The science on remote schooling is now clear. Here’s who it hurt most.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t understand the point of this. I mean it is very very obvious that virtual school sucked and would lead to worse outcomes. It isn’t like that wasn’t expected. The issue is we dealt with an emergency and now we are picking up the aftermath.

It’s like when a tornado strikes and a town is leveled and people have to find immediate shelter and clothes and in some case mourn and heal.

After that stage there is so much work. On tv you never see the tearing down of the rest of the structures and the painfully slow process of rebuilding. You never see the altered lives and how some move away or move in with family. We are with schools in this painful part of assessing and rebuilding. The fact that you are whining and pointing fingers at teachers and schools isn’t going to make the original emergency and pain go away. It won’t make how anyone handled it go away. It will show your child how you deal with adversity by blaming and shaming.
Everyone is sorry this all happened. Yiu show your character by how you move on.

A tornado hit my hometown when I was growing up and destroyed the high school, and heavily damaged the elementary and middle schools. We were still all back in school 2 weeks later. You figure it out.

The problem here is that the people and organizations that pushed for long-term school closures during the pandemic did so without acknowledging and weighing the harm that would result from school closures. Even now, many are refusing to acknowledge that harm. Some of these people are likely to push for more closures in the future, still ignoring the harm to students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m thinking that OP’s former friends were relieved to finally have a reason to cut the cord with her for good.
Thanks COVID!

+1

People who were “screaming” about this in summer 2020 are unhinged.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t understand the point of this. I mean it is very very obvious that virtual school sucked and would lead to worse outcomes. It isn’t like that wasn’t expected. The issue is we dealt with an emergency and now we are picking up the aftermath.

It’s like when a tornado strikes and a town is leveled and people have to find immediate shelter and clothes and in some case mourn and heal.

After that stage there is so much work. On tv you never see the tearing down of the rest of the structures and the painfully slow process of rebuilding. You never see the altered lives and how some move away or move in with family. We are with schools in this painful part of assessing and rebuilding. The fact that you are whining and pointing fingers at teachers and schools isn’t going to make the original emergency and pain go away. It won’t make how anyone handled it go away. It will show your child how you deal with adversity by blaming and shaming.
Everyone is sorry this all happened. Yiu show your character by how you move on.

A tornado hit my hometown when I was growing up and destroyed the high school, and heavily damaged the elementary and middle schools. We were still all back in school 2 weeks later. You figure it out.

The problem here is that the people and organizations that pushed for long-term school closures during the pandemic did so without acknowledging and weighing the harm that would result from school closures. Even now, many are refusing to acknowledge that harm. Some of these people are likely to push for more closures in the future, still ignoring the harm to students.

This. This. This.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t understand the point of this. I mean it is very very obvious that virtual school sucked and would lead to worse outcomes. It isn’t like that wasn’t expected. The issue is we dealt with an emergency and now we are picking up the aftermath.

It’s like when a tornado strikes and a town is leveled and people have to find immediate shelter and clothes and in some case mourn and heal.

After that stage there is so much work. On tv you never see the tearing down of the rest of the structures and the painfully slow process of rebuilding. You never see the altered lives and how some move away or move in with family. We are with schools in this painful part of assessing and rebuilding. The fact that you are whining and pointing fingers at teachers and schools isn’t going to make the original emergency and pain go away. It won’t make how anyone handled it go away. It will show your child how you deal with adversity by blaming and shaming.
Everyone is sorry this all happened. Yiu show your character by how you move on.

Well I guess the issue is what you mean by moving on. Yes, lots of people want to turn the page and put the onus on learning back on parents/students/tutors, without acknowledging the gaps that were created by the very method and curriculum that the administration chose. I think this is wrong. These articles focus on poor students being affected, but the reality is that most students were negatively affected. My kid is an MCPS HS and for the first time in years we went to many parent teacher conferences because she is clearly struggling, and in *every* conference, the teacher said *more than half* the class is completely underwater, which is a real change from past years. They are taking time to reteach basic material.

We cannot just “move on.” As a community, we must make attempts at repair before we can do that.

[Anonymous]

As a teacher and a parent, I’m tired of all these people STILL working remotely harping on and on about this. I went back in person before vaccines and then left because the stress of it all was awful. I taught remotely in a district where parents had the choice of full in person 5x a week school or remote learning. The vast majority of our parents wanted their kids to stay remote. The past few years have been awful for everyone and you are wrong if you think kids could have been insulated from that. We’ve seen time and time again that pretending COVID doesn’t exist and demanding things are “normal” is harmful and foolish. You can’t wish this away. I’m not sorry for keeping my family as safe as possible. Thank you to the parents who have vaccinated their kids, keep them home when they’re sick, and test when they do have symptoms.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a teacher and a parent, I’m tired of all these people STILL working remotely harping on and on about this. I went back in person before vaccines and then left because the stress of it all was awful. I taught remotely in a district where parents had the choice of full in person 5x a week school or remote learning. The vast majority of our parents wanted their kids to stay remote. The past few years have been awful for everyone and you are wrong if you think kids could have been insulated from that. We’ve seen time and time again that pretending COVID doesn’t exist and demanding things are “normal” is harmful and foolish. You can’t wish this away. I’m not sorry for keeping my family as safe as possible. Thank you to the parents who have vaccinated their kids, keep them home when they’re sick, and test when they do have symptoms.

