to sexless marriage guy who says affairs save the marriage...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think people cheating really care that much if they get a divorce. They are cheating..

Maybe they don't want to divorce because it is expensive and inconvenient, but it isn't as if they will be heartbroken.

OP, sorry you were cheated on. But move on

That's actually another misconception of cheaters. Often they still want the emotional connection with their spouse and they *are* heartbroken when they divorce. Especially if they regret cheating once they are caught or when it sinks in that they really are getting a divorce.

But it is true that they don't value their marriage as much as somebody who chooses not to cheat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's really odd to me when people say the partner who wants sex less frequently or no sex at all is "withholding" sex. This connotes some kind of intent that probably just isn't there.

I know that when I had a period of wanting sex less, I didn't really change. I always had sex when I felt like it (unless my partner didn't, of course), and I just happened to not want sex. I don't know the reason, but it wasn't a conscious decision at all.

I think it's really rare that you can legitimately assign blame to one partner for libido mismatches. People have lower libidos when they're stressed, when their partners stop praising their bodies (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, sometimes you just aren't as wowed by your partner's body as you used to be), when hormones change, etc. And pestering somebody for sex...well, that's not exactly an aphrodisiac. I just typically see a place for blame when somebody doesn't desire sex; it's just an unfortunate confluence of circumstances that takes a lot of work on behalf of both partners to overcome.

Cheating, on the other hand, seems pretty intentional, and doesn't seem like a proportionate reaction to a low libido. Personally I think open marriages and divorces are better options because people deserve honesty, as difficult as that may be.

Sorry, I mean I *don't* usually see a place for blame when somebody doesn't desire sex.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think people cheating really care that much if they get a divorce. They are cheating..

Maybe they don't want to divorce because it is expensive and inconvenient, but it isn't as if they will be heartbroken.

OP, sorry you were cheated on. But move on

That's actually another misconception of cheaters. Often they still want the emotional connection with their spouse and they *are* heartbroken when they divorce. Especially if they regret cheating once they are caught or when it sinks in that they really are getting a divorce.

But it is true that they don't value their marriage as much as somebody who chooses not to cheat.

OP still needs to move on. She isn't making anyone here feel guilty

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think people cheating really care that much if they get a divorce. They are cheating..

Maybe they don't want to divorce because it is expensive and inconvenient, but it isn't as if they will be heartbroken.

OP, sorry you were cheated on. But move on

That's actually another misconception of cheaters. Often they still want the emotional connection with their spouse and they *are* heartbroken when they divorce. Especially if they regret cheating once they are caught or when it sinks in that they really are getting a divorce.

But it is true that they don't value their marriage as much as somebody who chooses not to cheat.

OP still needs to move on. She isn't making anyone here feel guilty

True. These type of people can only blame others. They don’t have self-awareness and always point fingers to justify their deceit. It’s akin to talking to a wall. Life and karma will take care of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The open marriage guy is annoying and brash but he isn't wrong to the extent that sexless marriages have an expiration date. It's not that an affair saves a marriage but it makes it possible for the marriage to continue and potentially continue in relative peace rather than stewing in resentment.

Sure, the affair can be discovered and the marriage could blow up but no sexless marriage will ever survive long term. An affair gives the marriage a chance.

Also, I don't get why people get so invested in debating him. Who on earth sees a cheating spouse as a the bad person if they were the one cut off from sex and intimacy?

What gives the marriage a chance is honesty and not being a coward by directly facing the problems with your spouse and recognizing your own shortcomings and contribution to the problem. The behavior of the cheater in the marriage is a lot of the reason a bedroom grows cold. Years of emotional abuse, anger, hyper-criticism, lack of respect, yelling will cause a person to wall themselves off.

The problem with the falsehoods spread by sexless marriage guy is what stigmatizes a betrayed spouse. He/she must have done something wrong. They must not have given him/her enough sex, enough love, enough validation, etc. As is well-known and documented, 63% of cheating males are happy in their marriages and still cheat. They ARE having sex at home. The reasons somebody cheats are what is going on inside of them. They tell themselves lies. They have internal trauma. They are afraid of getting old. They are entitled. They are depressed. They have unaddressed childhood trauma. They didn’t achieve in life what they thought they would. They are narcissistic or any one or a combination of these things.

