Mass Deportation: this is going to be expensive

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

stop if with the chamber of commerce propaganda. Americans will do any job.

Chicken farms

Less than one week after ICE raided 7 food processing facilities in Mississippi apprehending nearly 700 illegal workers, American citizens are rushing to freshly-available jobs.

Koch Foods is headquartered in Chicago but maintains a chicken processing facility in Mississippi that employed 243 of the 680 undocumented Latino workers arrested in the raids last Thursday. Koch has since collaborated with the Mississippi Department of Employment Security (MDES), holding a job fair to recruit new, legal, workers, according to the Associated Press.

The fair raked in 200 applications before noon, according to local media. The company says it will require applicants to present two forms of identification before being hired, according to CNN. MDES will also vet all Mississippi workers for legality using the state’s E-Verify system, according to USA Today.

I would not do that work for peanuts with no benefits, like most US workers. maybe they should increase the wages and add health care? crazy idea to people like you.

Econ 101 will give you background on the impact of Supply and Demand on prices.

if Supply goes up, the cost will come down.
if Supply goes down, the cost goes up.

if we were to limit the overwhelming immigration of low wage workers, the wages for low wage workers would increase.

I think that is a good thing.

people like you think that is a bad thing.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/08/13/citizens-line-up-mississippi-jobs-fear-ice-raids-impact-immigrants/

And if cost of labor goes up, cost of goods will go up.

Meaning a whole lot of middle class Americans won't be able to afford their current lifestyle.

Ready to get an orange for Xmas, like my grandfather did?

Why do democrats take the exact opposite position when discussion of the minimum wage comes up?

Lol

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

then we need to give those foreign fruit pickers status. we cannot have a permanent underclass who live in the shadows, are both exploited and stealing ametican identities /exploiting american citizens. i used to work in a medical clininc in TP MD and so many people were sharing SS#s and scamming medicaid.

There is already a guest worker program for migrant farmworkers. If farms are using undocumented labor, it is because they don’t want to use existing formal channels. We can all speculate as to why.

So it boils down to employers choosing to hire undocumented workers. Want to stop this crap? You find out who's employing them and fine *them*, punish *them*, regulate *them.* Going after the migrants won't work unless there's nothing here for them unless done legally. But Trump/MAGA/any Republican really won't do that because it's too fun to punch down on the "illegals."

Punish both sides. At the same time .

All criminals and fraudsters deported immediately. High priority.

Stop citizenship by birth too. A fruit picker doesn’t need to show up with wives, aunts, children.

They don’t.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

stop if with the chamber of commerce propaganda. Americans will do any job.

Chicken farms

Less than one week after ICE raided 7 food processing facilities in Mississippi apprehending nearly 700 illegal workers, American citizens are rushing to freshly-available jobs.

Koch Foods is headquartered in Chicago but maintains a chicken processing facility in Mississippi that employed 243 of the 680 undocumented Latino workers arrested in the raids last Thursday. Koch has since collaborated with the Mississippi Department of Employment Security (MDES), holding a job fair to recruit new, legal, workers, according to the Associated Press.

The fair raked in 200 applications before noon, according to local media. The company says it will require applicants to present two forms of identification before being hired, according to CNN. MDES will also vet all Mississippi workers for legality using the state’s E-Verify system, according to USA Today.

I would not do that work for peanuts with no benefits, like most US workers. maybe they should increase the wages and add health care? crazy idea to people like you.

Econ 101 will give you background on the impact of Supply and Demand on prices.

if Supply goes up, the cost will come down.
if Supply goes down, the cost goes up.

if we were to limit the overwhelming immigration of low wage workers, the wages for low wage workers would increase.

I think that is a good thing.

people like you think that is a bad thing.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/08/13/citizens-line-up-mississippi-jobs-fear-ice-raids-impact-immigrants/

And if cost of labor goes up, cost of goods will go up.

Meaning a whole lot of middle class Americans won't be able to afford their current lifestyle.

Ready to get an orange for Xmas, like my grandfather did?

Why do democrats take the exact opposite position when discussion of the minimum wage comes up?