Right- you can’t just wish covid away. It’s going to be with us forever. We knew that from the start, but a vocal group of people talked as if it would “go away” if we just made kids of all ages wear masks all day. It never made any sense. By fall 2020 we knew the harms of school closures would outweigh the harm of reopening them, given we knew we'd all get covid either way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:School closings were bad. But opening them would have killed a lot of people - in particular, teachers and the family members of teachers. As a teacher, it disgusts me still that there were people who thought it was more important to open schools than to keep us and our families alive.

My child also suffered from closed schools. But the issue for me is not that schools closed, but that FCPS did such an inexcusably poor job of providing virtual instruction. It didn't have to be as useless as it was.

Also the family members of the students. Lots of kids lost parents.

Considering schools in red states were in-person and all private schools were in-person and it is now the end of 2022, you are going to have to work much harder to make your point than just saying in person school would have “killed” lots of people. I am shocked (though I shouldn’t be) how many people are still holding on to that with all of the evidence that says otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Why does the teacher upthread wish more kids were vaccinated? It’s been proven it doesn’t influence transmission one way or the other.
You are free to boost every week and wear 10 masks, but leave our kids alone.
I do agree about keeping them home when sick - the old 24 hrs fever free rule still stands. But no, I am not testing my child for every little sneeze or headache.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:School closings were bad. But opening them would have killed a lot of people - in particular, teachers and the family members of teachers. As a teacher, it disgusts me still that there were people who thought it was more important to open schools than to keep us and our families alive.

My child also suffered from closed schools. But the issue for me is not that schools closed, but that FCPS did such an inexcusably poor job of providing virtual instruction. It didn't have to be as useless as it was.

Also the family members of the students. Lots of kids lost parents.

Considering schools in red states were in-person and all private schools were in-person and it is now the end of 2022, you are going to have to work much harder to make your point than just saying in person school would have “killed” lots of people. I am shocked (though I shouldn’t be) how many people are still holding on to that with all of the evidence that says otherwise.

These people are trying to avoid the realization that their leadership basically made them and their kids the sacrificial lambs to their agenda.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone intellectually knew this would be the result of extended school closures. But as evident in this thread, a lot of people didn’t care, and still don’t.

I know that teachers tried. But here's where teachers' unions, and by extension, teachers, take a hit. They assured parents that as "experts" they knew what was best for children and would be quickly able to get children back up to speed once schools reopened. That has not turned out to be true. Instead, the problems caused by the pandemic, and exacerbated by virtual school, have made teaching even more difficult and students and parents chronically stressed and unsupported. Decision makers underestimated the harms of isolation and personal interaction between teachers and students and students with their fellow classmates. We are not talking about "learning losses" or setbacks, we now dealing with scores of anxious and depressed kids who can't learn. They don't trust anyone or believe that anyone cares about them.

Oh, and by the way, what was the plan for graduating seniors to make up all of the material they missed? There wasn't one, and no one cares. It's better to blame kids and their parents for everything and allow these kids to get lost.

There’s a long line of academic research showing that it is very hard for students to catch up when they call behind. Anyone that said teachers would be able to bring students back up to speed after schools reopened wasn’t arguing in good faith.

What is the reasoning behind trying to catch up? Why not just move at a realistic pace given the circumstances?

Because we want our kids to go to college? Your last chance to take the SAT is fall of senior year, and your high school grades count. My kid can’t undo his learning loss in time. A kid who was in K or 3rd during virtual learning can catch up, and the article talked about that. It is the high schoolers who had learning loss that are SOL

There was just an article in the NYT about how college freshmen and sophomores are struggling. They missed at least three months during high school (due to the March 2020 closures) and didn't get anything extra. It is any wonder that many find themselves unprepared for college. This will cost students a lifetime of lost earnings, yet no one cares.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/01/us/covid-college-students.html


And there have been many other articles about how things are not all right with new college students. The problems extend beyond academics, and there are no easy answers.

But what can be done to help them?

NP. As if the pro-closure people care at all about struggling kids. Come on. They’ve already shown they don’t. This includes university administration. Nothing will be done, and the permanent, lifelong harm that was immediately obvious to anyone with two brain cells will occur.

Funny how you never cared about struggling kids before and are just using them as a talking point. Schools have been open a year and a half, some never went virtual and kids are struggling. Maybe it wasn't covid that was the issue or even going virtual.

These studies are flawed. They need to look at kids currently in virtual to comparable kids in person as a true comparison.

Actually I’m pretty sure I’ve done more for struggling kids than you ever have. And stop with your BS gaslighting. We all know what I wrote is true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:YAWN!! My kids continued to do great in virtual school. I was very happy that they were safe. Our kids socialized outdoors, we masked, we had a pod, our kids had a lot of support. But then, our kids are also taught by us each day, so we are already very involved with their education.

