I can't breathe . . . Minneapolis police kill a man in broad daylight

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

An overarching problem here and in other well known cases is the appalling lack of correspondence between the alleged precipitating offense (counterfeit money) and the end result (death). The man in New York accused of selling loose cigarettes and then choked to death Is another example, as is the mentally ill man accused of stealing car radios but then beaten to death by police. It’s not realistic to expect police to just let arrestees walk away if they refuse to cooperate, but there needs to be some middle ground where people don’t get killed over minor crimes. Police in many jurisdictions have abandoned the “win at all costs” attitude toward high speed pursuits, reserving them for only the most serious offenders. Street policing needs something like that.

I AGREE!

I'm from a European country, visit Asian countries regularly and see their police in action, and am always so shocked at the atrocious level of permissible violence perpetrated by American police. Why is this allowed? Police forces all over the world are trained to adjust their response according to the situation, the suspect and the accusation. Why can't the US train their police better?

It's a blot on the ethics of Americans.

The level of police corruption in other countries is astounding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was cop and guy killed doing that ended up with cop killing him by crushing his neck?

Has any actual evidence been reported confirming the cause of death, i.e., strangulation, asphyxia, cervical dislocation, asthma, myocardial infarction, narcotics? As opposed to post hoc ergo propter hoc conclusions?

The cop in question was a major-league foul ball who should have been off the force years ago.

The rioting, burning, looting and the rest are absolutely unacceptable.

Let me come sit with my knee on your neck for 10 minutes and see if you're alive to debate whether my knee was the cause of any problems that result.

Yeah. That’s not how it works. And you don’t seem to know much about anatomy.

Adding: and from the violent, threatening, and personal time of your response, it would appear that the answer to the question is “no,” and it really pisses you off that anyone would dare question your unsupported, conclusory opinion.

I'm not threatening you. I have no idea who you are. I was demonstrating how ridiculous your logic is. If someone sits with their knee on someone's neck for 10 minutes, that person will likely suffocate. It's common sense.

Things are not that simple. To suffocate an individual would require compression of the windpipe, which is difficult with lateral pressure, particularly in a large, muscular individual. The photos do seem to show the cop’s knee near to/on the right carotid, but carotid compression would black the individual out, not cause them to complain they could not breathe. The more likely explanation would appear to be positional asphyxia, the chest compressed by the individual’s own weight and that of the police to the point where lung expansion becomes progressively more difficult and then impossible. Drug/alcohol intoxication would exacerbate this. The possibility remains, however, that death was from the drugs/alcohol, a heart attack, asthma or another idiopathic cause. Coincidence in time between action and result does not equal causation. However bad the cop’s use of force might have looked or been, it is important to know what actually happened.

An overarching problem here and in other well known cases is the appalling lack of correspondence between the alleged precipitating offense (counterfeit money) and the end result (death). The man in New York accused of selling loose cigarettes and then choked to death Is another example, as is the mentally ill man accused of stealing car radios but then beaten to death by police. It’s not realistic to expect police to just let arrestees walk away if they refuse to cooperate, but there needs to be some middle ground where people don’t get killed over minor crimes. Police in many jurisdictions have abandoned the “win at all costs” attitude toward high speed pursuits, reserving them for only the most serious offenders. Street policing needs something like that.

Wow, what a lucid well-reasoned and well-written post. No "gotcha" or inflammatory prose. Rare on DCUM. I enjoyed and learned from it. Please write more!

+1 This post was great.

No, its not. Where do we get that there could have been a drug overdose? Heart attack . . . The officer caused it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

An overarching problem here and in other well known cases is the appalling lack of correspondence between the alleged precipitating offense (counterfeit money) and the end result (death). The man in New York accused of selling loose cigarettes and then choked to death Is another example, as is the mentally ill man accused of stealing car radios but then beaten to death by police. It’s not realistic to expect police to just let arrestees walk away if they refuse to cooperate, but there needs to be some middle ground where people don’t get killed over minor crimes. Police in many jurisdictions have abandoned the “win at all costs” attitude toward high speed pursuits, reserving them for only the most serious offenders. Street policing needs something like that.

I AGREE!

I'm from a European country, visit Asian countries regularly and see their police in action, and am always so shocked at the atrocious level of permissible violence perpetrated by American police. Why is this allowed? Police forces all over the world are trained to adjust their response according to the situation, the suspect and the accusation. Why can't the US train their police better?