If you are in an unhappy sexless marriage you make the false assumption that that is everyone else’s reasons too. You are myopic. It’s not. That’s far from the truth. If you had the selflessness and the self awareness to realistically look at your own behavior and actions, you would see what others see. You can’t and your spouse is better off of you did leave.

So not only do betrayed spouses face the trauma of being lied to, deceived, have their health put at risk, they are also stigmatized and looked at as a person that had to have done something wrong or not been good enough.

The prior PP gets it. The immediate PP is clueless.

My message has always been to DECLARE THE MARRIAGE OPEN. That's a 12 second conversation. There is zero dishonesty in saving your sexless marriage in this way.

Please take all of your off topic "they still get sex at home" rants to a different thread about cheating. This is NOT a cheating thread! This is a sexless marriage thread. Likewise, any statistic about "happy in the marriage" is irrelevant. The only thing that is relevant is whether or not there is a normal active sex life. THAT is what makes a marriage sexless. This is a thread about how to save a sexless marriage. Stop trying to obfuscate this thread with alternate statistics or exceptionally rare scenarios (for example: man has plenty of sex at home yet still he cheats). Start a new thread if you want to have that discussion.

[Anonymous]

OP this is nothing new, I'm sure most know it.

When I was cheated on he was immediately dead to me. It certainly didn't save anything, lol. All I can add, a outsider isn't worth losing your spouse, kids, and finances over. Years ago I worked in family court, I can't tell you how many men cried foul at all the consequences of their cheating. Women too, but mostly men who didn't want to accept the domino effect. I'm sure when they were cheating though it was a different story, lol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The open marriage guy is annoying and brash but he isn't wrong to the extent that sexless marriages have an expiration date. It's not that an affair saves a marriage but it makes it possible for the marriage to continue and potentially continue in relative peace rather than stewing in resentment.

Sure, the affair can be discovered and the marriage could blow up but no sexless marriage will ever survive long term. An affair gives the marriage a chance.

Also, I don't get why people get so invested in debating him. Who on earth sees a cheating spouse as a the bad person if they were the one cut off from sex and intimacy?

What gives the marriage a chance is honesty and not being a coward by directly facing the problems with your spouse and recognizing your own shortcomings and contribution to the problem. The behavior of the cheater in the marriage is a lot of the reason a bedroom grows cold. Years of emotional abuse, anger, hyper-criticism, lack of respect, yelling will cause a person to wall themselves off.

The problem with the falsehoods spread by sexless marriage guy is what stigmatizes a betrayed spouse. He/she must have done something wrong. They must not have given him/her enough sex, enough love, enough validation, etc. As is well-known and documented, 63% of cheating males are happy in their marriages and still cheat. They ARE having sex at home. The reasons somebody cheats are what is going on inside of them. They tell themselves lies. They have internal trauma. They are afraid of getting old. They are entitled. They are depressed. They have unaddressed childhood trauma. They didn’t achieve in life what they thought they would. They are narcissistic or any one or a combination of these things.

If you are in an unhappy sexless marriage you make the false assumption that that is everyone else’s reasons too. You are myopic. It’s not. That’s far from the truth. If you had the selflessness and the self awareness to realistically look at your own behavior and actions, you would see what others see. You can’t and your spouse is better off of you did leave.

So not only do betrayed spouses face the trauma of being lied to, deceived, have their health put at risk, they are also stigmatized and looked at as a person that had to have done something wrong or not been good enough.

The prior PP gets it. The immediate PP is clueless.

My message has always been to DECLARE THE MARRIAGE OPEN. That's a 12 second conversation. There is zero dishonesty in saving your sexless marriage in this way.

