New Year Eve's Coordinated Sexual Assault Attacks in Cologne

[Anonymous]

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/09/europe/germany-new-year-violence/index.html

Thank you. This is astonishing.

The pervasiveness is pretty horrifying - and something that has not really be discussed in connection to the Koln incident. And I have to say that I am as disgusted here by the apologists for the rapes/assaults as by those who would use the events to entirely shut down asylum and refugee rights. (Classes, really? Have you ever taken a look at the stats on classes/therapy mandated for domestic violence? And those are often extensive and court-ordered.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/09/europe/germany-new-year-violence/index.html

Thank you. This is astonishing.

The pervasiveness is pretty horrifying - and something that has not really be discussed in connection to the Koln incident. And I have to say that I am as disgusted here by the apologists for the rapes/assaults as by those who would use the events to entirely shut down asylum and refugee rights. (Classes, really? Have you ever taken a look at the stats on classes/therapy mandated for domestic violence? And those are often extensive and court-ordered.)

Who are the "rape apologists" on this thread?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The German Police are now using water cannons on its own citizens who are protesting the massive attacks on German women.

http://www.dw.com/en/german-police-fire-water-cannons-to-disperse-protesters-amid-clashes-in-cologne/a-18969142

German police fire water cannons to disperse protesters amid clashes in Cologne

Police in the western German city of Cologne have broken up a protest by the "anti-Islamization" group PEGIDA. Water cannons were used to disperse demonstrators protesting after the New Year's Eve attacks on women.

PEGIDA - Patriotic Europeans Against the Islamisation of the Occident

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"The main point that I've been trying to make since joining this discussion is that there is no disagreement with regard to the crimes and violence committed in Cologne. On the topic of sexual assault, I doubt that my personal views are very different than any of the most fierce women's advocates here. If you want to focus on stoping sexual assaults, I am completely with you. Where I disagree with some here is when this issue is used to oppose refugees or to attack Muslims or Arabs. "

+1000
This is the only relevant point I can find in this 37 page arguing simply for the sake of arguing or vilifying all Arabs or Islam mess.

Exactly how do you expect to stop the attacks if you don't stop the attackers?

Why import the attackers in the first place?

Wtf? Are you a man? Or something? Do you know that there are homegrown rapists right here and in Germany, too? What is this obsession with refugees as if they're the first men to commit rape? Find the attackers. Punish appropriately. Hell, hold classes in appropriate behavior by men - frankly, there are huge numbers of native born men who could use them.

Don't mix in our local men with these animals. Europe had never had a massive attsck like that till those animals came in.

Aaaaand here are the Republican feelings about sexual assault in a nutshell. It's only bad if a) minorities do it and b) do it in large numbers, otherwise the sluts be making it up!

And to your second point: pretty sure rape was used as a tool of war in WWII. Is that massive enough for you?

Do you realize how hysterical you sound. For one, I think all rape is terrible and bad. What horrified me about this event was that this was a mass organized attack in a public place. Whatever color the men were, it would have been horrific and I would have condemned it. In this case it was Arab and North African looking men. I meant that in post WWII Europe, it has generally been safe for women to walk in public areas, this has now changed since the massive migration. Your attacks on my political leanings don't faze me, I'm not even Democrat or Republican, I'm not even from the US. I am proud to say the majority of men in places in Europe, US and other civilized places of the world have treated me with respect and kindness. When I have faced danger its been in Morocco, Egypt, and with migrant men in Europe.

I don't sound hysterical. Rape and sexual assault are awful, whether it occurs one by one in private or en masse in public. Your categorization that "our local men" aren't like "these animals" is completely misguided and wrong headed. And you can't move the goalposts: you said Europe had never had a massive attack, but it did and that was 70 years ago, not 700.

Nice touch with the old fashioned sexist "hysterical," by the way. Curious where you're from to know if you understand the connotations of using that word.

[Anonymous]

But they couldn't use water cannons and tesr gas on the 1000s of men sexually assaulting women, including a police officer?

There are some messed up priorities right now in Germany.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But they couldn't use water cannons and tesr gas on the 1000s of men sexually assaulting women, including a police officer?

There are some messed up priorities right now in Germany.

They just fired the police chief of Cologne for the poor handling of NYE. Other cities were more prepared and didn't get out of control the way Cologne did. It isn't accurate to compare the handling of a protest that is known about ahead of time to a mob situation that was a surprise to everyone in Cologne, and draw conclusions about priorities.