It's a blot on the ethics of Americans.

The level of police corruption in other countries is astounding.

It's not allowed. The cop who did this will likely be put away for the rest of his life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

An overarching problem here and in other well known cases is the appalling lack of correspondence between the alleged precipitating offense (counterfeit money) and the end result (death). The man in New York accused of selling loose cigarettes and then choked to death Is another example, as is the mentally ill man accused of stealing car radios but then beaten to death by police. It’s not realistic to expect police to just let arrestees walk away if they refuse to cooperate, but there needs to be some middle ground where people don’t get killed over minor crimes. Police in many jurisdictions have abandoned the “win at all costs” attitude toward high speed pursuits, reserving them for only the most serious offenders. Street policing needs something like that.

I AGREE!

I'm from a European country, visit Asian countries regularly and see their police in action, and am always so shocked at the atrocious level of permissible violence perpetrated by American police. Why is this allowed? Police forces all over the world are trained to adjust their response according to the situation, the suspect and the accusation. Why can't the US train their police better?

It's a blot on the ethics of Americans.

The level of police corruption in other countries is astounding.

I'm sure police are corrupt all over the world. That still doesn't take away from the fact that US cops are hyper-aggressive when dealing with POC and routinely get away with killing them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was cop and guy killed doing that ended up with cop killing him by crushing his neck?

Has any actual evidence been reported confirming the cause of death, i.e., strangulation, asphyxia, cervical dislocation, asthma, myocardial infarction, narcotics? As opposed to post hoc ergo propter hoc conclusions?

The cop in question was a major-league foul ball who should have been off the force years ago.

The rioting, burning, looting and the rest are absolutely unacceptable.

Let me come sit with my knee on your neck for 10 minutes and see if you're alive to debate whether my knee was the cause of any problems that result.

Yeah. That’s not how it works. And you don’t seem to know much about anatomy.

Adding: and from the violent, threatening, and personal time of your response, it would appear that the answer to the question is “no,” and it really pisses you off that anyone would dare question your unsupported, conclusory opinion.

I'm not threatening you. I have no idea who you are. I was demonstrating how ridiculous your logic is. If someone sits with their knee on someone's neck for 10 minutes, that person will likely suffocate. It's common sense.

Things are not that simple. To suffocate an individual would require compression of the windpipe, which is difficult with lateral pressure, particularly in a large, muscular individual. The photos do seem to show the cop’s knee near to/on the right carotid, but carotid compression would black the individual out, not cause them to complain they could not breathe. The more likely explanation would appear to be positional asphyxia, the chest compressed by the individual’s own weight and that of the police to the point where lung expansion becomes progressively more difficult and then impossible. Drug/alcohol intoxication would exacerbate this. The possibility remains, however, that death was from the drugs/alcohol, a heart attack, asthma or another idiopathic cause. Coincidence in time between action and result does not equal causation. However bad the cop’s use of force might have looked or been, it is important to know what actually happened.

An overarching problem here and in other well known cases is the appalling lack of correspondence between the alleged precipitating offense (counterfeit money) and the end result (death). The man in New York accused of selling loose cigarettes and then choked to death Is another example, as is the mentally ill man accused of stealing car radios but then beaten to death by police. It’s not realistic to expect police to just let arrestees walk away if they refuse to cooperate, but there needs to be some middle ground where people don’t get killed over minor crimes. Police in many jurisdictions have abandoned the “win at all costs” attitude toward high speed pursuits, reserving them for only the most serious offenders. Street policing needs something like that.

Wow, what a lucid well-reasoned and well-written post. No "gotcha" or inflammatory prose. Rare on DCUM. I enjoyed and learned from it. Please write more!

+1 This post was great.

No, its not. Where do we get that there could have been a drug overdose? Heart attack . . . The officer caused it.

Medically, there is a small likelihood that it could have been caused by other factors. You cannot rule out these factors based on the video alone and just say "the officer caused it, case closed." That is what the PP is talking about. And that is why the autopsy evidence will be very important to the legal teams (and testimony from medical experts).

[Anonymous]

The cop has been arrested! Step one down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The cop has been arrested! Step one down.

And charged with third-degree murder.

[Anonymous]

Rioters have vowed to come to the suburbs next.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Rioters have vowed to come to the suburbs next.