Please take all of your off topic "they still get sex at home" rants to a different thread about cheating. This is NOT a cheating thread! This is a sexless marriage thread. Likewise, any statistic about "happy in the marriage" is irrelevant. The only thing that is relevant is whether or not there is a normal active sex life. THAT is what makes a marriage sexless. This is a thread about how to save a sexless marriage. Stop trying to obfuscate this thread with alternate statistics or exceptionally rare scenarios (for example: man has plenty of sex at home yet still he cheats). Start a new thread if you want to have that discussion.

If you weren’t blindly following your own narrative like our current President, you would see what the immediate pp said in the first paragraph. It mirrors the “discussing options and intentions in an honest manner” e.g.., have balls, face the issue directly and don’t do something behind someone’s back. That’s a weak p@ssy way out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP this is nothing new, I'm sure most know it.

When I was cheated on he was immediately dead to me. It certainly didn't save anything, lol. All I can add, a outsider isn't worth losing your spouse, kids, and finances over. Years ago I worked in family court, I can't tell you how many men cried foul at all the consequences of their cheating. Women too, but mostly men who didn't want to accept the domino effect. I'm sure when they were cheating though it was a different story, lol.

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP this is nothing new, I'm sure most know it.

When I was cheated on he was immediately dead to me. It certainly didn't save anything, lol. All I can add, a outsider isn't worth losing your spouse, kids, and finances over. Years ago I worked in family court, I can't tell you how many men cried foul at all the consequences of their cheating. Women too, but mostly men who didn't want to accept the domino effect. I'm sure when they were cheating though it was a different story, lol.

But you skipped a crucial detail. What was your marital sex life BEFORE he cheated? If you had lost interest such that his sexual needs were no longer being met, then your marriage was already on the fast track to divorce BEFORE he cheated. So his cheating in fact DID save your low sex marriage.

Whatever happened in family courts is not a consequence of cheating, it's a consequence of the sexless marriage which preceded the cheating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The open marriage guy is annoying and brash but he isn't wrong to the extent that sexless marriages have an expiration date. It's not that an affair saves a marriage but it makes it possible for the marriage to continue and potentially continue in relative peace rather than stewing in resentment.

Sure, the affair can be discovered and the marriage could blow up but no sexless marriage will ever survive long term. An affair gives the marriage a chance.

Also, I don't get why people get so invested in debating him. Who on earth sees a cheating spouse as a the bad person if they were the one cut off from sex and intimacy?

What gives the marriage a chance is honesty and not being a coward by directly facing the problems with your spouse and recognizing your own shortcomings and contribution to the problem. The behavior of the cheater in the marriage is a lot of the reason a bedroom grows cold. Years of emotional abuse, anger, hyper-criticism, lack of respect, yelling will cause a person to wall themselves off.

The problem with the falsehoods spread by sexless marriage guy is what stigmatizes a betrayed spouse. He/she must have done something wrong. They must not have given him/her enough sex, enough love, enough validation, etc. As is well-known and documented, 63% of cheating males are happy in their marriages and still cheat. They ARE having sex at home. The reasons somebody cheats are what is going on inside of them. They tell themselves lies. They have internal trauma. They are afraid of getting old. They are entitled. They are depressed. They have unaddressed childhood trauma. They didn’t achieve in life what they thought they would. They are narcissistic or any one or a combination of these things.

If you are in an unhappy sexless marriage you make the false assumption that that is everyone else’s reasons too. You are myopic. It’s not. That’s far from the truth. If you had the selflessness and the self awareness to realistically look at your own behavior and actions, you would see what others see. You can’t and your spouse is better off of you did leave.

So not only do betrayed spouses face the trauma of being lied to, deceived, have their health put at risk, they are also stigmatized and looked at as a person that had to have done something wrong or not been good enough.

The prior PP gets it. The immediate PP is clueless.

My message has always been to DECLARE THE MARRIAGE OPEN. That's a 12 second conversation. There is zero dishonesty in saving your sexless marriage in this way.