[Anonymous]

I think a strong message needs to be sent. I am still strongly in favor of accepting refugees but they need to know that they need to follow the law and respect the people of their host country. That means being grateful, becoming a productive, positive member of the community, not being abusive, not harassing, threatening, intimidating, groping, proselytizing, et cetera - and that even the slightest infarction will get you put on the next transport out with your right of entry revoked for some defined period of time, no ifs ands or buts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"The main point that I've been trying to make since joining this discussion is that there is no disagreement with regard to the crimes and violence committed in Cologne. On the topic of sexual assault, I doubt that my personal views are very different than any of the most fierce women's advocates here. If you want to focus on stoping sexual assaults, I am completely with you. Where I disagree with some here is when this issue is used to oppose refugees or to attack Muslims or Arabs. "

+1000
This is the only relevant point I can find in this 37 page arguing simply for the sake of arguing or vilifying all Arabs or Islam mess.

Exactly how do you expect to stop the attacks if you don't stop the attackers?

Why import the attackers in the first place?

Wtf? Are you a man? Or something? Do you know that there are homegrown rapists right here and in Germany, too? What is this obsession with refugees as if they're the first men to commit rape? Find the attackers. Punish appropriately. Hell, hold classes in appropriate behavior by men - frankly, there are huge numbers of native born men who could use them.

Don't mix in our local men with these animals. Europe had never had a massive attsck like that till those animals came in.

Aaaaand here are the Republican feelings about sexual assault in a nutshell. It's only bad if a) minorities do it and b) do it in large numbers, otherwise the sluts be making it up!

And to your second point: pretty sure rape was used as a tool of war in WWII. Is that massive enough for you?

Do you realize how hysterical you sound. For one, I think all rape is terrible and bad. What horrified me about this event was that this was a mass organized attack in a public place. Whatever color the men were, it would have been horrific and I would have condemned it. In this case it was Arab and North African looking men. I meant that in post WWII Europe, it has generally been safe for women to walk in public areas, this has now changed since the massive migration. Your attacks on my political leanings don't faze me, I'm not even Democrat or Republican, I'm not even from the US. I am proud to say the majority of men in places in Europe, US and other civilized places of the world have treated me with respect and kindness. When I have faced danger its been in Morocco, Egypt, and with migrant men in Europe.

I don't sound hysterical. Rape and sexual assault are awful, whether it occurs one by one in private or en masse in public. Your categorization that "our local men" aren't like "these animals" is completely misguided and wrong headed. And you can't move the goalposts: you said Europe had never had a massive attack, but it did and that was 70 years ago, not 700.

Nice touch with the old fashioned sexist "hysterical," by the way. Curious where you're from to know if you understand the connotations of using that word.

You and I weren't alive 70 years ago. European and western men now weren't alive 70 years ago. You and I lived in an age where you can walk down a street and not be mobbed by groups of rapists. This is now no longer. If you care so much about women rights and the erosion of them instead of policing my language focus on the big picture and realize this is a massive intrusion into that rights. Instead of attacking the posters concerned about that and babbli go on about untested rape kits and abortion rights ( which even women disagree on), understand an event of this sort is an attack on fundamental liberties of women regardless of their political leanings. Try to put aside your biases and look at it objectively. these mobs of men don't care whether a woman is left or conservative. And I have never faced an onslaught like this from western men until those animals came in. So yes, animals and here is a difference

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think a strong message needs to be sent. I am still strongly in favor of accepting refugees but they need to know that they need to follow the law and respect the people of their host country. That means being grateful, becoming a productive, positive member of the community, not being abusive, not harassing, threatening, intimidating, groping, proselytizing, et cetera - and that even the slightest infarction will get you put on the next transport out with your right of entry revoked for some defined period of time, no ifs ands or buts.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/09/europe/germany-new-year-violence/index.html

Thank you. This is astonishing.

The pervasiveness is pretty horrifying - and something that has not really be discussed in connection to the Koln incident. And I have to say that I am as disgusted here by the apologists for the rapes/assaults as by those who would use the events to entirely shut down asylum and refugee rights. (Classes, really? Have you ever taken a look at the stats on classes/therapy mandated for domestic violence? And those are often extensive and court-ordered.)

Who are the "rape apologists" on this thread?

