Getting your adult kids "off the payroll"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just wonder when you accumulate so much money over time ... what's the money meant for?

To sit in bank accounts? To re-invest? To take vacations?

I don't mind giving money to my adult kids.

Why the double hockey sticks would I want them to suffer like I did at their age?

Should I buy a new handbag for myself or pay their rent for 6 months?

I remember asking my mom for 1K 30 years ago so that I could not get evicted. My mom said, "if you get evicted there's something wrong with you, not me, I have 1K and you do not"

My mom's elderly and in a home and I have her blocked on all platforms. Her home costs 12K a month. Not my problem

Because the daughter has failed to learn basic adult skills like managing a two-week income cycle. It's not very hard to do, so that's concerning. Eventually the daughter will be an adult and need to handle her life, and it doesn't do her any good to "help" her if it prevents her becoming an adult. Nobody is saying she has to suffer. She just has to do what so many of her peers can do-- a little math and a little self-control and common sense.

[Anonymous]

I would wait until the leap to the first job. Then you can assess whether she will be able to continue the lifestyle or not and act accordingly. I would not want to contribute to the prioritization of immediate earning versus studying/networking/career prepping in college if I didnt have to.

[Anonymous]

I don’t see how you are doing a 529 distribution for “living expenses “ like these. Ours wants receipts that qualify - if off campus, rent only.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just wonder when you accumulate so much money over time ... what's the money meant for?

To sit in bank accounts? To re-invest? To take vacations?

I don't mind giving money to my adult kids.

Why the double hockey sticks would I want them to suffer like I did at their age?

Should I buy a new handbag for myself or pay their rent for 6 months?

I remember asking my mom for 1K 30 years ago so that I could not get evicted. My mom said, "if you get evicted there's something wrong with you, not me, I have 1K and you do not"

My mom's elderly and in a home and I have her blocked on all platforms. Her home costs 12K a month. Not my problem

There is a middle ground. I had NO help as a young person, not that my parents couldn't help financially or were mean, but somehow it didn't even occur to them I might need to eat or find a place to live or that books and textbooks cost money. I made do, with difficulties. So sure, I don't want my children to ever go through what I did and feel alone and scared and I want to help with things like a downpayment, BUT I also don't want them to be given so much so often they can't operate as independent people and understand the world financially. It's a pretty hard spot to find imo because I am tempted to give them too much and do too much for them to compensate for my own tough young adulthood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We lived below our means and so my kids do not have super expensive taste. We have given them a lot of financial leg-ups but they also know that we will pay for only things that we value.

We have lived in an inexpensive neighborhood, my kids have gone to public schools, DH has a horrible commute, we drive our cars until they die. But, we have also been able to afford many UMC things - yearly international vacation, bi-weekly cleaners, a 3000sqft SFH, tutors, expensive ECs etc.

When my kids made money (paid internship, merit scholarships for college) - we did not expect them to use it, instead we wanted them to save it in their Roth etc.

Here are the things we have paid for or will pay for -
- Every cost for college and grad school
- Each kid got a new sedan when they started college
- Travel, socializing, anything they wanted to buy in college - until they got a well-paying job.
- On our medical insurance until they turned 25
- Lived for free at home for as long as they want - no paying for rent, groceries, toiletries, medicine, utilities, use of vehicle etc. They only paid for their own gas, parking, car-insurance and social life. We told them that if they live with us permanently...they will have to chip in for some costs after they turn 35.
- Wedding
- Setting up first apartment after getting a job (Furniture, gadgets, appliances, bed, bath, kitchen and dining stuff)
- First work wardrobe
- Winter, hiking and sports gear, Luggage.
- Laptop, phone, headphones, smartwatch, other devices.
- 50K for down payment to their first house.

Once they start their job and are living separately from us - they pay for their own stuff (except what is listed above). We send them money gifts for birthdays and Christmas.

this is either a troll or the most tone-deaf clueless person on DCUM. you pay for all that and think you live frugally???

Yes.
Because if as parents you live frugally in your 20s, 30s, 40s - you are financially better off in your 50s and 60s, and can pay for your kids. The only debate is whether you want to make life easier for your kids or not.

