Faith and the Reward of Heaven

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:God’s endgame is for only love and peace to exist.

Atheist Muslim here. The same belief exists in Islam - many non-Muslims do not know that Jesus is also the messiah in Islam. Muslims too, are awaiting Jesus' return in a triumph of goodness (but Muslims belief him to be a prophet and agent of God, not divine himself).

At this point in life, I cannot find belief in the "game," period - no matter the specific faith.

Thou doth protest too much. You are highly invested in the game, as your constant posts here evidence.

Atheists claim to not believe in religion or God, yet spend many hours involved in discussions about religion. If you truly didn’t care you wouldn’t be here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:God’s endgame is for only love and peace to exist.

Atheist Muslim here. The same belief exists in Islam - many non-Muslims do not know that Jesus is also the messiah in Islam. Muslims too, are awaiting Jesus' return in a triumph of goodness (but Muslims belief him to be a prophet and agent of God, not divine himself).

At this point in life, I cannot find belief in the "game," period - no matter the specific faith.

Thou doth protest too much. You are highly invested in the game, as your constant posts here evidence.

Atheists claim to not believe in religion or God, yet spend many hours involved in discussions about religion. If you truly didn’t care you wouldn’t be here.

Because it's interesting me. The stories of life, meaning, and how we all make sense of things is interesting to me. I'm sorry you have trouble understanding that and perceive it as deceitful - when you stop asking questions, things become stagnant. Questions propel us forward.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

I never claimed it was out of curiosity that I posted. I was making an honest statement about how I feel about some Christians. I am anti-fundamentalism of all religions, but evangelism is what I am most familiar with. Which you may or may not claim to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:God’s endgame is for only love and peace to exist.

Do we need a god to provide this?

Can they exist without their opposite?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:God’s endgame is for only love and peace to exist.

Do we need a god to provide this?

Can they exist without their opposite?

What percentage of earth and humankind is at peace, in the past and now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

I never claimed it was out of curiosity that I posted. I was making an honest statement about how I feel about some Christians. I am anti-fundamentalism of all religions, but evangelism is what I am most familiar with. Which you may or may not claim to be.

What do you think of Muslims who believe those that deny Islam must be killed, and that people who insult Mohamed deserve to die?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

I never claimed it was out of curiosity that I posted. I was making an honest statement about how I feel about some Christians. I am anti-fundamentalism of all religions, but evangelism is what I am most familiar with. Which you may or may not claim to be.

What do you think of Muslims who believe those that deny Islam must be killed, and that people who insult Mohamed deserve to die?

Perhaps you should create a new thread with questions you have about Islam, instead of trying to derail OPs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

+1

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

+1

+2

+3

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm glad that you believe "deathbed conversations" won't get you into heaven. Some Christians do believe this, however - maybe not many or most, but some do. Like I said upthread, there will be people of every faith (not just Christianity) who will abuse tenets to their favored attitude. But then again, everyone thinks they're "right."

My disagreement is not based on a "fundamental misunderstanding" - for some people they get it. Others do not. There's a fundamental difference of belief in Christianity vs. Islam, and I simply will never understand the point of salvation, or Jesus as savior. His role in Christianity is pointless to me. The whole plot is needless, from my perspective (generally more simplified: God created the earth, leaves us completely to our devices, sends a few human teachers/prophets now and then, judges us when we die). I also understand that this worldview probably doesn't make sense to Christians or others (and it doesn't make sense to me as an Atheist now, stepping 'out' of the system).

All belief systems and their veracity are clouded by our personal experiences and upbringing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

I never claimed it was out of curiosity that I posted. I was making an honest statement about how I feel about some Christians. I am anti-fundamentalism of all religions, but evangelism is what I am most familiar with. Which you may or may not claim to be.

What do you think of Muslims who believe those that deny Islam must be killed, and that people who insult Mohamed deserve to die?

Perhaps you should create a new thread with questions you have about Islam, instead of trying to derail OPs.

I think it’s perfect to get answers from a former Muslim to post here. They have been very open about their willingness to speak on their beliefs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:God’s endgame is for only love and peace to exist.

Do we need a god to provide this?

Can they exist without their opposite?

What percentage of earth and humankind is at peace, in the past and now?

What percentage of the earth and humankind will get to enjoy the "endgame"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

I never claimed it was out of curiosity that I posted. I was making an honest statement about how I feel about some Christians. I am anti-fundamentalism of all religions, but evangelism is what I am most familiar with. Which you may or may not claim to be.

What do you think of Muslims who believe those that deny Islam must be killed, and that people who insult Mohamed deserve to die?

How do you think I feel about them?

That's a serious question that I would like to know the answer to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm glad that you believe "deathbed conversations" won't get you into heaven. Some Christians do believe this, however - maybe not many or most, but some do. Like I said upthread, there will be people of every faith (not just Christianity) who will abuse tenets to their favored attitude. But then again, everyone thinks they're "right."

My disagreement is not based on a "fundamental misunderstanding" - for some people they get it. Others do not. There's a fundamental difference of belief in Christianity vs. Islam, and I simply will never understand the point of salvation, or Jesus as savior. His role in Christianity is pointless to me. The whole plot is needless, from my perspective (generally more simplified: God created the earth, leaves us completely to our devices, sends a few human teachers/prophets now and then, judges us when we die). I also understand that this worldview probably doesn't make sense to Christians or others (and it doesn't make sense to me as an Atheist now, stepping 'out' of the system).

All belief systems and their veracity are clouded by our personal experiences and upbringing.

No, this is just wrong. No Christian denomination claims that hypocrisy will get you into heaven.
- Jesus talked a lot against religious hypocrisy
- God knows what’s really in your heart

Therefore,
- you have to want to change
- you have to actually try to change

You’re deliberately confusing the actions of bad people with the tenets of Christianity itself. Like someone’s mean boss up thread who goes to church every Sunday. Of course there are Christian hypocrites who want to think they’re getting a free pass, but these people =\= Christianity.

Every religion has people who use their religion in a hypocritical way. I’m sure some Muslims use the “scales” idea as a free pass but it won’t do them much good heaven-wise. I’m sure we agree that ISIS members are abusing religion and won’t get into heaven.

Would you want people claiming these Muslim bad actors represent actual tenets of Islam? Of course not! So stop doing it to Christianity re Christian hypocrites.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...

Just to clarify, it was the Christians the other post that I was specifically thinking of. They seem to be the most focused on an afterlife and post-life rewards and consequences.

Of course, I include all other people in faiths that are equally focused on the afterlife that I am equally skeptical of.

I just wonder what these people would be like if they weren't promised an afterlife?

I thought Islam has a big after life incentive of a bunch of virgins?

Mormons get a planet.

Hindus get to keep coming back until they become a cow.

You are posting because you are anti Christian not because you are curious about all faiths and their view of the afterlife.

I never claimed it was out of curiosity that I posted. I was making an honest statement about how I feel about some Christians. I am anti-fundamentalism of all religions, but evangelism is what I am most familiar with. Which you may or may not claim to be.

What do you think of Muslims who believe those that deny Islam must be killed, and that people who insult Mohamed deserve to die?

How do you think I feel about them?

That's a serious question that I would like to know the answer to.

I think it's an unacceptable and ignorant belief. Both from an atheist perspective, and a Muslim one. There is a verse in the Quran that states that if you kill or harm one person, it as if you kill and harm the whole of humanity. As a former Muslim and current atheist, I assure you I am hated much, much more than a Christian, according to the types of extremists you mention.

But I also know there are verses that are not so kind. From my perspective, every religious text has inconsistencies and contradicts itself in numerous places.