The rape apologists on the thread are the ones who have not been whole heartedly condemning the assaults, referring to the sexual assaults as "groping" instead of what it is, sexual assault and violence to try to "lighten"'the impact of what happened. Making excuses for the men because they did not know better due to their culture or because they were oppressed. Referring to their behavior as just "unwanted behaviors." Instead of condemning their horrific behavior suggesting that these ingrained attitudes can be changed due to one or two quick fix solutions. Prattling on and on about how he rapists are victims in their own countries, instead of the real victims, the women that were brutalized. Suggesting the women victims could have avoided assault by modifying their behaviors instead of condemning the monsters actions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/09/europe/germany-new-year-violence/index.html

Thank you. This is astonishing.

The pervasiveness is pretty horrifying - and something that has not really be discussed in connection to the Koln incident. And I have to say that I am as disgusted here by the apologists for the rapes/assaults as by those who would use the events to entirely shut down asylum and refugee rights. (Classes, really? Have you ever taken a look at the stats on classes/therapy mandated for domestic violence? And those are often extensive and court-ordered.)

Who are the "rape apologists" on this thread?

There are those who are taking the "refugee route" by discouraging stereotyping and suggesting that we retrain these men by "Westernizing" them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But they couldn't use water cannons and tesr gas on the 1000s of men sexually assaulting women, including a police officer?

There are some messed up priorities right now in Germany.

They just fired the police chief of Cologne for the poor handling of NYE. Other cities were more prepared and didn't get out of control the way Cologne did. It isn't accurate to compare the handling of a protest that is known about ahead of time to a mob situation that was a surprise to everyone in Cologne, and draw conclusions about priorities.

At the point that their own policewoman was sexually assaulted by this group of animals, they should have called in massive support. To passively sit back and let is happen was an enormous failure for Germany. Then to turn around and use massive force on those simply protesting this horrid assault on women is simply abhorant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But they couldn't use water cannons and tesr gas on the 1000s of men sexually assaulting women, including a police officer?

There are some messed up priorities right now in Germany.

They just fired the police chief of Cologne for the poor handling of NYE. Other cities were more prepared and didn't get out of control the way Cologne did. It isn't accurate to compare the handling of a protest that is known about ahead of time to a mob situation that was a surprise to everyone in Cologne, and draw conclusions about priorities.

At the point that their own policewoman was sexually assaulted by this group of animals, they should have called in massive support. To passively sit back and let is happen was an enormous failure for Germany. Then to turn around and use massive force on those simply protesting this horrid assault on women is simply abhorant.

I read about the water canons. From what I understand at that point the state police were called in for the demonstrations And they don't f around. Only the cologne police were present during NYE and they were woefully unprepared

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:But they couldn't use water cannons and tesr gas on the 1000s of men sexually assaulting women, including a police officer?

There are some messed up priorities right now in Germany.

They just fired the police chief of Cologne for the poor handling of NYE. Other cities were more prepared and didn't get out of control the way Cologne did. It isn't accurate to compare the handling of a protest that is known about ahead of time to a mob situation that was a surprise to everyone in Cologne, and draw conclusions about priorities.

At the point that their own policewoman was sexually assaulted by this group of animals, they should have called in massive support. To passively sit back and let is happen was an enormous failure for Germany. Then to turn around and use massive force on those simply protesting this horrid assault on women is simply abhorant.

I read about the water canons. From what I understand at that point the state police were called in for the demonstrations And they don't f around. Only the cologne police were present during NYE and they were woefully unprepared

Then the instant they realized it was a massive rape and assault situation they should have called in the state police. They had no tear gas to disperse the NY eve crowd? Really? Yet they tear gas and water cannon those protesting the assault?

Tear gas and water cannons for those citizens using words and signs but passive observation for 1000s of men ripping clothes off women, raping them in the street and sexually assaulting them?

Something very, very wrong is happening in Germany right now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think a strong message needs to be sent. I am still strongly in favor of accepting refugees but they need to know that they need to follow the law and respect the people of their host country. That means being grateful, becoming a productive, positive member of the community, not being abusive, not harassing, threatening, intimidating, groping, proselytizing, et cetera - and that even the slightest infarction will get you put on the next transport out with your right of entry revoked for some defined period of time, no ifs ands or buts.

+1

Kind of like this one France sent in 2012
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/oct/11/gang-rape-trial-france