- DH and I, paid off our college student debt within two years after graduating.
- We had a very simple wedding that our parents chipped in.
- We basically did not touch my earnings at all. Lived and saved on DH's earnings.
- We paid ourselves first.
- We mainly ate at home and cooked from scratch.
- Did not have kids for the first 5 years of our marriage because we were living in penurious conditions.
- Van-pooled and public transportation to work for first 6 years of working
- Bought a house at the bottom of the housing market, in an inexpensive neighborhood in MoCo, with poor public schools and with a long commute for DH.
- My kids did not go to private school. I tutored at home and they got a place in the magnet schools.
- I quit to become a SAHM and saved on childcare costs.
- My DH's traveled for work and that paid for our international travelling
- We had only 2 kids, no pets, and we drove old cars.
- My kids went to in-state public college with generous merit scholarships in lucrative STEM fields. We had saved money for their public college tuition.

Being frugal did not mean not being strategic. We did pay for cleaners and tutors, so that our energy could go towards supporting our kids. However, with cheap housing, no childcare cost, no debt and no private schools - we did not have major costs. Also, over the years, our HHI increased. Our retirement savings and investments compounded. We refinanced our house to the lowest interest rates. We are not a 30 - 40 yr old. We have been in the work place for a long time.

As a result -
- When it came time for my kids to go to college, since we did not pay tuition, we were in a position to pay for a car and living costs for them.
- Since they went close to home, we saved a bundle by letting them stay on our medical insurance, not paying for them to travel back home, being able to support them for material goods from home. They were raiding our costco stash instead of spending money at the commissary.
- Since it costs us pennies, we will always let them stay with us for free.

Now, please calculate what a new sedan, winter and sports gear, electronics devices, first professional wardrobe, first apartment set up will cost. I can guarantee that it will cost less than 4 years of private college. Or OOS public.

Paying for wedding, downpayment for house...these are the expenses that we can now afford to pay or not. We do have money set aside for that.

I love how living frugally on a high income is supposed to be some big accomplishment. Congrats I guess for not buying a Birkin? You are still tone deaf and think you accomplished a huge surprise. Guess what- its not that hard to save money when you make a lot. You just didnt fall for private school.

Look, you can choose to believe whatever. I cannot fix generational paucity-mindset. You will think and do what was modeled to you. Birkin and $200 haircuts? I don't value these things. Not when I was 20...certainly not when I am 60. So there is no way I will waste money on these things even if I have the money.

I also do not value most luxury goods or status symbols. We were driven to make sure that our kids had the skills to become successful on their own and that they valued what we could provide. We mostly spent money on things that had long term value - education, health, basic needs, and access to opportunities.

But those who value the superficial are in for the generational woes, are they not? The grandparents, parents, or the ACs, no one is willing to tolerate the extreme lean years and living below their means for the future of their children, correct?

Besides, no one talks here about how to work hard in school and college, so that you can do well in hard decent paying majors/careers later in life. Everyone is stewing about the unfairness of life where they think someone has more money. Why is not unfair when these people were working hard in school?

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

Just say no, dad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wonder when you accumulate so much money over time ... what's the money meant for?

To sit in bank accounts? To re-invest? To take vacations?

I don't mind giving money to my adult kids.

Why the double hockey sticks would I want them to suffer like I did at their age?

Should I buy a new handbag for myself or pay their rent for 6 months?

I remember asking my mom for 1K 30 years ago so that I could not get evicted. My mom said, "if you get evicted there's something wrong with you, not me, I have 1K and you do not"

My mom's elderly and in a home and I have her blocked on all platforms. Her home costs 12K a month. Not my problem

There is a middle ground. I had NO help as a young person, not that my parents couldn't help financially or were mean, but somehow it didn't even occur to them I might need to eat or find a place to live or that books and textbooks cost money. I made do, with difficulties. So sure, I don't want my children to ever go through what I did and feel alone and scared and I want to help with things like a downpayment, BUT I also don't want them to be given so much so often they can't operate as independent people and understand the world financially. It's a pretty hard spot to find imo because I am tempted to give them too much and do too much for them to compensate for my own tough young adulthood.

Agreed. I think the only way to raise kids who are independent, strategic and appreciative is for parents to invest the time and effort with their kids. As babies, they need to feel loved, their needs met and they have to trust you. The secure attachment is a must. As they grow up...parents need to sit and teach them, go over the subjects taught in school, be invested in their education and pay attention to their emotional, social, physical, mental health.

Explain the value of money and how it can be used as a tool for good. My kids and I would watch Dave Ramsey, Suze Orman, Ramit Sethi etc and have discussions. The most important thing that they understood was to invest in relationships, family, health and education. If your kids value system is messed up, all the negativity - greed, envy, anger, entitlement and sloth - will show up in how they view money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wonder when you accumulate so much money over time ... what's the money meant for?