Lol

Why do you vote against minimum wage increases?

[Anonymous]

So it's expensive to send people back to their countries but not expensive to use FEMA money to fly them all over the US after coming here illegally? Can someone explain this to me?

[Anonymous]

Expensive like how? Spending over a billion dollars in 14 weeks and losing an election?

Clearly no one cared about the cost when voting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

then we need to give those foreign fruit pickers status. we cannot have a permanent underclass who live in the shadows, are both exploited and stealing ametican identities /exploiting american citizens. i used to work in a medical clininc in TP MD and so many people were sharing SS#s and scamming medicaid.

There is already a guest worker program for migrant farmworkers. If farms are using undocumented labor, it is because they don’t want to use existing formal channels. We can all speculate as to why.

So it boils down to employers choosing to hire undocumented workers. Want to stop this crap? You find out who's employing them and fine *them*, punish *them*, regulate *them.* Going after the migrants won't work unless there's nothing here for them unless done legally. But Trump/MAGA/any Republican really won't do that because it's too fun to punch down on the "illegals."

Punish both sides. At the same time .

All criminals and fraudsters deported immediately. High priority.

Stop citizenship by birth too. A fruit picker doesn’t need to show up with wives, aunts, children.

They don’t.

DP. They can but it's not clear how many do. Temporary agricultural workers on H-2A visas can bring family. "An H-2A worker's spouse and unmarried children under 21 years of age may seek admission in H-4 nonimmigrant classification. Family members are not eligible for employment in the United States while in H-4 status."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

then we need to give those foreign fruit pickers status. we cannot have a permanent underclass who live in the shadows, are both exploited and stealing ametican identities /exploiting american citizens. i used to work in a medical clininc in TP MD and so many people were sharing SS#s and scamming medicaid.

There is already a guest worker program for migrant farmworkers. If farms are using undocumented labor, it is because they don’t want to use existing formal channels. We can all speculate as to why.

So it boils down to employers choosing to hire undocumented workers. Want to stop this crap? You find out who's employing them and fine *them*, punish *them*, regulate *them.* Going after the migrants won't work unless there's nothing here for them unless done legally. But Trump/MAGA/any Republican really won't do that because it's too fun to punch down on the "illegals."

Punish both sides. At the same time .

All criminals and fraudsters deported immediately. High priority.

Stop citizenship by birth too. A fruit picker doesn’t need to show up with wives, aunts, children.

OR legitimize and regulate the employment relationship.

Create a guest worker program designed to cover existing employed undocumented workers who are paying taxes and otherwise following the law. Create a curing period where workers and employers can together obtain guest worker status and valid visas in order to remain in their jobs. Employers who continue to employ undocumented workers after the curing period will be fined to help pay for the costs of deporting those workers. Employers who knowingly employ workers (with or without visas) who are violating tax law or committing other crimes are also fined. Guest workers must submit to monitoring and if they don't remain in good standing with regards to taxes and avoiding criminal activity, they are deported.

Use tax apparatus to encourage the employment behaviors we want and discourage those we don't. Use fines and regulation to punish employers who attempt to avoid the program or use it inappropriately to undercut American workers. Crack down on undocumented independent contractors using cash businesses to avoid both legal immigration and paying taxes. Require such workers to apply for valid business licenses on special visas and then make this info easily available to consumers so that it's easy for people to hire documented workers as independent contractors. Fine people who hire undocumented contractors. Use fines to help fund that system that will process and monitor guest workers and conduct deportations when necessary.

This can be a pragmatic, technical resolution that helps everyone. It can have punitive elements (deportation, fines) for negative behaviors but overall it should operate as a carrot instead of a stick. Immigrants who want access to jobs in the US should only be able to get them through legitimate means.

Throwing everyone out makes no sense when such a large portion of undocumented workers are gainfully employed in jobs for which employers desperately need workers and these workers and employers pay taxes and are not otherwise violating the law. If we legitimize these workers and regulate them that will make it easier for us to go after the immigrants who are NOT otherwise complying with the law and the employers who use undocumented workers simply to undercut American workers and avoid taxes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

then we need to give those foreign fruit pickers status. we cannot have a permanent underclass who live in the shadows, are both exploited and stealing ametican identities /exploiting american citizens. i used to work in a medical clininc in TP MD and so many people were sharing SS#s and scamming medicaid.