Please take all of your off topic "they still get sex at home" rants to a different thread about cheating. This is NOT a cheating thread! This is a sexless marriage thread. Likewise, any statistic about "happy in the marriage" is irrelevant. The only thing that is relevant is whether or not there is a normal active sex life. THAT is what makes a marriage sexless. This is a thread about how to save a sexless marriage. Stop trying to obfuscate this thread with alternate statistics or exceptionally rare scenarios (for example: man has plenty of sex at home yet still he cheats). Start a new thread if you want to have that discussion.

If you weren’t blindly following your own narrative like our current President, you would see what the immediate pp said in the first paragraph. It mirrors the “discussing options and intentions in an honest manner” e.g.., have balls, face the issue directly and don’t do something behind someone’s back. That’s a weak p@ssy way out.

Huh? What could be a more direct/honest/ballsy/direct-facing/non-weak-pussy than DECLARING YOUR MARRIAGE OPEN ??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The open marriage guy is annoying and brash but he isn't wrong to the extent that sexless marriages have an expiration date. It's not that an affair saves a marriage but it makes it possible for the marriage to continue and potentially continue in relative peace rather than stewing in resentment.

Sure, the affair can be discovered and the marriage could blow up but no sexless marriage will ever survive long term. An affair gives the marriage a chance.

Also, I don't get why people get so invested in debating him. Who on earth sees a cheating spouse as a the bad person if they were the one cut off from sex and intimacy?

What gives the marriage a chance is honesty and not being a coward by directly facing the problems with your spouse and recognizing your own shortcomings and contribution to the problem. The behavior of the cheater in the marriage is a lot of the reason a bedroom grows cold. Years of emotional abuse, anger, hyper-criticism, lack of respect, yelling will cause a person to wall themselves off.

The problem with the falsehoods spread by sexless marriage guy is what stigmatizes a betrayed spouse. He/she must have done something wrong. They must not have given him/her enough sex, enough love, enough validation, etc. As is well-known and documented, 63% of cheating males are happy in their marriages and still cheat. They ARE having sex at home. The reasons somebody cheats are what is going on inside of them. They tell themselves lies. They have internal trauma. They are afraid of getting old. They are entitled. They are depressed. They have unaddressed childhood trauma. They didn’t achieve in life what they thought they would. They are narcissistic or any one or a combination of these things.

If you are in an unhappy sexless marriage you make the false assumption that that is everyone else’s reasons too. You are myopic. It’s not. That’s far from the truth. If you had the selflessness and the self awareness to realistically look at your own behavior and actions, you would see what others see. You can’t and your spouse is better off of you did leave.

So not only do betrayed spouses face the trauma of being lied to, deceived, have their health put at risk, they are also stigmatized and looked at as a person that had to have done something wrong or not been good enough.

The prior PP gets it. The immediate PP is clueless.

My message has always been to DECLARE THE MARRIAGE OPEN. That's a 12 second conversation. There is zero dishonesty in saving your sexless marriage in this way.

Please take all of your off topic "they still get sex at home" rants to a different thread about cheating. This is NOT a cheating thread! This is a sexless marriage thread. Likewise, any statistic about "happy in the marriage" is irrelevant. The only thing that is relevant is whether or not there is a normal active sex life. THAT is what makes a marriage sexless. This is a thread about how to save a sexless marriage. Stop trying to obfuscate this thread with alternate statistics or exceptionally rare scenarios (for example: man has plenty of sex at home yet still he cheats). Start a new thread if you want to have that discussion.

If you weren’t blindly following your own narrative like our current President, you would see what the immediate pp said in the first paragraph. It mirrors the “discussing options and intentions in an honest manner” e.g.., have balls, face the issue directly and don’t do something behind someone’s back. That’s a weak p@ssy way out.

Huh? What could be a more direct/honest/ballsy/direct-facing/non-weak-pussy than DECLARING YOUR MARRIAGE OPEN ??

Working on your marriage in a vulnerable manner. BOOM

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The open marriage guy is annoying and brash but he isn't wrong to the extent that sexless marriages have an expiration date. It's not that an affair saves a marriage but it makes it possible for the marriage to continue and potentially continue in relative peace rather than stewing in resentment.