To sit in bank accounts? To re-invest? To take vacations?

I don't mind giving money to my adult kids.

Why the double hockey sticks would I want them to suffer like I did at their age?

Should I buy a new handbag for myself or pay their rent for 6 months?

I remember asking my mom for 1K 30 years ago so that I could not get evicted. My mom said, "if you get evicted there's something wrong with you, not me, I have 1K and you do not"

My mom's elderly and in a home and I have her blocked on all platforms. Her home costs 12K a month. Not my problem

There is a middle ground. I had NO help as a young person, not that my parents couldn't help financially or were mean, but somehow it didn't even occur to them I might need to eat or find a place to live or that books and textbooks cost money. I made do, with difficulties. So sure, I don't want my children to ever go through what I did and feel alone and scared and I want to help with things like a downpayment, BUT I also don't want them to be given so much so often they can't operate as independent people and understand the world financially. It's a pretty hard spot to find imo because I am tempted to give them too much and do too much for them to compensate for my own tough young adulthood.

Agreed. I think the only way to raise kids who are independent, strategic and appreciative is for parents to invest the time and effort with their kids. As babies, they need to feel loved, their needs met and they have to trust you. The secure attachment is a must. As they grow up...parents need to sit and teach them, go over the subjects taught in school, be invested in their education and pay attention to their emotional, social, physical, mental health.

Explain the value of money and how it can be used as a tool for good. My kids and I would watch Dave Ramsey, Suze Orman, Ramit Sethi etc and have discussions. The most important thing that they understood was to invest in relationships, family, health and education. If your kids value system is messed up, all the negativity - greed, envy, anger, entitlement and sloth - will show up in how they view money.

OP here.

No on Dave Ramsey and Suze Orman. They are terrible.

First time checking this thread in a couple of days. Not sure who was describing frugality when you become relatively high income and then got attacked for not buying Birkin bags (whatever that is) but that post was relatable. I did something similar — sweat equity, earned my stability. Had more luxuries as kids became teens and that is their more familiar point of reference.

But my cars are 2010 and 2016 (and paid for for years), my house payment is $2,600 a month. We had fully funded 529. Kid got scholarship for tuition so I use it for off campus housing and she gets a check twice of month for food and incidentals. VA 529 has never asked for a receipt. The haircut was a surprise and I am sure we would get dinged for that if audited. But wasting money on food deliver is still food delivery.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We lived below our means and so my kids do not have super expensive taste. We have given them a lot of financial leg-ups but they also know that we will pay for only things that we value.

We have lived in an inexpensive neighborhood, my kids have gone to public schools, DH has a horrible commute, we drive our cars until they die. But, we have also been able to afford many UMC things - yearly international vacation, bi-weekly cleaners, a 3000sqft SFH, tutors, expensive ECs etc.

When my kids made money (paid internship, merit scholarships for college) - we did not expect them to use it, instead we wanted them to save it in their Roth etc.

Here are the things we have paid for or will pay for -
- Every cost for college and grad school
- Each kid got a new sedan when they started college
- Travel, socializing, anything they wanted to buy in college - until they got a well-paying job.
- On our medical insurance until they turned 25
- Lived for free at home for as long as they want - no paying for rent, groceries, toiletries, medicine, utilities, use of vehicle etc. They only paid for their own gas, parking, car-insurance and social life. We told them that if they live with us permanently...they will have to chip in for some costs after they turn 35.
- Wedding
- Setting up first apartment after getting a job (Furniture, gadgets, appliances, bed, bath, kitchen and dining stuff)
- First work wardrobe
- Winter, hiking and sports gear, Luggage.
- Laptop, phone, headphones, smartwatch, other devices.
- 50K for down payment to their first house.

Once they start their job and are living separately from us - they pay for their own stuff (except what is listed above). We send them money gifts for birthdays and Christmas.

Most people cannot afford this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You are doing a really good job with this. Just stick to absolutely saying no two extras. She has to live within her means, and her means are extraordinarily generous. She still gets to be in a sorority. She’s not taking out student loans. She has a generous meal plan and her housing paid for. She actually doesn’t need money. And yet she will get more money in 10 days. Let her suffer the very, very minor slight inconveniences of having spent all of her money. She has to experience living within her needs. Just say no.

+1

If you say anything, consider telling her that she could probably pick up some dog walking or babysitting work, and that maybe next time she should get a cheaper haircut.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wonder when you accumulate so much money over time ... what's the money meant for?

