Being a working parent sucks

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m an “anti-aftercare” poster. And a feminist. One has nothing to do with the other. Women should of course be able to work and have full lives. But infants and toddlers should also not be looked after in chaotic institutional settings by minimum-wage employees for 10 hours per day. It’s just wrong in a civilized, wealthy society. And the more anxious society gets, the more vulnerable our kids are. It’s a vicious cycle. And it all coincides with reduced standards in schools, nutrition, environment, security, etc.

I don’t know the solution but the first step in giving children a better start is for the professional classes to recognize the reality most of humankind knows. Flex hours, a few years of paid leave for both sexes, higher pay for daycare workers…all of this would be a start. But all the feminists who deny basic child development make me so upset. In my circle, most of the biggest aftercare and daycare users actually had sahms or nannies themselves.

They think because I didn’t change my name, vote for dems, married late, am an atheist etc that I agree with them. I don’t want anyone to feel judged because it’s not about them—it’s about what’s right for children.

How are you so supposedly educated and not know about Montessori education? They have awesome afrercare too. My kids get mad if I pick them up early and they miss cooking, chess, or any of the other activities.

Also what are you rambling about with child development? Do you run a cooking class from you house after school? And is your chess game good enough to teach chess? And do you also personally teach your kids violin? Flute? What about a second language? You aren't the end all and be all for your child. To believe that is unhealthy!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m an “anti-aftercare” poster. And a feminist. One has nothing to do with the other. Women should of course be able to work and have full lives. But infants and toddlers should also not be looked after in chaotic institutional settings by minimum-wage employees for 10 hours per day. It’s just wrong in a civilized, wealthy society. And the more anxious society gets, the more vulnerable our kids are. It’s a vicious cycle. And it all coincides with reduced standards in schools, nutrition, environment, security, etc.

I don’t know the solution but the first step in giving children a better start is for the professional classes to recognize the reality most of humankind knows. Flex hours, a few years of paid leave for both sexes, higher pay for daycare workers…all of this would be a start. But all the feminists who deny basic child development make me so upset. In my circle, most of the biggest aftercare and daycare users actually had sahms or nannies themselves.

They think because I didn’t change my name, vote for dems, married late, am an atheist etc that I agree with them. I don’t want anyone to feel judged because it’s not about them—it’s about what’s right for children.

How are you so supposedly educated and not know about Montessori education? They have awesome afrercare too. My kids get mad if I pick them up early and they miss cooking, chess, or any of the other activities.

Also what are you rambling about with child development? Do you run a cooking class from you house after school? And is your chess game good enough to teach chess? And do you also personally teach your kids violin? Flute? What about a second language? You aren't the end all and be all for your child. To believe that is unhealthy!

Kids don’t need chess and cooking classes in elementary school. They need a family member and a peaceful home.

[Anonymous]

Daycare has been wonderful for our family. And guess what, you won't be able to tell in 10 years which kids went to daycare and which ones had nannies or sahms. And if you claim that you can, you are lying. And yes I know about the ridiculous, anonymous blog post that makes all those sensational claims about "the science".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Warehousing of kids, overseen by surly (and sometimes sketch teenagers) without zero adults around : my experience at every camp aftercare.

And aftercare in general, school and camp, definitely reenacts Lord of the Flies.

this is wildly untrue.
at our private the aftercare is classes and sports. at camp it's extra sports. granted those are 'nice' options but I toured a public middle for my oldest one and their aftercare is 2 activities (sports or classes). Idk where you guys are sending your kids that the aftercare is so terrible but mine given the option choose aftercare rather than going home early even if given the option bc that's what their friends are doing and where they hang out rather than being alone on ipad.

Uh, yeah private school aftercare is probably quite pleasant. You don't get the discipline problems and overcrowding of a public school. The public after cares we went to all had published agendas for "fun" but in reality it all went out the windows after an hour.

No idea why this became an anti daycare thread; several hours with involved caregivers with play time, nap, and a meal is healthy and even SAHM send kids to preschool. It’s the 9 hours of warehousing with underpaid workers and overstimulated kids, that is the issue — and if you want to work at least a full 8 hours you need 9 hours of care, and most careers really need more than 8 hrs to thrive. And of course that still means zero personal time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Warehousing of kids, overseen by surly (and sometimes sketch teenagers) without zero adults around : my experience at every camp aftercare.

And aftercare in general, school and camp, definitely reenacts Lord of the Flies.

this is wildly untrue.
at our private the aftercare is classes and sports. at camp it's extra sports. granted those are 'nice' options but I toured a public middle for my oldest one and their aftercare is 2 activities (sports or classes). Idk where you guys are sending your kids that the aftercare is so terrible but mine given the option choose aftercare rather than going home early even if given the option bc that's what their friends are doing and where they hang out rather than being alone on ipad.

