, I'm all for sending the other child.

It's the Highly Gifted Center, not the Highly Motivated Center, let alone the Has Parents Who Are Highly Motivated Center.

[Anonymous]

I had my kid take one prep test. She did as well on the prep test as the actual test. I don't think it made much of a difference.