To sit in bank accounts? To re-invest? To take vacations?

I don't mind giving money to my adult kids.

Why the double hockey sticks would I want them to suffer like I did at their age?

Should I buy a new handbag for myself or pay their rent for 6 months?

I remember asking my mom for 1K 30 years ago so that I could not get evicted. My mom said, "if you get evicted there's something wrong with you, not me, I have 1K and you do not"

My mom's elderly and in a home and I have her blocked on all platforms. Her home costs 12K a month. Not my problem

There is a middle ground. I had NO help as a young person, not that my parents couldn't help financially or were mean, but somehow it didn't even occur to them I might need to eat or find a place to live or that books and textbooks cost money. I made do, with difficulties. So sure, I don't want my children to ever go through what I did and feel alone and scared and I want to help with things like a downpayment, BUT I also don't want them to be given so much so often they can't operate as independent people and understand the world financially. It's a pretty hard spot to find imo because I am tempted to give them too much and do too much for them to compensate for my own tough young adulthood.

Agreed. I think the only way to raise kids who are independent, strategic and appreciative is for parents to invest the time and effort with their kids. As babies, they need to feel loved, their needs met and they have to trust you. The secure attachment is a must. As they grow up...parents need to sit and teach them, go over the subjects taught in school, be invested in their education and pay attention to their emotional, social, physical, mental health.

Explain the value of money and how it can be used as a tool for good. My kids and I would watch Dave Ramsey, Suze Orman, Ramit Sethi etc and have discussions. The most important thing that they understood was to invest in relationships, family, health and education. If your kids value system is messed up, all the negativity - greed, envy, anger, entitlement and sloth - will show up in how they view money.

OP here.

No on Dave Ramsey and Suze Orman. They are terrible.

First time checking this thread in a couple of days. Not sure who was describing frugality when you become relatively high income and then got attacked for not buying Birkin bags (whatever that is) but that post was relatable. I did something similar — sweat equity, earned my stability. Had more luxuries as kids became teens and that is their more familiar point of reference.

But my cars are 2010 and 2016 (and paid for for years), my house payment is $2,600 a month. We had fully funded 529. Kid got scholarship for tuition so I use it for off campus housing and she gets a check twice of month for food and incidentals. VA 529 has never asked for a receipt. The haircut was a surprise and I am sure we would get dinged for that if audited. But wasting money on food deliver is still food delivery.

So I think you need to sit down and write out exactly how much money you will give her, on what time frame, and on what date the money stops. Write an outline with exact dates. Then share it with her. You may need to reiterate that the amounts and dates are fixed and not negotiable. Right now, the ambiguity is killing you. Most young adults will capitalize on that ambiguity to get as much parental help as they can - it's human nature. It's your job to figure out a clear plan and hold firm.

[Anonymous]

Tell her she’s being a spoiled brat, and needs to start budgeting well and taking responsibility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wonder when you accumulate so much money over time ... what's the money meant for?

To sit in bank accounts? To re-invest? To take vacations?

I don't mind giving money to my adult kids.

Why the double hockey sticks would I want them to suffer like I did at their age?

Should I buy a new handbag for myself or pay their rent for 6 months?

I remember asking my mom for 1K 30 years ago so that I could not get evicted. My mom said, "if you get evicted there's something wrong with you, not me, I have 1K and you do not"

My mom's elderly and in a home and I have her blocked on all platforms. Her home costs 12K a month. Not my problem

There is a middle ground. I had NO help as a young person, not that my parents couldn't help financially or were mean, but somehow it didn't even occur to them I might need to eat or find a place to live or that books and textbooks cost money. I made do, with difficulties. So sure, I don't want my children to ever go through what I did and feel alone and scared and I want to help with things like a downpayment, BUT I also don't want them to be given so much so often they can't operate as independent people and understand the world financially. It's a pretty hard spot to find imo because I am tempted to give them too much and do too much for them to compensate for my own tough young adulthood.

Agreed. I think the only way to raise kids who are independent, strategic and appreciative is for parents to invest the time and effort with their kids. As babies, they need to feel loved, their needs met and they have to trust you. The secure attachment is a must. As they grow up...parents need to sit and teach them, go over the subjects taught in school, be invested in their education and pay attention to their emotional, social, physical, mental health.