There is already a guest worker program for migrant farmworkers. If farms are using undocumented labor, it is because they don’t want to use existing formal channels. We can all speculate as to why.

So it boils down to employers choosing to hire undocumented workers. Want to stop this crap? You find out who's employing them and fine *them*, punish *them*, regulate *them.* Going after the migrants won't work unless there's nothing here for them unless done legally. But Trump/MAGA/any Republican really won't do that because it's too fun to punch down on the "illegals."

Punish both sides. At the same time .

All criminals and fraudsters deported immediately. High priority.

Stop citizenship by birth too. A fruit picker doesn’t need to show up with wives, aunts, children.

OR legitimize and regulate the employment relationship.

Create a guest worker program designed to cover existing employed undocumented workers who are paying taxes and otherwise following the law. Create a curing period where workers and employers can together obtain guest worker status and valid visas in order to remain in their jobs. Employers who continue to employ undocumented workers after the curing period will be fined to help pay for the costs of deporting those workers. Employers who knowingly employ workers (with or without visas) who are violating tax law or committing other crimes are also fined. Guest workers must submit to monitoring and if they don't remain in good standing with regards to taxes and avoiding criminal activity, they are deported.

Use tax apparatus to encourage the employment behaviors we want and discourage those we don't. Use fines and regulation to punish employers who attempt to avoid the program or use it inappropriately to undercut American workers. Crack down on undocumented independent contractors using cash businesses to avoid both legal immigration and paying taxes. Require such workers to apply for valid business licenses on special visas and then make this info easily available to consumers so that it's easy for people to hire documented workers as independent contractors. Fine people who hire undocumented contractors. Use fines to help fund that system that will process and monitor guest workers and conduct deportations when necessary.

This can be a pragmatic, technical resolution that helps everyone. It can have punitive elements (deportation, fines) for negative behaviors but overall it should operate as a carrot instead of a stick. Immigrants who want access to jobs in the US should only be able to get them through legitimate means.

Throwing everyone out makes no sense when such a large portion of undocumented workers are gainfully employed in jobs for which employers desperately need workers and these workers and employers pay taxes and are not otherwise violating the law. If we legitimize these workers and regulate them that will make it easier for us to go after the immigrants who are NOT otherwise complying with the law and the employers who use undocumented workers simply to undercut American workers and avoid taxes.

So basically reward them for breaking the law, incentivize others who are patiently waiting their turn in their home Countries to just cross the border illegally and spit in the faces of those who followed the rules. Why even have laws?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

then we need to give those foreign fruit pickers status. we cannot have a permanent underclass who live in the shadows, are both exploited and stealing ametican identities /exploiting american citizens. i used to work in a medical clininc in TP MD and so many people were sharing SS#s and scamming medicaid.

There is already a guest worker program for migrant farmworkers. If farms are using undocumented labor, it is because they don’t want to use existing formal channels. We can all speculate as to why.

So it boils down to employers choosing to hire undocumented workers. Want to stop this crap? You find out who's employing them and fine *them*, punish *them*, regulate *them.* Going after the migrants won't work unless there's nothing here for them unless done legally. But Trump/MAGA/any Republican really won't do that because it's too fun to punch down on the "illegals."

Punish both sides. At the same time .

All criminals and fraudsters deported immediately. High priority.

Stop citizenship by birth too. A fruit picker doesn’t need to show up with wives, aunts, children.

OR legitimize and regulate the employment relationship.

Create a guest worker program designed to cover existing employed undocumented workers who are paying taxes and otherwise following the law. Create a curing period where workers and employers can together obtain guest worker status and valid visas in order to remain in their jobs. Employers who continue to employ undocumented workers after the curing period will be fined to help pay for the costs of deporting those workers. Employers who knowingly employ workers (with or without visas) who are violating tax law or committing other crimes are also fined. Guest workers must submit to monitoring and if they don't remain in good standing with regards to taxes and avoiding criminal activity, they are deported.