Sure, the affair can be discovered and the marriage could blow up but no sexless marriage will ever survive long term. An affair gives the marriage a chance.

Also, I don't get why people get so invested in debating him. Who on earth sees a cheating spouse as a the bad person if they were the one cut off from sex and intimacy?

What gives the marriage a chance is honesty and not being a coward by directly facing the problems with your spouse and recognizing your own shortcomings and contribution to the problem. The behavior of the cheater in the marriage is a lot of the reason a bedroom grows cold. Years of emotional abuse, anger, hyper-criticism, lack of respect, yelling will cause a person to wall themselves off.

The problem with the falsehoods spread by sexless marriage guy is what stigmatizes a betrayed spouse. He/she must have done something wrong. They must not have given him/her enough sex, enough love, enough validation, etc. As is well-known and documented, 63% of cheating males are happy in their marriages and still cheat. They ARE having sex at home. The reasons somebody cheats are what is going on inside of them. They tell themselves lies. They have internal trauma. They are afraid of getting old. They are entitled. They are depressed. They have unaddressed childhood trauma. They didn’t achieve in life what they thought they would. They are narcissistic or any one or a combination of these things.

If you are in an unhappy sexless marriage you make the false assumption that that is everyone else’s reasons too. You are myopic. It’s not. That’s far from the truth. If you had the selflessness and the self awareness to realistically look at your own behavior and actions, you would see what others see. You can’t and your spouse is better off of you did leave.

So not only do betrayed spouses face the trauma of being lied to, deceived, have their health put at risk, they are also stigmatized and looked at as a person that had to have done something wrong or not been good enough.

The prior PP gets it. The immediate PP is clueless.

My message has always been to DECLARE THE MARRIAGE OPEN. That's a 12 second conversation. There is zero dishonesty in saving your sexless marriage in this way.

Please take all of your off topic "they still get sex at home" rants to a different thread about cheating. This is NOT a cheating thread! This is a sexless marriage thread. Likewise, any statistic about "happy in the marriage" is irrelevant. The only thing that is relevant is whether or not there is a normal active sex life. THAT is what makes a marriage sexless. This is a thread about how to save a sexless marriage. Stop trying to obfuscate this thread with alternate statistics or exceptionally rare scenarios (for example: man has plenty of sex at home yet still he cheats). Start a new thread if you want to have that discussion.

If you weren’t blindly following your own narrative like our current President, you would see what the immediate pp said in the first paragraph. It mirrors the “discussing options and intentions in an honest manner” e.g.., have balls, face the issue directly and don’t do something behind someone’s back. That’s a weak p@ssy way out.

Huh? What could be a more direct/honest/ballsy/direct-facing/non-weak-pussy than DECLARING YOUR MARRIAGE OPEN ??

Working on your marriage in a vulnerable manner. BOOM

What if you tried to work on the marriage for years, but the sexless with-holding spouse is simply uninterested?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP this is nothing new, I'm sure most know it.

When I was cheated on he was immediately dead to me. It certainly didn't save anything, lol. All I can add, a outsider isn't worth losing your spouse, kids, and finances over. Years ago I worked in family court, I can't tell you how many men cried foul at all the consequences of their cheating. Women too, but mostly men who didn't want to accept the domino effect. I'm sure when they were cheating though it was a different story, lol.

But you skipped a crucial detail. What was your marital sex life BEFORE he cheated? If you had lost interest such that his sexual needs were no longer being met, then your marriage was already on the fast track to divorce BEFORE he cheated. So his cheating in fact DID save your low sex marriage.

Whatever happened in family courts is not a consequence of cheating, it's a consequence of the sexless marriage which preceded the cheating.

See there you go, President. You ASSUME once again, it had to be the result of a sexless marriage. We had sex multiple times per week.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The open marriage guy is annoying and brash but he isn't wrong to the extent that sexless marriages have an expiration date. It's not that an affair saves a marriage but it makes it possible for the marriage to continue and potentially continue in relative peace rather than stewing in resentment.

Sure, the affair can be discovered and the marriage could blow up but no sexless marriage will ever survive long term. An affair gives the marriage a chance.