Explain the value of money and how it can be used as a tool for good. My kids and I would watch Dave Ramsey, Suze Orman, Ramit Sethi etc and have discussions. The most important thing that they understood was to invest in relationships, family, health and education. If your kids value system is messed up, all the negativity - greed, envy, anger, entitlement and sloth - will show up in how they view money.

OP here.

No on Dave Ramsey and Suze Orman. They are terrible.

First time checking this thread in a couple of days. Not sure who was describing frugality when you become relatively high income and then got attacked for not buying Birkin bags (whatever that is) but that post was relatable. I did something similar — sweat equity, earned my stability. Had more luxuries as kids became teens and that is their more familiar point of reference.

But my cars are 2010 and 2016 (and paid for for years), my house payment is $2,600 a month. We had fully funded 529. Kid got scholarship for tuition so I use it for off campus housing and she gets a check twice of month for food and incidentals. VA 529 has never asked for a receipt. The haircut was a surprise and I am sure we would get dinged for that if audited. But wasting money on food deliver is still food delivery.

And none of this is really relevant. What you have is a boundaries/communication problem. You need to make clear to her how much is coming, when it will come, and that outside of [i]emergencies [/i there will not be any more, nor will there be advances. And then you stick to that.

There are multiple right ways to handle finances with college and ACs, but I think clear boundaries and communication are necessary for all of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wonder when you accumulate so much money over time ... what's the money meant for?

To sit in bank accounts? To re-invest? To take vacations?

I don't mind giving money to my adult kids.

Why the double hockey sticks would I want them to suffer like I did at their age?

Should I buy a new handbag for myself or pay their rent for 6 months?

I remember asking my mom for 1K 30 years ago so that I could not get evicted. My mom said, "if you get evicted there's something wrong with you, not me, I have 1K and you do not"

My mom's elderly and in a home and I have her blocked on all platforms. Her home costs 12K a month. Not my problem

There is a middle ground. I had NO help as a young person, not that my parents couldn't help financially or were mean, but somehow it didn't even occur to them I might need to eat or find a place to live or that books and textbooks cost money. I made do, with difficulties. So sure, I don't want my children to ever go through what I did and feel alone and scared and I want to help with things like a downpayment, BUT I also don't want them to be given so much so often they can't operate as independent people and understand the world financially. It's a pretty hard spot to find imo because I am tempted to give them too much and do too much for them to compensate for my own tough young adulthood.

Agreed. I think the only way to raise kids who are independent, strategic and appreciative is for parents to invest the time and effort with their kids. As babies, they need to feel loved, their needs met and they have to trust you. The secure attachment is a must. As they grow up...parents need to sit and teach them, go over the subjects taught in school, be invested in their education and pay attention to their emotional, social, physical, mental health.

Explain the value of money and how it can be used as a tool for good. My kids and I would watch Dave Ramsey, Suze Orman, Ramit Sethi etc and have discussions. The most important thing that they understood was to invest in relationships, family, health and education. If your kids value system is messed up, all the negativity - greed, envy, anger, entitlement and sloth - will show up in how they view money.

OP here.

No on Dave Ramsey and Suze Orman. They are terrible.

First time checking this thread in a couple of days. Not sure who was describing frugality when you become relatively high income and then got attacked for not buying Birkin bags (whatever that is) but that post was relatable. I did something similar — sweat equity, earned my stability. Had more luxuries as kids became teens and that is their more familiar point of reference.

But my cars are 2010 and 2016 (and paid for for years), my house payment is $2,600 a month. We had fully funded 529. Kid got scholarship for tuition so I use it for off campus housing and she gets a check twice of month for food and incidentals. VA 529 has never asked for a receipt. The haircut was a surprise and I am sure we would get dinged for that if audited. But wasting money on food deliver is still food delivery.

And none of this is really relevant. What you have is a boundaries/communication problem. You need to make clear to her how much is coming, when it will come, and that outside of [i]emergencies [/i there will not be any more, nor will there be advances. And then you stick to that.

There are multiple right ways to handle finances with college and ACs, but I think clear boundaries and communication are necessary for all of them.

No, I don't have a boundaries or communications problem. She knows where I stand. I think she just hopes I might bend. Yesterday she was lamenting how she doesn't have any money to go away for Spring Break and all her friends are going to Cabo. I said, well, maybe focus harder on finding a job this summer so you can save for that kind of thing next year. THIS year, you just returned from a month of study abroad, it won't kill you to come home for Spring Break. I imagine her fantasy was I'd say, "Ok, honey, here's $3,000 go to Cabo with your friends." To her credit, she didn't come right out and ask LOL.