Use tax apparatus to encourage the employment behaviors we want and discourage those we don't. Use fines and regulation to punish employers who attempt to avoid the program or use it inappropriately to undercut American workers. Crack down on undocumented independent contractors using cash businesses to avoid both legal immigration and paying taxes. Require such workers to apply for valid business licenses on special visas and then make this info easily available to consumers so that it's easy for people to hire documented workers as independent contractors. Fine people who hire undocumented contractors. Use fines to help fund that system that will process and monitor guest workers and conduct deportations when necessary.

This can be a pragmatic, technical resolution that helps everyone. It can have punitive elements (deportation, fines) for negative behaviors but overall it should operate as a carrot instead of a stick. Immigrants who want access to jobs in the US should only be able to get them through legitimate means.

Throwing everyone out makes no sense when such a large portion of undocumented workers are gainfully employed in jobs for which employers desperately need workers and these workers and employers pay taxes and are not otherwise violating the law. If we legitimize these workers and regulate them that will make it easier for us to go after the immigrants who are NOT otherwise complying with the law and the employers who use undocumented workers simply to undercut American workers and avoid taxes.

So basically reward them for breaking the law, incentivize others who are patiently waiting their turn in their home Countries to just cross the border illegally and spit in the faces of those who followed the rules. Why even have laws?

Everything PP set out makes absolute sense. You idealogues are focused on punishment and ejection but never present any workable solutions on the process to find and eject 12 million illegal immigrants, deal with the impact of labour shortages, and stop it from happening all over again. If you have a perfect solution, I’m sure we would all love to hear it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This article outlines the Trump Administration plans for mass deportation. While in part relying on a “remain in Mexico” policy, it also requires the construction of an untold number of new detention facilities.

https://apple.news/Azc_QxwuoTymMEiX8wszEtA

First, this is going to take years to construct, and will line government contractors pockets with the overhead. Second, US citizens will be responsible for housing, food and transportation costs during the time period for adjudication. It seems like this set up is aimed to further privatize the deportation process at an enormous expense to American taxpayers.

Why is this more viable than having immigrants work while awaiting adjudication? Increase tracking capabilities and require employers of immigrants to maintain information on them. It will cost a fraction of the money used to construct and maintain these facilities.

The remain in mexico policy is probably the most important peice of the equation.

They are coming BECAUSE of the catch and release policy we have now.
People will stop coming if we change that policy.
I doubt we are going to have mass deportations. I suspect we will have immigration raids on sweatshops like we did in the old days and a bunch of DCUM liberals seem eager to narc out businesses that employ illegal aliens so they can make the business owners feel the pain of a trump presidency. But otherwise I doubt we will see anything beyond a stay in mexico policy, a bit more wall for photo ops and immigration raids circa 1980s. It would be nice if we reformed the immigration system while we were at it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So it's expensive to send people back to their countries but not expensive to use FEMA money to fly them all over the US after coming here illegally? Can someone explain this to me?

If we already have them in custody I suspect we will deport them. but we're not going to go to a ton of effort to "round them up"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

then we need to give those foreign fruit pickers status. we cannot have a permanent underclass who live in the shadows, are both exploited and stealing ametican identities /exploiting american citizens. i used to work in a medical clininc in TP MD and so many people were sharing SS#s and scamming medicaid.

There is already a guest worker program for migrant farmworkers. If farms are using undocumented labor, it is because they don’t want to use existing formal channels. We can all speculate as to why.

So it boils down to employers choosing to hire undocumented workers. Want to stop this crap? You find out who's employing them and fine *them*, punish *them*, regulate *them.* Going after the migrants won't work unless there's nothing here for them unless done legally. But Trump/MAGA/any Republican really won't do that because it's too fun to punch down on the "illegals."

Punish both sides. At the same time .

All criminals and fraudsters deported immediately. High priority.

Stop citizenship by birth too. A fruit picker doesn’t need to show up with wives, aunts, children.

OR legitimize and regulate the employment relationship.