So they got the murder charge what's the point now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Rioters have vowed to come to the suburbs next.

So they got the murder charge what's the point now?

Free TVs of course.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What was cop and guy killed doing that ended up with cop killing him by crushing his neck?

Has any actual evidence been reported confirming the cause of death, i.e., strangulation, asphyxia, cervical dislocation, asthma, myocardial infarction, narcotics? As opposed to post hoc ergo propter hoc conclusions?

The cop in question was a major-league foul ball who should have been off the force years ago.

The rioting, burning, looting and the rest are absolutely unacceptable.

Let me come sit with my knee on your neck for 10 minutes and see if you're alive to debate whether my knee was the cause of any problems that result.

Yeah. That’s not how it works. And you don’t seem to know much about anatomy.

Adding: and from the violent, threatening, and personal time of your response, it would appear that the answer to the question is “no,” and it really pisses you off that anyone would dare question your unsupported, conclusory opinion.

I'm not threatening you. I have no idea who you are. I was demonstrating how ridiculous your logic is. If someone sits with their knee on someone's neck for 10 minutes, that person will likely suffocate. It's common sense.

Things are not that simple. To suffocate an individual would require compression of the windpipe, which is difficult with lateral pressure, particularly in a large, muscular individual. The photos do seem to show the cop’s knee near to/on the right carotid, but carotid compression would black the individual out, not cause them to complain they could not breathe. The more likely explanation would appear to be positional asphyxia, the chest compressed by the individual’s own weight and that of the police to the point where lung expansion becomes progressively more difficult and then impossible. Drug/alcohol intoxication would exacerbate this. The possibility remains, however, that death was from the drugs/alcohol, a heart attack, asthma or another idiopathic cause. Coincidence in time between action and result does not equal causation. However bad the cop’s use of force might have looked or been, it is important to know what actually happened.

An overarching problem here and in other well known cases is the appalling lack of correspondence between the alleged precipitating offense (counterfeit money) and the end result (death). The man in New York accused of selling loose cigarettes and then choked to death Is another example, as is the mentally ill man accused of stealing car radios but then beaten to death by police. It’s not realistic to expect police to just let arrestees walk away if they refuse to cooperate, but there needs to be some middle ground where people don’t get killed over minor crimes. Police in many jurisdictions have abandoned the “win at all costs” attitude toward high speed pursuits, reserving them for only the most serious offenders. Street policing needs something like that.

But even then, for the officer to continue with the knee on the neck, able to see what was happening to the guy as he became less and less conscious, to simply continue with the knee? There is also a duty of care for the officer, who at best seems to have refused to exercise such duty?

[Anonymous]

Protests today at 5:00 at 14th and U street and at Georgetown Waterfront at 6:00pm.

Join us!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Rioters have vowed to come to the suburbs next.

Antifa is in Minnesota now

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

An overarching problem here and in other well known cases is the appalling lack of correspondence between the alleged precipitating offense (counterfeit money) and the end result (death). The man in New York accused of selling loose cigarettes and then choked to death Is another example, as is the mentally ill man accused of stealing car radios but then beaten to death by police. It’s not realistic to expect police to just let arrestees walk away if they refuse to cooperate, but there needs to be some middle ground where people don’t get killed over minor crimes. Police in many jurisdictions have abandoned the “win at all costs” attitude toward high speed pursuits, reserving them for only the most serious offenders. Street policing needs something like that.

I AGREE!

I'm from a European country, visit Asian countries regularly and see their police in action, and am always so shocked at the atrocious level of permissible violence perpetrated by American police. Why is this allowed? Police forces all over the world are trained to adjust their response according to the situation, the suspect and the accusation. Why can't the US train their police better?

It's a blot on the ethics of Americans.

The level of police corruption in other countries is astounding.

Not more than here. You really think Japanese, British or Swedish police to be more corrupt than American police? Ha. Could be the reverse, actually.
And it still doesn't excuse Americans from killing suspects routinely, something that practically never happens it other developed countries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If it takes some fires and smashed windows to get and keep people's attention, so be it. Property is not more important than people. One side is murdering people, the other side is smashing windows, and a lot of you are riled up about the wrong one.

Rioting maybe, what does looting solve???

Nothing says we want justice like theft.

Racists STILL want to discuss looting? GFY.

Apparently, Floyd's death had such a devastating impact on the community. It tuns out that nah, they just want to steal. GFY