Also, I don't get why people get so invested in debating him. Who on earth sees a cheating spouse as a the bad person if they were the one cut off from sex and intimacy?

What gives the marriage a chance is honesty and not being a coward by directly facing the problems with your spouse and recognizing your own shortcomings and contribution to the problem. The behavior of the cheater in the marriage is a lot of the reason a bedroom grows cold. Years of emotional abuse, anger, hyper-criticism, lack of respect, yelling will cause a person to wall themselves off.

The problem with the falsehoods spread by sexless marriage guy is what stigmatizes a betrayed spouse. He/she must have done something wrong. They must not have given him/her enough sex, enough love, enough validation, etc. As is well-known and documented, 63% of cheating males are happy in their marriages and still cheat. They ARE having sex at home. The reasons somebody cheats are what is going on inside of them. They tell themselves lies. They have internal trauma. They are afraid of getting old. They are entitled. They are depressed. They have unaddressed childhood trauma. They didn’t achieve in life what they thought they would. They are narcissistic or any one or a combination of these things.

If you are in an unhappy sexless marriage you make the false assumption that that is everyone else’s reasons too. You are myopic. It’s not. That’s far from the truth. If you had the selflessness and the self awareness to realistically look at your own behavior and actions, you would see what others see. You can’t and your spouse is better off of you did leave.

So not only do betrayed spouses face the trauma of being lied to, deceived, have their health put at risk, they are also stigmatized and looked at as a person that had to have done something wrong or not been good enough.

The prior PP gets it. The immediate PP is clueless.

My message has always been to DECLARE THE MARRIAGE OPEN. That's a 12 second conversation. There is zero dishonesty in saving your sexless marriage in this way.

Please take all of your off topic "they still get sex at home" rants to a different thread about cheating. This is NOT a cheating thread! This is a sexless marriage thread. Likewise, any statistic about "happy in the marriage" is irrelevant. The only thing that is relevant is whether or not there is a normal active sex life. THAT is what makes a marriage sexless. This is a thread about how to save a sexless marriage. Stop trying to obfuscate this thread with alternate statistics or exceptionally rare scenarios (for example: man has plenty of sex at home yet still he cheats). Start a new thread if you want to have that discussion.

If you weren’t blindly following your own narrative like our current President, you would see what the immediate pp said in the first paragraph. It mirrors the “discussing options and intentions in an honest manner” e.g.., have balls, face the issue directly and don’t do something behind someone’s back. That’s a weak p@ssy way out.

Huh? What could be a more direct/honest/ballsy/direct-facing/non-weak-pussy than DECLARING YOUR MARRIAGE OPEN ??

Working on your marriage in a vulnerable manner. BOOM

Did you really just say that? It's like you think a man would reach the stage of DECLARING THE MARRIAGE OPEN without first having a long series of escalating conversations about why she does not want sex. Saving your sexless marriage by cheating (or declaring it open) does not spontaneously happen inside a vacuum. And unless you are advocating rape, there is only so much the normal libido could / should do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP this is nothing new, I'm sure most know it.

When I was cheated on he was immediately dead to me. It certainly didn't save anything, lol. All I can add, a outsider isn't worth losing your spouse, kids, and finances over. Years ago I worked in family court, I can't tell you how many men cried foul at all the consequences of their cheating. Women too, but mostly men who didn't want to accept the domino effect. I'm sure when they were cheating though it was a different story, lol.

But you skipped a crucial detail. What was your marital sex life BEFORE he cheated? If you had lost interest such that his sexual needs were no longer being met, then your marriage was already on the fast track to divorce BEFORE he cheated. So his cheating in fact DID save your low sex marriage.

Whatever happened in family courts is not a consequence of cheating, it's a consequence of the sexless marriage which preceded the cheating.

See there you go, President. You ASSUME once again, it had to be the result of a sexless marriage. We had sex multiple times per week.

Yours is a rare special case. Sorry for your betrayal, but go start a thread about cheating because this is a sexless marriage thread, not a cheating thread.