Those who are not good students continued to do poorly. Those who were high achieving continued to do well. Yes, we know URM, SN, FARMs are going to perform poorly, but are they performing very well when the schools are not virtual? No.

Achievement gap was there before the pandemic, during the pandemic and has remained after the pandemic.

Maybe they should have kept the schools opened for the poor performingstudents, maybe they should have had a hybrid model for high performing students. In any case, we did not depend on the school to educate our children even before the pandemic so it was not a loss for us.

Also, since teachers don't want to educate low performing kids, who would have agreed to teach just this group of kids in person during pandemic?

I honestly do not believe any parent who claims their kid is doing very well in virtual school, unless their children are attending Stanford Online HS or a program of equivalent caliber. Beyond that, the data shows parents who claim their kids “thrived” in virtual are flatly delusional. You definitely sound like you are in that group, PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...lol. I am perfectly fine shedding the "friends" I had who wanted to stand with the liberal media and unions. Their kids didn't do well...I know one who suffered severe mental illness due to lack of socialization. Sad sad situation. The schools should have opened in the fall. Mine kid's school did, no teachers died, and my kid is on track to take AP Calc in her junior year of HS. Damn I hate being right all the time.

Uhhh, my kid was remote pretty much all year in 2022-21. Her school had kids come in one day a week in late winter. She’s also a junior and in AP Calc right now. Doing great. Not sure why you think your kid being in AP Calc is such a flex. 👀

Same. My kids stayed remote through 21. Both are juniors in AP Calc currently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...lol. I am perfectly fine shedding the "friends" I had who wanted to stand with the liberal media and unions. Their kids didn't do well...I know one who suffered severe mental illness due to lack of socialization. Sad sad situation. The schools should have opened in the fall. Mine kid's school did, no teachers died, and my kid is on track to take AP Calc in her junior year of HS. Damn I hate being right all the time.

Uhhh, my kid was remote pretty much all year in 2022-21. Her school had kids come in one day a week in late winter. She’s also a junior and in AP Calc right now. Doing great. Not sure why you think your kid being in AP Calc is such a flex. 👀

Same. My kids stayed remote through 21. Both are juniors in AP Calc currently.

Wow. Good for you. My kid got a 5 on the Calc BC exam during his virtual senior year and failed his next math class in college. Go figure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...lol. I am perfectly fine shedding the "friends" I had who wanted to stand with the liberal media and unions. Their kids didn't do well...I know one who suffered severe mental illness due to lack of socialization. Sad sad situation. The schools should have opened in the fall. Mine kid's school did, no teachers died, and my kid is on track to take AP Calc in her junior year of HS. Damn I hate being right all the time.

Uhhh, my kid was remote pretty much all year in 2022-21. Her school had kids come in one day a week in late winter. She’s also a junior and in AP Calc right now. Doing great. Not sure why you think your kid being in AP Calc is such a flex. 👀

Same. My kids stayed remote through 21. Both are juniors in AP Calc currently.

Wow. Good for you. My kid got a 5 on the Calc BC exam during his virtual senior year and failed his next math class in college. Go figure.

Didn’t they dumb down the AP exams that year? Makes sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t understand the point of this. I mean it is very very obvious that virtual school sucked and would lead to worse outcomes. It isn’t like that wasn’t expected. The issue is we dealt with an emergency and now we are picking up the aftermath.

It’s like when a tornado strikes and a town is leveled and people have to find immediate shelter and clothes and in some case mourn and heal.

After that stage there is so much work. On tv you never see the tearing down of the rest of the structures and the painfully slow process of rebuilding. You never see the altered lives and how some move away or move in with family. We are with schools in this painful part of assessing and rebuilding. The fact that you are whining and pointing fingers at teachers and schools isn’t going to make the original emergency and pain go away. It won’t make how anyone handled it go away. It will show your child how you deal with adversity by blaming and shaming.
Everyone is sorry this all happened. Yiu show your character by how you move on.

A tornado hit my hometown when I was growing up and destroyed the high school, and heavily damaged the elementary and middle schools. We were still all back in school 2 weeks later. You figure it out.

The problem here is that the people and organizations that pushed for long-term school closures during the pandemic did so without acknowledging and weighing the harm that would result from school closures. Even now, many are refusing to acknowledge that harm. Some of these people are likely to push for more closures in the future, still ignoring the harm to students.

And, some like you refuse to understand the harm done by keeping them open. The harm in kids losing their parents and loved ones unnecessarily because some people thought nothing of spreading covid to others, which ended up killing their parents.

It's ironic how some of us teach our kids to be resilient and be apart of the greater good, which means if something like this happens they/we shift and adapt to make it work. You seem rather inflexible as it's only about your needs. If we saved one child from losing their parent or one parent from losing their child, it was all worth it to me. Be thankful you've never been in that situation. So, while you celebrate with your family today, many of us grieve those we've lost.