Uh, yeah private school aftercare is probably quite pleasant. You don't get the discipline problems and overcrowding of a public school. The public after cares we went to all had published agendas for "fun" but in reality it all went out the windows after an hour.

No idea why this became an anti daycare thread; several hours with involved caregivers with play time, nap, and a meal is healthy and even SAHM send kids to preschool. It’s the 9 hours of warehousing with underpaid workers and overstimulated kids, that is the issue — and if you want to work at least a full 8 hours you need 9 hours of care, and most careers really need more than 8 hrs to thrive. And of course that still means zero personal time.

It sounds like it became an anti daycare thread because you started posting this garbage

[Anonymous]

I am with you Op. I think the two equal careers model is really bad for my marriage. Neither of us have our lane and we are constantly bartering and bickering over how to cover all the days off, camps that start at nine, etc. it is a really unpleasant life

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have never met a woman who was in daycare/aftercare as a child also want that for her own kids. The problem is no one talks about what it costs to avoid this until you’ve had a baby.

I actually think is a huge benefit of dcum—keeping it real for young women who stumble upon posts like this.

seriously, you have to be strategic in your 20s when you’re dating about the kind of life you’re gonna have over the next two decades.

So what is your proposal for the 99% of the population that doesn’t marry someone in BigLaw, medicine, etc?

[Anonymous]

My kids usually enjoyed their camps and aftercare programs because I would coordinate with the parents of their friends when signing them up for camps and so my kids were with their friends pretty much all day long. And then because I was coordinating with friends parents we would take turns on pick up and drop offs. I had two kids, and ideally, I would get both kids in the same camp such as Bullis, which would have something for the boy and something for the girl. I would also try to get them away to Sleepaway camp at least once in the summer, again coordinated with their friends parents so they went with friends. It was tricky, but I made it work. I'm glad I work. I have saved up for my retirement. I am financially independent and so on and so forth. No regrets.

My kitchen now grown and in college.

[Anonymous]

^^ i'm the previous poster here that coordinated with friends parents. We are not wealthy. And my kids did not go to private school. Bullis was just a good camp because it offered programs that both of my kids would like. We also went to city of Rockville camps and other camps. And sometimes we would have to separate the kids, but I was coordinating with friends parents because then I'd be coordinating with my daughters friends on her pick up and drop off and coordinating with my son's friends parents on his pick up and drop off when they went to separate camps.

[Anonymous]

We stuck to two careers because neither of us wanted to stop working. Took a serious toll on our marriage and now even when the kids are in elementary school, we are still struggling in the summer/over long holidays. It’s a constant tally keeping of “who had to leave work early last time.” We like our jobs but neither of us are superstars in terms of salary so I’m not sure I’d do it again.

[Anonymous]

Aftercare was a disaster for my 3 yo. It was too chaotic and the kids don’t socialize well at that age so it’s stressful. My kids both enjoyed aftercare as elementary schoolers and I have zero guilt.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Daycare has been wonderful for our family. And guess what, you won't be able to tell in 10 years which kids went to daycare and which ones had nannies or sahms. And if you claim that you can, you are lying. And yes I know about the ridiculous, anonymous blog post that makes all those sensational claims about "the science".

Agreed. I was a SAHM until DS was 3 and then worked PT until K. And had a flexible schedule so I was home with him when school got out. He's in MS now. You can't tell at all who went to daycare and who had a SAHP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Warehousing of kids, overseen by surly (and sometimes sketch teenagers) without zero adults around : my experience at every camp aftercare.

And aftercare in general, school and camp, definitely reenacts Lord of the Flies.

this is wildly untrue.
at our private the aftercare is classes and sports. at camp it's extra sports. granted those are 'nice' options but I toured a public middle for my oldest one and their aftercare is 2 activities (sports or classes). Idk where you guys are sending your kids that the aftercare is so terrible but mine given the option choose aftercare rather than going home early even if given the option bc that's what their friends are doing and where they hang out rather than being alone on ipad.

**rolls eyes hard*** cool susy thanks for letting me know that money does solve all problems unfortunately that's not most people's experiences.

I am sure if I had a nanny and housekeeper it would be better too!

[Anonymous]

We chose the breadwinner/SAHM path 16 years ago and I’ll be the first to admit that while I love kids and wanted to be with them, I mainly chose it for my own sanity and life balance and not because I thought daycare would harm my children. My own parents were dual working (out of true necessity, we were working class) and it really sucked for them and for us as kids. I knew I didn’t want that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have never met a woman who was in daycare/aftercare as a child also want that for her own kids. The problem is no one talks about what it costs to avoid this until you’ve had a baby.

I actually think is a huge benefit of dcum—keeping it real for young women who stumble upon posts like this.

seriously, you have to be strategic in your 20s when you’re dating about the kind of life you’re gonna have over the next two decades.

So what is your proposal for the 99% of the population that doesn’t marry someone in BigLaw, medicine, etc?

The rest of the world like Korea and Italy have figured it out: don’t have kids.