Create a guest worker program designed to cover existing employed undocumented workers who are paying taxes and otherwise following the law. Create a curing period where workers and employers can together obtain guest worker status and valid visas in order to remain in their jobs. Employers who continue to employ undocumented workers after the curing period will be fined to help pay for the costs of deporting those workers. Employers who knowingly employ workers (with or without visas) who are violating tax law or committing other crimes are also fined. Guest workers must submit to monitoring and if they don't remain in good standing with regards to taxes and avoiding criminal activity, they are deported.

Use tax apparatus to encourage the employment behaviors we want and discourage those we don't. Use fines and regulation to punish employers who attempt to avoid the program or use it inappropriately to undercut American workers. Crack down on undocumented independent contractors using cash businesses to avoid both legal immigration and paying taxes. Require such workers to apply for valid business licenses on special visas and then make this info easily available to consumers so that it's easy for people to hire documented workers as independent contractors. Fine people who hire undocumented contractors. Use fines to help fund that system that will process and monitor guest workers and conduct deportations when necessary.

This can be a pragmatic, technical resolution that helps everyone. It can have punitive elements (deportation, fines) for negative behaviors but overall it should operate as a carrot instead of a stick. Immigrants who want access to jobs in the US should only be able to get them through legitimate means.

Throwing everyone out makes no sense when such a large portion of undocumented workers are gainfully employed in jobs for which employers desperately need workers and these workers and employers pay taxes and are not otherwise violating the law. If we legitimize these workers and regulate them that will make it easier for us to go after the immigrants who are NOT otherwise complying with the law and the employers who use undocumented workers simply to undercut American workers and avoid taxes.

So basically reward them for breaking the law, incentivize others who are patiently waiting their turn in their home Countries to just cross the border illegally and spit in the faces of those who followed the rules. Why even have laws?

We've had a guest worker program in the past.

Send them back and let them apply for the guest worker program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So it's expensive to send people back to their countries but not expensive to use FEMA money to fly them all over the US after coming here illegally? Can someone explain this to me?

The liberal argument makes no sense. We spend hundreds of millions of dollars flying migrants across the country, housing them, feeding them. A one-way plane ticket back to their country of origin would be much cheaper than all of the costs we are currently paying for migrants. We shouldn’t have to bear the burden of other countries lack of economic development and poor governance. The migrants are not asylum seekers. They are economic migrants. They don’t qualify for asylum, and we can’t take in every poor person in the world hoping for a better life.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Dems brought them in and now they're complaining it's too expensive to deport them...

They come because Republicans keep hiring them.

Great. Then you agree:
- enforce the borders, turn away illegals
- stop citizenship by birth
- deport illegal alien criminals and fraudsters, and their children/ families
- tax remittances
- bolster worker visa programs
- require e-verify
- fine employers, deport illegals trying to work
- clear phony asylum book, deport all asylum country shoppers (if you traipsed through 1+ other country, you are a fraud)

All of this sounds fine but why tax remittances? Are you assuming any money remitted was earned by illegal immigrants and therefore never taxed?

You tax remittances to decrease the benefit of being in the US. Trump can do it on Day 1 and should. There should be no rewards for illegally entering the US.

Also, we don't need worker visa programs--those get abused.

Not even seasonal agricultural worker visa programs?

Those are slave labor programs. Government sanctioned, so it's fine.

American workers don't want those jobs. Even for $26 an hour. And those jobs supply us with the majority of our vegetables, fruits, nuts along with being the labor for a lot of our meat industry. You can pontificate while you starve.

I'm as liberal as they come but there's a point where the virtue signaling goes beyond basic human survival needs.

then we need to give those foreign fruit pickers status. we cannot have a permanent underclass who live in the shadows, are both exploited and stealing ametican identities /exploiting american citizens. i used to work in a medical clininc in TP MD and so many people were sharing SS#s and scamming medicaid.

There is already a guest worker program for migrant farmworkers. If farms are using undocumented labor, it is because they don’t want to use existing formal channels. We can all speculate as to why.

So it boils down to employers choosing to hire undocumented workers. Want to stop this crap? You find out who's employing them and fine *them*, punish *them*, regulate *them.* Going after the migrants won't work unless there's nothing here for them unless done legally. But Trump/MAGA/any Republican really won't do that because it's too fun to punch down on the "illegals."

Punish both sides. At the same time .

All criminals and fraudsters deported immediately. High priority.

Stop citizenship by birth too. A fruit picker doesn’t need to show up with wives, aunts, children.

OR legitimize and regulate the employment relationship.

Create a guest worker program designed to cover existing employed undocumented workers who are paying taxes and otherwise following the law. Create a curing period where workers and employers can together obtain guest worker status and valid visas in order to remain in their jobs. Employers who continue to employ undocumented workers after the curing period will be fined to help pay for the costs of deporting those workers. Employers who knowingly employ workers (with or without visas) who are violating tax law or committing other crimes are also fined. Guest workers must submit to monitoring and if they don't remain in good standing with regards to taxes and avoiding criminal activity, they are deported.

Use tax apparatus to encourage the employment behaviors we want and discourage those we don't. Use fines and regulation to punish employers who attempt to avoid the program or use it inappropriately to undercut American workers. Crack down on undocumented independent contractors using cash businesses to avoid both legal immigration and paying taxes. Require such workers to apply for valid business licenses on special visas and then make this info easily available to consumers so that it's easy for people to hire documented workers as independent contractors. Fine people who hire undocumented contractors. Use fines to help fund that system that will process and monitor guest workers and conduct deportations when necessary.

This can be a pragmatic, technical resolution that helps everyone. It can have punitive elements (deportation, fines) for negative behaviors but overall it should operate as a carrot instead of a stick. Immigrants who want access to jobs in the US should only be able to get them through legitimate means.

Throwing everyone out makes no sense when such a large portion of undocumented workers are gainfully employed in jobs for which employers desperately need workers and these workers and employers pay taxes and are not otherwise violating the law. If we legitimize these workers and regulate them that will make it easier for us to go after the immigrants who are NOT otherwise complying with the law and the employers who use undocumented workers simply to undercut American workers and avoid taxes.

So basically reward them for breaking the law, incentivize others who are patiently waiting their turn in their home Countries to just cross the border illegally and spit in the faces of those who followed the rules. Why even have laws?

Everything PP set out makes absolute sense. You idealogues are focused on punishment and ejection but never present any workable solutions on the process to find and eject 12 million illegal immigrants, deal with the impact of labour shortages, and stop it from happening all over again. If you have a perfect solution, I’m sure we would all love to hear it.

12 million people will not be deported overnight. The country will adjust as they are deported over time. Granting amnesty is not a workable solution because you will incentivize people to rush the border and wait for the next amnesty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This article outlines the Trump Administration plans for mass deportation. While in part relying on a “remain in Mexico” policy, it also requires the construction of an untold number of new detention facilities.

https://apple.news/Azc_QxwuoTymMEiX8wszEtA

First, this is going to take years to construct, and will line government contractors pockets with the overhead. Second, US citizens will be responsible for housing, food and transportation costs during the time period for adjudication. It seems like this set up is aimed to further privatize the deportation process at an enormous expense to American taxpayers.

Why is this more viable than having immigrants work while awaiting adjudication? Increase tracking capabilities and require employers of immigrants to maintain information on them. It will cost a fraction of the money used to construct and maintain these facilities.

The remain in mexico policy is probably the most important peice of the equation.

They are coming BECAUSE of the catch and release policy we have now.
People will stop coming if we change that policy.
I doubt we are going to have mass deportations. I suspect we will have immigration raids on sweatshops like we did in the old days and a bunch of DCUM liberals seem eager to narc out businesses that employ illegal aliens so they can make the business owners feel the pain of a trump presidency. But otherwise I doubt we will see anything beyond a stay in mexico policy, a bit more wall for photo ops and immigration raids circa 1980s. It would be nice if we reformed the immigration system while we were at it.

I'm pretty sure it's the MAGA that are going to NARC out businesses.

Liberals are too soft to want to hurt the poor illegal immigrants.